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Sunifiram?

sunifiram

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#301 Introspecta

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 06:14 PM

No memory issues or headaches Iso? Today I don't feel as focused and have had an on and off little effect. I also feel more euphoric and not super sharp like yesterday and like when on high dose Piracetam. I still think Piracetam is my number 1 but this has potential and needs more playing with. Almost all the noots I've tried start off great then get shitty with side effects like Paranoia, or Irritability.

#302 mkUltra999

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 06:16 PM

I've been dosing with Sunifiram for about 7 days now. I don't have time to get into too much detail at the moment, but thought I'd share what I am getting from my Suni use thus far. I'll let you know that I also stack Noopept and Aniracetam daily, but I stopped both for a few days knowing that the Sunifiram was on its way. Ordinarily, I take 10 mg of Noopept thrice daily, and I also usually take 500 Mg's of Aniracetam twice daily. Any more and I get brain fog, but at that mark, was perfect for me. I also take CDP Choline (250 mg's X2 daily) I know it doesn't sound like a lot (Aniracetam), but if I go over that threshold, I get some fogging. like I said, that really sucks. As many of you well know, finding the right doses of nootropics is a commitment unto itself, and is a huge part of making use of these highly variable compounds that very clearly affect people very differently. Anyway, the Noopept and Aniracetam combination seems to have a real synergy, and for me, they go together well. Anyway, did a few trials with Suni by itself; initially, did a 5mg test dose, then 10mg, with mild effects, i.e. alertness, focus, recall, verbal fluidity, very minor euphoria/mood lift, etc., and what some might consider increased intentionality, or a desire to "do something". Sometimes it's reading, writing, task-oriented things, and the like, or whatever I feel like doing. It seems like the Suni, which I've integrated into my Noopept/Ani stack, has a synergistic effect on the whole, and I immediately felt the need to drop the Aniracetam down and half what it was, to 250 twice a day, because it seems that for me, a got some fogging and weirdness that didn't agree with me that conicided with the addition of the Suniferam, which I have titrated to 20mg 3 times per day to this point, to good effect, I'd say. My stack is working well for me, but only because I stack thoughtfully and change things as needed, just like I cycle on and off the compounds. I don't have time for a longer post, but will say that a couple of things about this thread, or any nootropic thread, that concern me. First of all, I have heard it said that Suni potentiates caffeine or other stimulants, which I haven't found to be true at all, since I consume large quanitities of caffeine daily, and I have felt nothing by way of potenentiation is concerned. Nothing. I also have heard multiple people refer to this compound as "amphetamine like", which I could not find further from the truth, at least for me. Other than feeling an elevated mood, perhaps increased energy and motivation, focus and alertness, there has been nothing amphetamine like about it. But that's just me. I have done lots of stimulants in my life, and I HATE THEM, and if there was anything about this compound that was anything like amphetamine salts I'd have avoided it like the plague. Period. So I guess what I am saying is that I think it's easy to jump to conclusions based on anecdotes, but I also feel it's a disservice to go out on a limb by saying things about a compound that may or may not be true, but may lead people to believe they are, and either stay away from it or seek it out as a result of this relatively questionable information based on anecdotes. That's it for now, but I'll give more info on my trial in the near future. And like I said, as far as potentiation of caffeine is concerned, I'd be out of my mind because I consume between 4 and 6 shots of espresso daily, including with my morning and afternoon stacks, and I eat 86% Cacao Dark Chocolate twice daily as well. I have experienced nothing by way of potentiation at 60mgs of Suni per day. Not even a hint of it. And BTW...If that seems like a lot, I am 6'3 and weight 210 pounds.
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#303 quantummind

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 06:49 PM

Hi guys!

I am new to this forum but a long time lurker... I have read up to page 9 of this thread so far,just cannot wait for the package to arrive! Speaking of caffeine,I was at the verge of death once due to OD.

You see, I used to take caffeine for it's stiumaltory effects which helps in weightlifting.
BUT all that changed on one occasion I went total OTT(a table spoon of it alongside Beta-alanine/Taurine/monohydrate creatine). I had roughly a tablespoon of it.
I felt a different kind of "high"/nothing psychedelic like, just hyper,more talkative,full of energy when I was on it.
It came to the point where I was constantly throwing up, to the point where I was severely dehydrated,so I was taken to the ER.I had all of the symptoms of OD with the exception of a heart attack.
I was told to stay off any kind of supplement for at least 3 weeks,since my creatinine levels were x400 times higher than normal,no suprises there since I was lifting for 3 hours straight prior to the worsening of my condition.

To cut long story short (which this isn't): Never underestimate stimulants of any kind. My caffeine intake used to be non-existent before supplementation,within 4 months I went from 0mg up to 1g. lol

It has been six months since that day, I have come out clean... :)



Now coming back to what I read few pages back about a member taking high doses of caffeine.I am not surpised at all, it's very probable that high dose caffeine was the cuplrit,since it stimulaes sympathetic nervous system that in a chain of reaction relases Ach,not to mention "the flight or fight response"/ a response that the human body uses as "last resort".

P.S :Such high doses most likely alter our brain physiology.I panic too easily nowadays since that incident.

#304 manic_racetam

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 07:08 PM

DO NOT TAKE OVER 100MG DO NOT TAKE OVER 100mg

- one teaspoon caffeine anhydrous

Sounds good.

............
i will do this :
10
20
40
80
150
i am stopping caffeine no xplode hydroxycut taurine and creatine, i will try on monday
i only keep the fish oil


One teaspoon of caffeine? Is this something you do regularly? That's an insane amount of pure caffeine. Foolishly, I took a quarter teaspoon of caffeine without weighing it about 2 years ago and had a pretty severe reaction. IIRC that was nearly 1,000mg of caffeine on top of what I usually consume in energy drinks. If this was your first time taking that much caffeine I'd guess it as the culprit.

But as far as working your way up to 150mg of sunifiram... why would you want to do that? I really don't understand why the goal is to take large amounts of this stuff. Isn't the whole point of the shulgin method to find a safe effective dose when working with untested compounds?

Personally I think it would be more prudent to start somewhere around 2mg and work up from there each day. Find an effective minimum dose and keep it somewhere around that level. If 5-10mg is working why take 100-200mg?
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#305 Isochroma

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 07:41 PM

DM-235 = NZT-48 = Modafinil 2.0

Last night: 5:45a bedtime / 10:35a WIDE AWAKE: Total = 4 hours 50 minutes.
Normal requirement = 8.5 - 9 hours sleep.


75% Sustained reduction in sleep requirement in two days of therapeutic use with better clarity upon awakening and no more daytime sleepiness.

That 75% reduction in sleep requirement is not from baseline but the result of transitioning directly from the most powerful tested stack of Piracetam 5gx6 + Pramiracetam 300mgx6 daily for prevention of daytime sleepiness and increase in sleep-quality.

75% Better at sleep quality improvement and 100% better than that powerful racetam stack at preventing daytime sleepiness.

And that is from testing since Summer 2008 these nootropics in high doses, alone and stacked:

Piracetam

Aniracetam

Oxiracetam

Nefiracetam

Phenylpiracetam

Pramiracetam

Noopept

Sulbutiamine


Finally, wurm's report that Caffeine was potentiated to the extreme (in his case largely due to tolerance combined with very large intakes) but only when Sunifiram dose was escalated from the 10mg range to the 100mg range indicates that Sunifiram has stronger effects at least up to 100mg/dose, and those effects may be very powerful.

I hope other individuals can test at least the 55mg area and hopefully a few tries at 100+mg.

#306 megatron

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 07:57 PM

I simply can't get over Limitless! It was like the blue and the red pill in the Matrix. Once you've been enlightened you can never go back. After I found this forum I cannot go back to "normal" life, thinking about intelligence gains comprehends everything in my life. Dreaming about infinite intelligence, endless power, ruling others and such has become second nature. Long live narcissism! Really, let's hope we can find something that at least gives a fraction of NZT-48's effects this decade.

Edited by Megatrone, 07 April 2013 - 07:58 PM.


#307 Isochroma

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 08:14 PM

I watched it too - in HD - and found it to be quite amazing.


The movie was based on Modafinil, which unlike the fictitious NZT-48 has real side-effects and tolerance, and is a stimulant not a nootropic.


As for NZT's real-life formulation, I suggest trying 100mg x 6 per day of Sunifiram stacked with 200mg Modafinil in the morning or early afternoon.


The one thing missing from Sunifiram is the nice speedy stimulated effect at least in my experience thus far. It's a very clean, totally 'quiet' nootropic. So it would go well with a minimal dose of something that adds fuel to the fire. I'm running in lean-burn mode now so I have no idea how really powerful the Sunny catalyst might be because I have little fuel in my fire.


Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 07 April 2013 - 08:15 PM.


#308 Isochroma

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 10:12 PM

Oops, I forgot the wake frequency!

Normally I wake up about six times per night but for the first time in unknown years last night I slept with only about one waking.

Dreaming was at reference level.

It seems that - as another poster commented - Sunifiram consolidates sleep in addition to improving its quality.

#309 therein

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 01:02 AM

I just took 55mg of Sunifiram. Thermogenesis is pretty obviously present. I am in a good mood overall and feeling pretty cognitively fit considering I consumed a good amount of alcohol yesterday and have been sleep deprived lately. I am not having problems while typing but I am really good at typing in general.

@Isochroma
You said you take 5F-AKB-48 regularly. May I ask why? Aren't you worried about its long term effects? It is a synthetic cannabinoid as far as I know, and they are usually demonized.

Edited by therein, 08 April 2013 - 01:02 AM.


#310 Isochroma

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 01:11 AM

Demonized? There are a few sensationalist reports as with any drug.

Works far better than natural cannabis for my chronic insomnia and is much clearer and is legal and is easier on the lungs than the herbal material.

Not to mention costing 2/3 less and not requiring an illegal dealer - mine is delivered in nicely packed envelopes.

No dosing problems nor tolerance issues.

#311 therein

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 01:20 AM

There are more than a few reports. I'm especially talking about the JWH series; maybe 5F-AKB-48 is different? I haven't been following the synthetic cannabinoid discussion lately but last time I checked there were many reports of psychosis, panic attacks and lasting anxiety.

#312 Isochroma

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 01:32 AM

The JWH series is now illegal in most of the world's countries.

It also has a highly unbalanced receptor profile which is the equivalent to nearly pure THC without the CBD to moderate its effects and reverse tolerance. Those reports of psychosis, panic attacks and anxiety are due to stimulation of CB1 receptors only without the natural balance of CB2. The JWH series does that.

5F-AKB-48 is one of the best new cannabinoids and far superior to JWH because it has a naturally balanced action at the two receptor sites CB1 & CB2. Activation of CB2 prevents tolerance/withdrawal and also moderates the paranoid effects of pure CB1 activation.

Finally, like any intelligent drug user I buy my molecule pure from a reputable source rather than taking some 'spice' mix, etc. Starting pure means never getting suprised by an unexpected increase in purity.

Having a milligram scale and long experience measuring and using potent molecules means that I don't make stupid mistakes.

Not combining it with alcohol or other actives that can alter its metabolism, nor taking it more than once a day or obtaining dubious material from others are also safety features of my regimen.

All these factors meant I was able to transition flawlessly two months ago from over fifteen years of the plant material to 5F-AKB-48 with absolutely zero problems.

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 08 April 2013 - 01:36 AM.


#313 therein

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 01:41 AM

The JWH series is now illegal in most of the world's countries.

It also has a highly unbalanced receptor profile which is the equivalent to nearly pure THC without the CBD to moderate its effects and reverse tolerance. Those reports of psychosis, panic attacks and anxiety are due to stimulation of CB1 receptors only without the natural balance of CB2. The JWH series does that.

5F-AKB-48 is one of the best new cannabinoids and far superior to JWH because it has a naturally balanced action at the two receptor sites CB1 & CB2. Activation of CB2 prevents tolerance/withdrawal and also moderates the paranoid effects of pure CB1 activation.

Finally, like any intelligent drug user I buy my molecule pure from a reputable source rather than taking some 'spice' mix, etc. Starting pure means never getting suprised by an unexpected increase in purity.

Having a milligram scale and long experience measuring and using potent molecules means that I don't make stupid mistakes.

Not combining it with alcohol or other actives that can alter its metabolism, nor taking it more than once a day or obtaining dubious material from others are also safety features of my regimen.

All these factors meant I was able to transition flawlessly two months ago from over fifteen years of the plant material to 5F-AKB-48 with absolutely zero problems.


Sounds like you're on the safe side of things. I don't get why people get those 'spice' mixes either. You would never know what you're getting.

I don't intend to transition from plant material but synthetic cannabinoids are definitely interesting.

#314 Isochroma

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 02:17 AM

I never intended either - though I should have anyway.

The Law has funny ways of changing intentions into necessities and so does losing your dealer.

Now though I would never go back even if it were not for the things that pushed me to adopt my current regime.

#315 abelard lindsay

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 03:44 AM

DM-235 = NZT-48 = Modafinil 2.0



Ha! Well maybe when stacked with zembrin/ciltep. Hmm.. I think I'll go try that now. Will start with 5mg. Took zembrin/ciltep this morning and am definitely feeling it now. Wheee......

Edited by abelard lindsay, 08 April 2013 - 04:20 AM.


#316 Isochroma

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 03:53 AM

No stacking needed. I threw out my old stack and am on just Sunifiram 55mg x 6 / day.

5mg is very low so don't expect to feel anything.

#317 abelard lindsay

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 03:59 AM

No stacking needed. I threw out my old stack and am on just Sunifiram 55mg x 6 / day.

5mg is very low so don't expect to feel anything.


Ahh man you gotta try Zembrin + Forskolin. Zembrin is the first high potency, non-emetic, selective PDE4 inhibitor that any normal mortal could get his hands on. Adding Sunifram to this for CAMKII and Ampa activation completes the learning/memory pipeline, well except for NMDA but nobody knows how to fix that except for long-term Magnesium Threonate use.

Edited by abelard lindsay, 08 April 2013 - 04:20 AM.


#318 alecnevsky

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 04:06 AM

5-7mg is enough to see memory improvements via cambridge sciences in my experience. But I don't feel those usually.

#319 emckai

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 04:08 AM

I'm not sure if this was some kind of placebo effect, but the day before I did take about 20mg Sunifiram total and had no effect (10mg morning, 10 mg afternoon)
Today I went hiking with my friends up at Mt. Charleston - Mary Jane Falls. I took 1.8g Piracetam and 1.6g of Choline (no sunifiram that day) and I can say that the effects of Piracetam were amazing which I didn't have before. Keep in mind I stopped taking Piracetam about 2-3 weeks ago. Maybe it's the 2-3 week break that's helping the Piracetam, but damn I had so much focus and energy.

EDIT: Thanks Iso!

Edited by emckai, 08 April 2013 - 04:34 AM.


#320 Isochroma

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 04:32 AM

I'm sure you meant grams on both of those.

#321 emckai

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 04:36 AM

Hell no! I meant mg! Hahaha just kidding. Not sure if it was because I took a break from Piracetam or the remaining Sunifiram in my body.

#322 emckai

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 06:23 AM

Tomorrow I'll be taking about 10mg of Sunifiram along with 1.8g of Piracetam + 1.6g of Choline Bitartrate. I'll be continuing my Piracetam diet which I ended about 2-3 weeks ago.
There isn't much to do tomorrow, I have only one class tomorrow which is at 8:30am and after that I'll just head over to the library and get some work done.

Wish Fall semester would come faster, I'll be changing my major from Computer Science to Biochemistry. Not sure if I'll be making a complete change, but i'll be taking some biochem courses to get the feel for it.

#323 Introspecta

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 09:02 AM

Usually 3 weeks isn't really a long enough break for me to get the good Piracetam effects back. Actually usually a break doesn't do a whole lot for me. I still have to dose it high but will feel the effects a little more the first day or 2 then back to mega dosing to notice. Its somewhat annoying to have to take 30grams of Piracetam to get good effects. I think my adrenals were shot though. Its been about 2 Months since I've used Piracetam and I've greatly reduced caffiene and beeen sleeping good so I feel my adrenals are working better. I'm not tired all the time like I used to be.

#324 wurm

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 03:45 PM

i cut all caffeine and stuff, i only took 10 grams fish oil today
i took a chunk of sunifiram, i don't know how much i was kinda lazy and just eyeballed the stuff
i have an heightened sense of perception and feeling in balance with my environment, feels good, so far so good no sweating no heart going berserk
wasn't that after all but caffeine but this is dangerous guys, really who doesn't take a morning coffee? almost everyone does and this freaks me out, this stuff is too potent or maybe was it the combination of high dose sunifiram dunno
i still have damage from that other night, my cardiovascular system doesn't seem right, it hurts in my vessels sometimes, the doctor said it was because of alterd blood flow but didn't give me anything to solve this, i guess this is a lesson

#325 Dissolvedissolve

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 04:27 PM

wasn't that after all but caffeine but this is dangerous guys, really who doesn't take a morning coffee?


It's important to keep in mind that it is not established that sunifiram potentiates caffeine to any noticeable degree, especially at typical dosages, which seem to be 5-10 mg, not the 100+ mg megadoses that a few have experimented with. In your previous post, you said you took a teaspoon of caffeine. Caffeine has a density of 1.23 g/mL * 4.92 mL (ie one teaspoon) = 6 g.

Six grams of caffeine is a ton. You could literally overdose on that without mixing it. The fact that you mixed an absurd amount of caffeine with sunifiram does not mean that sunifiram is harmful. (Although I'm still not entirely comfortable with it since positive allosteric modulation at the AMPA site has some potential for excitotoxicity depending on a number of variables.)
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#326 Introspecta

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 09:49 PM

I really don't believe Sunifiram Potentiates Caffiene but I think they combine wonderfully. 15mgs Sunny taken at 500 am, then 20mgs taken at 400pm plus one scoop of Jack3d produced euphoric effects. Ready to hit the Gym. I'm full of energy. I really think I'm liking this stuff. Hopefully side effects don't start making their way in. Typing is pretty fast and i'm no longer making tons of errors. I think the errors I was making were unrelated and it got in my head due to Iso mentioning it. Placebo can really play tricks on ya sometimes exxargerating a problem. I'm actually typing 100 words per minute right now;)

#327 Isochroma

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 10:22 PM

Excellent!

Sounds like Sunifiram is working well for you.

It continues to work well for me too:

Last Night:

Bed: 6:30a
Wake: 10:30a
Slept Hours: 4

#328 emckai

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 11:29 PM

No stacking needed. I threw out my old stack and am on just Sunifiram 55mg x 6 / day.

5mg is very low so don't expect to feel anything.


I trust you Isochroma. Once I get home, i'll try 55mg of Sunifiram along with about 200mg of Choline Bitartrate.

#329 Isochroma

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Posted 09 April 2013 - 12:00 AM

Watch the Choline too - you might try testing it with and without added Choline.

And when I said no stacking needed I just meant that the effects are for me strong enough on their own that it doesn't need to be stacked - however, stacking will undoubtedly be the Next Big Project as we learn about Sunifiram's effects alone first.

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#330 Introspecta

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Posted 09 April 2013 - 12:07 AM

I can't believe how great I feel from this.. I only wonder if this is somehow wrong and doing damage. Going to the gym greatly increased the euphoria. Whatever Sunifram is doing plus the endorphin boost from the gym makes me want to go around talking to everyone. Hopefully this keeps up... It seems the effects are getting better. The early morning dose hasn't been too great but once I got home from work and dosed it opened me up to a new world..

I fear taking too high of doses because I believe it will probably create some mania. Its working at 15-20 mg doses now anyway so why waste it and take more. Its more than likely just gonna cause damage to brain and wallet. Although by damage I don't mean anything extreme but mainly just cause a burnout or some memory problems..

A few people mentioned being burnt out and taking a break.. Could any of you explain a little more what happend if you have some time?





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