1565 replies to this topic

[Sam375]

Got mine this morning, it's indeed very strong (for the dosage).

Any idea what is causing that head pressure feeling ?

[Climactic]

Any idea what is causing that head pressure feeling ?

Yes, why do you ask? My amateur hypothesis is that:

1. NMDA receptors, especially at the glycine binding site, and also AMPA receptors, are overactivated or overexpressed.
2. By feedback, glial cells are holding on to glutamate to attempt to prevent the above.
3. By feedback, CSF (cerebrospinal fluid) is attempting to clear out excess glutamate.
4. Increased CSF is causing elevations in ICP (intracranial pressure).

Edited by Climactic, 12 August 2013 - 01:21 PM.

[Sam375]

Any idea what is causing that head pressure feeling ?

Yes, why do you ask? My amateur hypothesis is that:

1. NMDA receptors, especially at the glycine binding site, and also AMPA receptors, are overactivated or overexpressed.
2. By feedback, glial cells are holding on to glutamate to attempt to prevent the above.
3. By feedback, CSF (cerebrospinal fluid) is attempting to clear out excess glutamate.
4. Increased CSF is causing elevations in ICP (intracranial pressure).

Piracetam produces the same effect on me, I thought it had something to do with the blood flow increase.

Is there any supplements to try beside choline ?

[Climactic]

Any idea what is causing that head pressure feeling ?

Yes, why do you ask? My amateur hypothesis is that:

1. NMDA receptors, especially at the glycine binding site, and also AMPA receptors, are overactivated or overexpressed.
2. By feedback, glial cells are holding on to glutamate to attempt to prevent the above.
3. By feedback, CSF (cerebrospinal fluid) is attempting to clear out excess glutamate.
4. Increased CSF is causing elevations in ICP (intracranial pressure).

Piracetam produces the same effect on me, I thought it had something to do with the blood flow increase.

Is there any supplements to try beside choline ?

Supplements for what? Are you having any symptoms?

In my previous post, I forgot to mention:

5. The effect of sunifiram is presumably most pronounced in the hippocampi - these are in the temples. (The abnormal sensations are felt mostly, but not exclusively in the temples.)

[Sam375]

Any idea what is causing that head pressure feeling ?

Yes, why do you ask? My amateur hypothesis is that:

1. NMDA receptors, especially at the glycine binding site, and also AMPA receptors, are overactivated or overexpressed.
2. By feedback, glial cells are holding on to glutamate to attempt to prevent the above.
3. By feedback, CSF (cerebrospinal fluid) is attempting to clear out excess glutamate.
4. Increased CSF is causing elevations in ICP (intracranial pressure).

Piracetam produces the same effect on me, I thought it had something to do with the blood flow increase.

Is there any supplements to try beside choline ?

Supplements for what? Are you having any symptoms?

In my previous post, I forgot to mention:

5. The effect of sunifiram is presumably most pronounced in the hippocampi - these are in the temples. (The abnormal sensations are felt mostly, but not exclusively in the temples.)

As I said, same thing than piracetam, head pressure.

[Climactic]

As I said, same thing than piracetam, head pressure.

I'm sorry to hear. I will PM you to discuss your situation more extensively. You're apparently yet another victim of sunifiram.

As I understand, piracetam too is glutamatergic, but much more mildly so. I don't believe the symptoms has anything to do with bloodflow because gabaergics provide temporary relief. Short-acting gabaergics may backfire, however, due to a possible glutamatergic or NMDAR rebound effect, and therefore must not be relied upon for treatment.

Edited by Climactic, 12 August 2013 - 04:10 PM.

[violetechos]

If you get head pressure with sunifiram, its important to drastically lower the dose. One must remember that nootropics increase blood flow to the brain. A lot. At a rate slower than vinpocetine (REALLY quickly) ... But with more breadth and width.

The issue with added stimulants seems to be the increase in pressure and increased heart rate... So smaller vessels, with more output (especially areas those that bind with nootropics in the brain) will experience a headache !!! Ever wonder why people complain of left eye/left brain pain after / during nootropics use sometimes? OOOOOH.

It's all about the glycine agonists ! I'll letcha in on a wonderful tip : full glycine agonism = full NMDA antagonism. O_O

[Sam375]

As I said, same thing than piracetam, head pressure.

I'm sorry to hear. I will PM you to discuss your situation more extensively. You're apparently yet another victim of sunifiram.

As I understand, piracetam too is glutamatergic, but much more mildly so. I don't believe the symptoms has anything to do with bloodflow because gabaergics provide temporary relief. Short-acting gabaergics may backfire, however, due to a possible glutamatergic or NMDAR rebound effect, and therefore must not be relied upon for treatment.

I must insist on the fact that I got this from other racetams too.

[Sam375]

If you get head pressure with sunifiram, its important to drastically lower the dose. One must remember that nootropics increase blood flow to the brain. A lot. At a rate slower than vinpocetine (REALLY quickly) ... But with more breadth and width.

The issue with added stimulants seems to be the increase in pressure and increased heart rate... So smaller vessels, with more output (especially areas those that bind with nootropics in the brain) will experience a headache !!! Ever wonder why people complain of left eye/left brain pain after / during nootropics use sometimes? OOOOOH.

It's all about the glycine agonists ! I'll letcha in on a wonderful tip : full glycine agonism = full NMDA antagonism. O_O

No pain for now and nothing incapacitating.

"full glycine agonism = full NMDA antagonism."

Sorry but what is it ?

[Climactic]

The concepts of agonism and antagonisms are associated not with neurotransmitters, but with binding sites on receptors. Among other sites, NMDAR has a glycine binding site which is effectively agonized by sunifiram. To say that glycine agonism is NMDAR antagonism is nothing short of incoherent nonsense.

I have used high doses of vinpocetine (30 mg) for years and not once experienced any headache from it.

If you had full NMDAR antagonism, you'd be dead.

Anybody who is at peak-LTP by virtue of NMDARs risks pressure headaches from nootropic racetams, CILTP stack, or sunifiram, etc. At present I can't take 20 mg of phenylpiracetam without worsening my symptoms, so the feeling that racetams cause such symptoms too is understandable.

Edited by Climactic, 12 August 2013 - 04:54 PM.

[Sam375]

I see lot of people referring to "brain fog", is that what you guys call head pressure ?

[Climactic]

I see lot of people referring to "brain fog", is that what you guys call head pressure ?

Not at all. Head pressure is a distinct sensation of pressure-like pain in the temples. Brain fog has more to do with impaired cognition.

Edited by Climactic, 12 August 2013 - 06:58 PM.

[violetechos]

"To say that glycine agonism is NMDAR antagonism is nothing short of incoherent nonsense."

Well, no... perhaps I phrased it wrong. Glycine agonism is required to activate the NMDAR co-receptor system . Without glycine agonism at the syrychine part of the NMDAR co receptor ,which is the same part that accepts ZN+,PB and caffeine (an antagonist here), no natural NMDA antagonism through kyeurenic acid and the polyamines and what not...



What have you been responding to ,that helps? Does zinc do anything?

NMDAR receptor pharmacology is so complex, a receptor with another 2 inside it, more or less !

Climatic : http://pharmrev.aspe...t/50/4/597.full

Its the fulltext of
Glycine and N-Methyl-d-Aspartate Receptors: Physiological Significance and Possible Therapeutic Applications

Not the lightest reading, but you will benefit greatly from it, friend.

I've recovered from the ear buzzing and general O_O of a bad brush with sunifiram. It's pretty freaky deaky stuff honestly. This one is not a toy.

[Climactic]

What have you been responding to ,that helps? Does zinc do anything?

NMDAR receptor pharmacology is so complex, a receptor with another 2 inside it, more or less !

Climatic : http://pharmrev.aspe...t/50/4/597.full

Its the fulltext of
Glycine and N-Methyl-d-Aspartate Receptors: Physiological Significance and Possible Therapeutic Applications

Not the lightest reading, but you will benefit greatly from it, friend.

I've recovered from the ear buzzing and general O_O of a bad brush with sunifiram. It's pretty freaky deaky stuff honestly. This one is not a toy.

Thanks for the link! I'm glad to hear you've recovered.

Zinc and copper do nothing much for me, independently or together. I do take them anyway in reasonable amounts for general reasons. I understand that they both have complicated associations with NMDAR.

My neurologist had put me on Depakote ER (valproate semisodium) (VPA). I am still on it in a new dosing pattern. It has numerous possible dose-dependent side effects. I think it helped lower the severity of my symptoms but I still have a long way to go. I'd like to try other drugs like memantine, etc., but I should finish the VPA first. At this rate, it might be many months before I can call myself healed.

I have a lot of reading ahead of me.

Edited by Climactic, 12 August 2013 - 09:39 PM.

[xsiv1]

What have you been responding to ,that helps? Does zinc do anything?

NMDAR receptor pharmacology is so complex, a receptor with another 2 inside it, more or less !

Climatic : http://pharmrev.aspe...t/50/4/597.full

Its the fulltext of
Glycine and N-Methyl-d-Aspartate Receptors: Physiological Significance and Possible Therapeutic Applications

Not the lightest reading, but you will benefit greatly from it, friend.

I've recovered from the ear buzzing and general O_O of a bad brush with sunifiram. It's pretty freaky deaky stuff honestly. This one is not a toy.

Thanks for the link! I'm glad to hear you've recovered.

Zinc and copper do nothing much for me, independently or together. I do take them anyway in reasonable amounts for general reasons. I understand that they both have complicated associations with NMDAR.

My neurologist had put me on Depakote ER (valproate semisodium) (VPA). I am still on it in a new dosing pattern. It has numerous possible dose-dependent side effects. I think it helped lower the severity of my symptoms but I still have a long way to go. I'd like to try other drugs like memantine, etc., but I should finish the VPA first. At this rate, it might be many months before I can call myself healed.

I have a lot of reading ahead of me.

As such, I've yet to try my Sunifiram although I've accrued enough Gaba mimetics and agonists to attempt dosing it. Regardless, these carry their own risks so I'm confident that I will relegate Suni to sporadic use as I do with phenylpiracetam. One review on Amazon actually had me thinking that sporadic (not more than a couple days a week) may likely be beneficial. If not, then I have it a whirl. I've spent far more on drink tips during my heyday to know that what I paid for a novel nootropic (to do me good) that could pose a serious risk to me is nothing but a drop in the bucket metaphorically speaking. Alcohol did a number on me in those short years despite having recovered at an early enough age to know better. Thanks fellas.

[Isochroma]

WOW.

Sunifiram works a mighty ton better with normal androgen levels.

I've been severely hypogonadal.

No more - as of August 7th I've been on 10mg 99% pure Dianabol (Methandrostenolone) taken upon awakening.

Sunifiram was incapable of keeping the daytime sleepiness tiredness completely at bay when I was using 5F-AKB48 (synthetic cannabinoid), Sunifiram (25mg x 6/day) and Oxiracetam (500mg x 6/day).

Without the 5F-AKB48 Sunifiram is powerful enough to provide complete protection against daytime brain fatigue.

Dianabol is an androgen and it appears Sunifiram, Oxiracetam or both can't reach their full power if the user has an insufficient level of sex hormone.

Further, this afternoon I put the studio phones on and yet again! Sunifiram brought out massive complexity and detail in sound but that was only halfway. Now that I've got some reasonable level of androgen the music is even more complex, detailed and - suprise - it slowed down again this afternoon.

If it's a measure of this hormone's power - only Sunifiram could slow down music for me. But this afternoon it happened again - and at half-rate, literally.

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 13 August 2013 - 04:08 AM.

[Isochroma]

Starting today the Sunifiram portion of my nootropic regime will be halted.

I will be retesting Oxiracetam alone with upgraded hormonal status.

[xsiv1]

Not sure if you know, or care, but dianabol is really one of the most stressful steroids on the liver. The rebound is, well, worse.. Unless followed by some HCG and full PCT.

[malden]

WOW.

Sunifiram works a mighty ton better with normal androgen levels.

I've been severely hypogonadal.

No more - as of August 7th I've been on 10mg 99% pure Dianabol (Methandrostenolone) taken upon awakening.

Sunifiram was incapable of keeping the daytime sleepiness tiredness completely at bay when I was using 5F-AKB48 (synthetic cannabinoid), Sunifiram (25mg x 6/day) and Oxiracetam (500mg x 6/day).

Without the 5F-AKB48 Sunifiram is powerful enough to provide complete protection against daytime brain fatigue.

Dianabol is an androgen and it appears Sunifiram, Oxiracetam or both can't reach their full power if the user has an insufficient level of sex hormone.

Further, this afternoon I put the studio phones on and yet again! Sunifiram brought out massive complexity and detail in sound but that was only halfway. Now that I've got some reasonable level of androgen the music is even more complex, detailed and - suprise - it slowed down again this afternoon.

If it's a measure of this hormone's power - only Sunifiram could slow down music for me. But this afternoon it happened again - and at half-rate, literally.

Taking dianabol as trt.. o men. good luck with restarting your hpta

why not just one shot a week of some test cyp ?

[xsiv1]

It's clear that Isochroma is on a 'ho nudda leva' (from the SNL skit). But Iso, seriously, you're living in a place that will prescribe a far safer TRT regimen at perhaps nearly as close a price as real Dianabol which was discontinued some time ago only to be brought back, or rather, live on in other countries.. Please tell me you, at the very least, engage in some sort of resistance exercise lol. Even still, during my younger years and my forays into bodybuilding, I always had opportunities to buy that stuff only to reconsider. If you have a reliable source that deals with strictly a limited amount of items, even Sustanon is safer and Deca-Durabolin better yet. However, a doctor can most certainly prescribe you something that will likely not damage your liver (and is even safer for you than the two aforementioned alternatives) beyond what I'm sure it's already been through given your propensity for high dosing novel compounds. ;-) I only half kid here as its with all due respect and life experience - having been down similar roads before, - that I feel I'm compelled to ask that you reconsider. Regardless, I know you'll go on your own path as I've done. Some lessons have to be learned the hard way. I honestly do find your posts entertaining and, on behalf of science (for the greater good), insightful although it'd be even more of a bonus if only we got to hear of any side effects you've encountered along the way. Any. At all.

Why have you decided to discontinue Sunifiram at this point? Has its therapeutic value diminished? Was it responsible, in part, for any adverse or negative effects? Have you grown a tail? Give us something lol.

I'm joking with ya for the most part man, but I'd bet others are as intrigued as I am.

[Isochroma]

Can't get a prescription and no docs taking patients. Tired of being told for two decades that it's all in my head - including latest GP at the hospital after he looked over the tests.

It's working great so far and at 10mg in the morning, my own (inadequate) production is minimally impacted.

This is not bodybuilding but it is what the medicine was made for by Ziegler.

As for Sunifiram - it seems that today was a success with only one dose - it was premixed with Oxiracetam in the backpack minijar.

It occurs to me that the cheaper more functional racetams like Oxiracetam can work as well to defeat brain fatigue during the daytime as Sunifiram if hormone levels are normal.

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 13 August 2013 - 09:12 PM.

[Isochroma]

After spending half of today off Sunifiram I have come to two conclusions: The first is that the mid-to-high frequency potentiation induced by Sunifiram remained but without the enhancement, resulting in very ugly music.

The second observation was trying to find words twice in a day when it won't happen more than once in six months on Sunifiram.

The visual sharpness of the treeline against the sky was visibly decreased - even while Oxiracetam consumption continued.

Therefore I have decided that even if Sunifiram is no longer needed to prevent fatigue I shall continue to use it at 25mg x 6/day.

There's the subtle elements too - a reduction in my thought complexity and speed proved unacceptable.

It seems that since Summer 2008 I've been on the Nootropic Ratchet. There are of course many other such ratchets but the nootropics one is my concern. It's a metaphor for the one-way street that is moving from weaker nootropics to more potent and powerful ones.

Following my own ratchet, Piracetam, Aniracetam and nearly Pramiracetam have already been eliminated as they can no longer provide either sufficient power for price or absolute power.

The current regime is by many years of testing able to eliminate or reduce fatigue more than nearly any other combination. The key component to reduce brain fatigue in cases of sleep deprivation or loss of quality sleep is Sunifiram. Sunifiram's most potent specialty is the refactorization of sleep. It consistently increases the hour-efficiency of sleep by 55% in my case.

I expect that due to both the availability of new nootropics and the decline of biofunction due to aging the Nootropic Ratchet will have to continue swapping nootropic molecules.

I predict from partial experimentation that the absolute best available today nootropic stack to prevent daytime brain fatigue and fight back the slowing tiredness of aging. Piracetam is included for its acceleration feature.

Proposed for local implementation:

Piracetam: 5g x 6/day
Oxiracetam: 1g x 6/day
Sunifiram: 25mg x 6/day
Unifiram: 25mg x 6/day

Racetams that cause slowdowns or emptybrain such as Aniracetam and Pramiracetam are fundamentally flawed and thus not included.

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 14 August 2013 - 07:58 PM.

[Isochroma]

Sunifiram: Incomplete with partial power.

Dirifiram: Complete with full power.

There is still much work to do. Sunifiram is just a start. I think my next project will be a custom synthesis of the world's next nootropic: Dirifiram.

Sunifiram is only halfway complete because of the propanoyl group - misplaced on the piperazine ring where it has no right to be.

The only thing that belongs on the second Nitrogen is a benzoyl.

This molecule is crying for symmetricization and there are multiple functional precedents in the Racetam family.

Sunifiram's lack of complete symmetricization causes a major problem: it has complete potentiation power but incomplete depotentiation power. Both creation and destruction in perfection of equal measure are required for Paradise on Earth to be realized.

Symmetricization of the benzoyl groups will equalize its powers of potentiation and depotentiation, preventing the few cases of overpotentiation who could not depotentiate.

[Isochroma]

Request for links: if you know of any affordable custom organic synth outfits - it's time to create Dirifiram.

I've got a few myself but the key is getting affordability.

The question's got to be answered and it's easy to test.

There is absolutely huge massive gigantic territory to be explored in just the atomic arrangement space between Sunifiram and Unifiram.

Considering both the absolute power and potency of these two molecules it is unreasonable to not continue searching for even more powerful or qualitatively unique molecules using the two existors as metatemplates.

The creators did execute a fairly large search but it was far from exhaustive.

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 14 August 2013 - 08:19 PM.

[Climactic]

Not only is there no animal or human research on this chemical, but there is also no literature on anything called 'dirifiram" whatsoever. Is there another name for it in literature? If not, then are you seriously asking people to become labrats? To you it may seem safe, even safer than sunifiram as you posited above, but I think your best bet is to discuss the structure with the current researchers of sunifiram rather than recommend that people here take it blindly.

[Isochroma]

GIF animated OK.

Animation coming shortly.

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 14 August 2013 - 08:24 PM.

[xsiv1]

Thank you for the feedback. I can find you a doctor if you'd like. I'm almost certain of that. ;-) Now, granted, I'm just as disenchanted with some of today's practitioners as you may be. It can be utterly disappointing when you learn that the very doctor you're dealing with knows less of a given topic than you do. CME should be a mandate. Regardless, here's a link to something you may be interested in and within contains a custom synth lab. I'm on my phone using Tapatalk so I can't give you the exact page right now : http://www.longecity...er?#entry527766

[Isochroma]

Climactic:

The current researchers of Sunifiram have stopped communicating with me. They were academic specialists who cared about getting their papers in and their grants and qualifications. In their last communication with me they have told me their research is done because of the economy and other factors.

Next: you seem to have a love of literature but words of the kind I want to make don't originate from paper or screens. Discussions don't work because we're dealing with global electric fields touching not reactions. Therefore global simulation is required and that is way too costly.

Thus the only way to tell is with living brains. The rats didn't have much to say about Sunifiram and Unifiram compared to the people.

I am not prone to caution and have a rather short timeline combined with a pressing need for absolute perfection.

That triumvirate of lethal combination is the rocket fuel for journeys into orbit and from there to space.

Investments in projects that require faith, deep computation, intuition or long determination to compute outcome interest me.

What interests me even more is the primely fun of proposing an impossibly big bet and laughing my head off if it wins or loses.

Nobody but maybe USMIL's got the needed quantum simulation rate and capacity to even remotely explore the feeling of how Sunifiram, Unifiram and Dirifiram touch various surfaces, especially AMPA receptors - which leaves this risky yet rewarding field open to disposable brains and new computation hardwares of heretofore unimagined configurations.

[xsiv1]

Told ya. Totally different level. I thought Isochroma's novel compound was one that he thought of trying to actually get synthesized through his own instructions /diagram - and for him to try. I've never heard of that noot, but it seemed that he felt an improvement in Sunifiram could be made by altering the molecule.

If you're truly low T, as evidenced by blood panels... this dosing of Dianabol will surely make you feel ALIVE. I mean alive like you haven't been alive since you were 18, assuming you're some years older. Low T is responsible for a lot of adverse symptoms experienced daily. One being, chronic fatigue. Don't get surprised if your sleep becomes a bit more fragile even at that daily dose.

[Isochroma]

Where do you think the recent posts came from My weak body can barely stand the sides at 10mg ED.

What should have taken minutes took half the day due to lack of competent GIF animator software.

The animation is a journey starting from Sunifiram and ending at Dirifiram.

Animated GIF - be sure to enable GIF animation in your browser:

AVI Video File (1.7 MB): Sunifiram-to-Dirifiram-to-Sunifiram-10FPS.avi

Edited by Isochroma-Reborn, 15 August 2013 - 01:43 AM.