4029 replies to this topic

[zeroskater6979]

I don't know if this has already been discussed (hey it's a pretty long thread) but has anyone on TULIP improved their DNB scores or noticed substantial math/reading/writing/speaking skill improvement?

[OpaqueMind]

My ability to express myself has become much smoother; thoughts flow better - within my mind, and out of my mouth. I also used to make some mistakes and corrections while writing with a pen but now I make none and my writing seems neater. Reading comprehension I feel has also been enhanced a little, but that's a harder one to measure.

I also seem to be able to access a state of heightened being during which all processing, creative and communicative abilities are enhanced. It's like a mild mania, often it hits if I'm deep in conversation and we're talking about something that excites me. Except the excitement runs much deeper than usual. I also get this if I'm pondering something deeply, and it seems I can sometimes self-induce it if I ask myself a lot of rapidfire questions about something and open my mind to pure curiousity. These states seem to be facilitated by TULIP, and go above and beyond the baseline elevation which I've also experienced from it.

[zeroskater6979]

Thanks for your reply Opaque. I know you've been asked but you have been taking NSI w/ TULIP correct? or at least plan on doing both? has anything changed w/ the NSI (more profound effects)? or is it too early to tell? Thanks

[OpaqueMind]

I've toned down the laser for now so I'm only doing it once every three days but so far there doesn't seem to any direct synergy, that is to say I haven't noticed a multiplicative effect, only an additive one. That's not to belittle the potency of each treatment though - NSI has been profound for my general well-being - the jury's still out on its nootropic potential. Baking fresh batches of delicious neuron-cake takes time. I will stick with this protocol for now and then re-introduce the laser full force when I have finished a two month course of NSI.

In other news I am waiting on the delivery of neurofeedback equipment. I went ahead and invested in NeurOptimal, found a cheapish 2nd hand seller on eBay much to my good fortune. Given the varying modalities (EEG and HEG) and customisability of treatments I also brought a pocket neurobics set, but I have no fucking clue how to do EEG. Can anyone point me towards some resources for how to train myself to use it? If anyone is interested I can write more about my experiences with NeurOptimal and/or HEG when the time comes.

[zeroskater6979]

I definitely want to hear about your NeurOptimal experiences.

[lostfalco]

Hey LF,
You've previously expressed interest in M blue. I happened to make a post about it that explains clearly and simply how to use it. It has at least 1 MOA in common with LLLT, so I think it could be apropos for people trying to enhance their mitochondria. The effects are similar to LLLT.
http://selfhacked.co...itive-enhancer/

Just read through your blog post Joe...very well done! Loved the discussion of hormesis, MB's role as an electron donor/antioxidant, and MB's relationship to ATP and LLLT. I'll be really interested in hearing your results with it and how it compares to and/or synergizes with LLLT.

[lostfalco]

Hi. I have been using Rhodiola Rosea with TULIP (inc LLLT 2x a week 2min per spot on total of 3 brain areas bilaterally) stack recently and it seems to have very good synergy. I did a little bit research and found this: http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15500079

Effect of extracts from Rhodiola rosea and Rhodiola crenulata (Crassulaceae) roots on ATP content in mitochondria of skeletal muscles.


We studied the effects of oral treatment with extracts from Rhodiola rosea (50 mg/kg) and Rhodiola crenulata (50 mg/kg) roots on the duration of exhaustive swimming and ATP content in mitochondria of skeletal muscles in rats. Treatment with R. rosea extract significantly (by 24.6%) prolonged the duration of exhaustive swimming in comparison with control rats and rats treated with R. crenullata. R. rosea extract activated the synthesis or resynthesis of ATP in mitochondria and stimulated reparative energy processes after intense exercise. Experiments proved different pharmacological characteristics of R. rosea and R. crenulata: R. rosea is most effective for improving physical working capacity.

Atm my TULIP (and related substances) stack consist of:

300mg of ALCAR
5g of Creatine (taken with 1g of baking soda for better absorption)
20mg of PQQ and 100mg of CoQ10
Shilajit 600mg
LLLT 2x a week 2min per spot on total of 3 brain areas bilaterally with 300mw laser (either 660nm or 830nm wavelength)
Pregnenolone 100mg
C60 in EVOO 6mg (planing to increase the dose to 24mg) a week in one dose
Rhodiola rosea extract (1%/3%) 250mg

Whats most important is the perceived effectiveness of this stack. Concentration seems better, talk more coherent and even calculus/math a bit easier to tackle.

That's awesome Mait. Really cool that you've been having good results. I like the way your stack centers around ATP production via mitochondrial enhancement. What's really fascinating to me as well is your use of different wavelengths...are you using 830nm one day and 660nm on the second day of your 2x/wk routine?

[Nattzor]

Hey LF,
You've previously expressed interest in M blue. I happened to make a post about it that explains clearly and simply how to use it. It has at least 1 MOA in common with LLLT, so I think it could be apropos for people trying to enhance their mitochondria. The effects are similar to LLLT.
http://selfhacked.co...itive-enhancer/

Just read through your blog post Joe...very well done! Loved the discussion of hormesis, MB's role as an electron donor/antioxidant, and MB's relationship to ATP and LLLT. I'll be really interested in hearing your results with it and how it compares to and/or synergizes with LLLT.

http://i.imgur.com/osuCGZV.png
http://i.imgur.com/Ok5muQJ.png

- From a paper you recommended. Really interesting, I'm guessing MB and LLLT synergises a lot. According to the paper, complex IV is the limiting factor of the mitochondira (atleast in ATP-production). Then we take this from wiki:

It also has been shown that in low doses methylene blue protects the brain from disease by acting as an antioxidant in the mitochondria, it also acts as an artificial electron donor to complex I, complex II, complex III, and complex IV of the mitochondria.

LLLT and MB should both greatly enhance the limiting factor (and a lot of the other factors), thus boost ATP even more.

[Strangelove]

If anyone is interested I can write more about my experiences with NeurOptimal and/or HEG when the time comes.

Please do so, I am very interested to hear your future experiences with NeurOptimal.

[lostfalco]

Hey LF,
You've previously expressed interest in M blue. I happened to make a post about it that explains clearly and simply how to use it. It has at least 1 MOA in common with LLLT, so I think it could be apropos for people trying to enhance their mitochondria. The effects are similar to LLLT.
http://selfhacked.co...itive-enhancer/

Just read through your blog post Joe...very well done! Loved the discussion of hormesis, MB's role as an electron donor/antioxidant, and MB's relationship to ATP and LLLT. I'll be really interested in hearing your results with it and how it compares to and/or synergizes with LLLT.

http://i.imgur.com/osuCGZV.png
http://i.imgur.com/Ok5muQJ.png

- From a paper you recommended. Really interesting, I'm guessing MB and LLLT synergises a lot. According to the paper, complex IV is the limiting factor of the mitochondira (atleast in ATP-production). Then we take this from wiki:

It also has been shown that in low doses methylene blue protects the brain from disease by acting as an antioxidant in the mitochondria, it also acts as an artificial electron donor to complex I, complex II, complex III, and complex IV of the mitochondria.

LLLT and MB should both greatly enhance the limiting factor (and a lot of the other factors), thus boost ATP even more.

Right on Nattzor. You are seeing the theory behind these supplement recommendations very clearly.

It's all (almost) about energy conversion. We are taking chemical energy from the environment (fat/protein/carbs/oxygen, etc.), converting it to electrical energy (proton gradient, electron transport, etc.), using that electrical energy to make chemical energy (ATP), and then converting ATP's chemical energy into mechanical energy (thus powering our molecular machinery). Our molecular machines consist of 'walkers', 'swimmers', 'pumps', 'engines', etc. These ATP-powered machines help us synthesize hormones, create neurotransmitters, aid in digestion, clean plaques from our brains, copy DNA, check for DNA errors, etc. The list goes on for light-years. Just pick a biological process and ATP-powered nano-machines are almost certainly involved. The more ATP they have, the faster (and maybe better) they do their work. Physicist turned molecular biologist, Peter Hoffman explains this extremely well. His book has been added to the short list of essential TULIP reading along with Gonzalez-Lima's summary article and the LEF advertisement. If you're short on time I recommend starting with chapter 3. =) http://www.amazon.co...ratchet hoffman

About methylene blue...Aarfai has reported excellent results combining it (60mcg) with TULIP over the past few months. He was a very early laser adopter and also started TULIP right about the same time Opaque and I did. He's also been experimenting with some very intriguing mitochondria/cellular respiration enhancing supplements. This http://www.amazon.co...evity formula and this http://www.amazon.co...f mitochondrial

These seem to me to be excellent choices (theoretically) and his experience seems to bear that out so far (2 months). Props to him.

Edited by lostfalco, 27 August 2013 - 03:00 PM.

[Barfly]

Hello everyone !

First I would like to thank lostfalco and everyone who contributed for an amazing thread, really excited about getting on TULIP !

I just have 2 questions please :

96 LED lamps mentioned in the thread - do they come with an adapter and are ready to use out of the box or should I also order some kind of adapter or some other parts to make them usable for our purposes?

Is there any difference in effects between the laser or using LED lamps? Do you use both side by side or can I go with either of those options? Thank you for all your help

[lostfalco]

Hello everyone !

First I would like to thank lostfalco and everyone who contributed for an amazing thread, really excited about getting on TULIP !

I just have 2 questions please :

96 LED lamps mentioned in the thread - do they come with an adapter and are ready to use out of the box or should I also order some kind of adapter or some other parts to make them usable for our purposes?

Is there any difference in effects between the laser or using LED lamps? Do you use both side by side or can I go with either of those options? Thank you for all your help

No problem. I hope some of this craziness makes your life a little better. =)

Here's a 96 LED with an adapter. http://www.ebay.com/...=item232c0ac99b

Here's a 48 LED with an adapter. http://www.ebay.com/...=item3a80a68672

Both lasers and LEDs will work...I like the LEDs because they are cheaper, safer, and I've had very good results lasering my entire brain. Nothing dogmatic here though.

Make sure you read up, listen to your body, and place safety above all else. The goal is to feel amazing and optimize abilities for life. Feel free to ask questions. =)

[lostfalco]

If anyone is interested I can write more about my experiences with NeurOptimal and/or HEG when the time comes.

Please do so, I am very interested to hear your future experiences with NeurOptimal.

I strongly second (or third?) this as well Opaque. =)

I wish NeurOptimal was a little more transparent with how their technology works but that doesn't mean it doesn't work. I don't really hold their desire for a little secrecy against them. Regardless, I'm looking forward to hearing your experience.

[lostfalco]

Alright guys, I'm REALLY sorry to do this but I have to add one more book to the essential reading list for understanding this approach nootropics. It has A LOT of the same info as "Life's Ratchet" but adds a visual element that really makes the concepts of biophysics/molecular biology understandable (I always like to read more than one book about the same topic anyway). The transition from particle physics to chemistry to biology is where the fundamental enhancements are hiding. They are right there waiting for us to grab them. I can't wait for you guys to see this! (many of you probably already do) Anyway, check out this book if you have the time. http://www.amazon.co...&pf_rd_i=507846

Edited by lostfalco, 28 August 2013 - 10:29 PM.

[EncyclopediaBrown]

If anyone is interested I can write more about my experiences with NeurOptimal and/or HEG when the time comes.

Please do so, I am very interested to hear your future experiences with NeurOptimal.

I strongly second (or third?) this as well Opaque. =)

I wish NeurOptimal was a little more transparent with how their technology works but that doesn't mean it doesn't work. I don't really hold their desire for a little secrecy against them. Regardless, I'm looking forward to hearing your experience.

Check out z-score, it's what I use at my Dr's office.

http://www.eegworksh...dex.php/z-score

http://www.brainm.com/


Also I just bought the 96 LED, I also bought the vetro laser. You say the 96 LED is easier? Do I just put in on each spot on my brain for 3 minutes? It looks like it has a big surface area. Does that mean you only hold it over about 5 spots to get the whole brain?

Thanks!

Edited by EncyclopediaBrown, 28 August 2013 - 10:41 PM.

[phil8462643]

I just ordered the 48 and 96. Will post my results here when they arrive!

[OpaqueMind]

I have a rough plan for total neurophysiological evolution, with synergistic components which will hopefully make the whole far more than the sum of it's parts. To outline this idea very roughly, it goes something like this;

1. Globally incite neuronal growth with NSI-189
2. Use PQQ+CoQ10 to upgrade mitochondrial function
3. Use LLLT to further enhance neurogenesis and resilience
4. Adopt a state of Ketosis or near ketosis in order to upregulate metabolic activity, cerebral bloodflow and neuroprotection via ketone bodies
5. Synchronise whole brain activity via intense neurofeedback (most likely with NeurOptimal) and meditation sessions.

Theoretically this should produce an incredibly efficient network of highly interconnected neurons, or perhaps rather set the framework for the manifestation of these structures to emerge with the aid of prolonged study. High interconnectivity is the neural correlate of a deeply associative mind aka pattern recognition on and between many levels of abstraction.

[OpaqueMind]

Would you care to elaborate Mr. Negative? Which part of what I've said do you feel is wrong? Perhaps I should not have used the word 'is' about high connectivity and association, that is saying too much... let me rephrase; High connectivity seems to be, in certain cases, the physical basis for the correlate of association. Obviously there are cases which do not involve association, I should not have been so rash. Forgive me, I am sleep deprived! If that was not it then I am at a loss as to your particular gripe with my comment...

[Plasticperson]

+1 for Opaque, all i read was good information. Receiving 48 led in mail today. Will post results later.

I currently have a left frontal lobe headache; hopefully the therapy will help with this.

[lostfalco]

If anyone is interested I can write more about my experiences with NeurOptimal and/or HEG when the time comes.

Please do so, I am very interested to hear your future experiences with NeurOptimal.

I strongly second (or third?) this as well Opaque. =)

I wish NeurOptimal was a little more transparent with how their technology works but that doesn't mean it doesn't work. I don't really hold their desire for a little secrecy against them. Regardless, I'm looking forward to hearing your experience.

Check out z-score, it's what I use at my Dr's office.

http://www.eegworksh...dex.php/z-score

http://www.brainm.com/


Also I just bought the 96 LED, I also bought the vetro laser. You say the 96 LED is easier? Do I just put in on each spot on my brain for 3 minutes? It looks like it has a big surface area. Does that mean you only hold it over about 5 spots to get the whole brain?

Thanks!

Cool you're trying this man! I just posted a summary of some of my recommendations. It's very imperfect and needs A LOT of editing (I'll be updating it frequently), but it's a start. Check it out here. http://www.longecity...1887-lostfalco/

I just ordered the 48 and 96. Will post my results here when they arrive!

Sounds good man. Look forward to getting more feedback! I just posted a few recommendations/guidelines here. http://www.longecity...1887-lostfalco/

Edited by lostfalco, 31 August 2013 - 12:56 AM.

[mettmett]

Supplements:
http://www.amazon.co...0?ie=UTF8&psc=1
http://www.amazon.co...0?ie=UTF8&psc=1
60 mcg Methylene Blue (cannot be used with CoQ10)

Laser:
808nm 200mW IR Laser

So I was wondering: Do you use MB the same day as the laser/LED or would you do it on a non-laser day.

As of right now I am doing EOD with both, alternating between laser and mb. I know MB has one method of action similar to laser, but I couldnt decide if It would overlap and be detrimental or if they could be used together and be synergistic.

My question is should these two be stacked or used on alternating days? I just used my 2nd dose of MB on an alternating schedule and it seems to be working well so far. (thanks Joe Cohen for the easy MB guide)

And also you said you shouldnt use co10 along with meth blue, but since my pqq and coq10 are in the same pill, I was wondering if i should be able to take the pills at night, since the half life of methblue is only 6hrs anyway? so morning dose MB and night dose pqq/coq10? correct? "http://pubchem.ncbi....ry.cgi?cid=6099

Anyways my current regime looks like this:

So Day 1: all AM..going to start lasering at night though to try it out.
LED/Laser whole brain ~5minutes (what ive worked up to so far)
nutrivene curcumin (ive tried wakalert and sunmodafinil but i cant justify the money since i didnt have any noticable results..i will try modafinil again if i can get the legit one and not some offbrand version from india)
creatine and d-ribose (I already had in stock),
b-complex
quercetin (till it runs out)
ebay pqq + coq10 supp
vit D

Day 2: all AM
Methylene Blue ~60mcg
nutrivene curcumin
creatine and d-ribose
b-complex
quercetin (till it runs out)
pregnenlone 50mg
PM Pqq + Coq10?

I have been lasering for about 3 weeks now and have definetly noticed benefits. I just recently added a lot of stuff like the 96 LEDs, the ebay Pqq/coq10, and the curcumin. So it will take time to see how it pans out. Some things I have noticed: I have more initiative...At work I can formulate plans on how to get the job done easier and quicker than before. My conversational skills are increasing along with my wit, but its not quite at the level id like it to be. I am still working on making my brain more 'well at quips'(well equipped). I did have a noticeable moment today where I had everyone laughing with a joke I was running along with.. just ad-libbing a long scenario that turned out really funny. I didnt really see where it was going in my head, but I was in the zone and it just came to me.

I notice I am making more connections with previous knowledge and intertwining it with stuff i currently read. While I have been following this thread from the start, Ive had my own side goal of figuring out how to have the healthiest blood...I came across a book called the Mucus free diet system by Arnold Ehret and I have to say it really resonates with me. So right now I am transitioning from a paleo/primal/bulletproof diet (ive tried them all) towards this one. Although physically I am fit with a 6 pack abs, strong, fast..ive always had a problem with foods giving me mucus..moreso than i notice anyone else I know having. it was pure luck that I came across this book and i just finished and now started the Rational Fasting book of his. I figured strong mitochondria need the blood feeding it to be strong as well. That was my reasoning at least. I just started this diet and will let you know how it goes. but damn its tough going from eating all of that meat to not eating any...:(

Thats all i have to say for now, keep up the good work everyone, this is definetly one of the best things that has happened to my life...aside from finding the girl im going to marry, but thats a different story

edit: quick summary of the mucus-less diet. pretty much our bodies have been accumulating wastes since birth from wrong food intake. all foods produce acid(read mucus in his book) except for vegetables and fruits. the body's (natures) way of eliminating these wastes is through the absence of food (fasting). You have to follow a transition diet for a while, which is mostly vegetables, serving to rebuild the blood and act as a broom through the intenstines. after your body is 'clean' you can eat fruit and eventually sustain vibrant life off of one type of fruit that is in season. He claims that a fruited body will scab over instantly when cut and wont bleed. I keep an open mind when it comes to anything so I am willing to try this. I love the taste of a fresh orange mm.

Edited by mettmett, 01 September 2013 - 11:40 PM.

[Plasticperson]

i honestly can't see any difference other than a feeling like i drank too much coffee for about a half hour after beaming my head with leds. I do however feel a little off today (light therapy session was yesterday morning). Ill do a second light session tomorrow and see if any new effects arise. im using the 9 dollar 48 led off of ebay 850 nm

[Plasticperson]

Iv'e also been a little tired today but apparently this is normal... at least i know its working!

[88LS]

This protocol works guys, I feel totally *effing* awesome, all of the time!

[lostfalco]

This protocol works guys, I feel totally *effing* awesome, all of the time!

Me too! =)

[Nattzor]

Why not start doing tests to see the effects and not just "feel" it?

And a question, why didn't CoQ10 and MB work together?

[lostfalco]

In keeping with our focus on the most fundamental enhancements possible, another supplement/dietary constituent that I've been looking into is DNA/RNA/nucleotides/nucleosides. These have been shown to enhance immune system function when taken with Omega 3s and arginine (in pretty high doses). Also, they have been associated with longevity and enhanced learning in rats. We obviously get a lot of these substances when we eat, but sometimes a little supplementation might help. Just a thought. Have any of you guys tried these or do you have any warnings?

Here are some studies/articles.

Nucleotide supplementation seems safe, helps humans recover from surgery, and enhances immune function.
http://www.webmd.com...ame=RNA AND DNA

Here's a good discussion of dietary nucleotides and the immune system.
http://www.nature.co...df/1601475a.pdf

Dietary nucleotides are antioxidants and possibly extend lifespan in rats.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/23459974

Dietary nucleotides increase phosphatidylcholine in the cerebral cortex, increase DHA and ARA in cortex, and enhance learning in rats.
http://www.beanstalk...cleotide/05.pdf

Edited by lostfalco, 02 September 2013 - 02:03 PM.

[lostfalco]

Why not start doing tests to see the effects and not just "feel" it?

And a question, why didn't CoQ10 and MB work together?

Excellent point Nattzor! I've asked the best self-experimenter on the internet to blind himself (hopefully not with the laser), test LLLT/TULIP, and measure his results. He's seriously thinking about it. http://www.reddit.co...pplications_of/

Check out gwern's blog here. The dude is awesome. http://www.gwern.net

Here's his nootropic experiments section. http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics

Edited by lostfalco, 02 September 2013 - 02:05 PM.

[Nattzor]

Why not start doing tests to see the effects and not just "feel" it?

And a question, why didn't CoQ10 and MB work together?

Excellent point Nattzor! I've asked the best self-experimenter on the internet to blind himself (hopefully not with the laser), test LLLT/TULIP, and measure his results. He's seriously thinking about it. http://www.reddit.co...pplications_of/

Check out gwern's blog here. The dude is awesome. http://www.gwern.net

Here's his nootropic experiments section. http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics

Or, you know, you and everyone else can do it too.

I'm planning on going 1 week on, 1 week off and measure, might blind it if I can.

[lostfalco]

Btw, while we're on the subject of DNA/RNA...check out this article. It will be very interesting to see if future research supports or refutes these findings, but I just can't help but think of J.B.S. Haldane at times like these. "I have no doubt that in reality the future will be vastly more surprising than anything I can imagine. Now my own suspicion is that the Universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose."

Apparently, there is preliminary evidence that dietary miRNAs affect your gene expression! Um yeah...that's cross-kingdom gene regulation. (if it's true)
http://www.karger.com/Article/Pdf/345826

"Moreover, the potential of food-derived miRNAs to affect host gene expression is a really exciting discovery. If these results are confirmed and more examples are found, the phrase ‘you are what you eat’ should be complemented with ‘and some of the food-derived miRNAs are capable of regulating the expression of your genes’. In such a situation, we will be witnessing another case of cross-kingdom gene regulation, similar in concept to the regulation of host genes by viral miRNAs [77], and food-derived exogenous miRNAs should be considered as novel nutrient components, just like amino acids or vitamins. In fact, miRNAs with immunomodulatory activities have been found in human breast milk in the first 6 months of lactation, where they can putatively regulate the infant’s immune system develop- ment [78]."

"Apparently some food-derived miRNAs are stable to cooking, are resistant to enzymatic digest in the gastrointestinal tract, are stable in animal serum, and are able to regulate gene expression in the organisms that ingest them. Another example has just recently been reported showing that bacterial regulatory RNAs can affect gene expression in an invertebrate [76]."

Edited by lostfalco, 02 September 2013 - 02:40 PM.