11 replies to this topic

[choqueiro]

Hi.

Any positive experience in the treatment of anxiety wit L-lysine??

I think anxiety is my biggest problem actually and the reason of many of my symptoms. Recently I read about the possibilities of this compound. Best results seem to be in combination with L-arginine.


Here is the study (http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/17510493):

Biomed Res. 2007 Apr;28(2):85-90.
Oral treatment with L-lysine and L-arginine reduces anxiety and basal cortisol levels in healthy humans.

Smriga M, Ando T, Akutsu M, Furukawa Y, Miwa K, Morinaga Y.

Source

Institute of Life Sciences, Ajimoto Co. Inc, 1-1 Suzuki-cho, 210-8681 Kawasaki-ku, Kawasaki-shi, Japan. miro_smriga@ehq.ajinomoto.com

Abstract


Dietary supplementation with an essential amino acid L-lysine has been shown to reduce chronic anxiety in humans with low dietary intake of L-lysine. A combination of L-lysine and L-arginine has been documented to normalize hormonal stress responses in humans with high trait anxiety. The present study was carried out in one hundred eight healthy Japanese adults. The aim of study was to find out whether a week-long oral treatment with L-lysine (2.64 g per day) and L-arginine (2.64 g per day) reduces trait and stress-induced state anxiety and basal levels of stress hormones. We confirmed that, without regard to gender, the amino acid treatment significantly reduced both trait anxiety and state anxiety induced by cognitive stress battery. In addition, we found that the treatment with L-lysine and L-arginine decreased the basal levels of salivary cortisol and chromogranin-A (a salivary marker of the sympatho-adrenal system) in male subjects. These results of this double-blind, placebo controlled and randomized study confirm the previous findings in humans and animals and point to a combination of L-lysine and L-arginine as a potentially useful dietary intervention in otherwise healthy humans with high subjective levels of mental stress and anxiety.


I´m really worried about the effects that this treatment could have in the growth hormone and it´s potential cancer risk. Some studies said that it does not increase growth hormone (see: http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/8315224) and in some forums it is said the opposite: "when combined with L-lysine , L-arginine´s effects on growth hormone levels are amplified" (see: http://www.thereales...s.com/hgh2.html).

Any opinion would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

[Lufega]

I still use it but i fou d that lysine one works just as well. Lysine also increases protein synthesis so it has a positive effect on hair growth.

[choqueiro]

Thanks so much Lufega.

What brand do you use?? Dosage?? Any tolerance in the long term??

[BioFreak]

I tried it to reduce avoidance behavior, which is an anxiety behavior in essence.

Didn't do much. Not alone, not with arginine.

Turns out facing fears(watch out for the fight instead of flight response though), and doing cbt for generalized anxiety disorder works much better.

Maybe read the book "treating generalized anxiety disorder Evidence based strategies, tools and techniques". But its more for the practitioner who wants to work with his clients.

[choqueiro]

The last few days I have been investigating (a little bit more) about supplements against anxiety. I´m considering for my next stack: L-Lysine + L-Arginine; Fish oil and Magnesium taurate.

I have some doubts about this combo:

1) Arginine (and Lysine indirectly) increases HGH. Increasing the human growth hormone is associated with cancer risk. I´m really confused because fight against cancer is a well known benefit of arginine (see point 9 of http://www.livingwit...ginine-benefits). The only explication to this contradiction I found it in this web (see:http://www.lef.org/m...arginine_01.htm). In this web it is said that "Arginine does not always stop the growth of cancer. It can do the opposite (...). The reason that arginine can act differently, depending on the cancer, probably has to do with an enzyme known as arginase. If the cancer creates a lot of the enzyme, it appears that it will use arginine to promote growth by converting it to L-ornithine. If the cancer doesn't create much arginase, it probably converts arginine to nitric oxide instead. Nitric oxide is used by immune cells to fight cancer. Since cancer cells are not tested for arginase, it's impossible to tell what effect arginine will have on cell growth". According to this information supplementing with arginine is safe??

2) There is a fantastic thread in this forum created by ScienceGuy about "TREATING ANXIETY SAFELY & EFFECTIVELY" (see: http://www.longecity...ly-effectively/). It´s curious that nobody in that thread mentions L-lysine + L-arginine as an effective supplement. In this thread it is said that magnesium is an effective way to fight against anxiety. I found this study that supports the effectivity of Lysine + Arginine and the ineffectivity of Magnesium (see: http://www.biomedcen...eases/20101005b).

3) To prevent against free radicals during the supplementation with arginine many users recommend to take antioxidants. Antioxidants in the scientific literature (in general) seem to be a "good" supplement until january. In that month appears an interview to the geneticist James Watson in which he said that "antioxidants may actually be causing cancer" (see: http://io9.com/5975002/james-watson-says-antioxidants-may-actually-be-causing-cancer). According to this information should I avoid taking any antioxidant??

[Neal Cullum]

Niacin helps my anxiety loads. i take it religously every day. if you don't like the 'flush' from it then take niacinamide. avoid caffeine also if anxiety is really bad, green tea is a safer bet if you need caffeine. meditation also.

[Duchykins]

I take extra lysine (500mg -1g /day) but only the little bit of arginine that's in my protein powder, since arginine is a vasodilator and often triggers migraines for me.

Lysine has mild nootropic effects and is a good weapon to have in my arsenal of migraine preventatives.

If I get cancer, oh well. At least I had more freedom from migraines terrorizing my life.

And zinc is so overlooked, so undervalued it's not even funny.


Magnesium is extremely helpful depending on what you need and what you already have. People low on mag will find find its supplementation very useful for preventing headaches, easing low mood and anxiety and restlessness. It is a critical supplement for people with autism and attention deficit problems.


Antioxidants can cause cancer - if you're taking TOO MUCH for TOO LONG. It turns out that oxidants are useful for a few things. Our immune systems use oxidation to protect us from invaders. Taking beaucoup antioxidants and causing a significant oxidant/antioxidant imbalance in your body is what is hurting people.

Chemical imbalances hurting people is old news. Now we just have another thing to try to keep balanced.

People who have depression or anxiety or sleep issues (or get migraines) are frequently found to have pretty low antioxidant levels in their brains. I think if you're stressed out a lot, keep some fruity antioxidants in your supplements. If you're not stressed out, you don't need them so much.


Keep it down with the vitamins A, C, D and E. That's right, I put C in there - especially for men. More C means you absorb more iron and the extra iron stays with you until you bleed somewhere. Some multivitamin manufacturers are finally catching onto this and keep iron out of men's multivitamins, and post-menopausal women's multis. Also a lot of multivitamins for kids, and autistic people have had iron removed from their product. You are only hurting yourself if you are loading on iron you don't need, and the only people that really need iron supplements are those who are *actually* deficient, bleeding or having a surgery. It is now unclear if pregnant women and fetuses are really better off with more iron as we like to think they do. So I'm just saying, just because you pee out excess vitamin C doesn't mean taking megadoses regularly won't hurt you. It can, indirectly.

And wtf, I saw 4000 IU vitamin E capsules at Walmart the other day. That much vitamin E regularly will kill you one day. Not directly, but it's the spark that kills you. Well not for sure, but mortality rates are significantly higher in people taking lots of E as an 'antioxidant'. New research shows that the new "max" for E is 2000 IU a day.

There is no reason to go way above the DV with antioxidants unless you have a different reason and you talked to your doctor about it. Opt for some fruits if you feel you need antioxidants. A lot of people don't know that quite a bit of the antioxidants they take are destroyed in the stomach.

[Ames]

Lysine acts like a barbiturate. That's why it treats anxiety.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/8587651

 

Also, Lysine tolerance also seems like it might develop, though the inferences to be made from the language in the following extract are a little bit over my head for me to make any definitive statements. Someone else may wish to clarify (as well as for the abstract in the above link.)

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/8385623

 

My question is how arginine may or may not reduce any potential tolerance or other negative effects from Lysine, and thus if it is possible that a Lysine / Arginine combination might act as an anxiolytic that also prevents the usual downregulation and accompanying side effects.

Edited by golgi1, 20 March 2017 - 12:48 AM.

[Duchykins]

Lysine acts like a barbiturate. That's why it treats anxiety.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/8587651

 

Also, Lysine tolerance also seems like it might develop, though the inferences to be made from the language in the following extract are a little bit over my head for me to make any definitive statements. Someone else may wish to clarify (as well as for the abstract in the above link.)

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/8385623

 

My question is how arginine may or may not reduce any potential tolerance or other negative effects from Lysine, and thus if it is possible that a Lysine / Arginine combination might act as an anxiolytic that also prevents the usual downregulation and accompanying side effects.

 

 

That might be one of the reasons why various lysine compounds are sometimes used intravenously for pain treatment

[Xptriate]

i tried the exact lysine/arginine combo for the hpa axis reductiom. figured it could help my chronic insomnia. it gave 8 hours of solid sleep whenever i used it

 

however the weirdest reaction from it:

 - the muscle twitches, skin crawling, got insane to  a point it was all over body, including face, tongue, neck etc etc

 - 2 hours after waking up it always gave me a very deep depression, which i cant realted to anything else i experience before.

 

anyone had this happen to them too?

[sthira]

Off topic, so punch me in the face, but please be careful with high dose arginine. I was reading Greg Fahy's thymus regeneration patent and decided to try his protocol, which includes high dose arginine to stimulate regrowth. Well, I suddenly developed a terrible itchy rash which I thought might be shingles. High dose arginine may trigger shingles. And it turns out that one of the naturalistic solutions to shingles is lysine. So a few rounds of lysine for me and, yep, rash b gone.

With 2/g doses of lysine, I haven't experienced yet the insane skin crawling and deep depression reported above. But "deep depression" is kinda my typical mood anyway; so I haven't noticed even deeper downs with the lysine yet. I'll keep a bleary eye open for even deeper despair, however.

[jack black]

Lysine acts like a barbiturate. That's why it treats anxiety.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/8587651

My experience agrees with that. First time I took 1000mg I had to take a nap. There is minimal antianxiety at 500 mg, but I really take it to prevent diarrhea while on metformin.