80 replies to this topic

[albedo]

This looks a formulation from LEF with might fit a generic need with different forms of magnesium (including glycinate) but the full composition is not disclosed:

Magnesium (as magnesium oxide, citrate, succinate, TRAACS® magnesium lysyl glycinate chelate)

500 mg

How about it?

Edited by albedo, 01 December 2014 - 08:48 AM.

[albedo]

Damn.. i did not make my research here! LOT on information on magnesium forms in this Forum, e.g.

 

http://www.longecity...ntal-magnesium/

http://www.longecity...718#entry201718

[serp777]

 

 

Unfortunately for my RBC magnesium and despite an increase from 4.09 to 4.26 (I am supplementing with 1800mg of magnesium citrate prescribed by my doctor providing 300mg of magnesium) I am still under the ref range (4.77-5.84). I also noticed a muscular cramp happening in the night about 2 weeks ago which is very rare but a sign I need to increase maybe absorption or dosage. What would you recommend?         

 

 

I'm surprised you don't have relentless diarreah from that much magnesium citrate.  I'd suggest switching to a more bioavailable form, i.e. magnesium glycinate from Albion.  600mg elemental in 3 caplets from VitaCost.

 

 

Thank you. No it looks like I do not have a major problem with that despite sometime I noticed stool is not well formed and this might be an hint I need to change. This is the composition of the product:

 

• magnesium citrate (calc. anhydrous) 1830 mg
• magnesium content: 12 mmol = 24 mEq = 295.7 mg

Yes I will discuss a possible change with my doctor. I wonder what is the best form of magnesium in general, there is so much on the market today! What about L-Threonate which LEF makes a case for better absorption ? At VitaCost I could only find a 400mg version of glycinate. Can you provide a link?

 

Many people here will probably recommend magnesium citrate or something, but I personally really enjoy l threonate for the nootropic effects and better sleep. 

[albedo]

This looks a formulation from LEF with might fit a generic need with different forms of magnesium (including glycinate) but the full composition is not disclosed:

Magnesium (as magnesium oxide, citrate, succinate, TRAACS® magnesium lysyl glycinate chelate)

500 mg

How about it?

 

LEF disclosed the composition here:

481.25mg Mg (as magnesium oxide); 6.25mg Mg (as magnesium citrate); 6.25mg Mg (as magnesium succinate); 6.25mg Mg (as TRAACS® magnesium lysyl glycinate chelate)
 

[serp777]

 

This looks a formulation from LEF with might fit a generic need with different forms of magnesium (including glycinate) but the full composition is not disclosed:

Magnesium (as magnesium oxide, citrate, succinate, TRAACS® magnesium lysyl glycinate chelate)

500 mg

How about it?

 

LEF disclosed the composition here:

481.25mg Mg (as magnesium oxide); 6.25mg Mg (as magnesium citrate); 6.25mg Mg (as magnesium succinate); 6.25mg Mg (as TRAACS® magnesium lysyl glycinate chelate)
 

 

 

It's not all just about the amount of elemental magnesium. Magnesium oxide is usually not recommended for various reasons.
 

[albedo]

I appreciate that is the catch. I might go for a mix of citrate and threonate. I did not search on what is possibly wrong with the oxide though.

[albedo]

Zenman gives here some differences between the various magnesium forms and absorbability:

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=559988

[MachineGhostX]

Well i wasn't really discussing vitamin E, that just happened to be included in the quote from the Harvard review. Also the daily recommended dosage is 75 ug, and 200 ug exceeds that by 2.66667 times. Thats in addition to the selenium you're already getting. And it's only not uncommon because China contains most of the world's population and the soil there has low levels of selenium.

 

If anything you should probably do a blood test or urine test to see what you're deficient in and supplement the difference to meet the recommended level. Otherwise it has almost no benefits im aware of for exceeding that dosage. Perhaps you have a study showing that 200 ug is somehow more beneficial than the recommended 75 ug?

 

According to the NIH, most Americans get enough selenium in their diet, and I think most people on this forum are Americans, or maybe Europeans idk.

 

http://ods.od.nih.go...thProfessional/

 

 

The majority of selenium studies with positive effects use 200mcg/day which is why supplements are at that level.  The TUL is 400mcg, so thats enough of a margin of safety for diet and a supplement if you don't eat brazil nuts.  Don't confuse adequate with optimal.  Adequate as in the RDA is only for making sure that glutathione is produced, nothing else.

 

Edited by MachineGhostX, 02 December 2014 - 03:33 AM.

[MachineGhostX]

This looks a formulation from LEF with might fit a generic need with different forms of magnesium (including glycinate) but the full composition is not disclosed:

Magnesium (as magnesium oxide, citrate, succinate, TRAACS® magnesium lysyl glycinate chelate)

500 mg

How about it?

 

No its junk and one that LEF consistently refuses to upgrade.  Oxide is cheap seafloor rock.  And citrate is not a true chelate; its just a mixture of oxide and citric acid.  Both oxide and citrate cause loose stools.  Only Albion makes true chelates as would be found in nature.

 

LEF sometimes takes research findings way too literally without critical thought.  I'm guessing that is why they continue to rely on cheap and poorly absorbed oxide.

 

It goes without saying LEF vastly overcharges for its supplements.

 

Edited by MachineGhostX, 02 December 2014 - 03:34 AM.

[MachineGhostX]

Yes I will discuss a possible change with my doctor. I wonder what is the best form of magnesium in general, there is so much on the market today! What about L-Threonate which LEF makes a case for better absorption ? At VitaCost I could only find a 400mg version of glycinate. Can you provide a link?

 

 

That is the correct link.  It is 200mg elemental per tablet.  The tablets are also a lot smaller than the KAL version which are like horse pills.

[capricorn]

 

Yes I will discuss a possible change with my doctor. I wonder what is the best form of magnesium in general, there is so much on the market today! What about L-Threonate which LEF makes a case for better absorption ? At VitaCost I could only find a 400mg version of glycinate. Can you provide a link?

 

 

That is the correct link.  It is 200mg elemental per tablet.  The tablets are also a lot smaller than the KAL version which are like horse pills.

 

 

As Vitacost's Magnesium Glycinate says "buffered" on the label I'm pretty sure it does contain also Magnesium Oxide, though not listed in the Supplement Facts. Same problem as with the Bluebonnet Nutrition product with Magnesium Glycinate from Albion. There's a lawsuit on this topic and Bluebonnet has changed the label in the meanwhile (now it's declaring the Oxide) - see the other Magnesium threads in this forum for more information.

I'm using the Albion Magnesium Glycinate from Doctor's Best - it's a 100% chelate and not "buffered".

Edited by capricorn, 07 December 2014 - 11:26 AM.

[albedo]

.... I'm using the Albion Magnesium Glycinate from Doctor's Best - it's a 100% chelate and not "buffered"....

 

It looks a great choice. I wonder which form they carry. From the Albion site the different forms are:

 

3451 Magnesium Bisglycinate Chelate Buffered
3461 Magnesium Bisglycinate Chelate Taste Free™
3476 Magnesium Bisglycinate Chelate
3500 Magnesium Lysinate Glycinate Chelate
3527 Magnesium Glycinate Glutamine Chelate
3465 Creatine MagnaPower^® (Click here for consumer information about Creatine MagnaPower^®)

 

http://www.albionmin...ts-trade/traacs

 

I suspect you are taking the type 3500 form.

 

Edited by albedo, 08 December 2014 - 04:33 PM.

[capricorn]

 

.... I'm using the Albion Magnesium Glycinate from Doctor's Best - it's a 100% chelate and not "buffered"....

 

It looks a great choice. I wonder which form they carry. From the Albion site the different forms are:

 

3451 Magnesium Bisglycinate Chelate Buffered
3461 Magnesium Bisglycinate Chelate Taste Free™
3476 Magnesium Bisglycinate Chelate
3500 Magnesium Lysinate Glycinate Chelate
3527 Magnesium Glycinate Glutamine Chelate
3465 Creatine MagnaPower^® (Click here for consumer information about Creatine MagnaPower^®)

 

http://www.albionmin...ts-trade/traacs

 

I suspect you are taking the type 3500 form.

 

 

Yes, it should be the "3500". Supplement Facts say "magnesium glycinate/lysinate chelate".

[albedo]

I run a new full set of tests after one year.

 

I have some changes in the iron status:

 

 iron.png   14.43KB   3 downloads

 haemoglobin.png   2.09KB   3 downloads

 

I tried to control the ferritin iron load with IP6 (800mg + 200mg inositol on empty stomach), also useful to other purposes, and indeed I could achieve some result over 10 years (average is >230, so I am still 44% lower) but would target below 100. Confounding, an increase of ferritin might be due to other causes than iron overload, e.g. inflammation, infection or worse.

 

I wonder if you have comments on these numbers and if/how I should try to better optimize. Thank you.

Edited by albedo, 07 August 2015 - 12:16 PM.

[Dorian Grey]

Interesting...  A high TSAT/serum means the body is shuttling a lot of iron around from place to place for some reason.  This should be stored as ferritin if it is not needed.  As ferritin is only climbing modestly this is puzzling.  

 

Curious; did you get your old/average ferritin down from 200+ by donating blood?  Or was it all from the IP6?  

 

Hope you get this figured out soon.  I'd really be interested in hearing what's going on when you get to the bottom of this.  

[Dolph]

What might be the case is that the ferritin is just high because of some kind of inflammation.(?) The high TSAT at least rather speaks for a functional lack of iron.(?)

 

[albedo]

Interesting...  A high TSAT/serum means the body is shuttling a lot of iron around from place to place for some reason.  This should be stored as ferritin if it is not needed.  As ferritin is only climbing modestly this is puzzling.  

 

Curious; did you get your old/average ferritin down from 200+ by donating blood?  Or was it all from the IP6?  

 

Hope you get this figured out soon.  I'd really be interested in hearing what's going on when you get to the bottom of this.  

 

Thank you for your comment. I never donated blood but considered it as I had ferritin so high in the past (in the 300+, up to 450) that MD thought about biopsy to check for hemochromatosis. When I introduced IP6 I had a nice reduction to 98 from 250 which make me thinking IP6 was doing something (I was taking it for the supposed enhancement of immune system). Of course this is just an hypothesis.

 

The only explication I can bring for the jump in TSAT is a local inflammation as I am suffering since several months of a tendinitis on my arm which was quite painful (better now) and likely due to overexercising. I think global inflammation if quite OK as hr-CRP is constantly low at 0.4. I did not use NSAID's.

[albedo]

What might be the case is that the ferritin is just high because of some kind of inflammation.(?) The high TSAT at least rather speaks for a functional lack of iron.(?)

 

Thank you Dolph. I think you are right. The only explication I can bring for the jump in TSAT is a local inflammation as I am suffering since several months of a tendinitis on my arm which was quite painful (better now) and likely due to overexercising. I think global inflammation if quite OK as hr-CRP is constantly low at 0.4. I did not use NSAID's. I really exclude lack of iron; haemoglobin is nicely at 156 as in the table above, down from 164 though but very much in my norm. I am also reading this to better undersand:
http://cjasn.asnjour...ement_1/S4.full

Edited by albedo, 08 August 2015 - 12:38 PM.

[albedo]

While everything is within the ref. range, I am trying to interpret a 31% increase over one year in my total testosterone T and equivalently the free fraction (40% increase). I am 60 and the trend has been somewhat a slight increase over 10 years. The sharper rise in last 3 years (table below) is maybe due (i) to some more regular resistance training (e.g. large muscles training, legs press, …) and more recently (ii) a very modest creatine supplementation (must be in average 800-1000 mg/d). In addition, (iii) my level of stress has decreased considerably.  However, in parallel, also my DHT similarly increased which I would expect, as my estradiol E2 has been only very moderately increasing. I am caution about DHT because had to go, successfully, through a TURP surgery more than 2 years ago due to BPH. I am using a prostate formula containing saw palmetto, supposed (not everyone agree) to lower the activity of the 5-alpha-reductase enzyme converting T into DHT and using other stuff such as I3C, supposed (ditto) to lower the activity of aromatase converting T to E2 (I guess crysin would be more powerful). My PSA has also lowered at 0.89. I try to keep inflammation as low as possible with diet and supplementation.

 

Overall, I feel satisfied of these results and wonder if you have comments on my interpretation or experience to share. Thank you.

 

 Hormonal.png   23.19KB   1 downloads

[albedo]

Have you ever studied your LP(a) (Lipoprotein(a)) level which is particularly pathogenic and is currently considered to be the strongest genetic risk factor for coronary heart disease?

 

While I could well improved with nutrition, lifestyle and supplementation in particular my total cholesterol, HDL, LDL, apoB/apoA-I ratio, TG's and could move from being "pattern B" (bad) to "pattern A" (good) in two VAP tests (patterns relate to the size of LDL particles, small side is bad as more atherosclerotic), my LP(a) remains stubbornly high around the 300-350 mg/dl (ref. <300). I am looking at its genetics and will post in my thread on personalized nutrition but wonder if you have some insight where to look and provide some help. Lowering LP(a) in severe cases is done using an expensive process called apheresis which I am not considering at present.

 

LP(a) molecule is composed of an LDL cholesterol molecule and a glycoprotein, apolipoprotein(a). There are huge differences in plasma ranges between healthy individuals (factor 1000) and it looks that pathogenity is possibly caused by the binding of oxidized phospholipids to the Lp(a).

 

Good information into LP(a) at:

 

Lipoprotein(a): resurrected by genetics

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22998429

 

[albedo]

related to subject post, re iron metabolism and hemoglobin:

https://www.longecit...ndpost&p=896122