450 replies to this topic

[Kingsley]

Thought I'd check back in.

 

In my previous posts I was touting NAG for mental clarify.  I'm still taking it and consider it a likely permanent part of my stack, but at the end of the day I still wasn't getting where I wanted to be.  I have decided that inflammation is only half the battle (actually more than half), but that I really need some direct NMDA agonism as well.

 

As such, I have been taking glycine, and added sarcosine back to my stack.  Good results at first, though they appeared to become attenuated over time.  So, I added a supplement that I have used in the past to good effect but which is controversial for some: l-glutamic acid (glutamate).  Combined with the other supplements in my stack, which I will list below, I am currently at a sweet spot.  We'll see how consistent it is.

 

I'm not going to recommend that anyone take l-glutamic acid, simply because there is so much doubt out there as to its safety.  It is well known that glutamate is neurotoxic under certain circumstances, though it is also absolutely key to cognitive function and is one of the primary neurotransmitters.  Personally, I accept the risk in light of how effective it is for me and because there appears to be no evidence that it is harmful at reasonable doses.  The closely related substance MSG has been extensively studied, and a panel of experts recently concluded that doses up to 16,000mg/kg are safe, which is an astronomical number.  I have been dosing between 1,000 mg and 2,000 mg per day.  I am sure that glutamic acid would be exactly the wrong supplement for some, particularly those suffering from more of an over-active mind, but for me it feels right.   

 

So, my current stack, honed over 3-4 years, and which is as of today making me feel almost cured, is as follows:

 

-L-glutamic Acid: 1,000-2,000 mg daily

-glycine 10,000(ish) mg daily

-Sarcosine: 2,000(ish) mg daily

-methylfolate: 400 - 1,200 mg daily

-NAC: 500 mg, every other day or so

-Quercetin: 1,000 mg daily

-NAG: 700 mg, every other day or so

-Vitamin D: 5,000-10,000iu per day (correcting a deficiency)

-Multivitamin

 

I am still fascinated to try BH4, especially after hearing about Chadwick's success, and I hope that it becomes more readily available soon.  BH4 seems to be implicated in all of the symptoms I complain of, and I have a feeling it could be related to my issues.

 

[Chadwick]

Has anyone else tried supplementing BH4?

[.Moose.]

Has anyone else tried supplementing BH4?

A couple of us are searching but as far as I can tell, it is not readily available online (as pteridin-4)? Considering a royal jelly binge, however I unfortunately haven't had any effect from the supps that you benefitted from Chadwick...

[Helllllo]

We might just have to take the plunge and use Alibaba. Maybe a group buy. How are you getting a consistent supply Chadwick?

Just ordered some pregnenolone which seems to be THE supplement for hypo nmda types. Has anyone had any luck with it?

[Helllllo]

On a side note, every time I take adderal. My neck, back and shoulders get extremely tight. I get more energy but it's an uncomfortable energy. Nothing like a hangover. Could the way I metabolise/recycle dopamine be off and hence adderal isn't the right med for the job?

[Kingsley]

We might just have to take the plunge and use Alibaba. Maybe a group buy. How are you getting a consistent supply Chadwick?

Just ordered some pregnenolone which seems to be THE supplement for hypo nmda types. Has anyone had any luck with it?

 

Not sure how comfortable I am with Chinese bulk suppliers, though if some one were to spearhead a group buy I might be interested.

 

I have some pregnenolone and have experimented a little bit in the past.  I do recall getting some clarifying effects from it though perhaps not consistent.  My dose may have been too low.  I may give it another try.  Please let us know if you experience a benefit from it.
 

[Kingsley]

On a side note, every time I take adderal. My neck, back and shoulders get extremely tight. I get more energy but it's an uncomfortable energy. Nothing like a hangover. Could the way I metabolise/recycle dopamine be off and hence adderal isn't the right med for the job?

 

I don't think I'd read anything specific about your dopamine metabolism into it.  Tension is a very common side effect of stimulants.  Options could be seeing if it subsides on its own, lowering your dose, or trying any number of supplements that promote relaxation (magnesium? l-theanine?) though as with anything individual mileage may vary.
 

[.Moose.]

 

I have had another breakthrough as well by adding calcium supplements.  In another post on this or another thread, I commented that I was having great success from magnesium.  I was actually taking calcium/magnesium pills and just assumed the effect was from the magnesium.  However, after switching to just straight magnesium for a while I found that the benefit was subsiding.  I just recently added calcium back in and the cognitive gains are staggering.  This makes some sense considering that I speculate that my issues are related to the glutamate-receptors and calcium-signaling, though why such a dramatic effect I am not sure.  Don't know if I was deficient or what was going on.

 

Kingsley, you might be way ahead of me on this one, but calcium is instrumental in NMDA receptors right? I see you don't supplement it anymore, but a possibility that your strange reaction to it is related?

 

We might just have to take the plunge and use Alibaba. Maybe a group buy. How are you getting a consistent supply Chadwick?

Just ordered some pregnenolone which seems to be THE supplement for hypo nmda types. Has anyone had any luck with it?

 

When looking for BH4, some of the more ballsy members of Phoenix Rising were bulk ordering directly from Swiss labs that didn't usually deal with the public. I think they also had to say that they needed it for research purposes and of course, definitely not for human administration... However, I believe Kingsley, yourself, and I couldn't have a larger mean distribution, we're all 1000s of miles apart so might not be economic anyway :/

 

 

On a side note, every time I take adderal. My neck, back and shoulders get extremely tight. I get more energy but it's an uncomfortable energy. Nothing like a hangover. Could the way I metabolise/recycle dopamine be off and hence adderal isn't the right med for the job?

 

Again, this might not be useful but apparently NMDA over-activation causes spinal chord muscle tension (i guess round the neck and shoulders) and this would fit the mechanism of Adderall I believe? On another LC post someone commented that ritalin, in laymans terms, essentially just boosts mood and energy.  That's how I felt, just really wired like on caffeine. Similar to your adderall experience?

 

 

Reiher, what was the connection with C4 Extreme, the 'N-acetyl L-tyrosine'? Plus another thank you for your bundles of information...

Edited by .Moose., 26 January 2016 - 06:10 AM.

[Kingsley]

 

 

Kingsley, you might be way ahead of me on this one, but calcium is instrumental in NMDA receptors right? I see you don't supplement it anymore, but a possibility that your strange reaction to it is related?

 

 

 

The calcium thing was a while ago, and actually I do still supplement it since I get very little in my diet, but I no longer get a noticeable cognitive boost.  It was a strange thing and I assumed that the strong subjective effect came from replenishing a deficiency.  And yes, as you note, calcium is tied to the NMDA receptors so I definitely made that connection.  In hindsight I'm not sure my response can be explained by a deficiency since it is my understanding that calcium levels in the blood stay pretty level even if your diet is deficient, as your body just draws calcium from your bones.  Also, I seemed to only get the effect from calcium carbonate.  My newer theory about what was going on is that maybe I was correcting or treating some type of mild acidosis, which occurs when the PH level of your blood is lower than it should be.  I have read that acidosis can affect cognition and energy levels, and can be caused by a deficiency of carbonate, which your body uses to alkalize your blood.  I had a similar effect recently from taking baking soda (sodium bicarbonate), i.e. brightened perception and improved cognition, which supports my acidosis theory.  However, the effects have never been consistent.  This is the problem with announcing "breakthroughs," as the real question is consistency.

 

As to the group buy, I'm inclined to steer clear and as you note the economics might not make sense, though if we did have some ballsy person step up and really spearhead the thing I'd seriously consider participating.  I read so many positive reports of BH4 online and the demand seems high--it's really frustrating not to be able to get ahold of it, and a potential gold mine for a company that can actually make it available with consistency.      

[Helllllo]

Some good news. The guy that made this thread (http://www.longecity...tonin-dopamine/)is selling BH4. Ice packs and all. 

Also my depression and inattentive symptoms are more or less under control. I feel the closest to normal I have in yonks. The feeling is incredible. At my worst, I was suicidal and completely out of it so I can't even begin to describe the relief. Kingsley, Cheers brudda. I wanna give you a massive hug because your stack was pretty much the base that cured me. Sarcosine was the ticket!

Here's my stack so far. Note that I haven't tried 1/4 of the supplements. They're on their way. I think they'll complement everything nicely. 

Regimen:
MORNING/AFTERNOON
Half a methyl-life tablet (contains 165mg methy folate)
Half an Eagle Tresos B Pluse multi vit
Sarcosine 2 grams
2 nordic natural fish oil tabs 850 EPA 200 DHA
2 Kyolic garlic tablets
400mg Blackmores longvida curcumin
125 mg alpha lipoic acid
N-acetyl Glucosamine 700mg every second say (IN THE MAIL)
Pregnenolone 25mg (IN THE MAIL)
NAC 250-500mg every second day
Third of an ostelin Cal-DK2  90mcg k2 Calcium 400mg Vit D3 500iu sometimes
Phosphatidylserine 100mg (IN THE MAIL)
Vitamin C
Kombucha


BEFORE GYM
Creatine 1.5g

NIGHT
Herbs of gold anxiety ease – 3.75g ashwagandha + lavender
Glycine 6 grams (IN THE MAIL)
COQ10


So yeah, love you all. Everyone that's contributed has literally saved my life. Will keep everyone posted on how everything goes with the new additions. 

[Kingsley]

Also my depression and inattentive symptoms are more or less under control. I feel the closest to normal I have in yonks. The feeling is incredible. At my worst, I was suicidal and completely out of it so I can't even begin to describe the relief. Kingsley, Cheers brudda. I wanna give you a massive hug because your stack was pretty much the base that cured me. Sarcosine was the ticket!

 

 

EXCELLENT.  Anti-inflammation and NMDA receptor stimulation for the win.  This made my day.   

 

I really think that future approaches to mental health are going to emphasize anti-inflammation and the NMDA receptor more and more, especially for the type of cognitive and affective issues you and I experience.  My current theory is that many of us diagnosed as ADHD-PI are actually hovering somewhere on the outer edges of schizotypal personality disorder, which is why I began experimenting so heavily with supplements shown effective for schizophrenia.   

 

Anyway, excellent work.  Please keep us updated on your progress and the consistency of the benefits you are experiencing. 

Edited by Kingsley, 04 February 2016 - 10:04 PM.

[.Moose.]

Also my depression and inattentive symptoms are more or less under control. I feel the closest to normal I have in yonks. The feeling is incredible. At my worst, I was suicidal and completely out of it so I can't even begin to describe the relief. Kingsley, Cheers brudda. I wanna give you a massive hug because your stack was pretty much the base that cured me. Sarcosine was the ticket!
 

 

You absolute hero, that's fantastic news after all the hard graft. It seems that quite a few people see diminishing returns when taking sarcosine continuously (Kingsley?), but whatever happens it really sounds like you're seeing the light at the end of tunnel...

 

I was going to post a days worth of good research about BH4, NMDA, cortisol which is really tying everything together for me but it seems everyone is waaay ahead of me! Hope everyone else is doing good. And dude seriously, great work, I'm going to treat myself to a celebratory beer! 

[Apprentice_Bob]

 

The activity of the NMDA channel is "greatly potentiated upon ethanol washout."  

 

This suggests to me that those of us who benefit most from a hangover may also benefit from supplements that enhance NMDA receptor function.  This is certainly true for me, as I find NAC and sarcosine indispensable.

 

Missed this before, great find!! i'll add these to the very long expensive list of things to try 

 

 

 

Welcome to nootropics. My plan, at this point, is to move mundanely through my days until I have some sort of stable living (60k +), which should not be so far away from today. Then I will have the opportunity to buy what I need, then I will find what I need.

[.Moose.]

 

 

Welcome to nootropics. My plan, at this point, is to move mundanely through my days until I have some sort of stable living (60k +), which should not be so far away from today. Then I will have the opportunity to buy what I need, then I will find what I need.

 

 

Really!? I think if there's anything that this thread has shown is that a bit of perseverance and a bit of research can go an incredibly long way - look at the gains some of these guys have made in just a few months of hard work. Even putting in a couple of hours reading every now and again, and keeping some good notes could make a big difference. 

 

Feel free to PM anytime, I'm always happy to give a hand.

[Apprentice_Bob]

I am making strides, but I am conserving my money MAJORLY. I'm in graduate school right now and am getting by with a few supplements and a few habits (mediation and... nofap). Diet seems to be helping. I have my ways, but it will take some time before I have enough money to try many of these. I have prenenolone and NAG in the mail. I find that nicotine helps, too.

[Apprentice_Bob]

I have a question. I notice that taking ~ 900 mg of gabapentin can put me in a similar mood/state. It's a modest dose. When taken sporadically (i.e. not 7 days a week) it allows me to move through my day with more energy and almost no anxiety... Nearly no anxiety. I feel none now. I am a bit manic, typing this response is a challenge because 1.) i feel unable to communicate exactly how I feel and 2.) I feel that I am wasting the productivity and mind-state that I currently have and 3.) I have a lot of energy and am not really given to being introspective at the moment. 

 

One might call this a manic state and I would not disagree. What surprises me about this state is many... I am controlled, yet amped. I can put my 'energy' where I want to put it without feeling the mental obstacle of perceived or anticipated effort. I was studying Quantum Mechanics and Nuclear Physics earlier (look at me). I went over the notes from the week and realized that I not only understood the lecture, I had questions about some of the key points, questions which had not come to mind when I dutifully copied the powerpoint into my notebook. It's either I absorbed the information over the past two nights (without studying) or this mind-state literally is one that comes with increased cognition. My ability to visualize is up. I can remember my old campus in precise detail, the layout of the campus. A memory of my bike rides on those campuses. Connections come unbidden... This is only to explain that I do feel that gabapentin somehow brings a taste of limitless. Reading a book becomes a pleasure and an adventure, where before it was a slog. 

 

I do know that gabapentin has a mostly unknown MOI. Wiki mentions glutamate, GABA, NMDA antagonism, many things which hint and tease around this area, this area that we feel to be at the heart of our disability! So I'm just curious if I'm manic or if this effect could be predicted by the research we've been doing here over the past few months/years. It's very exciting. My hope is that drugs like these will soon come to be understood and that, if we stay healthy (i.e. stop messing around with alcohol), then perhaps we can heal ourselves completely (if indeed there is a malfunction within us). Even if it is not a malfunction, it seems we can find enhancement through pharmaceutical research.

 

One note: My greatest struggle is with alcohol. Myself, I do not love the high of alcohol but I love what comes after it. The struggle is that this alcohol, over time, wrecks our brains and bodies. So it is exciting that we may be able to attain something close (but never exact) to the hangtropic effect! One more note: I do not believe that any of these drugs/supplements will ever be able to reproduce the hangtropic effect fully. It is something magical that, luckily for us, can be attained in small doses. God life is so harsh. For me at least, I can go from being the smartest person in the room with hangtrope going, to the dimmest guy there when normal. It's helped me to form compassion for others, but god is it a strange reality. 

 

Edit: Just a few more thoughts. I had been allowing myself 1 hangtrope per month. My plan now is to have no hantropes for at least a year, for health, safety, and as a motivational boost towards finding a safer way. I have interesting life-plans that do involve hangtropes ever so often, but it requires a safer more stable life. One last thought: It's hilarious that we who suffer with brain fog and fatigue can somehow propel ourselves to the highest heights. It's so goddamn ironic. Reminds me of a Greek tragedy. I could go on and on. This has become a part of who I am and I just find this fascinating. Sorry to let all my thoughts out at once. I hope they are as cohesive as they are in my head, but... these are my thoughts. Thanks to anyone who is actively contributing to our knowledge. 

 

^^^obviously I am a little bit manic, but that's to be expected.

Edited by Apprentice_Bob, 05 February 2016 - 08:48 PM.

[.Moose.]

That's great news, so you are making progress! Your cognition, sociability and energy are all improved? And do you associate with ADD at all? But yeah, your experience with gabapentin sounds consistent with this thread and others, as increased GABA inhibits NMDA. I find I have been a bit manic/ emotional when in that state, I think through being so ecstatic to just feel normal. I'm assuming that it calms down after a bit but the others will know more...

Edited by .Moose., 05 February 2016 - 09:45 PM.

[Apprentice_Bob]

That's great news, so you are making progress! Your cognition, sociability and energy are all improved? And do you associate with ADD at all? But yeah, your experience with gabapentin sounds consistent with this thread and others, as increased GABA inhibits NMDA. I find I have been a bit manic/ emotional when in that state, I think through being so ecstatic to just feel normal. I'm assuming that it calms down after a bit but the others will know more...

 

 

The energy thing is strange to me. An hour before the gabapentin took effect, I was struggling to walk across campus. Literally sluggish and tired as if there were not enough nutrients in my body. So somehow gabapentin works like adderall in the way it just 'magics' energy into you. Strange. Many people call it moron-in, because it turns people into morons. Strange.

 

 

It's great though. I just put eight great masterpiece works of literature on my kindle, knowing that I may not understand them fully now. But come hangtrope day, lol, I will. This struggle. It's better to laugh. Reminds me of a poem by Tennyson I think we all can relate to.

 

It is the little rift within the lute

That by and by will make the music mute

And ever-widening slowly silence all

 

 

Edited by niner, 07 February 2016 - 09:57 PM.

[Apprentice_Bob]

I'm sorry to double post, but can anyone relate with what I've written? While hangtroped, you feel (and are) capable of amazing things. Does anyone else plan on using this for more than personal achievement? Anyone already see success in career or artistic pursuit/pleasure because of these experiences? If there's no response, I'll just shut up. I understand that this is a thread dedicated to sober solutions. If anyone would like to PM me, feel free. I find the hangtrope effect fascinating in itself, without the neurological aspect (tho that is interesting too!). 

[Helllllo]

Ditto to everything. Feel like it's the pinnacle of the human experience. Every single positive attribute of mine shines and all negative disappears. Something else I've noticed is the that I get untapped empathy and compassion. It feels amazing. I also tend to write and draft a lot. Something I'm generally reluctant to do. Also get an awesome burst of energy. I'm usually quite lazy but the hangtropic changes everything.

The downside to the whole thing is that it's verging onto hypo-mania territory. I become ultra excitable and passionate (which is a breath of fresh air) and though i get a bit too outrageous at times, I somehow find the will to contain myself.

Though if that was a permanent version of me, it might be a little a little hard to handle but I'd be happy if I was 60 percent of the way. That's what I'm waiting on the pregnenolone as well as a couple of bits and pieces to help me achieve.

Definitely not depressed and have a great handle on my inattentiveness but not verging into hangtropic territory. Have you looked into the mechanism of action that gabapentin achieved and its similarity to alcohol?

Another thing worth noting is that the hangtropic effects is too great to be permanent. We're probably kindling & killing brain cells. Just a thought.

[Apprentice_Bob]

Yes and thus the irony. or a taste of it. It brings us so high while endangering the very machine that has brought us there. It's such a hard pill to swallow. But I agree with everything that you've said. My brother describes me as characters from novels, the ones looking at the rafters asking inane question while everyone else is focused on the issue at hand. I find that poetry really just flies off my tongue without any effort at all. When in that state, I feel like poets and writers that I read about on wikipedia, only they maintained that state naturally for their lifespans. And sometimes I am drawn towards that fantasy of creating, but how can one of us compare to one who has been in that mind-state for their entire lives? Every time I enter it, I feel like a newborn with his first look at the world. Everything is turned over, and you have to learn the rules again. In that sense, it makes me into an observer. I just hold in the back of my mind the knowledge that life is long and perhaps someday we will find a way. 

 

 

But I lost the book. Anyway. don't want to derail the discussion. But this is a hard, sometimes sweet package we've 'given'.

 

But, I'm not sure about Gabapentin. The MOA is pretty much unknown at this point, if we're being precise. So, I just hope that our knowledge of these things increases with time. Maybe one of us will strike the lottery and fund experimentation. My one goal is to, once I am financially secure, see a therapist. I will go to the therapist as myself, no drugs acting, then I will go while hangtroped. I just want to see what they make of it. Because when hangtroped, not to gloat (objectively), I stand out in all academic areas. Whether it be religion, music theory, or physics, I am among the best in the class. But then when it's gone, I become like everyone else. That is what is most maddening to me.

 

Sarcosine, Magnesium, Pregnelone, and NAG are in the mail. Meditating helps, and eating correctly helps. I just want to emphasize the nearly indefinite curve of this pursuit. It's like a graph of 1/r, as you get closer and closer to 0, 1/r reaches towards infinity. I feel the same way about our pursuit of the hangtroped state. 

 

Your words strike true.

Edited by niner, 07 February 2016 - 09:56 PM.

[Helllllo]

Crazy shit.

One thing I've noticed is that since forever, if I'd have 1-6 drinks, I'd get really bad insomnia, it would be literally impossible to go to sleep till the morning. Does anyone else experience this?
Ps: good luck brotha

[CameronA]

Wow I lazily tried to find a good thread about this a few times over the years but it is so hard to sift through the endless amount of negative hangover experiences. I have exactly the same feelings of clarity, empathy, and calmness of mind that have been described here and it is so amazing to read that maybe there is a way of recreating, at least partially, this feeling. I think that my problems could be attributed to MTHFR and have ordered the metafolin that Chadwick recommended, i'm excited to see if this will have any effect or not

[Apprentice_Bob]

Wow I lazily tried to find a good thread about this a few times over the years but it is so hard to sift through the endless amount of negative hangover experiences. I have exactly the same feelings of clarity, empathy, and calmness of mind that have been described here and it is so amazing to read that maybe there is a way of recreating, at least partially, this feeling. I think that my problems could be attributed to MTHFR and have ordered the metafolin that Chadwick recommended, i'm excited to see if this will have any effect or not

 

Yeah it's crazy, I remember scanning the web for hours, not expecting to find anything, reading so much other shit about how to use nootropics to get over hangovers, before stumbling upon this and one more post on longecity. Never thought it would be revived, too. So this is really nice, to have a small community of people who feel the same way. It validates my experience.

 

Oh, and I suggest a new name, though it may be too long. Inverse hangover?

Edited by Apprentice_Bob, 07 February 2016 - 03:57 PM.

[.Moose.]

Wow I lazily tried to find a good thread about this a few times over the years but it is so hard to sift through the endless amount of negative hangover experiences. I have exactly the same feelings of clarity, empathy, and calmness of mind that have been described here and it is so amazing to read that maybe there is a way of recreating, at least partially, this feeling. I think that my problems could be attributed to MTHFR and have ordered the metafolin that Chadwick recommended, i'm excited to see if this will have any effect or not

 

Welcome to the discussion! I was the same months ago, sifting through pointless pages before finding this one with a small community of people with strikingly similar experiences. It really is the only thing that validates my whole experience...

 

 

It's like a graph of 1/r, as you get closer and closer to 0, 1/r reaches towards infinity. I feel the same way about our pursuit of the hangtroped state. 

 

Haha i like that, but also agree that I feel the master of everything when in that state - everything feels doable. Like the 9AM economics lecture I went to that usually would be impossible but it was almost so easy as to be boring that day. Then the sociability and athletic performance were undoubtably better too. To suddenly find your gravitas and become the centre of attention in a crowded room, only to lose all interest a few hours later is so Incredibly frustrating. Especially as I can't replicate it on will, I don't know if it is a blessing or a curse sometimes.

 

I would be happy to talk more about the non-biochemical side although maybe it should be done away from this thread, so as to not hamper the developing discussion here...

[.Moose.]

Oh, and I suggest a new name, though it may be too long. Inverse hangover?

 

 

I think a more suitable/ technical name might actually be an afterglow:

 

"Afterglow, when used in the context of recreational drug use, refers to positive physical and mental effects that linger after the main effects of a drug have subsided, or after the peak experience has subsided. This state is often characterized by feelings of detachment or increased psychological clarity."

 

I don't know but I feel like afterglow is already an established term in drug culture, and seems to be exactly what we describe on alcohol. Also, you can find quite a few similar threads to this one by looking for 'alcohol afterglow' so may be the best to keep this thread discoverable?

[CameronA]

Thanks guys! I just can't believe how little there actually is about this online, I bring this topic up quite often and over the years have met a few people that knew exactly what i was talking about, and then I think quite a few people experience it, but to a lesser extent maybe. My experience with the hangtrope (I think that's my favourite term so far) is that i'm a 25 y.o 'emerging artist' that has been relatively successful in the last two years, but if i looked back at everything good i have ever made, almost all of it has either been started or at least conceptually conceived during a hangover state. Until now my only hypothesis had been formed from a study that found a link between sleep deprivation and creativity - that it sort of promotes a disjointed way of thinking and forgetting that allows information to be kinda cobbled together in different and surprising ways - but obviously this was never going to explain the full spectrum of changes that occur. 

Edited by CameronA, 07 February 2016 - 10:58 PM.

[Apprentice_Bob]

 

Oh, and I suggest a new name, though it may be too long. Inverse hangover?

 

 

I think a more suitable/ technical name might actually be an afterglow:

 

"Afterglow, when used in the context of recreational drug use, refers to positive physical and mental effects that linger after the main effects of a drug have subsided, or after the peak experience has subsided. This state is often characterized by feelings of detachment or increased psychological clarity."

 

I don't know but I feel like afterglow is already an established term in drug culture, and seems to be exactly what we describe on alcohol. Also, you can find quite a few similar threads to this one by looking for 'alcohol afterglow' so may be the best to keep this thread discoverable?

 

 

 

Awesome, that works. & I agree about keeping this to biochemical side of things. I went back and read through the thread, much of the qualitative parts are covered. Talking about how great or not great it is won't get us anywhere. Quick note: just blazed through 7 episodes of Better Call Saul. Lol this would not be happening on one of those days. Anyway, I'll keep you guys updated. NAG, Sarcosine, and uh, some other drugs... prenenolone, they will all be in by Tuesday. We'll see how that goes. And if anyone is comfortable with online pharmacies, give gabapentin a chance (pm me for source). Just promise me that you will not get addicted. It speeds up my mind, helps me visualize ideas, but doesn't bring the empathy that those days tend to bring. I'll update in a few days. If something magical occurs, you'll be able to tell by my writing.

Edited by Apprentice_Bob, 07 February 2016 - 11:48 PM.

[CameronA]

I also have problems with acid reflux that seem to be cured on the day of the hangover, I have seen people talking about NAG as a soloution for reflux, would this suggest a difficency in NAG?

[Kingsley]

 

 

 

You absolute hero, that's fantastic news after all the hard graft. It seems that quite a few people see diminishing returns when taking sarcosine continuously (Kingsley?), but whatever happens it really sounds like you're seeing the light at the end of tunnel...

 

 

 

I think that tolerance will always be a concern.  However, I suspect that if some one really does have issues with NMDA hypofunction and the sarcosine is bringing them up more toward base-line, it may be less likely for downregulation to kick in than some one who is starting out at baseline.  In any event, studies on sarcosine and schizophrenics have shown sustained effectiveness for months which is a good sign.  Just my layman take on things.

 

I'd like to add one word of caution for those who may decide to use high dose polyphenols as part of an anti-inflammation stack.  This would include curcumin, quercetin, grape seed extract, and others.  These substances are known to be effective iron chelators and to interfere with iron absorption.  On at least two occasions I have found my energy levels dropping to crazy low levels but have come roaring back after adding some iron supplements.  I should note that iron supplements are not to be taken lightly--it is definitely something that you can overdo.  But, if you are taking curcumin, quercetin, and/or others for a while and find your energy flagging, craving sleep, getting winded easily, etc., consider whether iron depletion might be an issue.  This is not to scare anyone off of polyphenols; they are outrageously good supplements for those like me battling inflammation.