• Log in with Facebook Log in with Twitter Log In with Google      Sign In    
  • Create Account
  LongeCity
              Advocacy & Research for Unlimited Lifespans

Photo
- - - - -

Elevated Blood-Sugar In Diabetics Is Due To Excessive Gluconeogenesis.

diabetes carbohydrate low-carb insulin pritikin sweeney kempner fat gluconeogenesis lipolysis

  • Please log in to reply
29 replies to this topic

#1 misterE

  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 30 July 2013 - 04:54 AM


A classic study conducted back in 1927 by Dr. Shirley Sweeney clearly told us which aspects of the diet cause diabetes [1], but the underlying mechanisms wasn’t discovered until later. What Sweeney did was he took four groups of college students and fed them different diets and then he measured their fasting blood-sugar.

Group-1 were put on a high-carbohydrate diet; consisting of: sugar, candy, syrup, baked-potatoes, oatmeal, white-bread and pasta.

Group-2 were put on a high-protein diet; consisting of: lean-meat, lean-fish and egg-whites.

Group-3 were put on a high-fat diet; consisting of: olive-oil, butter, mayonnaise and egg-yolks.

Group-4 were put on a fasting-diet or temporary starvation.


Sweeney tested the blood-sugar of each of the groups and found that all of the groups were diabetic except for the high-carbohydrate group. People on the high-protein diet however, were somewhat less diabetic than the students in the high-fat group, in which some were considered severely diabetic.
He took one student from Group-1 and switched with over to group-3 and found that he quickly went from being non-diabetic to diabetic.

Dr. Walter Kempner of Duke University realized the importance of this classic study which inspired him to create: The Rice Diet, which was composed of rice, fruit and sucrose. He created this diet in order to save people who had sever diabetes and suffering all the complications of diabetes, like kidney-failure, retinopathy, atherosclerosis, hypertension, obesity… these people were extremely sick and diabetic, their bodies were falling apart at an accelerated rate due to a lack of insulin.

Kempner knew this and figured these people needed to be on an extremely high-carb/fat-free diet, the kind of diet Sweeney used in his classic study… so he gave them fruit and rice (which do contain trace amounts of essential-fats) along with sucrose.

What he found, and what was reported back in the scientific-literature in the 1950’s, was that diabetes and all the diseases that stem from insulin-resistance were completely reversed with The Rice Diet [2-4].

Another important study conducted in 1971 by Brunzell et al. He took people that were insulin-resistant and had them on a diet that was 45% sucrose and then put them on a diet that was 85% sucrose, what they found was that all aspects of the insulin-resistance got better; insulin-sensitivity, fasting blood-sugar, fasting insulin, etc [5].


Studies from the Pritikin Longevity Center, which uses a very low-fat diet based on beans, grains, vegetables and fruit with lean proteins in small amounts… combined with daily exercise, has also been shown numerous times to completely reverse diabetes and metabolic-syndrome [6]. The Pritikin-diet is: 75% carbohydrate/15% protein/10% fat. A diet similar to Sweeney’s.

Sweeney’s experiment was considered a huge paradox, why would consuming sugar lower the levels of blood-sugar in the body? And how could eating fat cause a huge rise in blood-sugar?

The epidemiological data also seemed to support this strange paradox, such as immigrants from Oriental countries who get the majority of their calories from white-rice are normally free of diabetes, yet when migrating to the USA or Europe, they quickly develop diabetes once they consume less rice and more animal-protein and total fats and oils [7].

But with the primary study conducted by Sweeney, followed by epidemiological observations, the use of The Rice Diet to cure metabolic-syndrome by Kempner and clinical studies conducted by the Pritikin Longevity Center, all seem to indicate that carbohydrates makes diabetes better not, worse… which is what we commonly hear today.

Brunzell even stated in his research paper: “This data suggests that the high carbohydrate diet increased the sensitivity of peripheral tissues to insulin.”

Sooo…

The explanation of this paradox lies in the metabolic control of gluconeogenesis, which is your body’s way of making glucose, when it is needed by the body. The brain and the red-blood cells must have glucose to function properly. When you restrict glucose from the diet (like what happened in groups 2, 3, and 4) the body will actually begin to undergo gluconeogenesis, in order to make more glucose for the brain and blood-cells. It does this by converting branched-chained-amino-acids (BCAA’s) into glucose.

There is a feedback mechanism in the body that closely monitors glucose metabolism. If you eat lots of glucose, the body doesn’t need to synthesize any more glucose. If you restrict carbohydrates and glucose, then the body will make more of it and release it into circulation. The release of glucose into the circulation (via gluconeogenesis) is what caused the elevated blood-sugars found in groups 2, 3, and 4.

Insulin is the main regulator of gluconeogenesis, when insulin is secreted, gluconeogenesis is inhibited and blood-sugar is soaked up by the muscles and liver and converted into glycogen. This causes a decrease in blood-sugar and also allows leptin to make its way thru the blood-brain-barrier, thus turning off your appetite.

The problem is that fat and protein don’t cause insulin-secretion like carbohydrates do, thus with less insulin-secretion, blood-glucose cannot be converted into glycogen and stored away in the muscle and liver… plus gluconeogenesis cannot be inhibited. Thus the blood-sugar stays elevated and continues to rise as gluconeogensis stays uninhibited from the absence of insulin, due to a lack of carbohydrates.

The reason why fasting causes diabetes long term, is due once again, to a lack of insulin-secretion.; without adequate insulin-secretion, gluconeogenesis and lipolysis remain uninhibited, thus you see an increase in blood-sugar and free-fatty-acids observed in diabetes.



[1] Arch Intern Med (Chic). 1927;40(6):818-830. Dietary Factors That Influence The Dextrose Tolerance Test. Sweeney S.

[2] Am J Med. 1948 Apr;4(4):545-77. Treatment of hypertensive vascular disease with rice diet. KEMPNER W.

[3] Postgrad Med. 1958 Oct;24(4):359-71. Effect of rice diet on diabetes mellitus associated with vascular disease. KEMPNER W, PESCHEL RL, SCHLAYER C.

[4] Z Klin Med. 1954;152(4):328-45. Effect of rice diet in experimental hypertension and in patients with heart, kidney and vascular diseases. KEMPNER W.

[6] N Engl J Med. 1971 Mar 11;284(10):521-4. Improved glucose tolerance with high carbohydrate feeding in mild diabetes. Brunzell JD, Lerner RL, Hazzard WR.

[5] Diabetes Care. 1983 May-Jun;6(3):268-73. Long-term use of a high-complex-carbohydrate, high-fiber, low-fat diet and exercise in the treatment of NIDDM patients. Barnard RJ, Massey MR, Cherny S.

[7] Food Nutr Res. 2012;56. Changes in dietary habits after migration and consequences for health: a focus on South Asians in Europe. Holmboe-Ottesen G, Wandel M.

Edited by misterE, 30 July 2013 - 05:14 AM.

  • dislike x 3
  • like x 3

#2 rwac

  • Member
  • 4,764 posts
  • 61
  • Location:Dimension X

Posted 30 July 2013 - 08:46 AM

The problem is that fat and protein don’t cause insulin-secretion like carbohydrates do, thus with less insulin-secretion, blood-glucose cannot be converted into glycogen and stored away in the muscle and liver… plus gluconeogenesis cannot be inhibited. Thus the blood-sugar stays elevated and continues to rise as gluconeogensis stays uninhibited from the absence of insulin, due to a lack of carbohydrates.


FYI Protein does cause insulin-secretion. However when cortisol/glucagon triggers gluconeogenesis, cortisol also triggers the breakdown of glycogen. This is why it's hard to store glycogen on a low carb diet, despite the insulin.

Insulin secretion in response to protein ingestion. J C Floyd, Jr, S S Fajans, J W Conn, R F Knopf, and J Rull
http://www.ncbi.nlm....cles/PMC292827/
  • like x 1

sponsored ad

  • Advert
Click HERE to rent this advertising spot for NUTRITION to support LongeCity (this will replace the google ad above).

#3 rwac

  • Member
  • 4,764 posts
  • 61
  • Location:Dimension X

Posted 30 July 2013 - 08:55 AM

Sweeney tested the blood-sugar of each of the groups and found that all of the groups were diabetic except for the high-carbohydrate group. People on the high-protein diet however, were somewhat less diabetic than the students in the high-fat group, in which some were considered severely diabetic.
He took one student from Group-1 and switched with over to group-3 and found that he quickly went from being non-diabetic to diabetic.


If you're on a low carb diet, the rest of the body will become insulin resistant to spare glucose for your brain. This is normal, this is not diabetes. You can reverse it simply by starting to eat more carbs. Real Diabetes is not so easily reversed.
  • like x 4
  • dislike x 1

#4 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 30 July 2013 - 10:08 PM

FYI Protein does cause insulin-secretion. However when cortisol/glucagon triggers gluconeogenesis, cortisol also triggers the breakdown of glycogen. This is why it's hard to store glycogen on a low carb diet, despite the insulin.



Right. Protein does stimulate insulin-secretion, just not as much as carbohydrates… however if you combine carbohydrates and protein together, you get a synergistic insulin surge. Beans and skim-milk are two of the most insulinogenic foods known, and both are high in glucose and amino-acids. Milk is extremely insulinogenic, not only due to its lactose, but due its high levels of BCAA.



Cortisol is one of the catabolic-hormones that breaks down glycogen, protein and fat stores and liberates glucose, amino-acids and fatty-acids as energy. Cortisol (along with HGH) is released when insulin is low in the blood. Also when insulin is lowered in the blood, androgen synthesis also decreases.



When you secrete insulin, the catabolic-hormones decrease and anabolic-hormones increase; cortisol decreases, HGH converts into IGF-1, androgen synthesis increases, etc. The body is happy and stress free with proper insulin-signaling. The reason why people with diabetes have all these different health problems is due to a lack of insulin, IGF-1 and androgens and an excess of FFA’s, glucose, cortisol, HGH, glucagon, etc.



Take a look here at this study:



Life Sci. 1987 May 4;40(18):1761-8.

Diet-hormone interactions: protein/carbohydrate ratio alters reciprocally the plasma levels of testosterone and cortisol and their respective binding globulins in man.


Anderson KE, Rosner W, Khan MS.

Abstract


The aim of this study was to determine if a change in protein/carbohydrate ratio influences plasma steroid hormone concentrations. There is little information about the effects of specific dietary components on steroid hormone metabolism in humans. Testosterone concentrations in seven normal men were consistently higher after ten days on a high carbohydrate diet (468 +/- 34 ng/dl, mean +/- S.E.) than during a high protein diet (371 +/- 23 ng/dl, p less than 0.05) and were accompanied by parallel changes in sex hormone binding globulin (32.5 +/- 2.8 nmol/l vs. 23.4 +/- 1.6 nmol/l respectively, p less than 0.01). By contrast, cortisol concentrations were consistently lower during the high carbohydrate diet than during the high protein diet (7.74 +/- 0.71 micrograms/dl vs. 10.6 +/- 0.4 micrograms/dl respectively, p less than 0.05), and there were parallel changes in corticosteroid binding globulin concentrations (635 +/- 60 nmol/l vs. 754 +/- 31 nmol/l respectively, p less than 0.05). The diets were equal in total calories and fat. These consistent and reciprocal changes suggest that the ratio of protein to carbohydrate in the human diet is an important regulatory factor for steroid hormone plasma levels and for liver-derived hormone binding proteins.

Edited by misterE, 30 July 2013 - 10:10 PM.

  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#5 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 30 July 2013 - 10:29 PM

If you're on a low carb diet, the rest of the body will become insulin resistant to spare glucose for your brain. This is normal, this is not diabetes. You can reverse it simply by starting to eat more carbs. Real Diabetes is not so easily reversed.




What these studies show is that there is more than one way of getting type-2 diabetes. The first way is to avoid insulinogenic-foods (like grains and potatoes). This reduces insulin-production, which leads to less insulin-signalling.

The second way is by overstuffing your fat-cells with fat. Insulin stores dietary-fat inside your fat-cells for future use (like a famine). However, the fat-cells can store only a limited amount of fat and when the fat-cells begin to fill to full capacity, the fat-cells begin to secrete inflammatory cytokines which cause the release of free-fatty-acids (FFA’s) into the circulation, and they end up accumulating in vital organs. The excessive amount of FFA’s circulating in the blood and in the cells of organs also reduces insulin-signaling. Without proper insulin-signaling, cells can’t receive nutrients and energy and they undergo apoptosis (cell-death).

Basically you can cause diabetes by restricting carbohydrates or by overeating fats (along with your carbohydrates). The solution for both would be a high-carbohydrate/low-fat diet.
  • dislike x 4
  • like x 1

#6 zorba990

  • Guest
  • 1,614 posts
  • 318

Posted 30 July 2013 - 10:53 PM

White rice and other junk low nutrient carbohydrates are not appropriate for diabetics.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22422870
At least reccomend Okinowan Purple Potatoes or blueberries or something with an abundance of anti inflammatory nutrients.
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1
  • Agree x 1

#7 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 30 July 2013 - 11:57 PM

White rice and other junk low nutrient carbohydrates are not appropriate for diabetics.







What about the results of Sweeney and Brunzell?

Yes white rice is low in nutrients, but it is almost the ideal fuel for the body. The metabolism of the glucose in rice is very easy on the body and is anti-stressing. Rice also has a great amino-acid profile, and studies using Kempner’s Rice-Diet showed that patients of the rice-diet had normal nitrogen-balance.

Combine some fruit or steamed vegetables with rice and you should expect to have all the benefits that were seen with Kempner’s patients; clean arteries, healthy kidneys, normal body weight, healthy eyes, normal blood-sugar, etc.
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#8 zorba990

  • Guest
  • 1,614 posts
  • 318

Posted 31 July 2013 - 01:24 AM

They are at odds with other research and personal anecdotal experience related to a diabetic relative.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/19099589
http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/23680948

I suspect diets of mostly white rice will not be the "diet of the future" for those concerned with extending lifespan, but good luck with that.
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#9 rwac

  • Member
  • 4,764 posts
  • 61
  • Location:Dimension X

Posted 01 August 2013 - 12:07 AM

What these studies show is that there is more than one way of getting type-2 diabetes. The first way is to avoid insulinogenic-foods (like grains and potatoes). This reduces insulin-production, which leads to less insulin-signalling.


Well, can you show evidence of this?
If this was indeed the case, then there would be an epidemic of diabetes in low-carbers, but we don't see this.

The other path to diabetes is more plausible.

#10 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 01 August 2013 - 01:39 AM

Well, can you show evidence of this?


That is what the work of Sweeney showed. When you limit insulin-secretion (by avoiding carbohydrates), glucose cannot be stored away as glycogen and more is actually liberated into the bloodstream by catabolic-hormones, like glucagon and cortisol.



Low-carb diets mimic the effects of type-1 diabetes (insulin-deficiency) rather than type-2 diabetes (lipotoxicity).



The proper way of curing type-2 diabetes is by assuring that the glucose is cleared from the blood, enters the cells and is stored away as glycogen… how in the world can that be accomplished with a low-carb or ketogenic-diet?
  • dislike x 3
  • like x 2

#11 rwac

  • Member
  • 4,764 posts
  • 61
  • Location:Dimension X

Posted 01 August 2013 - 01:59 AM

That is what the work of Sweeney showed. When you limit insulin-secretion (by avoiding carbohydrates), glucose cannot be stored away as glycogen and more is actually liberated into the bloodstream by catabolic-hormones, like glucagon and cortisol.

Low levels of glycogen storage is not the same as diabetes.

The proper way of curing type-2 diabetes is by assuring that the glucose is cleared from the blood, enters the cells and is stored away as glycogen… how in the world can that be accomplished with a low-carb or ketogenic-diet?

I don't think a low-carb diet is optimal in any way.

#12 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 01 August 2013 - 02:06 AM

Low levels of glycogen storage is not the same as diabetes.




But excessive blood-glucose is… and without insulin, blood-glucose cannot be lowered and continues to rise.

Edited by misterE, 01 August 2013 - 02:07 AM.

  • dislike x 4
  • like x 1

#13 rwac

  • Member
  • 4,764 posts
  • 61
  • Location:Dimension X

Posted 01 August 2013 - 02:38 AM

But excessive blood-glucose is… and without insulin, blood-glucose cannot be lowered and continues to rise.


It doesn't for everybody though. Lots of people use a low carb diet to keep blood glucose in check.
And blood-glucose isn't the real problem with low carb diets, cortisol is. All low carb diets depend on cortisol to trigger gluconeogenesis.

#14 Hebbeh

  • Guest
  • 1,662 posts
  • 573
  • Location:x

Posted 01 August 2013 - 02:51 AM

But excessive blood-glucose is… and without insulin, blood-glucose cannot be lowered and continues to rise.


You have no clue what you are talking about. Low carb diets will invariably lead to some degree of ketosis which is the main goal of a low carb diet and while in ketosis, blood sugar values will typically be in the range of 60's mg/dL. Just the opposite of what you are claiming. People have been using low carb diets for the past 100+ years and that is the yard stick of low carb diets...low blood sugar values. You either have no real knowledge of the science of low carb diets or you make stuff up to justify your made up starch based diet. Yeah, we all would love to achieve high blood insulin levels...shakes head.
  • like x 4
  • dislike x 2
  • Needs references x 1
  • Dangerous, Irresponsible x 1

#15 Chupo

  • Guest
  • 321 posts
  • 230
  • Location:United States

Posted 01 August 2013 - 04:14 AM

But excessive blood-glucose is… and without insulin, blood-glucose cannot be lowered and continues to rise.


It doesn't for everybody though. Lots of people use a low carb diet to keep blood glucose in check.
And blood-glucose isn't the real problem with low carb diets, cortisol is. All low carb diets depend on cortisol to trigger gluconeogenesis.


How is cortisol a problem on a low carb diet? It is necessary. Cortisol also rises in calorie restricted people and animals, who also show better health markers, delayed onset of disease, and even longevity. I agree it can be a problem when it isn't necessary such as when under chronic stress (cortisol rises in anticipation of having to fight or flee) or having an over-abundance of visceral fat but those aren't the cause on either low carb or CR.
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1
  • Ill informed x 1

#16 rwac

  • Member
  • 4,764 posts
  • 61
  • Location:Dimension X

Posted 01 August 2013 - 11:49 AM

But excessive blood-glucose is… and without insulin, blood-glucose cannot be lowered and continues to rise.


It doesn't for everybody though. Lots of people use a low carb diet to keep blood glucose in check.
And blood-glucose isn't the real problem with low carb diets, cortisol is. All low carb diets depend on cortisol to trigger gluconeogenesis.


How is cortisol a problem on a low carb diet? It is necessary. Cortisol also rises in calorie restricted people and animals, who also show better health markers, delayed onset of disease, and even longevity. I agree it can be a problem when it isn't necessary such as when under chronic stress (cortisol rises in anticipation of having to fight or flee) or having an over-abundance of visceral fat but those aren't the cause on either low carb or CR.


There isn't that much evidence for the long term benefits of CR in humans or higher mammals like monkeys. This is despite the "improvement" in short term measures of health. Doesn't that make you wonder about how true the improvement is in the first place? There's no evidence for low carb diets increasing lifespan either. Have you been following the recent debate on CR in monkeys?
Michael's analysis is here: http://www.sens.org/...en-and-mimetics

That leaves the question of disease. There are higher carb ways to deal with those. Believe it or not, high carb or high sugar diets have also been used as a treatment of diabetes.
  • like x 2
  • dislike x 1
  • Good Point x 1

#17 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 01 August 2013 - 12:56 PM

You have no clue what you are talking about.

Yawn.
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#18 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 01 August 2013 - 01:01 PM

How is cortisol a problem on a low carb diet?

Excessive secretion of cortisol, is a reaction to the amount of stress you are under. Restricting the main source of fuel for the body (carbohydrates) put the body udder a tremendous amount of stress, and the body responds by releasing catabolic-hormones to liberate stored glucose. Cortisol also induces lipolysis, which can cause ectopic-fat accumulation in non adipose-tissue and is also known for inducing insulin-resistance and inhibiting testosterone production.

Edited by misterE, 01 August 2013 - 01:08 PM.

  • dislike x 4
  • like x 2

#19 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 01 August 2013 - 01:05 PM

Believe it or not, high carb or high sugar diets have also been used as a treatment of diabetes.

And high-fat diets are usually used to induce insulin-resistance in both humans and lab animals.
  • Ill informed x 1
  • Good Point x 1

#20 Chupo

  • Guest
  • 321 posts
  • 230
  • Location:United States

Posted 01 August 2013 - 04:25 PM

There isn't that much evidence for the long term benefits of CR in humans or higher mammals like monkeys. This is despite the "improvement" in short term measures of health. Doesn't that make you wonder about how true the improvement is in the first place? There's no evidence for low carb diets increasing lifespan either. Have you been following the recent debate on CR in monkeys?
Michael's analysis is here: http://www.sens.org/...en-and-mimetics

That leaves the question of disease. There are higher carb ways to deal with those. Believe it or not, high carb or high sugar diets have also been used as a treatment of diabetes.


Of course I'm aware of all that but low fat/high carb isn't for everyone - something misterE can't wrap his head around. I think the evidence is still in favor of CR working rather than not. The Japanese centenarians with a defect in an enzyme in mitochondrial complex I, for instance. If that's not enough, there are those with longevity syndrome who have an HDL of over 75. Emulating this is not hurting me and I feel much better and am much healthier on low carb.


Excessive secretion of cortisol, is a reaction to the amount of stress you are under. Restricting the main source of fuel for the body (carbohydrates) put the body udder a tremendous amount of stress, and the body responds by releasing catabolic-hormones to liberate stored glucose. Cortisol also induces lipolysis, which can cause ectopic-fat accumulation in non adipose-tissue and is also known for inducing insulin-resistance and inhibiting testosterone production.


There you go again. You are confusing a pathological condition with a physiological one. Inhibiting cortisol when it's needed can be dangerous. http://suppversity.b...-all-about.html Lipolysis on a low carb diet gets rid of ectopic fat. You also see elevated FFA and cortisol in CR yet I never see you bashing CR. Peripheral insulin resistance is again physiological not your pathological diabetic state. I also doubt the testosterone production inhibition but if true, eunuchs live longer over-all and the rate of centenarianism among them was 130 times higher than what we see today in the west. So, that doesn't really scare me.
  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#21 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 02 August 2013 - 12:33 AM

Inhibiting cortisol when it's needed can be dangerous.






No doubt. But the body doesn’t need cortisol when you are eating enough glucose.





Lipolysis on a low carb diet gets rid of ectopic fat




Ectopic-fat is the result of lipolysis. Diabetics have extremely high levels of FFA’s and fat accumulation in the organs… this is due to insulin-resistance within the adipose-tissue. Once the adipose-tissue becomes insulin-resistant, insulin can no longer inhibit lipolysis, thus you get a huge flux of FFA’s into peripheral-tissues (like the liver, muscles, heart and pancreas).





You also see elevated FFA and cortisol in CR yet I never see you bashing CR.




Prolonged fasting will actually cause insulin-resistance and fatty liver, this has been well researched and once again due to increased lipolysis. I practice CR by eating a low carlorie-dense diet. I base my diet off of starches. Carbohydrates contain 55% less energy per gram than fat (4 calories with carbohydrate vs. 9 calories with fat). With a starch-based diet, you cut back on calories without even trying. What I'm trying to convey is that you can practice CR without having to deal with hypercortisolism, just fill your belly with starch, fruit and vegetables... and save the rich food for a special occasion.







Peripheral insulin resistance is again physiological not your pathological diabetic state.






Like I said before, carbohydrate-restriction mimics the effects of type-1 diabetes.







I also doubt the testosterone production inhibition





Insulin is needed for androgen-synthesis. One of the reasons why diabetics have low-testosterone concentrations is due to reduced insulin-signaling in the leydig-cells.

Edited by misterE, 02 August 2013 - 12:41 AM.

  • dislike x 4
  • like x 1

#22 madanthony

  • Guest
  • 86 posts
  • -6

Posted 09 August 2013 - 06:03 AM

White rice and other junk low nutrient carbohydrates are not appropriate for diabetics.







What about the results of Sweeney and Brunzell?

Yes white rice is low in nutrients, but it is almost the ideal fuel for the body. The metabolism of the glucose in rice is very easy on the body and is anti-stressing. Rice also has a great amino-acid profile, and studies using Kempner’s Rice-Diet showed that patients of the rice-diet had normal nitrogen-balance.

Combine some fruit or steamed vegetables with rice and you should expect to have all the benefits that were seen with Kempner’s patients; clean arteries, healthy kidneys, normal body weight, healthy eyes, normal blood-sugar, etc.

I have been aware of the 1927 research for a long time and I believe the discrepancy in these studies is due to the time at which they were taken...in 1927 the carbohydrates were NOT OVERPROCESSED JUNK FOOD as they are today. The rice was probably NOT minute rice, for example. What your body needs to avoid diabetes is complex slow-digest carbs. I see this all the time. A woman came into the health food store I was at the other day and she had been in hospital and due to being sick lost close to 100 pounds...she said the weight loss made her diabetic. I told her - of course - your body was feeding off your fat - a high fat diet! I directed her to alpha lipoic acid as it lowers blood sugar TREMENDOUSLY (and is used in Germany to treat diabetes). However some people are genetically diabetic. There is a link between low testosterone in men and diabetes (because hormones affect gene expression)> idk the link btwn hormones and diabetes in women but I have diabetes in my genes and don't have it due to my bio identical HRT or something else I take (like 1g. Olive Leaf Extract/day). There is something WEIRD about eating the SAME DIET you did all your life, passing menopause/andropause and suddenly having that SAME DIET make you diabetic. So IMHO you eat a complex carb healthy diet and if that is not enough you do bio identical HRT. Except in egregious cases, it is NOT the individual's fault they become diabetic.
  • dislike x 1

#23 Clarity

  • Guest
  • 135 posts
  • 13
  • Location:Long Island, NY

Posted 04 September 2013 - 02:18 PM

I can attest to a high carb/low fat diet controlling my blood sugar. High fat/low carb for me packs on weight (I gained during induction for atkins), drains my adrenals (from drops & spikes in blood sugar). I'm not diabetic, but am insulin resistant. My insulin resistance definitely has a liver component to it (it started after being on steroids and other rx drugs). I can literally crash my adrenals on low carb once I get into ketosis (as in adrenal insufficiency). In chinese medicine, there are many routes to diabetes including the liver, the pancreas and blood stasis, among other things.

Lipids however are another story. Low carb is what gets mine down. However, I have to survive first. So it's a no win situation that I'm still trying to work out.

#24 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 08 September 2013 - 12:52 AM

The type of carbohydrate also affects blood-lipids. Nearly all of starch gets burned up directly as is... but with simple-sugars, a fraction (about 30%) is converted into lipid [1]. While the conversion of simple-sugars into lipids can alter blood-lipids (raise triglycerides), the conversion of simple-sugars into fat (de novo lipogensis), actually isn’t enough to induce obesity [2-4].



In my opinion, it is best to let the body makes its own needed fat out of carbohydrates, rather than eating premade-fats like animal-fat and oils, which also contain contamination (like dioxins and heavy-metals), arachodonic-acid and its precursors (linoleic-acid). Eating premade-fats causes obesity, de novo lipogenesis does not.







[1] Am J Clin Nutr. 1998 Apr;67(4):631-9. Human fatty acid synthesis is reduced after the substitution of dietary starch for sugar. Hudgins LC, Seidman CE, Diakun J.

[2] Am J Clin Nutr. 2001 Dec;74(6):707-8. No common energy currency: de novo lipogenesis as the road less traveled. Hellerstein MK.

[3] Obes Res. 2003 Sep;11(9):1096-103. Effect of carbohydrate overfeeding on whole body and adipose tissue metabolism in humans. Minehira K, Bettschart V, Vidal H, Vega.

[4] Am J Clin Nutr. 2001 Dec;74(6):737-46 De novo lipogenesis during controlled overfeeding with sucrose or glucose in lean and obese women. McDevitt RM, Bott SJ, Harding M.

Edited by misterE, 08 September 2013 - 12:52 AM.

  • dislike x 2
  • like x 2

#25 Strangelove

  • Guest
  • 792 posts
  • 95
  • Location:)

Posted 19 September 2013 - 12:31 PM

MisterE I am really wondering why you had to go so back to a study in 1927 to support your claims concerning a good diabetes diet.

Please, go to a diabetes forum (as I have to do) that people are very interested to control their blood sugar and regularly have readings to check how food affects them, and I am sure you are going to get another (quite different) perspective of what you discuss in this thread.

If you are going to make health claims for a serious disease its good to have all your facts together.
  • like x 4
  • dislike x 1

#26 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 19 September 2013 - 11:36 PM

MisterE I am really wondering why you had to go so back to a study in 1927 to support your claims concerning a good diabetes diet.





I was showing that researchers knew what type of diet caused diabetes way back in 1927. I also showed studies in the 1940's, 50’s, 70’s and 80’s. It’s pretty hard to deny the results of Sweeney, and blaming the time of publication will not make these results go away either.


I am sure you are going to get another (quite different) perspective of what you discuss in this thread.









I am sure you are right. Unfortunately, most people don’t understand the importance of a low-fat/high-fiber complex-carbohydrate diet. Most people are lured into the low-carb/high-meat diets because those are the easiest to follow and people don’t have to give up their rich food (just throw away the hamburger buns!). The meat and dairy industries play such a prominent role in setting food policy that most people have misinformation.




If you are going to make health claims for a serious disease its good to have all your facts together.





What makes you say that?! Have you even read any of the studies I posted? How do you explain Sweeney’s results?

Edited by misterE, 19 September 2013 - 11:38 PM.

  • dislike x 1
  • like x 1

#27 NeuroGeneration

  • Guest
  • 103 posts
  • 11
  • Location:NYC
  • NO

Posted 12 February 2015 - 10:28 PM

Hey guys - I know this thread is a bit dated, but if you're still active, I'm facing a real-world issue related to blood sugar control & carbs. Any help / thoughts would be appreciated. I posted here: http://www.longecity...arb-keto-diets/



#28 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 18 February 2015 - 01:40 PM

Read the first post. Can't make it easier than that.

 



#29 NeuroGeneration

  • Guest
  • 103 posts
  • 11
  • Location:NYC
  • NO

Posted 18 February 2015 - 09:44 PM

Yes, I read it misterE – thank you. I still have a concern, because despite upping my glucose for 4 weeks, the blood glucose numbers are only increasing.

 

I don't have access to the full text of the study. Do you know how long it took for the insulin sensitivity to normalize (glut4(+), insulin(+), gluconeogensis(-), etc.)?



#30 misterE

  • Topic Starter
  • Guest
  • 1,035 posts
  • -76
  • Location:Texas
  • NO

Posted 19 February 2015 - 08:26 AM

I think what is probably occurring with you is that you might have high levels of glucocorticoids, like cortsol and glucagon. These are the hormones that elevate blood-sugar, perhaps some exercise to restore insulin-sensitivity, which helps increase glycogen synthesis. Soluble fiber ferments into bypructs that also lower blood-sugar along with alcohol consumption believe it or not.
  • like x 1





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: diabetes, carbohydrate, low-carb, insulin, pritikin, sweeney, kempner, fat, gluconeogenesis, lipolysis

18 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 18 guests, 0 anonymous users