81 replies to this topic

[solarfingers]

Hopefully everyone is done feeding the troll now and will be posting their experiences on Epitalon from the group buy?

Glad to see you back Logic!

[Authentic]

To Authentic's point, I personally have not used epitalon because of the lack of independent studies verifying its effects. I also haven't used C60 olive oil, but am a bit more likely to try it.

For epitalon, we have only the studies of one lab: Khavinson's. Since his career is based in large part on the idea that this compound is important, he has an incentive to fake his data, and we know that fake data is a big problem in scientific papers. If even one other lab had verified Khavinson's results, I'd be much more likely to take epitalon. The fact that Khavinsonhas patents and sells the compound also gives him a conflict of interest: if he published negative results, he'd be undermining any potential sales.

Again, the results may be perfectly genuine, and the fact that other labs haven't published may be due to the patents, and it may all be perfectly above-board, but without independent verification it's not possible to be certain.

Beside's Khavison's results, we have anecdotal reports from people on this thread. I don't recall that anyone has tried to collate these reports and see if there really is a highly positive trend, as there seems to be with C60OO. The reports I remember reading here all seemed to fall under the potential placebo effect category. Also lacking are reports of members here testing with animals. This is likely due to the very high cost of the compound, but the anecdotal animal reports for C60OO lend some additional credence since animals are less likely to be affected by a placebo effect (although their owners may be, and olive oil on its own could be providing some benefit).

With regard to Sciwalk's conflict of interest or lack thereof, it's hard to say that there isn't a conflict. He does have an interest in a producer of the compound, and he does benefit financially from sales of the compound. There are also a limited number of producers of the compound. So by promoting it he may stand to benefit financially. That does meet the definition of a conflict of interest as far as I can see: it's the same conflict of interest Khavinson has.

Which again is not to say that Sciwalk is lying, fabricating data, or being at all dishonest. Like Khavinson, all his statements and results may be perfectly genuine. Even when there is a conflict of interest, that doesn't in itself prove any dishonesty or misdeed.

For me, there isn't a preponderance of evidence sufficient to make me try this compound. I still follow this thread (although with all the bickering I'm wondering why I bother), because I think there is a possibility that it could be an important or useful compound. But I haven't seen enough data to be convinced to try it yet.

I wonder if anyone here is interested in producing a matrix as was done for C60OO showing how many people reported which effects from this compound, what their dose and method of delivery was, etc. If we can start collecting some data, however anecdotal, it would go some way towards showing that epitalon is or is not a useful compound for life-extension or health-extension.

Thank you for posting this well written and correct post. I wonder if an Admin could do a "Shill Check" by checking IP addresses on certain posters here to see if there might be something to that. The posts of some here seem to merit this, just to be safe. Hopefully they're all real.

[Dreamer]

Thank you for posting this well written and correct post. I wonder if an Admin could do a "Shill Check" by checking IP addresses on certain posters here to see if there might be something to that. The posts of some here seem to merit this, just to be safe. Hopefully they're all real.

I don't believe a "Shill Check" would turn up anything since nobody here is selling anything, with the possible exception of a certain troll who is busy trying to sell him/herself.

However, if someone wants to take on developing a matrix as suggested by Smithx, I would participate privately via PM with data and notes only to be revealed, nothing personal, identity withheld.

The way the forum is evolving, I am reluctant to post anything personal. The environment has changed, so I don't feel comfortable in posting some things.

[Authentic]

There is a problem on this thread:
http://www.longecity...-thread/unread/

The topic starter, Sciwalk has admitted that he owns a peptide lab in China that produces Epitalon for "many companies". He has previously sold Epitalon as a group buy on this same thread. Another user Dreamer has arranged a group buy which he profited from. These users are definitely conflicted and have become extremely irate and agitated when I drew their attention both to their conflict and also began asking poignant questions.

I've been called a troll, personally attacked and treated extremely harsh by these posters (and a few others, one of which I suspect is a shill). What I ask is that you do a third party review of the forum, and my posts in particular. If you think I am as bad as they claim please let me know what I've done to appear that way. My intention was to help the forum and give some very good information.

For example instead of following the protocols developed by the inventor of Epitalon, Sciwalk promoted his own protocol which is entirely different. When I tried to ask why I was personally attacked as you'll see. No answer was given, just many attacks. It's not normal behavior.

I would request that the thread by completely removed as it includes too many threads that are promotional and personal. The conversation could then be started anew without conflicted participants.

When comparing the C60 thread to this messy one, it's eye opening.

Edited by Authentic, 14 August 2013 - 05:56 PM.

[daouda]

You most definitely display the most salient characteristics of a troll... Ive had my differences with both Sciwalk and Dreamer but here you are spreading what is at best misinformation, either maliciously or unintentionnaly as a result of your lazyness to actually read the thread from the beginning. Sciwalk didnt sell Epitalon as a "group buy", and theres no proof that Dreamer profited from the actual one.

My intention was to help the forum and give some very good information.

How arrogant from you, so you think that youre so much smarter than the average poster on this board that you can step into a year-long conversation judging everyone by his latest post (without bothering to read what had been written until your "coming") and give evryone patronizing lectures ("Please dont buy anything from anyone on this board")...

I would request that the thread by completely removed as it includes too many threads that are promotional and personal. The conversation could then be started anew without conflicted participants.

Really, who the hell do you think you are?

Edited by daouda, 14 August 2013 - 06:24 PM.

[Authentic]

Thank you daouda for giving an example of what I am talking about. Sciwalk did sell Epitalon directly to people here and has admitted that, if you would check back you'll see it very clearly.

[daouda]

Of course I do know about this but that was still not a "group buy". Read my posts in that thread and you'll see that Ive had some argument with sciwalk about his conflict of interest when he came in spreading doubts about Genscript and my group buy project. Also you'll see that I and dreamer arent exactly friends and I'm not a huge fan of the way he conducted the group buy, to say the least... I am simply put off by your unbelievable arrogance, and again, the accusations above have no ground (and pretty much amount to calomnia) and should be enough to get you banned IMO.

Edited by daouda, 14 August 2013 - 06:39 PM.

[Authentic]

Ah now I understand more. Daouda I sincerely apologize for making myself come across so arrogant. It was not my intention and I am truly sorry.

[Authentic]

I put together a partial list to show how this Sciwalk user went further and further into selling on this forum. He later changes his mind and instead pushes sales through companies he seems to supply or be otherwise related to. It starts innocuous but then degrades into full-on selling and promising miracles in a bottle.


Posted 05 January 2012 - 05:34 PM
I guess I cannot send more then 2 PM's in a day so, if someone wants to reach me personally I can tell you that I like yahoo and my name is consistant: sciwalk.

have a couple more kits of 100mg if anyone else wanted to test it out on their mice? My brother is in the middle of a move so he can't take his now.
If anyone wants to give it a shot, it now comes in easy to take packaging. It comes in glass vials that have a gauge on the side so you know where to fill with water and where to fill up to with wine. You then cap it with a silicone dropper top (comes pacakged with the vial ) that lets you squeese out drops. It has really simplified the process for me, I love it.

I currently have stock and should have for the near and far future. I have an extensive amount of friends and family that are using it currently so I had told everyone on the board that I can supply for them also if they wish. You can PM me if you wish and I can go over the details with you.

Yes, it can, but as it can be taken sublinqual there hasn't been anyone yet trying that. The way it is packaged and its purity, one could use it for Sub-q I suppose.
Links to article: You can obtain AGAG directly through us. Just use the contact form on this site and let us who you are, know how much you want and where to ship it. We have sent you an email.
Update: 2-3-2013
AGAG is no longer available through us. There are a few labs that can custom produce it for people, “Gen-script” and “Biotrends”. But those are for large quantities, generally in bulk. There is talk about another company, “Bio-Luma Research” that is selling in smaller doses. Sorry, I wish I had links, but not at this time.
You can send your request for the amount you wish to purchase along with your full name, address (including country and zip code) and phone number to admin@appliedyouth.com. We will respond back promptly with the cost and a tracking number for your AGAG.

I was talking to my brother in-law a couple of days ago (he is taking AGAG also, age 63) and he said I have to do more to let more people find out about AGAG. I kind of brushed it off, I am not out to be in the AGAG business really, but, after also talking to my partner we decided to do something for people here on longecity.
Right now we will offer 10 people - 1 free vial (50mg) of the AGAG with no other purchase neccessary. You will need to pay for shipping ($25, international) but there is nothing else required, asked or expected, oh, except that you let other know what you think.
I know that 1 vial, maybe only 25 to 50 days worth, is not much but so far, most people see and feel difference within that time so I am willing to do this.
If you want, you can buy more and all can ship within the $25 with the free vial (dilute the shipping costs).
First come, first serve on this offer.

Somone just asked me how much the actual shipping cost is, not sure why, but:

I am in Hong Kong, I ship via Hong Kong Postal Express (3 to 7 days) which provides for tracking and requires a signature on delivery. The cost varies from place to place. I have had some cost as little as $19.30 and others cost as much as $27.50. I just put it at $25 to round out. I am not making money on that if that is what the question was about? My time to pack it, the cost of packaging and having to take it down to the post office is more then any "padding" that may be on the shipping costs. That is not the point here, we just want to give a chance for others to try and hope they will report, better yet, let their friends and family know so they can benefit from it like my friends and family have.

OK, I hope this isn't against the rules or anything, but, I am getting so many questions in PM's that I know I am going to run over my PM limit. So, please, here is my email address, you can write to me directly - sciwalk at yahoo dot com.
For the three people that asked what they could or should see within the time of the free vial. First, smoother skin. This is the same report back from everyone. Second, more sleep (maybe lucid dreaming) except in the case of Adam and his twin brother file:///C:\Users\JDK\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtmlclip1\01\clip_image002.png. Thirdly, more energy.
I would like to point out, if there are those willing to try, it really helps, and shows up right away, in leveling out hormones. If you are suffering from PMS or PPD, you might want to give it a try, the results come fast but keep in mind, you may not notice it, but others will.
I don't know, I just know that twice now I have been locked out of replying.

Get with me by email and have your friends contact me too, I will let you guys know what to do. About out of slots now. I think 2 more.

OK, I have had enough people ask, so numbers are up and I can push the new pricing forward faster. I was going to wait until Nov. 1st but starting right now the lab will sell 4 vials for the price of 3. (Buy 3 vials at full price and get the 4th one free). This can be done in multiples also so, for example, pay for 6 vials and get 8. The previous discount on 1gram still stands.

Update on me. Well, sorry I have been kind of absent but I have been focusing on my workout (body transformation) and cracked a couple of ribs, (the two are not related). The cracked ribs have caused me a lot of trouble and distracting me from a lot of things. But, I am feeling much better now.
I stopped taking the AGAG at the end of September, one year on. I did not notice any detriment from stopping, sleeping has still been quite well, I still have lots of energy and feel good overall, except my ribs.

I did not loose as much gray hair as I had hoped. Although, there is no doubt I lost some, it did not all go away. Actually rather uneven as I have more remaining on one side of my head then the other. I wonder if my telomeres were just too far gone for those melanocytes?

I don't get quesses or suggestions from people any longer, that I must be in my mid 40's. Almost exclusively, people seem to feel that I am in my mid 30's (I am 51).
Here is a current picture of me. I just shot this just now, sitting on my couch. I want it to be totally spontaneous, no editing, no touch up, no preparation. Just a candid shot of the moment. Sorry for the lack of smile but my ribs do still hurt.

Link to current post on my blog

In the last few months I had dropped down to just 1mg a day.
Not really advertisment. Everyone keeps asking me about price reduction. I worked out something with the lab and gave the new information. There are other labs where you can get it, not going to hurt my feelings. Primary point is to get the word out.
I don't thiink there will be any issue with access. I have sent it now to over 15 countries and no problem with any. Customs take a bit longer in some places then others to try and figure out what it is but I label it as exactly what it is,

If there was any other information, specifically, that you were looking for, please let me know and I will promtply reply. If you just want to ask about getting some AGAG, better to just contact me by email. You will find my email address listed a few times through out the thread, but, here it is again in case you can't find it: sciwalk@yahoo.com

I hate to use this board for mention about sales but as I keep getting the same questions, let me put everything here and hopefully, guys, if someone asks again, please point them back to this post.

The AGAG comes in 50mg vials, labled with a drop indicator to help with mixing, a silicone dropper top to make it easy for use and packaged in individual boxes for customs clarification and shipping safety.
There is an MOQ of 2 vials.
Each vial is $50 (2 vial MOQ = $100 MOQ purchase).
If you buy 3 vials you get 1 free (4 vials for the price of 3).
If you buy 1 gram, 20 vials, the "buy 3 get one free" offer is null but the price of the AGAG reduces by 40% ($600 for 1 gram).
If you buy a gram or more and are willing to take in unlabled vials, 10 vials per small white box, then the price goes down to $25 a vial.
Because someone has mentioned on here about buying 100 grams, that comes in a single large plastic sealed bottle and costs $23,000. Although we have only ever sold this way to large University labs, the offer is there for anyone. But I must warn you that it is very difficult to store, dose and use in this way. Once the bottle is opened it is then exposed to the air and faces the issue of bacterial degradation. It needs to be handled in a "clean" enviroment and extremely cold temperatures with no humidity or it will turn into a ball of glue.

Because I wanted to trial the AGAG I sought out the best lab I could find to make it. After investigation of that lab and other things they were getting involved in, I decided to become a vested partner in their business. As such, and having other friends and family that wanted to trial the AGAG, I arranged for the peptide to be processed into the 50mg vials. All of the labeling, packaging and silicone dropper is done on my side, by me, by hand. That is not and should not be missconstrued as it being some kind of market ready product. I do that for ease of use and to make it more proper for passing customs in shipping.

I will not be offering the AGAG for too much longer in this way. My companies primary focus is large bulk purchases of peptides and enzymes for commercial and industrial use. As my envolvement comes to its final resolution, I will not have time to do this any longer. If someone else wants to pick up the torch, I am more then happy to arrange bulk purchases and they can prepare it in the way I have been doing for others.

I hope that takes care of most of the questions and if not, again, please write to me by email, sciwalk@yahoo.com, as yahoo seems to like to block the email from Longecity from time to time so I don't always see PM's from here right away.


Pleb,

Don't worry too much. I should be able to continue supplying up until the middle of 2013 and by then I am quite sure that someone else will step up to handling distribution.

Once again, I please ask that concerns or questions, with regard to the sales, production, ect... of the peptide be asked to me individually and I will respond as quickly and as well as I can but I prefer that those kinds of things are kept off of here because putting them here, I then have to repsond here which then causes people to think I am again trying to advertise or something. I don't mind at all if people just forget that I ever said I sell it. If someone knows about or has bought it from me before and would like some, contact me, but really lets not keep talking about me selling it or asking me questions about selling it here, OK?

With what I have seen in reports so far, if you are 35 or under, 1mg a day is fine. If you are 45 to 35, 2mg, 45 and up - 3mg. But keep in mind that as you benefit your requirement will continue to go down. I am 51 in years now but after more then a year on AGAG I only need 1mg a day now and it seems I may be ready to decrease that again soon.

By the way, just a heads up folks, I no longer am personally handling sales of the AGAG. You now need to go through Biotrends directly and also let you know that it seems there will be a few changes.

1. The contact email for sales for them is sales@biotrendshk.com
2. They have not listed it yet so you need to let them know what you are after, "Epitalon", that is the name by which they will sell it.
3. They are going to sell it in single vials (50mg), no 100mg MOQ like I needed to do.
4. They can send through regular mail, takes longer but is much cheaper if someone wants to go that route.
5. In about 2 weeks they will stop the 4 for 3 vial offer.

I finally tried some c60oo, made me feel like I was getting the flu and my joints hurt. I think I will let that one go.

Don't worry, I still have my eye on the AGAG, personally. It is just that the corp. has decided to do the sales directly and will probably be partnering with others in the near future.
The packaging is still relatively the same, different artwork. And, actually, the box has some directions on it now.
The shipping can still be the same like before, the Hong Kong Express with tracking, it is just that they are also offering to ship via regular mail if someone wants to lower that cost.

Posted 02 June 2013 - 05:12 PM
Wow, I can't believe how much activity this thread has had lately. I am really encouraged to see so many people taking a interest in Epitalon and wanting to trial.
Positive- Dude, fantastic!!!! That kind of kit is exactly what I have been waiting for. You rock, thanks thanks thanks!
I can give you the names and contact numbers of a dozen "reputable companies" in China that will give you even a better price then that. In fact, you can contact them all and start a bidding war. it's pretty easy to put some white powder in a vial. Pretty easy to put white powder in baby milk also. Please be careful and please do not use that to gauge results.
I would like to know, from others taking Epitalon, on a regular basis, have any of you been sick? When I am on the Epitalon, I swear, I don't get sick. People all around be can come down with flu, colds, whatever, but nothing happens to me. I really don't think this can be simple coincidence. I used to get sick every winter/spring but since on the Epitalon I don't. I have even, during my down cycles, started to feel a cold or flu coming on and start right back up on the Epitalon, wake up the next morning like I never even had symptoms. I have done that 3 times now. I really cannot believe it is just coincidence.

Posted 05 June 2013 - 08:18 AM
This is all very confusing. Genscript was one of the labs that many of us first started looking at when I opened this thread and from the last reports their price for 98% was about $25,000 if you buy 100 grams. Everyone here is well aware of Genscript and they have no bones about selling to just about anyone as long as you "sign up". If you were able to negotiate this, really low, rate from them then why didn't you just say so so everyone, anyone else could take advantage of it or join you in a buy? Why all the secrecy, then bashing me because I just suggested that you have it tested (because you would not divulge the source) and then next going after Dreamer because he did?
This really did not need to devolve into this at all. Just be upfront and straight from the beginning.
How about we let all this go, please proceed with your group buy and let us all know the results. I am glad to know now who the source is.

(sciwalk’s company appears to be the supplier to Genscript)

From Dreamer: I do not expect there to be any different logistics problems between GenScript shipping to individuals in the US versus shipping to other countries. The product is produced by a lab in China and shipped out from there
My wife and I have been using AGAG for about a year, buying from Sciwalk.
Monday was a holiday in China. The quote for larger quantities, 10 to 15 grams, was incorrect. We expect a corrected quote tomorrow. Since China is halfway around the world, we lose a day with each correspondence with them. Not all information comes from their US facility.

If there is anyone else that wants in on the Direct Buy Group order, please PM me with your information as outlined previously.

I should be able to send out all the information in the next few days via email, as soon as I get it. The order should be in place early next week.




*Whenever anyone questions the motives or honesty of Sciwalk, the first person to jump up and both attack the person who posted and defend Sciwalk is always "Dreamer". It's a cycle that repeats itself several times on the thread. I know it takes a long time to read the full thread, but it's worth it.

Edited by Authentic, 14 August 2013 - 07:23 PM.

[manic_racetam]

I'm moving all relevant posts from the original thread here. Thanks for posting here.

[Authentic]

I'm moving all relevant posts from the original thread here. Thanks for posting here.

Manic or any other moderator, would you please review and if you think it is necessary, take action to stop Sciwalk from sly selling on the forum.

Edited by Authentic, 19 August 2013 - 10:43 PM.

[solarfingers]

*Whenever anyone questions the motives or honesty of Sciwalk, the first person to jump up and both attack the person who posted and defend Sciwalk is always "Dreamer". It's a cycle that repeats itself several times on the thread. I know it takes a long time to read the full thread, but it's worth it.

You are misguided my friend. Dreamer is not Sciwalk and Dreamer is working with Genscript. We've already spelled this out for you. You seem to be overly concerned about this and it is becoming quite compulsive. Perhaps if you are so concerned you might spend your energies helping the community find a better source. Then, you might actually be helpful. This Sciwalk bashing has got to end.

[Authentic]

Sciwalk did sell goods via Dreamer in this "group buy".
Sciwalk did sell goods to Dreamer and others direct on this forum
Sciwalk encouraged people to email him direct, sneakily putting his email into his posts by saying things like "if someone wants to reach me personally I can tell you that I like yahoo and my name is consistant: sciwalk "
Sciwalk is also the supplier to Genscript, so when you buy Epitalon from Genscript you're actually buying from Sciwalk.

I am trying to protect the community from a Chinese peptide manufacturer selling his wares here on this forum. I am sorry that my posts have upset you. Please do not post any more negative things about me and please stop personally attacking me. I am really trying to help and I think I've a very good job of it based on the PMs that I have received.

This community is not a place for people to promote and sell their company's wares.

Edited by Authentic, 22 August 2013 - 08:29 PM.

[hav]

If you look to the beginnings of this thread you'll see that early on there were not many suppliers to choose from and a few members and moderators suggested the limited possibilities. Sciwalk never suggested any company name, only mentioned that he was involved in an evaluation, and to this day I still don't know the name of company he got involved with. From among the companies and web sites that were suggested, Genscript was the only one I could get a quote from myself. I don't recall a single instance of Sciwalk ever saying anything about Genscript, much less promoting them in any way.

Btw, I'm not aware that Sciwalk has ever talked about any peptide except Epithalon. In contrast Genscript is a general peptide manufacturer whose published peptide list doesn't even include Epithalon... it's only available from them as a special order for custom synthesis. If anything, I'd expect Sciwalk's company to order from Genscript. If they did, I'd expect Genscript would list it my name in their menu. I suspect Dreamer's group buy was their first bulk order.

But Sciwalk probably did stretch the rules a bit. I suspect it was tolerated because he was up front, open, honest, discrete, and suppliers were scarce. And he did secure some pretty attractive prices... substantially lower than Genscript's. And there hasn't been any dissatisfaction voiced from among those that dealt with him. Your complaint is the first but seems totally based on your concern for the rules here. But you have to realize that rules are designed and enforced to maximize the benefit of the members here. Group buys and vendor participation are thus welcome to the extent they benefit members. But management makes the balancing decisions... if you wanted to have more persuasive influence on management, maybe you should consider becoming a member yourself. Then again, maybe Sciwalk's company should consider buying a banner advertisement and maybe even offering us a special members-only discount.

Howard

[Authentic]

Howard if you want to buy from Sciwalk he lays it out in his email to which company to contact;

By the way, just a heads up folks, I no longer am personally handling sales of the AGAG. You now need to go through Biotrends directly and also let you know that it seems there will be a few changes.

1. The contact email for sales for them is sales@biotrendshk.com
2. They have not listed it yet so you need to let them know what you are after, "Epitalon", that is the name by which they will sell it.
3. They are going to sell it in single vials (50mg), no 100mg MOQ like I needed to do.
4. They can send through regular mail, takes longer but is much cheaper if someone wants to go that route.
5. In about 2 weeks they will stop the 4 for 3 vial offer.

http://hk1014319023....ontactinfo.html
Mr. Hugo Walker
Job Title: Marketing Director

My concern is that we're all being misled by Sciwalk/Hugo. I'm still not sure if he is selling a safe product or what is really in it. He touts Epitalon as a miracle drug that cures his gray hair, sickness, makes his wife happy (not kidding) and then tells you to buy it from him. If people want to experiment with Epitalon I think it is their right to do so and I have done my own experiments. However I follow the protocols set up by the inventor and I buy mine from an ISO9001 lab in a first world country.

Hugo made up his own protocol mixing the peptide with water and wine, then using it sub-lingual. One of the key points I was trying to raise is that this is not how any of the successful results with Epitalon were achieved. The inventor of Epitalon only used it in an injectable form with subcutaneous injections. He reconstituted the peptide with bacteriostatic water as explained in the research. Using the inventors protocol uses over 90% less Epitalon than Hugo's protocol. That might be the reason he doesn't want it used...

[solarfingers]

Howard if you want to buy from Sciwalk he lays it out in his email to which company to contact;

By the way, just a heads up folks, I no longer am personally handling sales of the AGAG. You now need to go through Biotrends directly and also let you know that it seems there will be a few changes.

1. The contact email for sales for them is sales@biotrendshk.com
2. They have not listed it yet so you need to let them know what you are after, "Epitalon", that is the name by which they will sell it.
3. They are going to sell it in single vials (50mg), no 100mg MOQ like I needed to do.
4. They can send through regular mail, takes longer but is much cheaper if someone wants to go that route.
5. In about 2 weeks they will stop the 4 for 3 vial offer.

http://hk1014319023....ontactinfo.html
Mr. Hugo Walker
Job Title: Marketing Director

My concern is that we're all being misled by Sciwalk/Hugo. I'm still not sure if he is selling a safe product or what is really in it. He touts Epitalon as a miracle drug that cures his gray hair, sickness, makes his wife happy (not kidding) and then tells you to buy it from him. If people want to experiment with Epitalon I think it is their right to do so and I have done my own experiments. However I follow the protocols set up by the inventor and I buy mine from an ISO9001 lab in a first world country.

Hugo made up his own protocol mixing the peptide with water and wine, then using it sub-lingual. One of the key points I was trying to raise is that this is not how any of the successful results with Epitalon were achieved. The inventor of Epitalon only used it in an injectable form with subcutaneous injections. He reconstituted the peptide with bacteriostatic water as explained in the research. Using the inventors protocol uses over 90% less Epitalon than Hugo's protocol. That might be the reason he doesn't want it used...

Dange! I totally missed that. Thank you, I'm contacting them right now. I sure hope they are still in China. Best grade peptides in the world.

[hav]

Howard if you want to buy from Sciwalk he lays it out in his email to which company to contact;

By the way, just a heads up folks, I no longer am personally handling sales of the AGAG. You now need to go through Biotrends directly and also let you know that it seems there will be a few changes.

1. The contact email for sales for them is sales@biotrendshk.com
2. They have not listed it yet so you need to let them know what you are after, "Epitalon", that is the name by which they will sell it.
3. They are going to sell it in single vials (50mg), no 100mg MOQ like I needed to do.
4. They can send through regular mail, takes longer but is much cheaper if someone wants to go that route.
5. In about 2 weeks they will stop the 4 for 3 vial offer.

http://hk1014319023....ontactinfo.html
Mr. Hugo Walker
Job Title: Marketing Director

My concern is that we're all being misled by Sciwalk/Hugo. I'm still not sure if he is selling a safe product or what is really in it. He touts Epitalon as a miracle drug that cures his gray hair, sickness, makes his wife happy (not kidding) and then tells you to buy it from him. If people want to experiment with Epitalon I think it is their right to do so and I have done my own experiments. However I follow the protocols set up by the inventor and I buy mine from an ISO9001 lab in a first world country.

Hugo made up his own protocol mixing the peptide with water and wine, then using it sub-lingual. One of the key points I was trying to raise is that this is not how any of the successful results with Epitalon were achieved. The inventor of Epitalon only used it in an injectable form with subcutaneous injections. He reconstituted the peptide with bacteriostatic water as explained in the research. Using the inventors protocol uses over 90% less Epitalon than Hugo's protocol. That might be the reason he doesn't want it used...

Guess I never got an email from him.

My understanding is that with short peptides like epithalon, injection is not necessary. Only for longer sequences like
Thymosin Beta 4 is it required. Also, strictly speaking, I don't think reconstitution with water containing benzyl alcohol is required for sub-q. Sterile water will probably do. But most of the peptide pinners on other sites seem to use it anyway, probably out of habit shooting other things like steroids im, or for added piece of mind, and the ability to store the mix for a short while in the fridge for a day when they reconstitute double doses. Most users here reconstitute epithalon with a few drops of vodka to help preserve but take it under the tongue which is probably fine as long as they don't swallow too much. If you reconstitute and use immediately, a preservative is probably unnecessary.

Personally, I'm needle phobic and would rather take and spend a little more than try self injecting when I don't have to. For example, I could probably use allot less dmso with a much stronger effect taking it by iv drip but I prefer to use it topically.

Howard

Edited by hav, 22 August 2013 - 11:59 PM.

[Authentic]

Howard I had shared and others had shared their methodology for injecting. One of the good things about esseSubQ is that you really use very little, and you get every bit of it. That's bad for people who sell the peptide but good for those who buy it. I would like to point out that I think it's super-important to use bacteriostatic water instead of just sterile water. When you go SubQ, a 5mg vial will last weeks!

You probably already know the danger of not using bac water on peptides stored for more than a few hours. Sorry to be such a worrywart, I had read those stories of a bad manufacturer causing meningitis with non-sterile injections https://en.wikipedia...ngitis_outbreak

If something like that were to go down in the peptide community it might shut down all of our research :(

[hav]

I don't think bac water is effective against fungus. But I think you would have to hit the spinal column to risk meningitis. I actually used to worry about making that mistake when I used to administer insulin to a diabetic cat I once owned because the injection site was a raised fold of skin on the scruff of her neck. But I still can't watch when the doctor gives me an injection.

Howard

Edited by hav, 23 August 2013 - 11:06 PM.

[hav]

To Authentic's point, I personally have not used epitalon because of the lack of independent studies verifying its effects. I also haven't used C60 olive oil, but am a bit more likely to try it.

For epitalon, we have only the studies of one lab: Khavinson's. Since his career is based in large part on the idea that this compound is important, he has an incentive to fake his data, and we know that fake data is a big problem in scientific papers. If even one other lab had verified Khavinson's results, I'd be much more likely to take epitalon. The fact that Khavinsonhas patents and sells the compound also gives him a conflict of interest: if he published negative results, he'd be undermining any potential sales.

Just stumbled across this on Klavinson's site... looks like a sales brochure with a peptide for every bodily system:
http://www.khavinson...wnloads/ibg.pdf

Not sure if they are actually marketing an Epithalon product. They do seem to have one called Pinealon but that also happens to be the name of a peptide with the sequence Glu-Asp-Arg.

Interestingly, their Testagen peptide product is starting to show up on body building sites as a testosterone enhancer. It has a sequence very similar to epithalon, Lys-Glu-Asp-Gly, which has shown up in a few studies, not all of which are his, were they are tested together with epithalon for similar effects on birds. Oddly, no straight up testosterone studies, however.
http://www.ncbi.nlm....lys-glu-asp-gly

Howard

[gerass]

I don't think bac water is effective against fungus. But I think you would have to hit the spinal column to risk meningitis. I actually used to worry about making that mistake when I used to administer insulin to a diabetic cat I once owned because the injection site was a raised fold of skin on the scruff of her neck. But I still can't watch when the doctor gives me an injection.

Howard

no fungus works on a different level.

[mikey]

If I shared that information I'd be mistaken as just another person on this board trying to sell their wares. I've already shared with you exactly how to obtain it in the proper manner this time. Rather then sharing my source, I've taught you exactly how to source it yourself.

 

Thank you, Authentic!

You saved me a bunch of money AND I'll get a "best" product!