591 replies to this topic

[pamojja]

Not a single supplement but it is quite well documented that, after switching to the Whole Plant Based Diet, arterial plague growth stops and than reverses.
​The improvements in the blood tests are usually seen just afer a couple of weeks (2-4).

 

Phew. Zen I wished that to be true. However, I turned a vegan with 10 years of age and at age 41 I ended up with a 80% blockage. Meanwhile I could revert a 60% percent walking-disability from it, by adding at least daily eggs, fermented cheese, fish and high healthy fats (>60% of calories).

 

And you seem to be even more in the unknown if you think plaque-growth could be seen with blood tests..

 

 

“Let food be thy medicine, and medicine be thy food”

 

Agree, but already Linus Pauling talked about bio-chemical individuality. And one man's poison could turn out an other's ambrosia.

Edited by pamojja, 28 July 2017 - 05:33 PM.

[pamojja]

Vitamin E (d-alpha tocopherol) significantly reduces oxy-LDL. Note that d-alpha tocopheryl(yl) does not perform. The vitamin E must be in the "ol" form.

 

Dosing must be at least 400 IU.

 

The Daily Value for vitamin E is currently 30 IU. A placebo-controlled study showed that vitamin E dosing of 60 IU or 200 IU had no effect on reducing the oxidation of LDL cholesterol that precedes cholesterol plaque formation, but that doses of 400 IU, 800 IU and 1,200 IU had significant effects on reducing the oxidization of LDL cholesterol.

400 IU = 25% reduction. 800 IU = 58% reduction. 1,200 IU = 61% reduction.
 

Jialal I, et al. The effect of alpha-tocopherol supplementation on LDL oxidation. A dose-response study. Arterioscler Thromb Vasc Biol 1995;15(2):190-198.

 

One of the only true active vitamin E "ol" supplements on the market is made by AC Grace, called Unique E,  I started taking 800 IU per day. I will have an oxy-LDL test in about a month to compare to a previous test.

 

Thanks. I was taking 340mg d-alpha-tocopherol (=507 IU), 270 gamma-tocopherol and 100 mg tocotrienols pretty consistently for 9 years, and that might indeed not have been enough.

 

However, I did observe almost doubling of oxLDL (still within normal range, just not optimal), and the only difference in any of the antioxidant intakes has been 1/3 lower astaxanthin. Upped that again, the next test will tell more again.

[zen]

 

Not a single supplement but it is quite well documented that, after switching to the Whole Plant Based Diet, arterial plague growth stops and than reverses.
​The improvements in the blood tests are usually seen just afer a couple of weeks (2-4).

 

Phew. Zen I wished that to be true. However, I turned a vegan with 10 years of age and at age 41 I ended up with a 80% blockage. Meanwhile I could revert a 60% percent walking-disabilty from it, by adding at least daily eggs, fermented cheese, fish and high healthy fats (>60% of calories).

 

And you seem to be even be more in the unknown if you think plaque-growth could be seen with blood tests

 

I am sorry to hear that switching to vegan wasn't helpful for you. :(
Note, Whole Plant Based Diet is not exactly the same as vegan, French fries can be considered a vegan dish but I would not think of it as being good for ones health.

​My wife an I switched to WPBD over year ago, we are not going back.
​My wife's cholesterol, which was ~250, and her doctor was advising starting her on statins, is now ~140 with zero drugs.
​I had some problems with elevated blood pressure 150/100, now my blood pressure is ~120/70.








 

Edited by zen, 28 July 2017 - 05:39 PM.

[pamojja]

​My wife an I switched to WPBD over year ago, we are not going back.

 

I never ate fast-food. All my numbers also improved, so why should I look back?

 

Sorry if I don't react that friendly. But I'm really tired of all the whole plant based diet zealots (which I hope you aren't) on the Internet, who claim without any coronary calcium scoring (CAC - the only test which unequivocally shows if there regression) only their approach could heal, when in fact it was part of initiating this disease process in my case.

Edited by pamojja, 28 July 2017 - 05:49 PM.

[zen]

 

​My wife an I switched to WPBD over year ago, we are not going back.

 

I never ate fast-food. All my numbers also improved, so why should I look back?

 

​We are all different, I am simply sharing my personal experience, I do not expect that this is going to work the same way for every other person.
If you have tried something and you know it is not working for you, it would be illogical to keep doing it anyway.


 

[PeaceAndProsperity]

Plant-based diets are bad for you and will under no circumstances improve your health whatsoever..

The reason people avoid eating animal products is because they have a feminized brain which causes them to believe that animals feel the same level of pain as humans do but this is not the case since there are 3 types of pain, the last type of pain being psychological ("I am suffering") and this form of pain sensing animals do not have whatsoever, so animals never suffer from the physical pain they receive.

This whole subject is complex and delves into philosophy, since pain entails the attribute of aboutness that physical things do not have.

 

 

[pamojja]

This whole subject is complex and delves into philosophy, since pain entails the attribute of aboutness that physical things do not have.

 

As a 10 year old I went to a neighbor butchery to watch. Without the philosophical self-defense of adults I saw anguish and sheer panic in the manner of those cows about to be butchered. Beside it intentionally inflicted, I simply didn't want to nourish off that stress-hormone levels from that onwards. And I still don't.

 

How you ended up such a dogmatic know-it-all, peace?

[Colorow]

Dont bother with him. He is the local longecity troll engaging in classic troll behavior.

Good boy, go back under the bridge


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[pamojja]

Dont bother with him. He is the local longecity troll engaging in classic troll behavior.

Good boy, go back under the bridge

 

I earn my money with social work, an the moment actually with homeless people. Sure he behaves perfectly like a troll with all their typical personality disorders. But then when you hear all their stories, their past pains and traumas they never got over, the systematic bad behavior and drama, just like peace's, suddenly becomes self-explanatory. Sadly, often such a human's only way to protect that tiny shadow of a personality left.
 

[aconita]

OK, what about triglycerides/ HDL ratio?

 

All this talking about cholesterol but evidence seems to point at TG/HDL ratio as a much more reliable risk indicator.

 

My total cholesterol is 290 but my TG/HDL is 0.5, I am gonna die any soon?

 

By the way my doctor doesn't know my values yet, I am afraid of an hearth attack... no, not mine, his!

[pamojja]

All this talking about cholesterol but evidence seems to point at TG/HDL ratio as a much more reliable risk indicator.

 

Some risk factors are better than others, but in the end it all its like reading tea-leaves. You could have no risk, or very high - only a CAC score could tell. Unless you would get it as bad as me, and can't walk anymore.

[aconita]

Well, a CAC test is a pain in the neck....but with my cholesterol values I should get a prescription for it without questions, I guess.

 

If I decide to do it (not sure yet) I'll let know the outcomes.

[Daniel Cooper]

Mikey needs to come back and talk to us about his quercetin/dasatnib protocol and experience.  That one looks very interesting. I've done a 6 month regimen of 1000mg quercetin on the weekends, but I haven't got the guts to add dasatnib to it.  I suspect you will get some results from quercetin alone, especially if you keep it up for a protracted time which you would not want to do with the dasatnib in the mix.

 

 

[Advocatus Diaboli]

The definitive test for blood lipids is an NMR LipoProfile test. It includes a wealth of information and, in the USA, is probably covered by your health insurance.

 

The test will report lipid particle sizes, which are important data to know--typical lipid panels don't report particle size. Most major heart attacks happen to people with normal cholesterol levels. It is the concentration of medium and small LDL particles that should be of greater concern.

 

(formerly known as "hypnos"--someone who stays away from statins)

[pamojja]

The definitive test for blood lipids is an NMR LipoProfile test. It includes a wealth of information and, in the USA, is probably covered by your health insurance.

 

The test will report lipid particle sizes, which are important data to know--typical lipid panels don't report particle size. Most major heart attacks happen to people with normal cholesterol levels. It is the concentration of medium and small LDL particles that should be of greater concern.

 

Once a CAC score (or an event) establishes risk, many blood test help to determine where the risk is coming from. CRP, fibrinogen, homocysteine, thyroid and hormone panel, HbA1c and insulin, and on and on. NMR isn't done here, and gets expensive when done out of your pocket repeatedly for monitoring.

 

OK, what about triglycerides/ HDL ratio?

 

All this talking about cholesterol but evidence seems to point at TG/HDL ratio as a much more reliable risk indicator.

 

My total cholesterol is 290 but my TG/HDL is 0.5, I am gonna die any soon?

 

There is a neat little trick to know your LDL-size with your regular triglycerides: if they are close to 50 mg/dl almost certainly most LDLs are of the harmless large fluffy size, if icloser to 150 mg/dl, mostly the dangerous small and dense type. More widely available Apo-B can be taken as substitution marker for LDL-particle number. But again, all these other risk-factors only mean it, once you've got a CAC score other than zero. But that is almost certain beyond age 50. CAC scoring isn't even recommended before age 40, with many risk factors already at 35.

 

Edited by pamojja, 29 July 2017 - 09:55 AM.

[pamojja]

Mikey needs to come back and talk to us about his quercetin/dasatnib protocol and experience.  That one looks very interesting. I've done a 6 month regimen of 1000mg quercetin on the weekends, but I haven't got the guts to add dasatnib to it.

 
Mikey's protocol indeed came to fruition. But if you look at his whole regimen for so many years - and staying consistent as with my case - you would also have to admit that he took too many thinks for being able to pin it down to 1 agent only.
 

Posted 19 September 2013 - 05:17 PM
 
I started taking C60oo in early August, 2012, ..
 
.. high-dose vitamin K2 (MK4) .. So, I began taking 5 mg three times a day. I'm raising it to 15 mg, tid, because it is not toxic and I've seen multiple recommendations for 45 mg/day.

I'm also taking vitamin K2 (MK7) 400 mcg/day.

K1 has beneficial effects for bone, but not plaque, but I am taking 200 mcg/day of it, also.
I get xanthohumol from ..

Calcium is in the multi I take but I don't even take half the RDA.
 
I've been taking 5-6 capsules of Tocomin SuprBio tocotrienols a day for several years, ..
 
Taking 8,500 IU/day, my OH-vitamin D tests as 60 ng/ml, ..
 
I've been taking nattopeptase and serrapeptase for years .. I am still taking them, ..

.. drinking a beverage made with 5 grams of arginine and 1 g of citruline, which I drink inconsistently.
Therefore, whenever I have to have some kind of x-ray, ..
 
I take 3,000 mg of vitamin C and 1,800 mg of N-acetyl-cysteine, which converts in the body into glutathione, about 90 minutes before the scan.
 
While 4,000 mg/day of EPA/DHA from fish oil stops me from having dozens of years of acute chronic atrial fibrillation - 10-15 events a year ..

After three years of taking 500+ mcg of vitamin K2 (MK-7) .., combined with its required nutrient partners vitamin A and vitamin D…
 
The only thing that produced a clear effect, that of lowing of blood pressure significantly, was taking Dasatinib with quercitin, to remove senescent cells. Two exposures to DQ and within a couple of weeks my blood pressure dropped from what could be a high of about 140-150/80-100 to 100-120/60-75, like a 20-year old's....
 
..This lasted for about 60 days and then there has been a gradual increase again, but it still hasn't reached the highs that were frequently what I encountered before I used DQ.
.
..I haven't used DQ again, because it did cause some facial fat loss, such that I have a line on my face that was not there before and I do not want more loss of facial fat tissue.
 
..As far as therapies to regenerate everything via clearing senescent cells we will see the emergence of side-effect free therapies, that don't have the potential adverse effects that DQ does.
 
..As to single molecules that have some role in arterial health, I have done and am doing many of them from niacin to acetyl L-carnitine to K2 (MK-7). Several of them do have some beneficial effects. But none of them do enough.
 
I figure that if I wait until FOXO4-DRI becomes more available/less costly, I will use that to clear senescent cells globally, without the side-effects of DQ.

Edited by pamojja, 29 July 2017 - 11:35 AM.

[pamojja]

Progression was about 10%....
…
(I eat a low carb, organic plant food, high-fat, moderate protein diet that includes animal fats. The fats that I consume are generally a carefully-considered balance of polyunsaturates so that my omega-3-6-9 balance is controlled, with the addition of saturates as high cholesterol, organic grass-fed butters, cheeses and eggs. Yum!)

 

Personally, I take 3,000 mg of Endur-C, a pharmaceutical-grade sustained-release vitamin C to keep my vitamin C blood levels consistent, several times a day. I've been taking 6-15 grams of vitamin C for over 40 years. (My father knew Linus Pauling.) This might be one reason that people say that I look at least 20 years younger than my siblings.

 

The vitamin E must be in the "ol" form.. Dosing must be at least 400 IU...

I started taking 800 IU per day. I will have an oxy-LDL test in about a month to compare to a previous test.

 
That in todo is not only TYP's approach (find causes, adding strategies and monitor; which can give very individual regimens, as you may've learned at TYP), but even contains what Linus Pauling recommended in his book for maintaining good health (lysine was an addition to his CVD recommendations only).

Edited by pamojja, 29 July 2017 - 11:45 AM.

[pamojja]

..As to single molecules that have some role in arterial health, I have done and am doing many of them from niacin to acetyl L-carnitine to K2 (MK-7). Several of them do have some beneficial effects. But none of them do enough.

 

Of all persons I know archiving a declaration below 15% yearly plaque growth, or even repeated reduction, all did it with more than a dozen supplements and diet. None without those combined synergistic effects.

Edited by pamojja, 29 July 2017 - 11:47 AM.

[Daniel Cooper]

 

Mikey needs to come back and talk to us about his quercetin/dasatnib protocol and experience.  That one looks very interesting. I've done a 6 month regimen of 1000mg quercetin on the weekends, but I haven't got the guts to add dasatnib to it.

 
Mikey's protocol indeed came to fruition. But if you look at his whole regimen for so many years - and staying consistent as with my case - you would also have to admit that he took too many thinks for being able to pin it down to 1 agent only.
 

Posted 19 September 2013 - 05:17 PM
 
I started taking C60oo in early August, 2012, ..
 
.. high-dose vitamin K2 (MK4) .. So, I began taking 5 mg three times a day. I'm raising it to 15 mg, tid, because it is not toxic and I've seen multiple recommendations for 45 mg/day.

I'm also taking vitamin K2 (MK7) 400 mcg/day.

K1 has beneficial effects for bone, but not plaque, but I am taking 200 mcg/day of it, also.
I get xanthohumol from ..

Calcium is in the multi I take but I don't even take half the RDA.
 
I've been taking 5-6 capsules of Tocomin SuprBio tocotrienols a day for several years, ..
 
Taking 8,500 IU/day, my OH-vitamin D tests as 60 ng/ml, ..
 
I've been taking nattopeptase and serrapeptase for years .. I am still taking them, ..

.. drinking a beverage made with 5 grams of arginine and 1 g of citruline, which I drink inconsistently.
Therefore, whenever I have to have some kind of x-ray, ..
 
I take 3,000 mg of vitamin C and 1,800 mg of N-acetyl-cysteine, which converts in the body into glutathione, about 90 minutes before the scan.
 
While 4,000 mg/day of EPA/DHA from fish oil stops me from having dozens of years of acute chronic atrial fibrillation - 10-15 events a year ..

After three years of taking 500+ mcg of vitamin K2 (MK-7) .., combined with its required nutrient partners vitamin A and vitamin D…
 
The only thing that produced a clear effect, that of lowing of blood pressure significantly, was taking Dasatinib with quercitin, to remove senescent cells. Two exposures to DQ and within a couple of weeks my blood pressure dropped from what could be a high of about 140-150/80-100 to 100-120/60-75, like a 20-year old's....
 
..This lasted for about 60 days and then there has been a gradual increase again, but it still hasn't reached the highs that were frequently what I encountered before I used DQ.
.
..I haven't used DQ again, because it did cause some facial fat loss, such that I have a line on my face that was not there before and I do not want more loss of facial fat tissue.
 
..As far as therapies to regenerate everything via clearing senescent cells we will see the emergence of side-effect free therapies, that don't have the potential adverse effects that DQ does.
 
..As to single molecules that have some role in arterial health, I have done and am doing many of them from niacin to acetyl L-carnitine to K2 (MK-7). Several of them do have some beneficial effects. But none of them do enough.
 
I figure that if I wait until FOXO4-DRI becomes more available/less costly, I will use that to clear senescent cells globally, without the side-effects of DQ.

 

 

 

 

That's very similar to my regimen.  I take many of those same substances and a similar total number.

 

Now if I only add another 280 items I'll be up to your list. 

 

Now stop being so pissy our you'll be our next P&P.

 

 

 

 

 

[pamojja]

Now if I only add another 280 items I'll be up to your list. 
 
Now stop being so pissy our you'll be our next P&P.

 

All I'm pointing out reversal of plaque is already done in that specified particular synergistic way for benefit of those willing to try and persist.

 

Yourself found already out that the high number of ingredients comes from listing everything in multies and combination products, including macro nutrient breakdown and more.

 

Who is pissy here? Anything meaningful?

[mikey]

Mikey needs to come back and talk to us about his quercetin/dasatnib protocol and experience.  That one looks very interesting. I've done a 6 month regimen of 1000mg quercetin on the weekends, but I haven't got the guts to add dasatnib to it.  I suspect you will get some results from quercetin alone, especially if you keep it up for a protracted time which you would not want to do with the dasatnib in the mix.

 

Dasatinib definitely works, but it has side-effects, like facial fat loss that makes me not want to repeat using it.

Edited by mikey, 31 July 2017 - 12:00 AM.

[Daniel Cooper]

Mikey,

 

I think that  D+Q therapy has the potential to do some real good on some aspects of cardiovascular health, the dramatic blood pressure improvement that you noted being one.

 

Since you've done this therapy I suspect you've seen this study but for others who may not be familiar:

 

Chronic senolytic treatment alleviates established vasomotor dysfunction in aged or atherosclerotic mice

 

This was a mouse study where they induced atherosclerosis then administered D+Q.  This senolytic combination seems particularly good at clearing senescent endothelial cells.  One thing I found particularly interesting was this bit:

 

 

Medial vascular calcification in aorta, however, tended to be reduced by pharmacological cell clearance (Fig. 1G) and was paralleled by changes in protein levels of osterix (Fig. 1H). The modest effects of senolytic treatment on structural aspects of large arteries may be due to the period of time required to regress/reverse age-related structural changes or the efficacy of senescent cell clearance (e.g., higher and/or more frequent dosing with senolytic agents) required to elicit regression of calcification or deleterious changes in vascular compliance in conduit vessels.

 

So this treatment may be backing the calcium out of your arteries.  Have you had a CAC score since doing this?

 

Since you don't want to be taking dasatnib too frequently I suspect, one thing I would consider doing is periodic (say weekly) doses of quercetin, with less frequent doses of D+Q.  Quercetin by itself is a senolytic, though not as powerful as D+Q, but it is very low risk.  So, the D+Q might gain the most ground for you, while the Q alone might make smaller improvements or at least hold the ground you've gained.

 

You've really done well.  3% progression per year of your CAC score means you've basically got this at a standstill.  You've dramatically decreased your odds of a cardiovascular event at this point.  I think you're a huge success story and you should share all the details of what you've done as you're willing.

 

 

 

 

 

[smithx]

See if you can find an Electron Beam Tomography machine in your area. There are a few of them left, and they are much much lower radiation exposure. Here's a site with a table showing the amount of exposure for different procedures:

http://www.newportbo...ebt-procedures/

 

They show a maximum exposure of 0.4 mSv and typical of half that.

 

Daniel, if I ask my cardiologist for a sub millisievert CAC scan, is he likely to know what that is? Is this the same thing as low-radiation dose calcium scoring?

 

[Darryl]

The definitive test for blood lipids is an NMR LipoProfile test. It includes a wealth of information

 

It's certainly more profitable for testing companies. Unfortunately the additional information adds little to risk prediction.

 

Mora et al, 2009. Lipoprotein particle profiles by nuclear magnetic resonance compared with standard lipids and apolipoproteins in predicting incident cardiovascular disease in women. Circulation, 119(7), pp.931-939.

 

[Advocatus Diaboli]

@Darryl

 

"It's certainly more profitable for testing companies."--reference?

From the study you cite:

"Because the present study is largely limited to white women, these data may not be generalizable to men or other patient groups. In particular, because we studied an apparently healthy cohort at low overall risk for CVD, the present data do not address the question of whether or not lipoprotein testing with NMR has clinical utility for risk assessment and treatment strategies for higher-risk patients, such as those with known CVD, diabetes mellitus/insulin resistance, or dyslipidemia, or for the monitoring of patients taking lipid-altering therapy. Such studies need to be performed in the appropriate patient settings, preferably within the context of randomized trials of primary or secondary prevention."


This more recent (2017 v. 2009) article, which also focused on women reports:

"Currently, clinical laboratories are faced with the problem of standardizing current methods for correctly quantifying low density lipoproteins bound to cholesterol (cLDL).[21] This, along with variability of some lipid components among individuals, has led to an incorrect interpretation of lipid profile results, which is fundamental in an MHO diagnosis." (MHO--metabolically healthy obese)

 

and

 

"Conventional lipoprotein quantification methods used in clinical laboratories only allow for the quantification of concentrations.[22] Therefore, it is necessary to find new techniques that allow for a much more precise estimate of CVR. This requires the ability to distinguish between different classes and subclasses of lipoproteins through the use of nuclear magnetic resonance spectroscopy (¹H NMR). NMR has been shown to be a more accurate technique across different population types." (CVR--cardiovascular risk)

 

and

 

"Adequate analysis of the lipid profile using novel techniques such as ¹H NMR is necessary for the correct characterization of the MHO population since both the number and sizes of the different lipoprotein particles better estimate CVR after a short-term, intensive intervention with a hypocaloric Mediterranean diet, and physical exercise. The results of our study can only be identified through ¹H NMR, hence the importance of including this technique in normal clinical practice."

 

 

I'm not sure if LipoProfile is generic NMR or is ¹H NMR, but, if not, then I suspect that

¹H NMR might arguably take top billing over standard lipid panels as well as generic NMR (assuming there is a difference between NMR and ¹H NMR) .

 

I guess one takeaway might be to let personal choice dictate which lipid-assessment tool one wants to avail themselves of. My personal choice is to go with the test that provides the greatest amount of information.

 

 

(emphasis by bolding and italics is mine)
 

Edited by Advocatus Diaboli, 01 August 2017 - 10:34 PM.

[aconita]

Pomegranate juice consumption for 3 years by patients with carotid artery stenosis reduces common carotid intima-media thickness, blood pressure and LDL oxidation.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/15158307

[smithx]

Seems like it was really good juice.

 

Pomegranates were picked by hand, washed, and stored in tanks. The fruits were crushed, and squeezed. The juice was filtered, pasteurized, concentrated and stored at 18C. Each day along the study period, the concentrated PJ was diluted 1:5 (v:v) with water in order to obtain a single strength PJ. The antioxidant composition of the juice include: 1979 mg/l of tannins (1561 mg/l of punicalagins and 417mg/l of hydrolyzable tannins), 384 mg/l of anthocyanins (delphinidin 3,5-digluco-side, cyanidin 3,5-diglucoside, delphinidin-3-gluco-side,  cyanidin  3-glucoside,  pelargonidine  3-glucoside), and 121 mg/l of ellagic acids derivatives. The juice contained also 3 mg of vitamin C per 100 ml of PJ.

 

 

 

I wonder if commercially available juices have anything like this concentration of active compounds?

BTW the study participates took 50ml of the juice per day.

[mikey]

 

Mikey needs to come back and talk to us about his quercetin/dasatnib protocol and experience.  That one looks very interesting. I've done a 6 month regimen of 1000mg quercetin on the weekends, but I haven't got the guts to add dasatnib to it.

 
Mikey's protocol indeed came to fruition. But if you look at his whole regimen for so many years - and staying consistent as with my case - you would also have to admit that he took too many thinks for being able to pin it down to 1 agent only.
 

Posted 19 September 2013 - 05:17 PM
 
I started taking C60oo in early August, 2012, ..
 
.. high-dose vitamin K2 (MK4) .. So, I began taking 5 mg three times a day. I'm raising it to 15 mg, tid, because it is not toxic and I've seen multiple recommendations for 45 mg/day.

I'm also taking vitamin K2 (MK7) 400 mcg/day.

K1 has beneficial effects for bone, but not plaque, but I am taking 200 mcg/day of it, also.
I get xanthohumol from ..

Calcium is in the multi I take but I don't even take half the RDA.
 
I've been taking 5-6 capsules of Tocomin SuprBio tocotrienols a day for several years, ..
 
Taking 8,500 IU/day, my OH-vitamin D tests as 60 ng/ml, ..
 
I've been taking nattopeptase and serrapeptase for years .. I am still taking them, ..

.. drinking a beverage made with 5 grams of arginine and 1 g of citruline, which I drink inconsistently.
Therefore, whenever I have to have some kind of x-ray, ..
 
I take 3,000 mg of vitamin C and 1,800 mg of N-acetyl-cysteine, which converts in the body into glutathione, about 90 minutes before the scan.
 
While 4,000 mg/day of EPA/DHA from fish oil stops me from having dozens of years of acute chronic atrial fibrillation - 10-15 events a year ..

After three years of taking 500+ mcg of vitamin K2 (MK-7) .., combined with its required nutrient partners vitamin A and vitamin D…
 
The only thing that produced a clear effect, that of lowing of blood pressure significantly, was taking Dasatinib with quercitin, to remove senescent cells. Two exposures to DQ and within a couple of weeks my blood pressure dropped from what could be a high of about 140-150/80-100 to 100-120/60-75, like a 20-year old's....
 
..This lasted for about 60 days and then there has been a gradual increase again, but it still hasn't reached the highs that were frequently what I encountered before I used DQ.
.
..I haven't used DQ again, because it did cause some facial fat loss, such that I have a line on my face that was not there before and I do not want more loss of facial fat tissue.
 
..As far as therapies to regenerate everything via clearing senescent cells we will see the emergence of side-effect free therapies, that don't have the potential adverse effects that DQ does.
 
..As to single molecules that have some role in arterial health, I have done and am doing many of them from niacin to acetyl L-carnitine to K2 (MK-7). Several of them do have some beneficial effects. But none of them do enough.
 
I figure that if I wait until FOXO4-DRI becomes more available/less costly, I will use that to clear senescent cells globally, without the side-effects of DQ.

 

 

To Answer: "Mikey's protocol indeed came to fruition. But if you look at his whole regimen for so many years - and staying consistent as with my case - you would also have to admit that he took too many thinks for being able to pin it down to 1 agent only."

 

I have been carefully studying the effects of each supplement that I add to my alchemicals for over 40 years now, as I introduce them and was praised by one world-renown practitioner for "knowing what is good for me better than any patient he had ever met." Another specialist was astounded by how I beneficially altered by comprehensive blood tests by changing supplements and diet. 

 

So, it is possible to be perceptive enough to know what each change one makes in the supplements that one takes to be certain that D &Q lowered by blood pressure by about 20 points, which no other supplements are any other aspect of my life has equaled.

 

As to Daniels question I made a calculation error and took 300 mg the first time that I took of Dasatinib with 1,000 mg of liposomal quercitin and found that I had apparently screwed up my heart's QT interval. I thought that I have really screwed myself up, but it reverted to normal after 8 days.

 

About two weeks later I took 50 mg of Dasatinib with 1,000 mg of liposomal quercitin, which absorbs perhaps a dozen times better than plain quecitin.

 

About two weeks later - a time interval that probably gave senescent arterial cells time to be "shedded" and my arterial flexibility was so much better that my BP was 20 points lower. I don't know that I will do scans that expose me to radiation, again. What I want is the result of decreased epithelial calcium az the blood pressure of a 12-year old. I may try D, at 70 mg and liposomosal  Q at 1000 mg once and see how much my BP drops over the few weeks after. I do advise being careful with Q, is it does feel like causes facial fat loss, at least it did to me a little and Daredevil, who used them a number of times experienced pretty severe facial fat loss.

 

 So, I am quite certain that D&Q produced a profound lowering of blood pressure that none of the other couple of hundred molecules that I've experimented with over the last 40 years accomplished.

 

I also don't see reason not to take quercitin by itself almost daily. If someone knows of a publication that shows danger please let us know.

Edited by mikey, 07 August 2017 - 07:24 AM.

[pamojja]

So, it is possible to be perceptive enough to know what each change one makes in the supplements that one takes to be certain that D &Q lowered by blood pressure by about 20 points, which no other supplements are any other aspect of my life has equaled...

So, I am quite certain that D&Q produced a profound lowering of blood pressure that none of the other couple of hundred molecules that I've experimented with over the last 40 years accomplished.

 

Sure, also in my case monitor extensive lab works, and thereby can know what improved kidney or liver function, homocysteine, fibronogen, Lp(a), thyroid and other hormones, CBC, blood glucose, other inflammation markers and so on.

 

However - high blood pressure being of course a large contributing factor in arteriosclerosis - in my case wasn't even there and can't have contributed a bid to the 80% blockage in plaque growth.
 

 

I have been carefully studying the effects of each supplement that I add to my alchemicals for over 40 years now, as I introduce them and was praised by one world-renown practitioner for "knowing what is good for me better than any patient he had ever met." Another specialist was astounded by how I beneficially altered by comprehensive blood tests by changing supplements and diet.

 

With all individual risk markers, like blood pressure, that works pretty well. But CAC score decelerates over long periods of time, like years. And in some case I heard of, it first could even accelerate (aka soft plaque healing up=calcifying). Therefore much more difficult to pin down to 1 agent, but much more likely being the result of having taken each and everyone of those multiples risk markers (in lab work) on their own. As you did for an astounding 40 years.

 

All I'm saying with CAC score we can only guess, and it could very well be that in your case blood pressure was the main driving force in plaque growth. It wasn't in mine.

Edited by pamojja, 07 August 2017 - 11:22 AM.

[Kevinsan]

I do not have time to read through it all, but here are some easy ways to clear up that nasty plaque.

 

1. Lipo EDTA - Commercially available. Wake up at night, take your one or two grams, fall back to sleep. Eat breakfast a few hours later and mineral supplements around noon. Half life is 45 minutes. Takes forty treatments. At two treatments a week it takes five months. Total cost: ~$800 USD. Bit of a flush.
2. Lipo Trehalose - Make at home with a sonicator. Take daily. Research says 35% plaque reduction in mice. Cheap
3. Lipo 2 hydroxypropyl Beta cyclodextrin. make at home in a sonicator. Research says 75% plaque reduction. They inject it into the brains of children to reduce plaque so it is perfectly safe. In mice fed obscenely plaque causing diets, the daily dose of HPCD prevented any and all plaque buildup. US made expensive. China made cheap.

Of course all can be injected. But the lipo has added benefits. You can research why. Tried them all. Prefer 1 and 3. Take 3 on a daily basis. For instructions, search DIY Lipo Vitamin C or Glutathione.

Edited by Kevinsan, 07 August 2017 - 07:30 PM.