32 replies to this topic

[timar]

Today I want to introduce to you a crucial part of my supplement regime, which is a quite unique and all-natural concotion of very potent superfoods. I call it my Polypulp^TM, because of its high content of polyphenols and as an homage and sort-of-synthesis of the concepts of the Polypill and the Polymeal (hah, Hegel would be proud of me!)

Now - pssst! - here's the secret recipe. You are lucky that I'm sharing it with you. Other people would rather have tried to sell the Polypulp^TM to you, for something like, say, $50 for a 200 g jar

Take one part each (by volume) of plain cocoa powder, cinnamon (ceylon), turmeric and red palm oil (heat it until in becomes liquid). Add some finely ground black pepper (~1/100 part) and stir thoroughly until you have thick paste looking like chocolate spread (no, don't think about any less appetizing ressemblances).

There you have the Polypulp^TM. What about it's nutritional value, you ask? After all, there must be a good reason for trying to gulp that stuff down. No, seriously, it tastes surprisingly unbad. The sweetness of the cocoa and cinnamon go a long way to make the unpleasant taste of the turmeric more palatable and the palm oil greases your throat so that it goes down swiftly.

But here's what you approximately get for that little bit of accustomization (per heaped teaspoon of Polypulp^TM, 15 g):

Calories: 85
Caffeine (from cocoa): 7 mg
Theobromine (from cocoa): 62 mg
Proanthocyanidins (from cinnamon and cocoa): 438 mg
of which...

• Momomers: 21 mg
• Dimers: 26 mg
• Trimers: 85 mg
• 4-6-mers: 188 mg
• 7-9-mers: 99 mg
• Polymers: 19 mg

Curcumin (from turmeric): 113 mg
Piperine (from black pepper): 2 mg
Tocotrienols (from red palm oil): 2.7 mg
Carotenoids (from red palm oil): 3.3 mg

This is about the amount of OPC you get from two supplemental capsules of grape seed extract, plus half the amount of curcumine you get from many supplements, in a highly bioavailable form, and a fair share of tocotrienols and carotenoids from the palm oil. In addition to the oil, the small amount of piperine should serve to further improve the absorption of those compounds. Moreover, it provides all those fancy whole food synergies supplement extracts lack (e.g. due to the essential oils and polysaccharides from turmeric).

As the Polypulp^TM has a slightly stimulating quality (more than to be explained by its alkaloid content), I would suggest to take it early in the day. I have one teaspon (15 g) of Polypulp^TM with my coffee before breakfast. It seems to help me to stay free of the allergies and arthritis symptoms I once had to cope with (probably by its anti-inflammatory virtues), plus it gives me a gentle boost in the morning.

[timar]

I forgot to mention that, as this recipe contains 3 g of cinnamon per suggested serving size, it may have a profound effect on blood glucose. I used to have a fasting blood sugar reading a bit higher than optimal (85-90 mg/dl) in the morning, but with the polypulp it went down to the lower 80s. If you ever had troubles with episodes of hypoglycemia, you should be a bit cautious with it.

Another point I should have been more explicit about is that you better make sure to use real ceylon cinnamon and not cheap cassia. Cassia contains high levels of hy hydroxycinnamic acid coumarin which is carninogenic in rodents (but probably not in humans. Better to err on the side of caution though)

The amounts of phytonutrients given above, although meticously calculated (by the measured density of each ingredient and based on the given references providing solid avarages) may give a false impression of exactness. In reality, the levels vary widely. In order to obtain the highest level of phytonutrients (likely higher than the given ones) choose organic ingredients. Organically grown plants have to deal with pests themselves and thereby produce higher levels of phytochemicals (Moreover, you avoid any pesticide residues). Choose cocoa powder that is not "dutched" (an alkali process which destroys much of the OPC), as evident by a very dark color and bitter taste. And, of course, keep the prepared polypaste in the fridge. It will last there for several weeks.

The reasoning behind the combination of cocoa and cinnamon is that both are exceptionally high in OPC and complement each other in their profile of oligomers. Cacoa provides more of the shorter-chain oligomers, while cinnamon provides more of the longer ones. Monomers and shorter chain oligomers (di- and trimers) have a much higher bioavailability and probably excert more potent systemic effects. Longer chain oligomers, however, are metabolized by gut bacteria in ways not yet completely understood. Some researchers argue that they may be equally important for maintaining a healthy gut flora as dietary fiber.

Last but not least, if you want to benefit from the tocotrienols, don't take the polypulp together with a tocopherol/vitamin E supplement as both compete for absorption. Note that the value given above for tocotrienols is probably way too low, as the source I used was for refined palm oil. I finally found another source for unrefined red palm oil, which gives 4.7 mg per 15 g of polypaste (or 5.4 g palm oil). Oh, and finally this is the ORAC value I calculated for that serving size: It's an impressive 10319 μmol TE.

Edited by timar, 09 January 2014 - 07:20 PM.

[nameless]

What brand of cocoa powder are you using? Years back when I looked at cocoa, I believe Navitas came in really high polyphenol-wise. No idea if it's the same now as it was then, however.

Interesting mix, although my belly might explode if I tried it (sensitive stomach). And although it is probably not an issue, those taking prescription drugs may wish to skip the pepper part of the mix, at least if they take their medications at the same time.

[timar]

A generic brand of organic cocoa (which is probably only available in Germany anyway). You can roughly estimate the polyphenol content of cocoa powder by the color (the darker the better) and taste (the more bitter the better).

Of course you should be careful if you have a sensitive stomach but for me this is much easier on the stomach than taking the cinnamon or turmeric on their own. I think the oil acts as a kind of slow-release carrier for the powders, preventing them from instantly dissolving in the stomach.

Edited by timar, 09 January 2014 - 07:59 PM.

[blood]

Do you take no concentrated polyphenol extracts, carotenoids or tocotrienols/ tocopherols in pill form?

I recall you mentioning (in other threads) that you take 1 LEF "two a day" cap, some carninutrients, and perhaps some magnesium oxide. Anything else?

[timar]

You have done a good job in keeping track of my supplement regime.

Besides of what you mentioned I take low dose fish oil (600 mg EPA + DHA), a self-made capsule of "phytonutrients" similar to the carninutrients (containing a blend of grape seed, green tea, milk thistle and saw palmetto extracts).

Moreover, my homemade synbiotic yogurt contains 5 g of each inulin and lactulose, as well as 1000 IU vitamin D and 200 mcg of K2 (from Thorne's Vitamin D/K2 oil) per 250 g serving. During wintertime, I take an additional 20.000 IU vitamin D capsule per week.

I also "supplement" chokeberries, flaxseed, dark chocolate, green tea, sun-dried tomatoes, etc. I always prefer whole foods to supplements if possible and practical. They do not only provide synergies not present in extracts, but are often much more pleasurable and economical.

The monthly cost of all those supplements and super foods is about €30, of which the pills and vitamins are less than €10.

Edited by timar, 10 January 2014 - 12:31 PM.

[timar]

Thanks to Michael Greger, I just became aware of a fascinating study, showing very elegantly how spices, even when consumed in very modest amounts (as little as 300 mg in the case of turmeric!), can have a profound impact on inflammation and DNA strand breaks. This study reinforces the whole food approach to supplementation that is behind the polypulp. It also shows that heat treatment of turmeric (as customary in indian cooking) may further contribute to its beneficial effects. Therefore, I now make my polypulp by first shortly heating the palm oil to about 100°C (which is the point up to which no major losses in carotenoids or tocotrienols are to be expected) while stirring in the turmeric. Oh, and just in case anyone should complain about the saturated fat content (2.7 g/serving): saturated fat actually improves absorption of carotenoids by 20-30% compared to unsaturated fats. The mechanism by which they increase bioavailability may apply for curcumin as well.

Edited by timar, 14 January 2014 - 06:26 PM.

[hav]

Hi, Timar. I just happened to be exploring the Longvida "invention" of increasing the solubility of Curcumin by gently heating it in water with a splash of alcohol in a pressure cooker:

https://www.google.c.../WO2013078477A2

Personally. I like your approach better. Because it stands a better chance of getting more product around the liver which tries to destroy it best it can. Did you ever consider adding something like lecithin to speed uptake?

Howard

[timar]

Interesting, that seems to describe an effective way to increase water solubility of curcumin.

What I really would like to see is a study comparing the plasma levels attained by tumeric, providing a defined amount of curcumin heated in fat, with those attained by the same amount of curcumin heated in fat, with those attained by curcumin prepared by the pressure cooker method and of a commercial phospholipid complex of curcumin.

I think simple, whole turmeric heated in saturated fat may come out surprisingly good, given the significant results of the aforementioned study with just 300 mg of turmeric (I'm still puzzled by those results!).

[hav]

Yes, and presumably increase uptake from the intestines via the portal vein directly to the liver and from there to the rest of the bloodstream. That's the path curcumin normally takes. It's also the path that most water soluble supplements, alcohol, and medium chain tryglicerides take. Long chain triglycerides like oleic acid would be more likely to take the lymphatic route nourishing cells along its pathway before dumping into the bloodstream via the thoracic duct about 8 hours later. Which I think is near the blood-brain-barrier but doesn't hit the liver until the next go round. So blood levels measured for things taking the lymphatic route take longer to peak and would probably be lower. But don't necessarily reflect bio-availability in direct comparison to stuff taking the portal vein route. Guess it depends on that you are trying to target.

Not sure how to predict what route the red palm oil you use takes. Would depend on the composition. I would expect anything dissolved into the oleic would go lymphatic. But if curcumin dissolves better in palm than olive oil, I would expect more of it to dissolve into the the saturated fat content. If the SF's were mct's, I'd expect that portion to go mostly portal. But if they're lct's, maybe its all going mostly lymphatic. There's allot of variation in the SF composition of palm oils listed online with some mostly mct and others not.

Fwiw, Revgenetics sells a curcumin in a gelcap with mct oil. Not sure if they still do. I think the idea was to overwhelm the liver and maximize bloodstream peaking levels. I imagine the Longvida approach does the same thing. But I'm not sure overwhelming the liver is such a good idea. I saw a study of resveratrol dissolved in neobee oil (sf/mct) suggesting it is not.

Howard

[sthira]

Take one part each (by volume) of plain cocoa powder, cinnamon (ceylon), turmeric and red palm oil (heat it until in becomes liquid). Add some finely ground black pepper (~1/100 part) and stir thoroughly until you have thick paste looking like chocolate spread (no, don't think about any less appetizing ressemblances).

Yes, but I love orangutans. And they're losing habitat due in part to the rise in popularity of red palm oil. Have you considered substituting another, perhaps equally healthy and environmentally sustainable product like (high polyphenolic) olive oil?

[timar]

Two more papers strongly suggesting synergistic health effects from whole tumeric that are lost with curcumin extracts!

Yes, and presumably increase uptake from the intestines via the portal vein directly to the liver and from there to the rest of the bloodstream. That's the path curcumin normally takes. It's also the path that most water soluble supplements, alcohol, and medium chain tryglicerides take. Long chain triglycerides like oleic acid would be more likely to take the lymphatic route nourishing cells along its pathway before dumping into the bloodstream via the thoracic duct about 8 hours later. Which I think is near the blood-brain-barrier but doesn't hit the liver until the next go round. So blood levels measured for things taking the lymphatic route take longer to peak and would probably be lower. But don't necessarily reflect bio-availability in direct comparison to stuff taking the portal vein route. Guess it depends on that you are trying to target.

Of course you would have to measure blood levels either in intervals or determine uptake by excretion in order to compare the total AUC. It's a shame that there don't seem to be any decent pharmacokinetic studies comparing both routes of uptake.

Not sure how to predict what route the red palm oil you use takes. Would depend on the composition. I would expect anything dissolved into the oleic would go lymphatic. But if curcumin dissolves better in palm than olive oil, I would expect more of it to dissolve into the the saturated fat content. If the SF's were mct's, I'd expect that portion to go mostly portal. But if they're lct's, maybe its all going mostly lymphatic. There's allot of variation in the SF composition of palm oils listed online with some mostly mct and others not.

A source of confusion with regarding the fatty acid profile is the distinction between palm oil, which is mechanically pressed from the mesocarp and refined only for getting rid of its peculiar taste and the carotenoids (and pretty much all of its goodness) and palm kernel oil, which is extracted from the seed. Both have very different fatty acid profiles. Palm kernel oil is mostly MCT (50% C14:0), whereas regular (red) palm oil is mostly palmitic (45%) and oleic acid (35%). So I guess a fair share of the curcumin dissolved in red palm oil should go the lymphatic route.

Yes, but I love orangutans. And they're losing habitat due in part to the rise in popularity of red palm oil. Have you considered substituting another, perhaps equally healthy and environmentally sustainable product like (high polyphenolic) olive oil?

I think this is a similar situation as with soy, for which the Brazilian rainforest is destroyed. But this is not the soy for the vegans eating their organic tofu, but the soy required by the massive meat industry. Since the disreputation of hydrogenated vegetable oils, refined palm oil has become the primary source of fat for the processed food industry. That's what creates the ecological devastating demand, not the few health nuts who buy organic red palm oil.

Of course you could substitute the palm oil for olive oil but I included red palm oil because I actually wanted to consume it on a regular basis, given its extremely high content of carotenoids and tocotrienols, and because of its strong taste don't have much culinary use for it (quite contrarily to olive oil).

[Jeoshua]

You should sell this stuff. Honestly, if there is a market for Vegemite and Marmite, there is a market for this stuff.

[timar]

Ha, I think it actually tastes way better than those. You are right though, but I guess I just suck in marketing so I made it open source

[dunbar]

A few short questions I'd like to ask:

1) Is tumeric more effective when you cook it? Usually I add the tumeric to foods only after cooking cause I thought that the heat might destroy it.

2) Is it possible that cinnamon and other spices might not work when they're taken together with milk or dairy? I'm asking because blueberries apparently lose their benefits when taken with dairy.

http://www.allstarhe...dont-mix-study/

Edited by dunbar, 21 February 2014 - 07:25 PM.

[timar]

1) Is tumeric more effective when you cook it? Usually I add the tumeric to foods only after cooking cause I thought that the heat might destroy it.

It's the other way around. It seems to be more bioavailable when heated in oil, like customary in Indian cooking.

2) Is it possible that cinnamon and other spices might not work when they're taken together with milk or dairy? I'm asking because blueberries apparently lose their benefits when taken with dairy.

The milk protein forms complexes with flavanols, which tends to reduce their bioavailability. There is contradictory data concerning the extend of that reduction, though.

Edited by timar, 21 February 2014 - 07:58 PM.

[dunbar]

So this means that mixing cinnamon for example with whey protein could reduce the benefits of the cinnamon?
All the years I have been mixing my cinnamon with whey protein and water. Oh boy.

[Volcanic]

Anybody been using this? Results to report?

 

Looks like Timar's concocted a good, cost-effective source of very nice chemicals. Thanks for sharing. 

[aribadabar]

Anybody been using this? Results to report?

 

I do - nothing (positive or negative) to report.

As timar put it - it is surprisingly unbad 

[nupi]

Interesting, I might start adding cinnamon and turmeric to my whey shakes (there is already undutched cocoa in there)...

[hav]

. Long chain triglycerides like oleic acid would be more likely to take the lymphatic route nourishing cells along its pathway before dumping into the bloodstream via the thoracic duct about 8 hours later. Which I think is near the blood-brain-barrier but doesn't hit the liver until the next go round. So blood levels measured for things taking the lymphatic route take longer to peak and would probably be lower. But don't necessarily reflect bio-availability in direct comparison to stuff taking the portal vein route. Guess it depends on that you are trying to target.

 

Just wanted to make a clarification of the 8-hour number I mentioned above.  I got that number from data in the Baati study that showed c60 blood levels peaking 8 hours after rats were fed c60 in olive oil.  I've done some additional reading since then that indicated that humans have a lymph volume between 2.5 and 3 liters  and that the lymph flow rate is around 120 ml/hr.  Suggesting that human uptake via the lymph system would allow any c60 not absorbed that way to peak in the bloodstream around 24 hours later.  The Baati data does show minor but steadily increasing amounts entering the bloodstream within 15 minutes, however, so the lymphatic route doesn't seem to be a completely isolated pathway... maybe there's a bit of crossover all along the way as cells get nourished by both lymph and blood flow. 

 

Howard

[Captain Obvious]

"Take one part each (by volume) of plain cocoa powder, cinnamon (ceylon), turmeric and red palm oil"

 

Really? I've always assumed that the amount of cocoa powder required for health benefits is measured in tablespoons and cinnamon in teaspoons. I usually supplement at least 2-4 tablespoons of unprocessed cocoa powder and about 1-2 teaspoons of ceylon cinnamon. How did you end up with these ratios, Timar?

 

With turmeric, I've used curcumin supplements but the recent study has made me reconsider and maybe testing a modified "polypulp" recipe.

 

- mikko

[timar]

Well, I never aimed to include all ingredients at "equipotent" doses. Cinnamon is a much more concentrated source of proanthocyanidins than cocoa, even raw cocoa. The overall dose of OPC is about 400 mg, that of curcumin about 100 mg, which should give a good equilibrium as both are about a fith of the doses that have been estimated to provide the most benefit. Anyway, it is meant as a supplement. I regularly eat dark chocolate or my chocolate nut cake, so there's no need for me to supplement with lots of cocoa pulver.

 

But of course, everyone should modify the recipe according to his own needs! The method of combining the ingredients is moch more important than the suggested amounts.

 

Btw., I noticed that I made a mistake regarding the color of cocoa powder: it is exactly the opposite of what I wrote above - the more bitter the taste and the lighter [not the darker] the color of the cocoa, the more polyphenols it contains. Raw cocoa contains the most polyphenols, but regular undutched cocoa is still more potent relative to the price.

[chemicalambrosia]

Are there any good substitutes for cocoa? I like cocoa, but it gives me stomach problems. I already have the other ingredients.

[pamojja]

But here's what you approximately get for that little bit of accustomization (per heaped teaspoon of Polypulp^TM, 15 g):

Calories: 85
Caffeine (from cocoa): 7 mg
Theobromine (from cocoa): 62 mg
Proanthocyanidins (from cinnamon and cocoa): 438 mg
of which...

• Momomers: 21 mg
• Dimers: 26 mg
• Trimers: 85 mg
• 4-6-mers: 188 mg
• 7-9-mers: 99 mg
• Polymers: 19 mg

 

 

Was looking for polyphenol content of cinnamon and cocoa, being lazy clicked these 2 links. They lead to usda database tables of popcorn and greek yogurt??? Seems I've been the first to check the sources. The remaining links do lead to references.

 

Then looked up phenol explorer, which gives only 26,69 mg/100g phenols in cinnamon, and 309,76 mg/100g in cocoa.

 

Timar, if you're still around, where you got such an astronomic number of proanthocyanidins in only 15g, while according to phenol explorer there isn't that much of all phenols combined in 200 grams of cocoa and cinnamon?
 

[timar]

 

But here's what you approximately get for that little bit of accustomization (per heaped teaspoon of Polypulp^TM, 15 g):

Calories: 85
Caffeine (from cocoa): 7 mg
Theobromine (from cocoa): 62 mg
Proanthocyanidins (from cinnamon and cocoa): 438 mg
of which...

• Momomers: 21 mg
• Dimers: 26 mg
• Trimers: 85 mg
• 4-6-mers: 188 mg
• 7-9-mers: 99 mg
• Polymers: 19 mg

 

 

Was looking for polyphenol content of cinnamon and cocoa, being lazy clicked these 2 links. They lead to usda database tables of popcorn and greek yogurt??? Seems I've been the first to check the sources. The remaining links do lead to references.

 

Then looked up phenol explorer, which gives only 26,69 mg/100g phenols in cinnamon, and 309,76 mg/100g in cocoa.

 

Timar, if you're still around, where you got such an astronomic number of proanthocyanidins in only 15g, while according to phenol explorer there isn't that much of all phenols combined in 200 grams of cocoa and cinnamon?

 

Congratulations, pamojja, for being the first one to notice - after two and a half years - that my Polypulp is in fact a big hoax and that I made all those seemingly painstakingly calculated values out of thin air, giving references to some random stuff for my amusement.

 

Well, not really.

 

The USDA database has been relaunched since and the unfortunately messed up the food IDs, rendering all the former links invalid.

 

Anyway, you were quite close.

 

You could either have looked up the entry for cocoa powder and cinnamon in the USDA database, clicked on "Full Report" and opened up the entry for proanthocyanidins (which are those I used in my calculation, hence the reference), or you could have looked them up in the Phenol-Explorer database, but then instead of getting stuck in the chromatography tab selected the HPLC tab, which is the only method suitable to fully quantify proanthocyanidins (hence they even conveniently put that term into the brackets), which brings up values similar but somewhat lower than those given by the USDA database.

 

Or, alternatively, you could have found those values directly in the USDA Database for the Proanthocyanidin Content of Selected Foods (PDF) I just recently referenced in another topic.

 

Next time I'd invest a little more effort before rushing to conclusions
 

Edited by timar, 09 June 2016 - 10:22 AM.

[pamojja]

Next time I'd invest a little more effort before rushing to conclusions

 

Thanks for taking the time for that perfect answer. Still don't think would have come up with something that complete without asking..

[timar]

Anyway, thanks for noticing the bad links. I wish it would be possible to edit the original post.

[dazed1]

So how much grams RPO is acutally per 15g? how much tocotrineols are in 1kg in unrefined red plam oil?

Edited by dazed1, 07 February 2017 - 04:08 PM.

[davis89x]

I won't go into the details and just to want to inform and warn others to do the research about coconut oil vs palm oil and why use coconut in this recipe instead of palm oil.

Although I thought that it was already common knowledge.