1051 replies to this topic

[mandaryn]

XKS has said that it was his intent to have all of it before shipping so that everyone got theirs at about the same time. I can see his reasoning there. It's in his interests to finish this buy in an orderly fashion...

Don't be ridiculous. Xks sitting on huge amounts of our dihexa for 2-3 months (while he himself gets the pleasure of sampling it) is unacceptable. And besides, that's obviously not what he's been promising since October. You're pulling weak excuses out of your ass just like he is.

...but continuing to attack him is not going to help that process. I think he gets that he has to be more open about his side of things. Let's just get this done.

Have fun waiting until next year for your dihexa. Maybe you'll finally get it as a present for Easter.

It's 2-3 months now? The number grows with each post. So it's open season on XKS and anyone who doesn't support your view of how this should be handled. Read my prior posts and you'll see that I am not picking sides. What I said was that I could see his reasoning in not wanting to ship until he had it all in hand. You notice he never responded to anyone asking to get theirs first. After carefully examining the posts by XKS and other group members I believe him when he says he wanted to ship it all at once. We've already acknowledged that his payment was to receive his portion of Dihexa for free. If he confirms that the portion he sampled came from his portion, and communicates with us in an open fashion I see no point in adding more time to the process by demanding he send what he has to another representative. I'm a paying member of this group and I'm entitled to my opinion. XKS's critics, I notice, seem to consist of a group no larger than about 6-8 people. Many of which had pre-existing conflicts with him. I'd say that fact makes any criticisms those people make questionable at the very least. Remember, he doesn't HAVE TO do anything you demand. He's got the money and the Dihexa. How about focusing your efforts on getting him to agree on the way that we want this process handled.

[mindpatch]

I think XKS is naturally somewhat defensive after everything that's been said. If Niles can confirm that payment has been received and keep us up to date on what's happening with the last shipment now in customs I'm willing to go forward with the current arrangement and see it through to its finish. XKS has said that it was his intent to have all of it before shipping so that everyone got theirs at about the same time. I can see his reasoning there. It's in his interests to finish this buy in an orderly fashion, but continuing to attack him is not going to help that process. I think he gets that he has to be more open about his side of things. Let's just get this done.

I agree.  This is a very reasonable post, a quality which I think has been lacking here recently. 

[mindpatch]

 

XKS has said that it was his intent to have all of it before shipping so that everyone got theirs at about the same time. I can see his reasoning there. It's in his interests to finish this buy in an orderly fashion...

 

Don't be ridiculous.  Xks sitting on huge amounts of our dihexa for 2-3 months (while he himself gets the pleasure of sampling it) is unacceptable.  And besides, that's obviously not what he's been promising since October.  You're pulling weak excuses out of your ass just like he is.

 

 

...but continuing to attack him is not going to help that process. I think he gets that he has to be more open about his side of things. Let's just get this done.

 

 

Have fun waiting until next year for your dihexa. Maybe you'll finally get it as a present for Easter.

 

 For the record, as someone who has paid and is waiting for my product, too, I absolutely do not want Jbac in charge of this.  We need cooler heads involved.  

[Werper]

Yeah it's funny mindpatch because I was thinking yesterday this is almost right out of a comedy skit( animal house or something) .   John Belushi  rounds up all the money from the fraternity to go get some coke,  comes back higher than a kite with his eye's bulging out of his head, everybody opens their package to see only  a few crumbs left.   Belushi of course claiming he was testing the purity for the sake of others.  

[Werper]

Mind patch,   Jbac has not lost his temper or thrown out any irrational thoughts here.   His posts are well thought out and not some hot headed knee jerk reaction to the situation.   

[mandaryn]

This thread has devolved to just jbac and werper going back and forth with their criticisms of XKS. For the many other people invested in this I would think it's time to say what's on your mind. Given the opportunity they will exaggerate every detail of this until we're no longer dealing with factual information. I'm not on anyone's side, but after carefully examining the posts in this thread It's obvious to me that, while XKS was not always friendly in his response to our requests for info (which is unacceptable), that he obviously had a plan for how he was going to execute this. And no, I don't believe that plan was to just take our dihexa and our money too. Let's stop with the escalation and start talking reasonably about what we want from XKS and Niles going forward. I think a good starting place would be to tell us how many participants there are, how much Dihexa each can expect from the total amount, based on their contributions, and best estimates on dates for when we can expect shipping to begin if the last batch clears customs. Transparency is what I want. Not a lynching. I have more to do with my life than trade shitty little barbs back and forth with other members.

[Jbac]

 

It's 2-3 months now? The number grows with each post. 

 

 

You were suggesting that it's acceptable for Xks to wait until the entire 100 grams is in his possession before starting distribution.  2-3 months (starting from October, when he got the first 30 grams) is easily how long it could be before the entire 100 grams arrives (minimum 2 months, possibly 3 if customs doesn't let it through).  I don't do exaggerations.

 

After carefully examining the posts by XKS and other group members I believe him when he says he wanted to ship it all at once. 

 

He's been promising to ship promptly since he received it in October (which, of course, is the only reasonable thing to do).  You're making a convenient fallback excuse.

 

Back in March he also implied that there were no guarantees - that when you send money to a stranger on the Internet, you're taking a risk of losing everything - and that there was always a possibility that we'd never get dihexa.  Perhaps several months from now, if Xks has utterly failed to deliver, you'll fall back on that excuse?

 

We've already acknowledged that his payment was to receive his portion of Dihexa for free. If he confirms that the portion he sampled came from his portion

 

You just changed topics right in the middle of your paragraph, but whatever.

 

What is his portion? 1-2 grams (like most of us)? 10 grams? 30 grams?  I don't think he ever said how much he'd take, and we never agreed to an amount.  He could easily be making a tremendous profit on this, and stealing huge amounts of dihexa, and we'll never know.  Xks refuses to release financial data (i.e. how much money he's collected in total and how much Nyles charged him), and Nyles won't tell us anything either, presumably out of professional respect (lol) for Xks.

 

... and communicates with us in an open fashion

 

He doesn't

 

I see no point in adding more time to the process by demanding he send what he has to another representative.

 

It would save time, because he'll never mail our product in a reasonable timeframe anyway.

 

Remember, he doesn't HAVE TO do anything you demand. He's got the money and the Dihexa.

 

A scary thought.

 

How about focusing your efforts on getting him to agree on the way that we want this process handled.

 

Not gonna work.

 

Edited by Jbac, 21 November 2014 - 04:58 PM.

[pro-v]

I vote to have someone else send it out other than XKS. If it has to be XKS, I hope nyles doesn't send him anything else until XKS sends out what's available and people report back. Nyles please do us that favor. You have your suspicions about XKS and at this point, it's the least you could do.

[drg]

XKS is still around if he wanted to screw us he'd have ran or we are already screwed. I logically see no benefit of getting someone else to distribute. Because either he makes good or he doesn't. He would have to make good by sending it to someone else, or he'd have to make good by shipping it out directly.

[StevesPetRat]

For the many other people invested in this I would think it's time to say what's on your mind.

OK. My thought is somewhat in line with yours, in that no amount of typing we do on our little screen boxes is going to have much effect on the outcome of this deal. People at some subconscious level are aware of this, and that lack of control is driving some of us nuts. Yes, we can threaten to involve law enforcement, but I'm pretty sure this is basically an idle threat given the absence of any formal contract in this arrangement. I've bought out somebody else's place in the buy, so I have even less legal standing than the rest.

We can consider the amount of Dihexa XKS ha "stolen" -- it is 500 mg / 30 g shipment and perhaps 2-3g previously. This works out to 5% or less of the total. That seems a reasonable "handling fee" to me. Even 10% would not be that much, as that's about what I pay in sales tax anyway. I'm still optimistic I'll see my share by the end of the year.

That said, a weekly status update would be nice, but it hardly seems like it would do much to satisfy those who are the most agitated.

Of course, I've recently been able to improve my mental state considerably without Dihexa, so who knows what I'd be typing now if that weren't the case.

Also, you may want to check the "10 million times..." thread to see one person's experience with a course of Dihexa use. It is a bit less than encouraging.

[mindpatch]

Mind patch,   Jbac has not lost his temper or thrown out any irrational thoughts here.   His posts are well thought out and not some hot headed knee jerk reaction to the situation.   

Granted, Jbac has made some good points, especially the bullet point post, but he also doesn't really strike me as a level headed and reasonable personality, either, particularly in his response to Mandaryn.  He seems like a personality type that wants to get his way and is unwilling to look at another side to conflict resolution, which is exactly the personality type I absolutely do not want getting his way. 

 

Let's all practice some meta-cognition and self awareness and question our own assumptions, look at the situation objectively and without emotion, and find a reasonable solution. 

Edited by mindpatch, 21 November 2014 - 07:42 PM.

[mindpatch]

Yeah it's funny mindpatch because I was thinking yesterday this is almost right out of a comedy skit( animal house or something) .   John Belushi  rounds up all the money from the fraternity to go get some coke,  comes back higher than a kite with his eye's bulging out of his head, everybody opens their package to see only  a few crumbs left.   Belushi of course claiming he was testing the purity for the sake of others.  

Which is a funny image, but let's also acknowledge that this might not necessarily be reality, either. 

[Leadingdaway]

I, for one, don't care who distributes the DIhexa as long as it gets to me, but I do have some reservations. XKS hasn't help his cause by speaking in generalities instead of directly responding to the many legitimate concerns that have been expressed. I understand he may have made decisions based on what he felt was best, but it clearly has not played out in our favor as many of us should've had our Dihexa by now. I would feel more at ease with XKS finishing what he started, if we began receiving the product we've all been waiting for and if  Nyles confirms he has received payment for the second and third batch. If this doesn't materialize in the next coming days, then we may be better of heading in a different direction. But if the group decides someone else should take over the distribution aspect of the group buy, who's to say the newly appointed member won't bail out on us and leave us empty handed? We're all strangers so no one can vouch for someones character with certainty. This makes a changing of the guard that much more unlikely and difficult, unless someone of notoriety steps up.

[pro-v]

Mind patch, Jbac has not lost his temper or thrown out any irrational thoughts here. His posts are well thought out and not some hot headed knee jerk reaction to the situation.

Granted, Jbac has made some good points, especially the bullet point post, but he also doesn't really strike me as a level headed and reasonable personality, either, particularly in his response to Mandaryn. He seems like a personality type that wants to get his way and is unwilling to look at another side to conflict resolution, which is exactly the personality type I absolutely do not want getting his way.

Let's all practice some meta-cognition and self awareness and question our own assumptions, look at the situation objectively and without emotion, and find a reasonable solution.

This isn't group therapy, this is a group buy. Can you blame people for being irritated when confronted with evidence that they are being swindled or the person they entrusted their money to is being incredibly irresponsible?

[Jbac]

Seems like mindpatch is the kind of guy who votes for politicians based on their 'political correctness' and how nice they look when they kiss a baby.

And others here seem to enjoy being bullied and jerked around by Xks - never complaining once about Xks's rudeness and selfishness, and seeing him as the misunderstood hero when criticized. I guess these people just don't like change, because it makes them feel less safe. Or maybe they secretly hope that appeasing Xks with their sympathies will help them get their product faster, even though appeasing a jerk/bully never works.

I hope that these few people I described here are just an oddly vocal minority. Everyone who is sick of Xks's incompetence and selfishness, speak up already and inform Nyles that you don't want Xks getting your paid product.

[Jbac]

I would feel more at ease with XKS finishing what he started, if we began receiving the product we've all been waiting for and if Nyles confirms he has received payment for the second and third batch. If this doesn't materialize in the next coming days, then we may be better of heading in a different direction.

You don't get the situation we're in. We don't have time to hold off for a few more weeks, and wait and see if Xks mails our stuff, and if he doesn't, then demand change. Nyles is going to have the next 30 grams shipped to Xks, and once Xks has it, you have no leverage. He can boss you around and demand you kiss his ass, and you still may or may not ever get your product. Or maybe you'll get it next March, or April, as his schedule allows (because he's a busy guy with a life, allegedly).

You might get another chance to ask Nyles to send us the final 40 grams, but don't count on Xks sending payment for that 40 grams. Nyles put pressure on Xks to pay for the first 60 grams minimum out of contractual obligation. Whether Xks pays for the final 40 g is optional, according to N. That's ~$6000 of our money (as far as we know) that he might hold on to indefinitely, and make excuses for not having any longer.

[Leadingdaway]

I see your point, but I was not thinking of holding off for weeks, more so a few days or so.  XKS stated he has sent payment for the second batch, I was hoping Nyles could confirm this soon. Let's suppose the group does as you suggest and inform nyles to collect payment and hold on to the Dihexa, who can we trust to handle this messy situation? Nyles already declined as he's in the other side of the hemisphere, and even if there were someone trustworthy who could take on this task, what incentive would they have to want to take on the tedious responsibility of packaging and distributing Dihexa all across the globe? I suspect this may be a factor in Nyles unwillingness to handle the group buy.  I hope this doesn't, somehow, get construed as an endorsement for XKS, because it certainly is not  I just haven't heard an alternative scenario that could possibly work out. 

[sparkk51]

Can there at least be one participant who does testing to see that flour wasn't mixed with it? Lmao

Edited by sparkk51, 22 November 2014 - 05:55 AM.

[Jbac]

Let's suppose the group does as you suggest and inform nyles to collect payment and hold on to the Dihexa, who can we trust to handle this messy situation? Nyles already declined as he's in the other side of the hemisphere, and even if there were someone trustworthy who could take on this task, what incentive would they have to want to take on the tedious responsibility of packaging and distributing Dihexa all across the globe?

I was hoping a senior member with a good reputation would volunteer so people didn't have to ask "What's in it for them?", but for some unsettling reason, everyone is quiet. Assuming they're a nice guy who actually cares about people who depend on them, the main incentive to taking on the responsibility is: 1) To get their own share of dihexa quickly, and 2) To make everyone else happy.

In spite of what Xks wants you to think, this isn't a painstaking 100 hour project that requires a master's degree and deserves huge compensation in the form of free dihexa. It's as easy as measuring 1 gram, pouring it in a little bag, stuffing into an envelope, seal/address/stamp, and repeat. Then drop off all the envelopes at the post office.

[medicineman]

I have probably the most at stake in this buy. I want xks to continue the deal. if any voting is going to happen, it should be a vote per gram ordered. I bought 5. I vote xks X 5

[mindpatch]

 

Let's suppose the group does as you suggest and inform nyles to collect payment and hold on to the Dihexa, who can we trust to handle this messy situation? Nyles already declined as he's in the other side of the hemisphere, and even if there were someone trustworthy who could take on this task, what incentive would they have to want to take on the tedious responsibility of packaging and distributing Dihexa all across the globe?

I was hoping a senior member with a good reputation would volunteer so people didn't have to ask "What's in it for them?", but for some unsettling reason, everyone is quiet. Assuming they're a nice guy who actually cares about people who depend on them, the main incentive to taking on the responsibility is: 1) To get their own share of dihexa quickly, and 2) To make everyone else happy.

In spite of what Xks wants you to think, this isn't a painstaking 100 hour project that requires a master's degree and deserves huge compensation in the form of free dihexa. It's as easy as measuring 1 gram, pouring it in a little bag, stuffing into an envelope, seal/address/stamp, and repeat. Then drop off all the envelopes at the post office.

 

That's not considering the lists of those who have paid, who have sold their shares, the order in which participants will be getting shipment, and it's assuming that all of these hopefully decipherable records will be transferred to the next organizer in a timely fashion by a current organizer who has stated clearly that the current arrangement is going forward as planned and he's not changing.  He has a partial shipment, possibly Nyles has one, and apparently one is still in limbo.  Both the logistics of doing a transfer of responsibilities now and the likelihood of Xks being even being cooperative make your proposal untenable.  Have you actually thought this through?  It's not going to happen.  Period.   

[mindpatch]

 

 

Mind patch, Jbac has not lost his temper or thrown out any irrational thoughts here. His posts are well thought out and not some hot headed knee jerk reaction to the situation.

Granted, Jbac has made some good points, especially the bullet point post, but he also doesn't really strike me as a level headed and reasonable personality, either, particularly in his response to Mandaryn. He seems like a personality type that wants to get his way and is unwilling to look at another side to conflict resolution, which is exactly the personality type I absolutely do not want getting his way.

Let's all practice some meta-cognition and self awareness and question our own assumptions, look at the situation objectively and without emotion, and find a reasonable solution.

This isn't group therapy, this is a group buy. Can you blame people for being irritated when confronted with evidence that they are being swindled or the person they entrusted their money to is being incredibly irresponsible?

 

No, I can't blame people for being irritated, but I can point out with some justification that the over-reaction by the Anti-Xks faction is not particularly helpful.  And there isn't evidence, there's accusations.  I don't know all the facts. Either do you.  

[mindpatch]

Seems like mindpatch is the kind of guy who votes for politicians based on their 'political correctness' and how nice they look when they kiss a baby.

And others here seem to enjoy being bullied and jerked around by Xks - never complaining once about Xks's rudeness and selfishness, and seeing him as the misunderstood hero when criticized. I guess these people just don't like change, because it makes them feel less safe. Or maybe they secretly hope that appeasing Xks with their sympathies will help them get their product faster, even though appeasing a jerk/bully never works.

I hope that these few people I described here are just an oddly vocal minority. Everyone who is sick of Xks's incompetence and selfishness, speak up already and inform Nyles that you don't want Xks getting your paid product.

Oh, I'm "one of those kind of people" ...whatever that means.  I enjoy being bullied.  It's obvious I'm suffering from some form of Stockholm Syndrome and I'm identifying with my abuser.  

 

This whole process has now devolved into projecting, egos, politics and drama, which is what happens when communication breaks down.  It's not accomplishing anything. 

[mindpatch]

 

I would feel more at ease with XKS finishing what he started, if we began receiving the product we've all been waiting for and if Nyles confirms he has received payment for the second and third batch. If this doesn't materialize in the next coming days, then we may be better of heading in a different direction.

You don't get the situation we're in. We don't have time to hold off for a few more weeks, and wait and see if Xks mails our stuff, and if he doesn't, then demand change. Nyles is going to have the next 30 grams shipped to Xks, and once Xks has it, you have no leverage. He can boss you around and demand you kiss his ass, and you still may or may not ever get your product. Or maybe you'll get it next March, or April, as his schedule allows (because he's a busy guy with a life, allegedly).

You might get another chance to ask Nyles to send us the final 40 grams, but don't count on Xks sending payment for that 40 grams. Nyles put pressure on Xks to pay for the first 60 grams minimum out of contractual obligation. Whether Xks pays for the final 40 g is optional, according to N. That's ~$6000 of our money (as far as we know) that he might hold on to indefinitely, and make excuses for not having any longer.

 

" If this doesn't materialize in the next coming days"...

 

From that you get "weeks."  The type of exaggeration that leads to hysteria is a slippery slope.  

[The Capybara]

Here is the latest update......

I have indeed received payment from xks for the next 30g.

Once I verify that this payment cannot be "charged back", I will send it out by express to xks.

No other options were presented by the group or agreed upon with xks.

Figure it'll ship Monday in the US.

 

The last 40g was sent back to the lab......for the second time.

At least it wasn't destroyed. Figure that it will be resent to me late next week since it hasn't yet arrived back at the lab and this typically takes a week.

Maybe this is a good thing since you can all see if the first 60g ships to you before this last 40g gets here.

I will update you if anything changes.

[Strangelove]

 Nyles is going to have the next 30 grams shipped to Xks, and once Xks has it, you have no leverage. 

 

 

Some trust Xks and some not. I Cannot see why Xks would insist getting the second batch for distribution (it is extra work). He can take his share, send the rest of the 30grams he has to the individuals that ordered the most, so its even less trouble for him, and you can send some PMs to long-standing, reputable members for distributing the second batch, perhaps suggesting a small fee?

 

Then you can exchange notes, on the first and second batch. 

 

Someone should start a poll quickly though (it seems there is no much time) with all options mentioned, instead of keep posting opinions. 

 

Jbac or anyone else that can start the poll?

 

Disclaimer.

I have not ordered Dihexa due to lack of funds, I am very interested though that this (and future group buys) end well, everyone getting what they ordered and start discussing about Dihexa's effects.

[Leadingdaway]

Nyles, thanks for the prompt update.  I understand you've dealt with XKS and may have some sort of agreement, but the group funded the synthesis of this product; therefore, the group as a whole, should be entitled to make a decision on how we should proceed from here on. The group is still debating what would be the best course of action moving forward, so we kindly request a few days to sort this out. Most of us have been waiting eagerly for over eight months now, so a few more days of waiting is well worth it if it leads to the fulfillment of the group's wishes.   Guys, if there was ever a time to leave the differences aside and come together for an official vote on this issue, this is it!  There have been three proposals thus far.

 

1.  Allow XKS to finish the group buy

 

2.  Choose some one of note to take over the whole group buy

 

3. Allow XKS to distribute the 30g he has received, and have the remaining Dihexa sent to whomever is chosen to finish the project.

 

 

Please turn in your votes! 

[mandaryn]

Number 1

[JASOG888]

Number 1

[mandaryn]

Seems like mindpatch is the kind of guy who votes for politicians based on their 'political correctness' and how nice they look when they kiss a baby.

And others here seem to enjoy being bullied and jerked around by Xks - never complaining once about Xks's rudeness and selfishness, and seeing him as the misunderstood hero when criticized. I guess these people just don't like change, because it makes them feel less safe. Or maybe they secretly hope that appeasing Xks with their sympathies will help them get their product faster, even though appeasing a jerk/bully never works.

I hope that these few people I described here are just an oddly vocal minority. Everyone who is sick of Xks's incompetence and selfishness, speak up already and inform Nyles that you don't want Xks getting your paid product.

JBac I think we're very clear on how you feel about the situation. Attacking other participants for having a different point of view is, at the least, bullying, and most likely the prelude to character assassination. If you are going to sway anyone's opinion I think you've done it by now. Please refrain from going after those that have the balls to disagree with you. It serves no purpose in accomplishing our mutual goal of getting our flippin dihexa asap.