110 replies to this topic

[pure]

I understood that Epithalamin was discontinued due to raw material shortage, however it is still available in capsule form as Endoluten, whose price (high) is likely a reflection of there being limited raw material available,

Regarding a Group Buy custom synthesis of Thymogen, there might be a big technical issue to contend with:

- Genuine Thymalin is produced/packaged as freeze dried powder which requires reconstitution

- Genuine Prostatilen is produced/packaged as freeze dried powder which requires reconstitution

- Genuine Cortexin is produced/packaged as freeze dried powder which requires reconstitution

- BUT, genuine Thymogen is produced/packaged as a solution ready for injection

- AND, unlike other short Peptide Bioregulators, Thymogen isn't available in capsule form

Why? Why wouldn't genuine Thymogen (produced by the same Russian company that produces Prostatilen) also be produced/packaged as freeze dried powder like all the others? It would surely be better for shelf-life.

.

A: because short Peptide Bioregulators, particularly those shorter than 4 amino acids in length, are very hygroscopic (attractant of moisture - even minute amounts in the air).

Even if it's produced under GMP conditions in a humidity/moisture controlled environment it will be very difficult to freeze dry (so as to be totally dry) the bulk powder synthesized in order to weigh it to determine the total quantity/weight of peptide actually synthesized.

And then, even if this is successful, in the time it takes to take it out of the freeze dryer and properly/precisely weigh and then bag [for storage] (if not being immediately reconstituted, aliquoted, and freeze dried) the bulk powder synthesized, it will attract moisture from the atmosphere.

Hence why the Russian company which produces genuine Thymogen produces it as an already-reconstituted solution ready for injection. And if you're going to produce it in this form, then you need to be certain it is sterile.

I had Cartalax and Vesugen (both 3 amino acids long) synthesized and it was a nightmare. 2 back to back rounds of 4 days freeze drying and the bulk powders could still not be completely dried.

In the end, to achieve a dry bulk powder, they had to add a known quantity of Trehalose (another excipient like Mannitol, but far more moisture absorbent) to the bulk peptide.

I also had Pinealon synthesized (also 3 amino acids long) and for it too it was also difficult to completely freeze dry the total quantity synthesized to a dry bulk powder, but unlike Vesugen and Cartalax it did not require any moisture absorbing excipient to be added to the total quantity of peptide synthesized in order to achieve a dry bulk powder when freeze dried. It just took an inordinately long time in the freeze drier.

.

BUT, the very interesting thing was, that according to various online peptide property calculation tools, Pinealon was supposed to be the most hydrophilic/hygroscopic of all three of them, yet it was the only one of the three which could be freeze dried to a dry bulk powder without the addition of a moisture absorbing excipient to the total quantity of peptide synthesized.

However, those online tools do say that hydrophilicity/hygroscopicity calculations are just theoretical, and that the actual properties in this regard can only be properly determined by experimentation.

Obviously the known quantity of excipient which had already been added to the total quatity of peptide synthesized in order to achieve a dry bulk freeze dried powder (as verified by moisture content test) of Vesugen and Cartalax then had to be taken into consideration when it came to the ultimate reconstitution, aliquoting, and freeze drying into vials.

I am sure that Pivotal Bioscience did not make any real money out of those orders from me because of all the frigging around and extra processes which were required! hahaha!

.

If you're going to try to have produced the short Peptide Bioregulators as freeze dried powder, then you have to be careful because a supplier which doesn't give a toss about quality will just weight the bulk peptide powder after freeze drying and tell you there is, say, 1 gram, but 40% of the weight might be water content, and so you'll pay for, say, 1 gram, but only really get 600 mg.

And you can't really tell whether a peptide has a high water content by its appearance. It must be tested, which is yet another reason to use a reputable source to do proper testing, which despite what some posters say, does not in fact cost the earth.

According to online peptide calculation tools, Thymogen contains 1 Hydrophilic amino acid (Glu) and 1 Hydrophobic amino acid (Trp), so who knows how Hygroscopic it will be in reality.

But if the Russian OE producer of Thymogen is not producing it as a freeze dried powder like they are Prostatilen, then it suggests that its Hygroscopicity is an issue.

Edited by pure, 28 March 2016 - 01:36 AM.

[pope]

So pure, are you still using epitalon regulary.  Is it the biohacking we are looking for.  Thanks for your post

[pure]

yeah, pope, still 'using'.

i've found my optimum dose to be 500 mcg injected AM and PM = 1 mg/day, or 2-3 mg sublingual AM and PM = 4-6 mg/day.

it's great stuff.

i tried it mixed in a moisturizing cream to see if it improved skin condition.

it definitely hastens skin turnover, and you have to exfoliate very regularly otherwise the old skin being turned over make your complexion appear crap.

that was too hard/girly so i stopped.

So pure, are you still using epitalon regulary.  Is it the biohacking we are looking for.  Thanks for your post

 

[pope]

Not girly at all.  Hell I wanna look 50 when Im 75.  Have you tried HGH and how would you compare the benefits.  I know they are short and long, so very different.  Im just trying to figure out if Epitalon will benefit my HGH use

[pure]

I used GH years ago but it's just too costly. And I don't wanna use Chinese GH unless it is guaranteed to be genuine Jintropin or Hypertropin.

But almost all 'Jintropin' is fake, and it's not worth the risk of being duped and using 192 AA GH (instead of 191 AA legit GH).

Setting aside the issue of endotoxins, 20%+ of people who use 192 AA GH end up developing antibodies to GH, which means your body no longer responds to ANY GH.

And THAT would be a great way to look 75 when you're 50!

So it's just not worth the risk.

 

And anyway, I'm not looking to achieve 'supraphysiological' levels of anything, or risk shutting down anything because of negative feedback.

I'm only interested in keeping everything 'pro-male' (IGF-1, Preg, DHEA, Andro, Total-T, Free-T, DHT, LH, FSH) in the upper 1/3 of the Reference Range, and everything 'anti-male' (SHBG, Estradiol, Prolactin, Progesterone) in the lower 1/3 of the Reference Range (you need some of them too).

GH/IGF-1 wise I get a good result from a single weekly 2 mg dose of CJC-1295 (WITH DAC), which keeps my baseline IGF-1 at around 29 (19 without).

On top of this I 'spike' from that platform AM and PM using CJC-1295 (Non-DAC) or Mod. GRF (1-29) in combination with GHRP-6 or GHRP-2 or Ipamorelin or Hexarelin (I vary the combo just in case there is any possibility of downregulation/desensitization over time).

 

Over the last couple of months I've been testing a new GHRP-6 analogue which Pivotal Bioscience invited me to test as part of their testing programme, which seems to have more muscle building effect than standard GHRP-6.

 

And over the last 4 weeks I've also been testing (just finished) something else (non-peptide but still a natural human endogenous molecule, ie. not man-invented chemical molecule) which has been quite transformative exercise-wise, for which I promised I would not disclose to anyone the compound until after they launched the product.

 

And next week as soon as a shipment arrives I'm going to start testing high-dose Nicotinamide Riboside. Pivotal advised they have developed a new cost-effective synthesis route for Nicotinamide Riboside which will enable the cost of a 1000 mg/1 gram dose to be around 75c. Presently NR 125 mg caps retail for at best about 75c, but often much higher.

 

Something else different that definitely does get a result skin-condition-wise is Collagen Peptides, 10 grams per day dissolved in water, drink. Unmistakable improvement in skin condition. You gotta be careful which brand though. Gelita 'Verisol' is the best according to my experimentation. CP's also improve bone mineral density and muscle mass according to Gelita's published studies.

 

And soon I'm gonna try a different GHK analogue to any previously mentioned here (as far as I know), as a topical preparation. I ordered it 2 weeks ago and am expecting PB to let me know this week that it has finished synthesis and ready for testing.

Not girly at all.  Hell I wanna look 50 when Im 75.  Have you tried HGH and how would you compare the benefits.  I know they are short and long, so very different.  Im just trying to figure out if Epitalon will benefit my HGH use

 

Edited by pure, 03 April 2016 - 11:50 AM.

[sagit]

Has no one done any due diligence on pivotal bioscience?

 

Here are some facts that turned up when I did my DD:

1. When I checked recently with the Institute of Bioregulation and Gerontology in Russia, I was advised that Pivotal was never appointed as a distributor. They were sent some samples some years ago for scientific collaboration, not for clinical application.

2. Pivotalbioscience.com is a registered internet domain name only.

3. A search of the ASIC(dot gov dot au) business names registrations reveals no registration in the name of Pivotal Bioscience, i.e. it is a non-entity.

4. Matthew Walker has stated that he is not the owner of Pivotal Bioscience.

5. The Institute has stated that their authorized distributor is IAS.

6. The Institute state they have not had any contact from pivotal bioscience for some years.

7. Any reputable business, particularly one that claims an address on one of highest floors of one the most prestigious skyscrapers in Melbourne, would surely have a landline phone number. All Pivotal Bioscience claims as a phone number is a mobile phone. As there is no public register of mobile phones in AU, it is almost impossible to determine in whose name it is registered, or who has possession of it. The registered owner and person using the phone need not necessarily be one and the same.

 

So who are members really dealing with, and just what is actually being supplied?

[pure]

Well, in all my dealings with them to date their integrity has been beyond reproach. And their depth and breadth of knowledge is the best I've found.

I've physically compared their Russian Peptide Bioregulators to the ones from IAS and they are identical.

They ship everything via DHL, not via the post as some untraceable fly-by-night operation would do.

And I pay by PayPal or SWIFT, not Western Union or some other untraceable method.

And they ship without pre-payment and I only have to pay when my shipments clear UK Customs.

A flaky two-bit supplier is not gonna offer these services.

 

But since I have spent a lot of money with them I want to ask them about the points you mention below for my own peace of mind.

Can you post the email correspondence you received from the St. Petersburg Institute so there is no ambiguity or 'hearsay' aspect and the process is completely transparent?

BTW, I doubt you will find public record of the ownership of any online seller of innovative 'research' compounds who is based in a Western country which is not a tax haven, due to Regulatory factors.

What did you find when you did your DD on Ceretropic?

I couldn't find anything about Ceretropic (not even an address) when I was buying P21. They only have an email on their website, no phone number or address.

BUT, I reckon, based on my experience, along with Pivotal, Ceretropic is another reputable supplier.

Please post your correspondence with the St. Petersburg Institute so I can forward it to pivotal and get their reply.

 

Has no one done any due diligence on pivotal bioscience?

Here are some facts that turned up when I did my DD:

1. When I checked recently with the Institute of Bioregulation and Gerontology in Russia, I was advised that Pivotal was never appointed as a distributor. They were sent some samples some years ago for scientific collaboration, not for clinical application.

2. Pivotalbioscience.com is a registered internet domain name only.

3. A search of the ASIC(dot gov dot au) business names registrations reveals no registration in the name of Pivotal Bioscience, i.e. it is a non-entity.

4. Matthew Walker has stated that he is not the owner of Pivotal Bioscience.

5. The Institute has stated that their authorized distributor is IAS.

6. The Institute state they have not had any contact from pivotal bioscience for some years.

7. Any reputable business, particularly one that claims an address on one of highest floors of one the most prestigious skyscrapers in Melbourne, would surely have a landline phone number. All Pivotal Bioscience claims as a phone number is a mobile phone. As there is no public register of mobile phones in AU, it is almost impossible to determine in whose name it is registered, or who has possession of it. The registered owner and person using the phone need not necessarily be one and the same.

So who are members really dealing with, and just what is actually being supplied?

 

Edited by pure, 12 April 2016 - 01:19 AM.

[sagit]

If you want to verify my points, I suggest you email directly to the Russian Insitiute - http://eng.gerontolo...research/ageing - like I did. You will then have it from the horse's mouth. The information I posted came in a number of email exchanges, not just one.

 

And you may also do your own search of the ASIC registrations. It is in the public domain.

 

You may have physically compared it, but have you had it chemcially tested? And what of the number of different "samples" that were sent you? They can't all be identical!!! If they were, what was the point in sending them?

 

I am not suggesting they are a "flaky two-bit supplier". What I am suggesting is that they claim to supply the genuine Russian made peptides, whereas the Institute claim that they have not had any contact from PB for quite some time. If they are not distributors, and have not obtained their "genuine" supplies from the Institute, just where are they getting their supplies from? Can you spell fraud?

 

Any business/individual that conducts trade out of, or in, Australia, is required to register that business name with the Australian Securities and Investment Commission. One of the reasons for this is that the owner can be identified.

 

If PB are trying to increase their sales, of course it would be in their interests to be accommodating as far as payment goes.

 

I have not done any DD on any other entity regarding the Russian peptide bioregulators - yet.

 

Well, in all my dealings with them to date their integrity has been beyond reproach. And their depth and breadth of knowledge is the best I've found.

I've physically compared their Russian Peptide Bioregulators to the ones from IAS and they are identical.

They ship everything via DHL, not via the post as some untraceable fly-by-night operation would do.

And I pay by PayPal or SWIFT, not Western Union or some other untraceable method.

And they ship without pre-payment and I only have to pay when my shipments clear UK Customs.

A flaky two-bit supplier is not gonna offer these services.

 

But since I have spent a lot of money with them I want to ask them about the points you mention below for my own peace of mind.

Can you post the email correspondence you received from the St. Petersburg Institute so there is no ambiguity or 'hearsay' aspect and the process is completely transparent?

BTW, I doubt you will find public record of the ownership of any online seller of innovative 'research' compounds who is based in a Western country which is not a tax haven, due to Regulatory factors.

What did you find when you did your DD on Ceretropic?

I couldn't find anything about Ceretropic (not even an address) when I was buying P21. They only have an email on their website, no phone number or address.

BUT, I reckon, based on my experience, along with Pivotal, Ceretropic is another reputable supplier.

Please post your correspondence with the St. Petersburg Institute so I can forward it to pivotal and get their reply.

 

Has no one done any due diligence on pivotal bioscience?

Here are some facts that turned up when I did my DD:

1. When I checked recently with the Institute of Bioregulation and Gerontology in Russia, I was advised that Pivotal was never appointed as a distributor. They were sent some samples some years ago for scientific collaboration, not for clinical application.

2. Pivotalbioscience.com is a registered internet domain name only.

3. A search of the ASIC(dot gov dot au) business names registrations reveals no registration in the name of Pivotal Bioscience, i.e. it is a non-entity.

4. Matthew Walker has stated that he is not the owner of Pivotal Bioscience.

5. The Institute has stated that their authorized distributor is IAS.

6. The Institute state they have not had any contact from pivotal bioscience for some years.

7. Any reputable business, particularly one that claims an address on one of highest floors of one the most prestigious skyscrapers in Melbourne, would surely have a landline phone number. All Pivotal Bioscience claims as a phone number is a mobile phone. As there is no public register of mobile phones in AU, it is almost impossible to determine in whose name it is registered, or who has possession of it. The registered owner and person using the phone need not necessarily be one and the same.

So who are members really dealing with, and just what is actually being supplied?

 

 

[sagit]

OK. Here is the relevant info:

This is the person with whom I exchanged emails:

 

Olga Mikhailova, Ph.D.
Executive Director
St.Petersburg Institute of
Bioregulation and Gerontology
Academic Secretary of the Gerontological
Society of the Russian Academy of Sciences
3, Dynamo Pr., 197110, St.Petersburg, Russia
Phone/fax: +7 (812) 235-18-32
Mobile: +7(921)936-68-91
 

 

And here are the relevant sections of each applicable email:

Email 11/03/16 :

“Dear xxxxxxxxx,

 

We do not have a partner in Australia, that is why I am afraid the peptides are fake. The distributor of our products is International Anti-aging Systems. You can easily address them.

 

With kind regards

Olga”

 

Email 12/03/16:

 

“......

2. We used to communicate with Matthew Walker from Pivotal Bioscience and provided him with our brochures and samples, so the brochure is the one we sent him. But it was long ago. I do not know where he gets (or produces) the peptides.The products belong to our company GARMONIA in Russia. The technology is unique and very complicate. “

 

Email 13/03/16:

“Hello,

 

…............................................................ The majority of peptides were given to Pivotal for scientific collaboration not for clinical application. “

 

 

 

If you want to verify my points, I suggest you email directly to the Russian Insitiute - (oops. My bad Not supposed to post links) - like I did. You will then have it from the horse's mouth. The information I posted came in a number of email exchanges, not just one.

 

And you may also do your own search of the ASIC registrations. It is in the public domain.

 

You may have physically compared it, but have you had it chemcially tested? And what of the number of different "samples" that were sent you? They can't all be identical!!! If they were, what was the point in sending them?

 

I am not suggesting they are a "flaky two-bit supplier". What I am suggesting is that they claim to supply the genuine Russian made peptides, whereas the Institute claim that they have not had any contact from PB for quite some time. If they are not distributors, and have not obtained their "genuine" supplies from the Institute, just where are they getting their supplies from? Can you spell fraud?

 

Any business/individual that conducts trade out of, or in, Australia, is required to register that business name with the Australian Securities and Investment Commission. One of the reasons for this is that the owner can be identified.

 

If PB are trying to increase their sales, of course it would be in their interests to be accommodating as far as payment goes.

 

I have not done any DD on any other entity regarding the Russian peptide bioregulators - yet.

 

Well, in all my dealings with them to date their integrity has been beyond reproach. And their depth and breadth of knowledge is the best I've found.

I've physically compared their Russian Peptide Bioregulators to the ones from IAS and they are identical.

They ship everything via DHL, not via the post as some untraceable fly-by-night operation would do.

And I pay by PayPal or SWIFT, not Western Union or some other untraceable method.

And they ship without pre-payment and I only have to pay when my shipments clear UK Customs.

A flaky two-bit supplier is not gonna offer these services.

 

But since I have spent a lot of money with them I want to ask them about the points you mention below for my own peace of mind.

Can you post the email correspondence you received from the St. Petersburg Institute so there is no ambiguity or 'hearsay' aspect and the process is completely transparent?

BTW, I doubt you will find public record of the ownership of any online seller of innovative 'research' compounds who is based in a Western country which is not a tax haven, due to Regulatory factors.

What did you find when you did your DD on Ceretropic?

I couldn't find anything about Ceretropic (not even an address) when I was buying P21. They only have an email on their website, no phone number or address.

BUT, I reckon, based on my experience, along with Pivotal, Ceretropic is another reputable supplier.

Please post your correspondence with the St. Petersburg Institute so I can forward it to pivotal and get their reply.

 

Has no one done any due diligence on pivotal bioscience?

Here are some facts that turned up when I did my DD:

1. When I checked recently with the Institute of Bioregulation and Gerontology in Russia, I was advised that Pivotal was never appointed as a distributor. They were sent some samples some years ago for scientific collaboration, not for clinical application.

2. Pivotalbioscience.com is a registered internet domain name only.

3. A search of the ASIC(dot gov dot au) business names registrations reveals no registration in the name of Pivotal Bioscience, i.e. it is a non-entity.

4. Matthew Walker has stated that he is not the owner of Pivotal Bioscience.

5. The Institute has stated that their authorized distributor is IAS.

6. The Institute state they have not had any contact from pivotal bioscience for some years.

7. Any reputable business, particularly one that claims an address on one of highest floors of one the most prestigious skyscrapers in Melbourne, would surely have a landline phone number. All Pivotal Bioscience claims as a phone number is a mobile phone. As there is no public register of mobile phones in AU, it is almost impossible to determine in whose name it is registered, or who has possession of it. The registered owner and person using the phone need not necessarily be one and the same.

So who are members really dealing with, and just what is actually being supplied?

 

 

 

[pure]

You're on a mission, eh?

So you (sagit) joined this forum the same day you made your first post? And according to your mandatory intro post you "found this site by chance"? hahaha! sure you did.

And your first posts just happen to suggest the integrity of a long-time known supplier might be in question?

Should I just call you IAS?

Can YOU smell fraud?

If Pivotal were supplying non-genuine product, don't you think someone on this forum or elsewhere on the internet would already have posted to that effect sometime during the last couple of years?

Hell, I would have myself. I flocking loath jackass incompetent amateur inept suppliers and especially cheats. My mission on this forum is to get the absolute truth and the best quality.

 

But when I just searched this forum for any references to pivotal before writing the above, I found the following:

http://www.longecity...e-2#entry729466

Post #45 from poster Alin Samson in Luxembourg writes:

"contact mwalker@pivotalbioscience.com. They`re reliable and the stuff they are selling is the real deal."

 

I've purchased Peptide Bioregulators from IAS, then peptidesstore.com, then Pivotal Bioscience.

Products from each of them are identical in every way.

Who is peptidesstore.com then? Why didn't that 'Executive Director' woman you corresponded with at the St. Petersburg Institute also mention peptidesstore.com as well as IAS?

Since she didn't mention peptidesstore.com, then according to you they might be selling 'counterfeit' fake product, right?

I know for a fact that peptidesstore.com do not source from the St. Petersburg Institute. They source from the St. Petersburg Institute's biggest distributor called npcriz.ru

I know this because I asked them when I was ordering from them and then I confirmed it with npcriz.ru because I wanted surety that I was getting the genuine article.

 

Hang on, now there's not just another reseller (peptidesstore.com) but also an entire distributor (npcriz.ru) which the Executive director woman didn't tell you about?

H'mmm, I wonder why she wouldn't have mentioned npcriz.ru to you? NPCRIZ advise they are the oldest and biggest distributor for the St. Petersburg Institute.

Seems a lot dodgy and suspicious to me that she would have omitted to mention their biggest distributor and a well known reseller (peptidesstore.com).

I am absolutely certain peptidesstore.com, Pivotal Bioscience, and IAS are all selling genuine Peptide Bioregulators manufactured by the St. Petersburg Institute.

All their products are identical and they all have the same noticeable effect.

And that is all that matters.. whether they are genuine, not which distribution channel they have transited through.

 

and who are the following guys in South Africa?..

http://shop.biogenes...20-x-200mg.html

Another counterfeiter selling fake product in your opinion?

The Executive Director also didn't mention them so they must be selling fake products right?

Why don't you also try and find their ownership structure from their website? Good luck with that.

And how are you getting on finding out the ownership from their websites of Ceretropic, rui-products.com, and peptidesciences.com, three other trusted suppliers?

If you bother trying, I bet you get nowhere.

 

It is difficult finding good trustworthy suppliers of innovative products and research compounds.

When someone on the very day they register on this forum makes their first post and that post is suggesting a long time known trusted supplier might be suspect:

1. such behavior is suspect in itself

2. it wastes other peoples time in possibly checking things out/questioning them unnecessarily

 

I don't want my time to be wasted on being alarmed and possibly heading off on a wild goose chase based on what turns out to be unfounded poorly researched information.

 

Why don't you just man-up and write to Pivotal Bioscience and ask them about your queries?

That would be the best test of transparency and integrity to subject them to.

Then when you've got some concrete facts come back here and post.

 

Or, just instead just pay IAS $70 for 20 capsules, instead of $33 from Pivotal, if you're that precious about their ownership.

 

Also, you wrote:

"Any business/individual that conducts trade out of, or in, Australia, is required to register that business name with the Australian Securities and Investment Commission."

 

This is an outright lie, fabricated to support your story.

I know this for a fact because we export all over the world including to Australia, and we always carry out 'know your customer' checks, even if they are paying in advance.

In Australia, as in the UK and many countries, anyone can use any business trading name they like providing no one else has registered it.

Registering a business trading name is optional. You register a business trading name if you want to prevent others from using it.

 

The only registration which which is mandatory in Australia is something called an 'Australian Business Number' which is a unique number assigned to the legal entity carrying out the business.

But the name of the legal entity carrying out the business, and the public business name(s) used by it in the course of its day to day trading activities, can be completely different.

The 'Australian Business Number' of the legal entity carrying out the business must appear on the legal entity's Purchase Orders and Sales Invoices, which provides the connection back to the ownership.

 

If you dispute having lied about this, then post the link to the page of the Australian Securities and Investment Commission or HM Revenue/Inland Revenue (or equivalent) where is says Any business/individual that conducts trade out of, or in, Australia, is required to register that business name.

Edited by pure, 13 April 2016 - 03:46 PM.

[sagit]

Do you feel better now that you have had your rant?

Have you taken the time and effort to contact the Russian Institute, or are you interested only in ranting?

No, I am not on a mission; nor am I associated in any way with IAS. I am an independent individual. And I found this website only when I conducted a web search on "Russian peptide bioregulators". I did not necessarily research any other sites that came up in that search, as earlier posts on this thread pointed to PB as having a good price structure.

In fact, I was about to buy from PB but just wanted to check with the Russian Institute that their recommendations were the same as PB.

Also, The Director did mention NPCRIZ.

Now, as to the requirement for a business to register with ASIC. Where do you think the ABN number comes from? It is issued only when that entity registers with ASIC, and pays the prescribed fee each and every year! PB claims a physical address in Melbourne. It is selling product. It is required to register with ASIC. Any litigation against PB will fail because action can only proceed if taken against the owner, who in this case is not disclosed. Because PB has no registration with ASIC, it is trading illegally. So good luck in finding out just with whom you are dealing.

Matthew Walker claims that the owner of PB is a university professor in medicine. If that is so, he would have access to all the lab equipment there from where with the right equipment it is possible to determine the structure of any item. It would also explain the level of knowledge they have. But that does not guarantee that what they are selling is genuine.

And you still have not addressed the matter of why PB sent you 7 different samples of the same product. Does that not suggest that they are playing around with formulations? Simple logic says that 7 different samples just cannot be identical. Nor have you had any sample/item laboratory checked to determine its composition.  So how can you be sure that it is genuine? Ever thought that you might be an unwitting human guinea pig? Do you always judge a book by its cover, particularly in the world of the internet which abounds with crooks? Conmen are successful because they are very good at convincing others they are genuine.

Given that IAS's prices are high, has it never struck you as odd that PB's prices are about one third that of IAS? Sure, IAS might load their price, but really, three times greater than their competitor! Come on, now. If you are in the business world, surely you would know that such a large variation is sus.

Nor have you addressed the fact that PB does not have a landline phone number even though it claims to occupy office space in one of the most prestigious buildings in Melbourne CBD. It sports only a mobile phone number which, as I said earlier, is almost impossible to trace. Landlines, on the other hand, can be. So what are PB trying to hide? And who are you really dealing with?

Nor have you addressed the statement by the Director of the Institute that PB were sent samples for scientific collaboration, not clinical application. Does that not imply that PB have been underhanded if they are selling product? Where is their integrity?

You're on a mission, eh?

So you (sagit) joined this forum the same day you made your first post? And according to your mandatory intro post you "found this site by chance"? hahaha! sure you did.

And your first posts just happen to suggest the integrity of a long-time known supplier might be in question?

Should I just call you IAS?

Can YOU smell fraud?

If Pivotal were supplying non-genuine product, don't you think someone on this forum or elsewhere on the internet would already have posted to that effect sometime during the last couple of years?

Hell, I would have myself. I flocking loath jackass incompetent amateur inept suppliers and especially cheats. My mission on this forum is to get the absolute truth and the best quality.

 

But when I just searched this forum for any references to pivotal before writing the above, I found the following:

http://www.longecity...e-2#entry729466

Post #45 from poster Alin Samson in Luxembourg writes:

"contact mwalker@pivotalbioscience.com. They`re reliable and the stuff they are selling is the real deal."

 

I've purchased Peptide Bioregulators from IAS, then peptidesstore.com, then Pivotal Bioscience.

Products from each of them are identical in every way.

Who is peptidesstore.com then? Why didn't that 'Executive Director' woman you corresponded with at the St. Petersburg Institute also mention peptidesstore.com as well as IAS?

Since she didn't mention peptidesstore.com, then according to you they might be selling 'counterfeit' fake product, right?

I know for a fact that peptidesstore.com do not source from the St. Petersburg Institute. They source from the St. Petersburg Institute's biggest distributor called npcriz.ru

I know this because I asked them when I was ordering from them and then I confirmed it with npcriz.ru because I wanted surety that I was getting the genuine article.

 

Hang on, now there's not just another reseller (peptidesstore.com) but also an entire distributor (npcriz.ru) which the Executive director woman didn't tell you about?

H'mmm, I wonder why she wouldn't have mentioned npcriz.ru to you? NPCRIZ advise they are the oldest and biggest distributor for the St. Petersburg Institute.

Seems a lot dodgy and suspicious to me that she would have omitted to mention their biggest distributor and a well known reseller (peptidesstore.com).

I am absolutely certain peptidesstore.com, Pivotal Bioscience, and IAS are all selling genuine Peptide Bioregulators manufactured by the St. Petersburg Institute.

All their products are identical and they all have the same noticeable effect.

And that is all that matters.. whether they are genuine, not which distribution channel they have transited through.

 

and who are the following guys in South Africa?..

http://shop.biogenes...20-x-200mg.html

Another counterfeiter selling fake product in your opinion?

The Executive Director also didn't mention them so they must be selling fake products right?

Why don't you also try and find their ownership structure from their website? Good luck with that.

And how are you getting on finding out the ownership from their websites of Ceretropic, rui-products.com, and peptidesciences.com, three other trusted suppliers?

If you bother trying, I bet you get nowhere.

 

It is difficult finding good trustworthy suppliers of innovative products and research compounds.

When someone on the very day they register on this forum makes their first post and that post is suggesting a long time known trusted supplier might be suspect:

1. such behavior is suspect in itself

2. it wastes other peoples time in possibly checking things out/questioning them unnecessarily

 

I don't want my time to be wasted on being alarmed and possibly heading off on a wild goose chase based on what turns out to be unfounded poorly researched information.

 

Why don't you just man-up and write to Pivotal Bioscience and ask them about your queries?

That would be the best test of transparency and integrity to subject them to.

Then when you've got some concrete facts come back here and post.

 

Or, just instead just pay IAS $70 for 20 capsules, instead of $33 from Pivotal, if you're that precious about their ownership.

 

Also, you wrote:

"Any business/individual that conducts trade out of, or in, Australia, is required to register that business name with the Australian Securities and Investment Commission."

 

This is an outright lie, fabricated to support your story.

I know this for a fact because we export all over the world including to Australia, and we always carry out 'know your customer' checks, even if they are paying in advance.

In Australia, as in the UK and many countries, anyone can use any business trading name they like providing no one else has registered it.

Registering a business trading name is optional. You register a business trading name if you want to prevent others from using it.

 

The only registration which which is mandatory in Australia is something called an 'Australian Business Number' which is a unique number assigned to the legal entity carrying out the business.

But the name of the legal entity carrying out the business, and the public business name(s) used by it in the course of its day to day trading activities, can be completely different.

The 'Australian Business Number' of the legal entity carrying out the business must appear on the legal entity's Purchase Orders and Sales Invoices, which provides the connection back to the ownership.

 

If you dispute having lied about this, then post the link to the page of the Australian Securities and Investment Commission or HM Revenue/Inland Revenue (or equivalent) where is says Any business/individual that conducts trade out of, or in, Australia, is required to register that business name.

 

[sagit]

It looks like I have to spell things out in simple terms, since you seem to be unwilling/unable to connect all the dots.

PB are not into marketing (yet), which is why they have not set up a website. The owner, after all, is a university professor.

A university professor – of medicine – not only lectures, but also carries out experiments/trials.

To conduct a trial he needs subjects, whom he monitors very closely for feedback. So he will give everyone lots of care and attention.

In a properly conducted trial the subjects receive a sample which is in identical packaging so that no one knows who is getting the real deal, and who is getting the trial “pill”.

He has already shown his hand in sending you so many different samples of the same peptide.

But he is also very smart. What happens if any of the subjects suffer serious reactions – maybe even deceases?

Who will be held liable? This smart professor has covered his tracks very well – nobody seems to know who or where he is.

So, my friend, the last laugh, I think, is on you. I will pass on becoming one of his human lab rats.

 

 

Do you feel better now that you have had your rant?

Have you taken the time and effort to contact the Russian Institute, or are you interested only in ranting?

No, I am not on a mission; nor am I associated in any way with IAS. I am an independent individual. And I found this website only when I conducted a web search on "Russian peptide bioregulators". I did not necessarily research any other sites that came up in that search, as earlier posts on this thread pointed to PB as having a good price structure.

In fact, I was about to buy from PB but just wanted to check with the Russian Institute that their recommendations were the same as PB.

Also, The Director did mention NPCRIZ.

Now, as to the requirement for a business to register with ASIC. Where do you think the ABN number comes from? It is issued only when that entity registers with ASIC, and pays the prescribed fee each and every year! PB claims a physical address in Melbourne. It is selling product. It is required to register with ASIC. Any litigation against PB will fail because action can only proceed if taken against the owner, who in this case is not disclosed. Because PB has no registration with ASIC, it is trading illegally. So good luck in finding out just with whom you are dealing.

Matthew Walker claims that the owner of PB is a university professor in medicine. If that is so, he would have access to all the lab equipment there from where with the right equipment it is possible to determine the structure of any item. It would also explain the level of knowledge they have. But that does not guarantee that what they are selling is genuine.

And you still have not addressed the matter of why PB sent you 7 different samples of the same product. Does that not suggest that they are playing around with formulations? Simple logic says that 7 different samples just cannot be identical. Nor have you had any sample/item laboratory checked to determine its composition.  So how can you be sure that it is genuine? Ever thought that you might be an unwitting human guinea pig? Do you always judge a book by its cover, particularly in the world of the internet which abounds with crooks? Conmen are successful because they are very good at convincing others they are genuine.

Given that IAS's prices are high, has it never struck you as odd that PB's prices are about one third that of IAS? Sure, IAS might load their price, but really, three times greater than their competitor! Come on, now. If you are in the business world, surely you would know that such a large variation is sus.

Nor have you addressed the fact that PB does not have a landline phone number even though it claims to occupy office space in one of the most prestigious buildings in Melbourne CBD. It sports only a mobile phone number which, as I said earlier, is almost impossible to trace. Landlines, on the other hand, can be. So what are PB trying to hide? And who are you really dealing with?

Nor have you addressed the statement by the Director of the Institute that PB were sent samples for scientific collaboration, not clinical application. Does that not imply that PB have been underhanded if they are selling product? Where is their integrity?

You're on a mission, eh?

So you (sagit) joined this forum the same day you made your first post? And according to your mandatory intro post you "found this site by chance"? hahaha! sure you did.

And your first posts just happen to suggest the integrity of a long-time known supplier might be in question?

Should I just call you IAS?

Can YOU smell fraud?

If Pivotal were supplying non-genuine product, don't you think someone on this forum or elsewhere on the internet would already have posted to that effect sometime during the last couple of years?

Hell, I would have myself. I flocking loath jackass incompetent amateur inept suppliers and especially cheats. My mission on this forum is to get the absolute truth and the best quality.

 

But when I just searched this forum for any references to pivotal before writing the above, I found the following:

http://www.longecity...e-2#entry729466

Post #45 from poster Alin Samson in Luxembourg writes:

"contact mwalker@pivotalbioscience.com. They`re reliable and the stuff they are selling is the real deal."

 

I've purchased Peptide Bioregulators from IAS, then peptidesstore.com, then Pivotal Bioscience.

Products from each of them are identical in every way.

Who is peptidesstore.com then? Why didn't that 'Executive Director' woman you corresponded with at the St. Petersburg Institute also mention peptidesstore.com as well as IAS?

Since she didn't mention peptidesstore.com, then according to you they might be selling 'counterfeit' fake product, right?

I know for a fact that peptidesstore.com do not source from the St. Petersburg Institute. They source from the St. Petersburg Institute's biggest distributor called npcriz.ru

I know this because I asked them when I was ordering from them and then I confirmed it with npcriz.ru because I wanted surety that I was getting the genuine article.

 

Hang on, now there's not just another reseller (peptidesstore.com) but also an entire distributor (npcriz.ru) which the Executive director woman didn't tell you about?

H'mmm, I wonder why she wouldn't have mentioned npcriz.ru to you? NPCRIZ advise they are the oldest and biggest distributor for the St. Petersburg Institute.

Seems a lot dodgy and suspicious to me that she would have omitted to mention their biggest distributor and a well known reseller (peptidesstore.com).

I am absolutely certain peptidesstore.com, Pivotal Bioscience, and IAS are all selling genuine Peptide Bioregulators manufactured by the St. Petersburg Institute.

All their products are identical and they all have the same noticeable effect.

And that is all that matters.. whether they are genuine, not which distribution channel they have transited through.

 

and who are the following guys in South Africa?..

http://shop.biogenes...20-x-200mg.html

Another counterfeiter selling fake product in your opinion?

The Executive Director also didn't mention them so they must be selling fake products right?

Why don't you also try and find their ownership structure from their website? Good luck with that.

And how are you getting on finding out the ownership from their websites of Ceretropic, rui-products.com, and peptidesciences.com, three other trusted suppliers?

If you bother trying, I bet you get nowhere.

 

It is difficult finding good trustworthy suppliers of innovative products and research compounds.

When someone on the very day they register on this forum makes their first post and that post is suggesting a long time known trusted supplier might be suspect:

1. such behavior is suspect in itself

2. it wastes other peoples time in possibly checking things out/questioning them unnecessarily

 

I don't want my time to be wasted on being alarmed and possibly heading off on a wild goose chase based on what turns out to be unfounded poorly researched information.

 

Why don't you just man-up and write to Pivotal Bioscience and ask them about your queries?

That would be the best test of transparency and integrity to subject them to.

Then when you've got some concrete facts come back here and post.

 

Or, just instead just pay IAS $70 for 20 capsules, instead of $33 from Pivotal, if you're that precious about their ownership.

 

Also, you wrote:

"Any business/individual that conducts trade out of, or in, Australia, is required to register that business name with the Australian Securities and Investment Commission."

 

This is an outright lie, fabricated to support your story.

I know this for a fact because we export all over the world including to Australia, and we always carry out 'know your customer' checks, even if they are paying in advance.

In Australia, as in the UK and many countries, anyone can use any business trading name they like providing no one else has registered it.

Registering a business trading name is optional. You register a business trading name if you want to prevent others from using it.

 

The only registration which which is mandatory in Australia is something called an 'Australian Business Number' which is a unique number assigned to the legal entity carrying out the business.

But the name of the legal entity carrying out the business, and the public business name(s) used by it in the course of its day to day trading activities, can be completely different.

The 'Australian Business Number' of the legal entity carrying out the business must appear on the legal entity's Purchase Orders and Sales Invoices, which provides the connection back to the ownership.

 

If you dispute having lied about this, then post the link to the page of the Australian Securities and Investment Commission or HM Revenue/Inland Revenue (or equivalent) where is says Any business/individual that conducts trade out of, or in, Australia, is required to register that business name.

 

 

[mikey]

Has anyone taken endoluten?  I cant find a single testimonial on the web

 

I've taken it and prefer it to subq Epitalon, but I'm 63, in the age group that was shown to benefit slightly more with endoluten than epitalon.

 

And I prefer taking a capsule to doing subq injections.

 

Epitalon is a synthetic tetrapeptide that consists of the four amino acids that are the "heart" of the signaling mechanism from the pineal gland.

 

Epitalon weighs significantly less than epithalamin or endoluten, because each of them consists of the natural peptides from young animals.

 

So, there are other constituents in them besides the four amino acids in epitalon.

 

Perhaps that is why endoluten (oral) was shown to increase telomere length for 60-65 year olds more than epitalon (IV).

 

A comparative study showed that for 60-65 year olds epithalamin (IV) increase telomere length by 16%.

 

Epitalon increased telomere length by 12%, while Endoluten increased telomere length by 13%.

 

For 75-80 year olds epithalamin increased telomere length by 19%. Epitalon increased them by 19% and Endoluten increased them by 13%.

 

So, for people who don’t like using needles, Endoluten worked slightly better for 60-65 year olds, while it did increase telomere length, but significantly less than epitalon for 75-80 year olds.
 

This comparison is seen in slide 79 of http://www.khavinson...s-genome-ageing.

 

For your convenience I attached the slide with notes.

Attached Files

•  What is the difference between epitalon, epithalamin & endoluten - slide 79 with percentages.docx   83.27KB   9 downloads

Edited by mikey, 06 July 2016 - 05:09 AM.

[Huckfinn]

Hi Mikey,

any reliable endoluten source?

 

Thanks

[mikey]

https://www.antiagin...&submit_search=     $89.00

 

http://rupharma.com/endoluten/   $91.00

 

Although there are Russian sites that sell it for $49.
http://xn--d1acrgdd3ah9f.xn--p1ai/

 

And others. Just Google "Buy Endoluten" in Russian.

 

I can't vouch for the quality, although I have used it - from a vendor that is gone now -and found that it definitelyexhibited anti-aging effects, most noticeable in my skin.
 

[Huckfinn]

Thanks Mikey.

How long have you being taking it for?

[mikey]

I noticed that three red welts on my ankles disappeared in a few days when I used epitalon and the thymalin from Peptide Sciences, which I found is not the real thymalin.

 

Skin tone improved quickly. Cuts heal faster. Seems that they improved detox pathways.

 

I've been using epitalon almost every day for probably four months. I've only used Peptide Sciences thymalin twice.

 

Peptide Sciences' thymalin is not the true bi-peptide but when I have used it with epitalon it added to the effect of epitalon. The study said that too.

 

I am shopping for a lab in the US to make real thymalin (H-L-Glu-Trp-OH) 100 mg per vial, as the data show, thymalin being more effective then epitalon in extending life, but using them together gives even better results. 

 

If anyone wants to do a group buy of thymalin, made by a lab in the USA, please let me know.

 

 

[RiDDIM]

I may be interested in the group buy.  Please do let me know if anything develops.  Thanks!

[mikey]

Thanks Mikey.

How long have you being taking it for?

 

I subq'd it daily for about four months.

 

Then stopped for about two months.

 

Now I'm taking one endoluten capsule a day ongoing, rather than the prescribed two for ten days.

 

I intend to continue taking one capsule a day continually, as it has a noticeable beneficial effect on my skin, so I assume it's producing other beneficial effects in my metabolism.

 

Actually, when I did a complex blood test, my blood lipids were exceptional, better than ever.

 

I'm doing numerous anti-aging things, so I can't say for sure that it's the endoluten/epitalon, but it seems like when I resumed it after being off for a couple months that my skin improved again.

 

It appears to have an enduring effect, once one stops using it.

 

However, continual use seems to do more.

Edited by mikey, 18 August 2016 - 01:20 AM.

[Huckfinn]

Has anyone bought Endoluten from these guys (i.e. are they reliable?)?:

http://xn--d1acrgdd3ah9f.xn--p1ai/

[aconita]

Probably they are reliable since those supplements are sold in pharmacies in Russia and there are quite a few online pharmacies there.

 

The problem is that the sites are all in Russian which doesn't make it smooth to place an order, likely there is no way to insert an outside Russia address and since these sites are all in Russian only I assume they don't ship elsewhere.

 

Anyway if contacting them by e-mail leads somewhere let me know since prices are quite appealing.

[Huckfinn]

Actually they have a "live chat" in English.

They seem to be ok kind of people but...don't take paypal so.....

[aconita]

Paypal or credit card makes no difference, Western union or bitcoins are another matter certainly worth caution.

[oxanaweb]

Peptide bioregulators are effective. I confirm that. Very good are komlex peptide bioregulators 'Made in Germany'.

Here: http://previtalica.com/index_en.html

[Baten]

I had a good deal on testoluten 60caps, taking two first thing in the morning every day. Seems to stimulate hormonal production in a very clean way, liking it quite a bit.

Might have to run these once a year or so... russian peptides sure are interesting! Now I'd like to try endoluten and/or pinaleon some day, too.

[Izan]

I had a good deal on testoluten 60caps, taking two first thing in the morning every day. Seems to stimulate hormonal production in a very clean way, liking it quite a bit.

Might have to run these once a year or so... russian peptides sure are interesting! Now I'd like to try endoluten and/or pinaleon some day, too.

What can you tell us more about it please? Increase in libido? strength? Thanks

[Baten]

 

I had a good deal on testoluten 60caps, taking two first thing in the morning every day. Seems to stimulate hormonal production in a very clean way, liking it quite a bit.

Might have to run these once a year or so... russian peptides sure are interesting! Now I'd like to try endoluten and/or pinaleon some day, too.

What can you tell us more about it please? Increase in libido? strength? Thanks

 

Libido a notch up, balls seem honestly, full and bigger. Strength I'm not sure, seems relatively same.

 

Overall this feels kind of like how 'PCT' feels like, brings your nuts to a state where they work quite well. If for some reason they are functioning below baseline (hpa-axis related, stress, other supplements, age, ...), this could just get them to proper working order. If you're already 'healthy', testoluten can only make them work even better. Hard to explain exactly how you feel it, I just feel somewhat closer to how it felt being a teenager, when it comes to hormonal balance. Any supplement that can make me feel this way is pretty good stuff in my book.

Edited by Baten, 14 January 2017 - 07:24 PM.

[JoeMonp]

Hey Bayern, where are you purchasing it from?

[Baten]

I used a website called 'RusMedStore'. Didn't seem to have a lot of orders yet, but they were selling 60 caps for the price that other Russian sites charged for 20 capsules...

They don't offer a lot of payment options though, I had to use WU which has no money-back guarantee whatsoever... but well all went fine so I can only recommend the store.

[Ark]

I'm looking foreword to trying Actovegin and Tenoten, has anyone else tried these two?