112 replies to this topic

[PWAIN]

I am looking into sourcing some SkQ1. This has been talked about on these forums for years. I think it would be nice to get some and try it.

Does anyone know the dosing, I have seem reference to 0.5 to 50nmol/kg/day in mice but what does that translate to in humans in milli/micrograms?

Anyway if anyone is interested, please post here so I can guage interest.

[YOLF]

Sounds interesting. We'll definitely have to get permission from the patent holders, but I'm interested and willing to run it. Started a group buy group:
http://www.longecity...skq1-group-buy/

It's waiting for approval.

[PWAIN]

Sounds interesting. We'll definitely have to get permission from the patent holders, but I'm interested and willing to run it. Started a group buy group:
http://www.longecity...skq1-group-buy/

Group has been approved.
[disclaimer]

I'm happy for you to run it. I'll pass on the details of the company that is creating this stuff via pm. I think the way to do this is to use the standard method which is selling for research purposes only. This is allowed under the patent system. I think it is possibly the method of synthesis that is patented.

Do we have any interest from others??? Please let us know.

Edited by cryonicsculture, 03 April 2014 - 01:10 AM.

[blood]

What benefits would this offer over C60-EVOO (if any)?

Edited by blood, 26 March 2014 - 11:08 AM.

[BobSeitz]

I'm very interested.

[PWAIN]

Anyone able to help determine doseage? What does "0.5 to 50nmol/kg/day in mice" translate to in mg/kg in humans?

[YOLF]

It was determined somewhere in the forum. I'm not certain what they came up with though.

[niner]

Anyone able to help determine doseage? What does "0.5 to 50nmol/kg/day in mice" translate to in mg/kg in humans?

The usual interspecies scaling constant between mice and humans is a factor of 12 lower for humans, because our metabolism is much slower than a mouse. A mole of SkQ1 is 538g. For the midpoint of the range (which is a factor of 100 wide- a pretty broad mouse dosage range), 5nm/kg/d, it would be:

5nm/kg * (1e-9m/nm) * (538g/m) (1 human/ 12 mouse) = 2.24e-7 g/kg = 22.4 mcg/kg

For a 70kg human:

70kg * 22.4 mcg/kg = 1568 mcg = 1.6 mg

Considering the range that covers a factor of 100, that would result in a dose of between 160 mcg and 16 mg per day.

It might be worth looking at the recommended dose of MitoQ, since SkQ1 and mitoQ have very similar structures.



It's worth noting that these calculated doses are about the same as the dose of c60-oo that people are using. I think c60-oo works in the same way, but with a more effective antioxidant group and possibly less specific mitochondrial targeting. The c60-fatty acid adduct might get incorporated into a phospholipid and join the mitochondrial membrane that way, or it might even enter the membrane by itself, as an anion. This might be opposed by the mitochondrial membrane potential, but favored by the cationic head groups of the native membrane.

 

Edit: fixed error in units:  160 mcg, not mg!

Edited by niner, 12 July 2014 - 07:54 PM.

[Geoffrey1]

Sounds interesting. We'll definitely have to get permission from the patent holders, but I'm interested and willing to run it. Started a group buy group:
http://www.longecity...skq1-group-buy/

It's waiting for approval.

I'm happy for you to run it. I'll pass on the details of the company that is creating this stuff via pm. I think the way to do this is to use the standard method which is selling for research purposes only. This is allowed under the patent system. I think it is possibly the method of synthesis that is patented.

Do we have any interest from others??? Please let us know.

definitely interested --re MitoQ
Oral administration of MitoQ in otherwise healthy wild type mice over 28 weeks fails to significantly alter mitochondrial function or gene expression, and no overall influence on systemic energy metabolism

• Rodriguez-Cuenca S, et al. Consequences of long-term oral administration of the mitochondria-targeted antioxidant MitoQ to wild-type mice. Free Radic Biol Med. (2010)

does not sound 2 promising for MitoQ over-priced hype?
heard of better results for SkQ1---I am definitely interested in a group buy (font just got big, sorry)

[PWAIN]

Sounds interesting. We'll definitely have to get permission from the patent holders, but I'm interested and willing to run it. Started a group buy group:
http://www.longecity...skq1-group-buy/

It's waiting for approval.

Cryonicsculture, how is this going? I can't seem to access it.

So far we seem to have:

PWAIN
Cryonicsculture
BobSeitz
Geoffrey1

Any more??

[YOLF]

The group still hasn't been approved. I think since it's new and there have only been a few group buys since it being implemented it's not being watched. I've sent a pm to someone about it and I've got a meeting with them tomorrow for something else, so check in sometime late tomorrow.

[eighthman]

I'm interested. In addition, can we buy spermidine thru this site, perhaps as a group? I am striking out with all suppliers due to their contentious policies of who they sell to.

Thanks

[PWAIN]

So far we have:

PWAIN
Cryonicsculture
BobSeitz
Geoffrey1
eighthman

[tintinet]

Why not? Count me in!

[PWAIN]

So far we have:

PWAIN
Cryonicsculture
BobSeitz
Geoffrey1
eighthman
tintinet

Starting to build up the numbers a bit...

[YOLF]

Group has been approved, you can follow it here:
http://www.longecity...skq1-group-buy/

BobSeitz
PWAIN
tintinet
eighthman
Geoffrey1
CryonicsCulture

[Dazzcat]

Count me in.

By the way, what's the reasoning behind why SkQ1 would be more effective or even safer than MitoQ?

[PWAIN]

Group has been approved, you can follow it here:
http://www.longecity.org/forum/groups/

BobSeitz
PWAIN
tintinet
eighthman
Geoffrey1
CryonicsCulture
Dazzcat

Edit: I noticed the link didn't work and could fix it for whatever reason. The new link will take you to the Groups index page. - CC

Edited by cryonicsculture, 06 April 2014 - 02:11 AM.

[niner]

Count me in.

By the way, what's the reasoning behind why SkQ1 would be more effective or even safer than MitoQ?

As I understand it, SkQ1 was designed to have a wider range of safe dosage before it becomes pro-oxidant. Supposedly MitoQ becomes pro-oxidant at lower doses than SkQ1.

[Dazzcat]

^ Thanks niner.

PWAIN, I read on the other thread that you took around 80mg before you noticed some kind of positive effect from MitoQ? I wonder if at this dose it gets close to the realm of pro-oxidant, it would seem that any positive effects would be evident that it's ok, but chronic daily high dosing maybe a different story.

Also when we speak of a compound reaching pro-oxidant levels, then all therapeutic effects are nullified and one would be doing more harm than good?

Edited by Dazzcat, 06 April 2014 - 08:55 PM.

[StevesPetRat]

What's the status of this group buy? I am interested though I am a bit worried about the lethargy-behavior the mice showed.

[YOLF]

The group buy group has 14 people. So how many are interested and at what price point?

[BobSeitz]

Maybe I should reaffirm my interest in an SkQ1 group buy. 

[YOLF]

Ok, we're up to 7 participants. PWAIN, would you mind forwarding the lab info to me?

 

 

[Dazzcat]

Do we want the bromide or chloride salt or just the SKQ1 cation on it's own?

[Light]

I am interested and have joined the official group buy group.

 

But by any chance could the bulk material purchased through this group buy be made into a solution and used as eyedrops?

[YOLF]

I'm sure it could be. There is a Russian product available in Moscow for this. I tried ordering some a while back but it was only available for local delivery :( I'm sure we could discuss the possibility of creating an eye drop product and what materials would be involved.

[Light]

Excellent, thanks. I have heard about that product and have been wanting to get my hands on it as well.

[hX_]

If I'm in on this I'd rather we don't mix it with random solvents to drop into your eye. Just supply a raw powder and those of us responsible enough to actually have a decent set of milligram scales will be fine.

 

Also I highly doubt that making and packaging an 'eyedrop' product before distributing it would be covered under the 'research' part of the patent law. Also it would prevent 3rd party analysis or make it much harder.

[YOLF]

Very true. Raw powder it will be, but we can still discuss formulations. People may want to generate case reports on their experience with it and given that it isn't yet available outside the city of Moscow and people may be in need of it for various reasons, it might actually be legal to obtain anyways in some jurisdictions. I'm fairly certain the patent holder will welcome the anecdotal reports as it may help them to get loans to spread their project....

 

 

Edited by cryonicsculture, 12 June 2014 - 07:08 PM.