2266 replies to this topic

[MikeDC]

Oh, it does nothing on humans? What about the multiple studies that show effects on humans, how are those "nothing"?

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/22240353

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/21385509

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/22219517

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/22055504

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/20357044

There is a meta analysis of all Resveratrol clinical trials and found the overall results not significant

[Captain Obvious]

There is a meta analysis of all Resveratrol clinical trials and found the overall results not significant

 

Could you please post a link to that meta-analysis and along with that the meta-analysis of all NR clinical trials that shows the significant overall results of NR supplementation in humans?

 

Thanks!

[MikeDC]

Resveratrol does not improve lipid profiles

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/29305228

 

Resveratrol does not improve blood pressure

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/29359958

 

Not much in cognition improvement

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/29596658

 

We don't have a meta data analysis on NR because there is so far only one clinical trial on the health improvement has been published. The Colorado trial showed NR reduced blood pressure for people with blood pressure in the

120 and 139 range. My faith in NR right now is mostly based on personal experiences of me, my friends, and other NR users and the science behind NAD+.

[Captain Obvious]

Since you seem to like cherry picking, below are some results from other meta-analysis on resveratrol. It's funny that for resveratrol these do not seem to count, yet for NR you rely mostly on anecdotal evidence.

 

"Our results indicated that resveratrol can significantly reduce total cholesterol..  In cross-over trials, resveratrol could significantly increase HDL-C."

 

https://www.research...clinical_trials

 

"This meta-analysis provides evidence that supplementation of resveratrol may benefit management of T2DM."

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/29018489

 

"The present study provides substantial evidence that resveratrol supplementation has favorable effects on several risk factors of NCDs."

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/28933578

 

"Our finding provides evidence that daily resveratrol consumption might be a candidate as an adjunct to pharmacological management to better prevent and control cardiovascular disease in overweight/obese individuals."

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/27456934

 

"Resveratrol significantly improves adiponectin but does not affect leptin concentrations."

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/28089943

 

"The present meta-analysis indicates that resveratrol consumption significantly decreases the SBP level at the higher dose, while resveratrol has no significant effects on DBP levels"

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...pubmed/24731650

 

 

Edited by Captain Obvious, 24 April 2018 - 12:47 PM.

[jjnz]

Thanks for those Captain Obvious, looks like there is better evidence for the efficacy of Resveratrol than NR !

[MikeDC]

Thanks for those Captain Obvious, looks like there is better evidence for the efficacy of Resveratrol than NR !

I searched for Resveratrol and meta and got these 3 most recent meta analysis. They are all negative.

If you like Resveratrol, keep taking it. Don’t waste other people’s time here.

[Supierce]

Thanks for those Captain Obvious, looks like there is better evidence for the efficacy of Resveratrol than NR !

While the benefits of resveratrol are well established, Sinclair found that it's less effective in test subjects with low NAD+ so I wouldn't say it's either/or.

[MikeDC]

While the benefits of resveratrol are well established, Sinclair found that it's less effective in test subjects with low NAD+ so I wouldn't say it's either/or.

The benefit of Resveratrol was so well established that Sinclair had to create Resveratrol derivatives to make it more effective and Glaxo ended up shelving the project because the lab results can’t be reproduced after spending $700 million on it.

[Captain Obvious]

I searched for Resveratrol and meta and got these 3 most recent meta analysis. They are all negative.

If you like Resveratrol, keep taking it. Don’t waste other people’s time here.

 

I see, so when someone proves that your claims are untrue (for example that resveratrol does "nothing") and that you try to validate your claims by cherry-picking evidence, they are "wasting other people's time". But instead of just taking NR because you like it, it's fine for you to keep making truth claims about it based on anecdotal evidence and unproven hypothesis. 

 

Since meta-discussion IS a waste of time and off-topic, I'll stop with it here.

 

PS. They were not the most recent meta-studies, as if that would immediately validate them over others anyway.

Edited by Captain Obvious, 24 April 2018 - 02:05 PM.

[LawrenceW]

Search for the patent. Yes nobody is allowed to mix NR and pterostilbene except Elysium.

 

Technical question.  Can an individual purchase and take NR and pterostilbene separately and then take them at the same time or would they be infringing on the patent?

[MikeDC]

Technical question. Can an individual purchase and take NR and pterostilbene separately and then take them at the same time or would they be infringing on the patent?

You can mix it and take it. Just not selling it.

[MikeDC]

I see, so when someone proves that your claims are untrue (for example that resveratrol does "nothing") and that you try to validate your claims by cherry-picking evidence, they are "wasting other people's time". But instead of just taking NR because you like it, it's fine for you to keep making truth claims about it based on anecdotal evidence and unproven hypothesis.

Since meta-discussion IS a waste of time and off-topic, I'll stop with it here.

PS. They were not the most recent meta-studies, as if that would immediately validate them over others anyway.

New meta analysis will invalidate old ones because new research are included.

I have used Resveratrol for a year without feeling any effects. I was convinced NR is a miracle anti aging pill after a couple of months.

[LawrenceW]

You can mix it and take it. Just not selling it.

 

Can you tell other people about the ratio of the compounds covered by a patent?

[able]

You can mix it and take it. Just not selling it.

 

 

I don't believe Elysium has any patent on NR + Ptero.

 

I think that when they first contracted, Chromadex said they would not allow any retailers to combine the 2 in one product, so Elysium had control of the market.

 

I believe anyone can mix the 2 products and sell them.  There was a brand on Amazon that sold both products in 2 separate bottles (I forget which).  

 

Chromadex wont do that, as they don't want to help Elysium by saying they think the combination works.

 

No other retailers would want to either.

 

But there is no legal reason why they couldn't - just marketing.

 

Just my understanding of the situation.  If you have proof otherwise, please post.

Edited by able, 24 April 2018 - 04:01 PM.

[MikeDC]

I don't believe Elysium has any patent on NR + Ptero.

I think that when they first contracted, Chromadex said they would not allow any retailers to combine the 2 in one product, so Elysium had control of the market.

I believe anyone can mix the 2 products and sell them. There was a brand on Amazon that sold both products in 2 separate bottles (I forget which).

Chromadex wont do that, as they don't want to help Elysium by saying they think the combination works.

No other retailers would want to either.

But there is no legal reason why they couldn't - just marketing.

Just my understanding of the situation. If you have proof otherwise, please post.

I remember someone posted that Elysium has obtained patent on Nicotinamide Riboside and Pterostilbene on yahoo message board. But I could not find it. But I did find patent applications from Elysium on using the mixture for skin problems.

[bluemoon]

 
I have used Resveratrol for a year without feeling any effects. I was convinced NR is a miracle anti aging pill after a couple of months.

 

I felt effects when I took 500 mg of Longevenix, which has a small amount of quercetin as well as resveratrol. Week 1, no effects until about the 7th day when I had a strange reaction. As a friend who was taking 100 mg at the time said: "It feels like you are jumping out of your skin!" That went away within 24 hours. I then started to steadily lose weight until after a month I had lost 8% of my body weight. I also could easily climb hills without getting winded. Because of expense, I cut to 250 mg a day (alternating between 300 mg and 200 mg ) and the weight returned as quickly as it left. I felt more energy but less pronounced. When I took only 100 mg, I felt nothing unusual.

[MikeDC]

I felt effects when I took 500 mg of Longevenix, which has a small amount of quercetin as well as resveratrol. Week 1, no effects until about the 7th day when I had a strange reaction. As a friend who was taking 100 mg at the time said: "It feels like you are jumping out of your skin!" That went away within 24 hours. I then started to steadily lose weight until after a month I had lost 8% of my body weight. I also could easily climb hills without getting winded. Because of expense, I cut to 250 mg a day (alternating between 300 mg and 200 mg ) and the weight returned as quickly as it left. I felt more energy but less pronounced. When I took only 100 mg, I felt nothing unusual.

Good for you. I have decided to stay away from plant based supplements. I take Niagen, Ubiquinol, fish oil, vitamin D. I have never felt anything with fish oil and Ubiquinol. But my skin turned really smooth after 2 weeks of Niagen. I have lost weight, reduced cholesterol and triglycerides and A1C. I also lost 18lbs and cured my prostate inflammation. The pain from prostate inflammation reduces my quality of life considerably. Eliminating it is a big boost to my quality of life. Most of my friends are also getting amazing results. NR is on a league of its own. Nothing else come even close.

[bluemoon]

April 24 update

 

I'm only posting updates about the condition of my friend's mother in Tokyo if I hear of an interesting change. The mother has been taking 250 mg of NR for 8 weeks and today my friend said that her mother started her hobby of water color  painting scenery after four years of saying that it had been too difficult. Once again, while based on mice studies, NR could be increasing her mental capacity or maybe her sudden renewed interest in painting would have happened without NR.

[APBT]

Most of the previous 50 or so posts have nothing to do with PERSONAL EXPERIENCES WITH NR/NIAGEN. I hate to sound like a broken record but, let's try to keep posts on-topic or begin new threads.  Thanks.

[Oakman]

Being off topic aside, it seems like the argument, "this is totally useless", "this is a miracle" and quoting studies on NR, R, and Ptero here is a bit short sighted.

 

Here, anyones reference point, be it the search for longevity, heart health, skin condition, cancer, whatever - determines what is useful. Moreover, studies don't often combine supplements to uncover synergies, but we do. So all our N=1 stories may be unique and still valid. My current experience is that, by taking NR, NAM, and R/C in a certain way, I feel strong and healthy. I'm a sexagenarian, so my results might not work for you, but it is one experience to consider.

 

I've been on this for a month, but NR for 1.5 yrs. So early AM with food, alternate days, take NR 250 mg or NAM 500 mg  -  I recently started taking NAM for some actinic keratosis and improving skin health. I didn't want to take both NAM and NR together. I surprising result is a perceived mental rush each morning switching to NAM.

 

PM - 75 mg / 200 mg  Liposomal Resveratrol / Curcumin - I like the effectiveness of the liposomal delivery of these, and taken at this time of day (PM), R and C are most helpful to whole body health and rejuvenation. Seems to be helping with the joints, and endurance.  

 

Or chalk it up to the placebo effect, or some combination of other things I take/do. But for a time, I'll be testing this.

[LawrenceW]

NR is on a league of its own. Nothing else come even close.

 

That comparison is only your valid assessment against other supplements that you have taken.  You have never taken NMN, so therefore you have no personal knowledge of NR being better than NMN.  If you finally got off your NR throne and tried NMN, I predict that you will be pleasantly surprised by the results.

[MikeDC]

That comparison is only your valid assessment against other supplements that you have taken. You have never taken NMN, so therefore you have no personal knowledge of NR being better than NMN. If you finally got off your NR throne and tried NMN, I predict that you will be pleasantly surprised by the results.

I might give it a try when the NMN human trials are published and good. I will also need a reliable source of NMN. I will never buy the junk from China. All NMN in the market are junks from China. Even Chinese in China don’t want to take supplements made in China.

[Harkijn]

Most of the previous 50 or so posts have nothing to do with PERSONAL EXPERIENCES WITH NR/NIAGEN. I hate to sound like a broken record but, let's try to keep posts on-topic or begin new threads.  Thanks.

Ì totally agree. Please move posts or convince LC to do so...

[Michael]

MTORC1 is not a perfect target for anti aging. Some cells needs mTORC1 up regulated to show good benefits. Inhibition of mTORC1 in all cells cause immune suppression, intestine stem cell suppression, reduction in testosterone production and reduction in testis size.

There is no perfect target for anti-aging, at least so long as one is engaged with tweaking of metabolic pathways, and it's silly to pretend otherwise. We evolved the multiple biochemical systems and their complex regulatory networks to be tuned as they are because they promoted survival and perpetuation of the species, and you mess with them at some peril, whether you target mTOR, or inflammation, or autophagy, or NAD(H), or anything else. CR robustly retards aging and increases true species maximum lifespan; it also arrests oestrus in female animals, retards wound healing, and makes an organism far more vulnerable to death from exposure. This is a big part of the reason why Dr. de Grey formulated the "damage-repair" strategy of SENS: to bypass metabolism and target the cellular and molecular damage of aging directly.

That said, mTOR inhibition (with an mTORC1 bias) with rapamycin is the first and remains the best-documented anti-aging pharmacological strategy to date; it's unreasonable to pooh-pooh it.
 

Pterostilbene and Resveratrol have no beneficial effects on humans. Pterostilbene actually increases LDL and blood pressure.

The latter is false — or, at least, is contrary to the sole human trial of which I'm aware, which found that In 125 mg PT twice daily lowered both systolic (−7.8 mmHg) and diastolic (−7.3 mmHg) BP, and 100 mg twice daily led to a trend of reduction of SBP and DBP. Do you have evidence to the contrary?

[MikeDC]

There is no perfect target for anti-aging, at least so long as one is engaged with tweaking of metabolic pathways, and it's silly to pretend otherwise. We evolved the multiple biochemical systems and their complex regulatory networks to be tuned as they are because they promoted survival and perpetuation of the species, and you mess with them at some peril, whether you target mTOR, or inflammation, or autophagy, or NAD(H), or anything else. CR robustly retards aging and increases true species maximum lifespan; it also arrests oestrus in female animals, retards wound healing, and makes an organism far more vulnerable to death from exposure. This is a big part of the reason why Dr. de Grey formulated the "damage-repair" strategy of SENS: to bypass metabolism and target the cellular and molecular damage of aging directly.

That said, mTOR inhibition (with an mTORC1 bias) with rapamycin is the first and remains the best-documented anti-aging pharmacological strategy to date; it's unreasonable to pooh-pooh it.


The latter is false — or, at least, is contrary to the sole human trial of which I'm aware, which found that In 125 mg PT twice daily lowered both systolic (−7.8 mmHg) and diastolic (−7.3 mmHg) BP, and 100 mg twice daily led to a trend of reduction of SBP and DBP. Do you have evidence to the contrary?

MAD+ precursor path is a much better way for anti aging. Mtorc1 doesn’t even come close.

[jjnz]

I searched for Resveratrol and meta and got these 3 most recent meta analysis. They are all negative.

If you like Resveratrol, keep taking it. Don’t waste other people’s time here.

In reference to wasting other people’s time here.
1/ this “personal experience forum” is literally littered by off topic posts by you to the point that it is impossible to rescue it so it can be used as a harvestable source of anecdotes. This despite multiple requests by myself and others that comments remain on target. If it was not for the title of the forum it would be difficult to know it’s purpose.

2/ your posts are rude and immature at best , comments such as “are you drunk?” and “stop wasting people’s time” are almost as unhelpful as your deliberate misrepresentation of science.

3/You are the most frequent poster on this forum yet you add nothing but to argue with the experiences of others , something for which you have no insight ,what so ever.

4/You consistently “cherrypick” data from small studies to bolster findings to your favour yet hide behind the vagueness of large meta analysis in an attempt to prove a finding you don’t find favour with.

5/ I suspect you post under different accounts, the semantic patterns are fairly obvious ,as is the logic. Only the admins could verify this. This would be similarly disingenuous.

So rather than accuse others of being drunk or attempting to invalidate their genuine anecdotes, rather than accusing others of wasting people’s time, perhaps engage in a little self reflection

[midas]

I remember someone posted that Elysium has obtained patent on Nicotinamide Riboside and Pterostilbene on yahoo message board. But I could not find it. But I did find patent applications from Elysium on using the mixture for skin problems.

Probably this your thinking of....

 

https://patents.goog...2016200447A1/en

[Harkijn]

I have been taking NR for at least 5 years now (would have to read way back in this thread to find out). For a very long period 200 or 300 mgs/day and 500 mg since dr. Brenner said he takes that much. I am now 66 years old.

Unfortunate circumstances made NR unavailable to me five weeks ago and I expected to feel slumping energy after a week or so but there was no noticeable effect. One week ago I received NR(LEF) and restarted taking 500 mgs of which 100mg sublingual by opening the capsule. Once again: no noticeable change.

Today I received NMN(AlivebyNature) and I intend to take 300mg NR(1 sublingual) and 200mgs NMN (1 sublingual). If anything useful emerges I will be sure to post it in both personal experiences threads .

This may not sound too enthusiastic about NR but perhaps I have NR to thank that I feel en look very young for my age. Even to such an extend that acquaintances who don't know my age expect 'that younger guy' to come round when heavy furniture has to be moved. These people are years younger than me, it's just not fair!

[MikeDC]

I have been taking NR for at least 5 years now (would have to read way back in this thread to find out). For a very long period 200 or 300 mgs/day and 500 mg since dr. Brenner said he takes that much. I am now 66 years old.
Unfortunate circumstances made NR unavailable to me five weeks ago and I expected to feel slumping energy after a week or so but there was no noticeable effect. One week ago I received NR(LEF) and restarted taking 500 mgs of which 100mg sublingual by opening the capsule. Once again: no noticeable change.
Today I received NMN(AlivebyNature) and I intend to take 300mg NR(1 sublingual) and 200mgs NMN (1 sublingual). If anything useful emerges I will be sure to post it in both personal experiences threads .
This may not sound too enthusiastic about NR but perhaps I have NR to thank that I feel en look very young for my age. Even to such an extend that acquaintances who don't know my age expect 'that younger guy' to come round when heavy furniture has to be moved. These people are years younger than me, it's just not fair!

It is very fair. You get rewarded for your decisions. Instead of inflamed and painful prostate two years ago, my prostate is as good as in the 30’s. No inflammation and enlargement. I am almost 60.

Edited by MikeDC, 12 May 2018 - 04:06 PM.

[male_1978]

I am 39 years old and taking NR (200 mg/day) now for 5 months and no other supplements (took resveratrol earlier). As this is a personal experience thread, i summarize the effects i had from NR in short:

 

Effects:

 

- In the first weeks i noticed an increase in energy and awakeness, i woke up earlier and i couldn't sleep sometimes. But i think the effect has become less after a while.

- I had libido problems because of a previous finasteride intake (against hair loss) and these problems disappeared after taking NR. 

- My blood pressure dropped from +-140 to about 130. 

 

Unclear effects:

- I lost 5 kg of weight but i cant tell for sure that its because of NR or from lifestyle.

- My excercise performance is very good and i rarely feel tired at the gym, but again i am not sure about whether its from NR or something else.

- Maybe my appetite increased a little.

 

- No effects on skin (Firmness,Wrinkles), hair, hearing or vision