Posted 04 August 2015 - 04:52 PM
As for kefir, one study I saw concluded that it actually helps lactose intolerance and improves digestive upset. I can't post the link for some reason; the study is from 2003 and is entitled "Kefir improves lactose digestion and tolerance in adults with lactose maldigestion." Plus, you can buy lactose-free kefir.
http://www.sciencedi...002822303002074
Posted 06 August 2015 - 12:55 PM
What else is there for potassium?
Tubers, greens, beans & nuts make it easy. Some typical serving sizes in my diet:
1 large (300 g) baked potato 1626 mg
1 large (300 g) baked sweet potato 1425 mg
1 cup (177 g) cooked kidney beans 717 mg
1.5 oz (42 g) pistachio nuts 428 mg
1 oz (28 g) wheat bran 335 mg
1.5 oz (42 g) almonds 302 mg
3 tbsp (30 g) flaxseed 251 mg
3 tbsp (21 g) wheat germ, toasted 227 mg
1 cup (30 g) spinach 167 mg
1 cup (16 g) kale 78 mg
Well 3 baked potatoes looks like it will satisfy the FDA RDI. Anything below the kidney beans is pretty weak... you'd have to eat way too much.
Posted 06 August 2015 - 01:02 PM
Well B12 is made by bacteria in the gut, we can manipulate it as far as the methyl groups go, but if you're gut isn't stable, neither will your head be
I know I'm lactose intolerant and even elevated prolactin levels might be causing me some problems from time to time, but I stay away from food coloring and basically just simplified my diet down to a few safe things and take supplements for everything else I need as that seems to be the easiest way to get the right nutrition.
Digestive enzymes are also pretty good. Swanson has an nzymes product with lactase and alot of other stuff that's needed for the various types of lactose intolerance that exist and so far it works wonders for me (I've only used it twice so far, the real test is using it daily for a week or so), otherwise kefir may be of some benefit for the probiotics and nutrition it provides, but it will cause regular digestive upset depending on your intake and other factors.
oh and lactose is made in you as part of digestion, so taking lactose enzymes regularly regardless of dairy intake will help, especially if you're eating food high in galactose (also a pro aging sugar).
Yes, I suspect that I have some gut issues which I need to address.
As for kefir, one study I saw concluded that it actually helps lactose intolerance and improves digestive upset. I can't post the link for some reason; the study is from 2003 and is entitled "Kefir improves lactose digestion and tolerance in adults with lactose maldigestion." Plus, you can buy lactose-free kefir.
As for the calcium and potassium supplements, I don't have much to add based on my brief research. As I said, I find V-8 Low Sodium to be a quick and easy way to supplement potassium, though I know you had some concerns about it. Darryl suggested some good food-sources of potassium, though I find it uniquely difficult to get enough potassium through diet alone because I have so little time to prepare really healthy, whole meals.
French fries? I think the stuff in kefir that helps is bacillus coagulans? Maybe some other probiotics? That helps my lactose digestive upset... Potatoes are a root, so are ginger, garlic and onion, I take some of that daily, wonder how much potassium I'm getting... it makes a big difference for me... also eat potato chips, but they don't say how much potassium they have...
Posted 06 August 2015 - 10:54 PM
Posted 07 August 2015 - 06:07 AM
Homozygous for which alleles? rs1801181? rs4633? rs4680?
Anything starting with an rs will usually have a pair of letters that tell you which version of them you have. Most everyone will have one form or another of the afformentioned genes. Without this info, we don't know which SNP you're saying you have unless we are acutely familiar with those genes, so it's difficult to discuss or learn much from following the conversation.
Posted 07 August 2015 - 08:33 AM
Homozygous for which alleles? rs1801181? rs4633? rs4680?
Anything starting with an rs will usually have a pair of letters that tell you which version of them you have. Most everyone will have one form or another of the afformentioned genes. Without this info, we don't know which SNP you're saying you have unless we are acutely familiar with those genes, so it's difficult to discuss or learn much from following the conversation.
Edited by world33, 07 August 2015 - 08:45 AM.
Posted 07 August 2015 - 10:44 AM
I have the same spread on the last two... MB12 works great for me though, I get a nice stimulant kick and more attention span from it, but I'll have to try HB12 and see if that gives me better. What do you get when you take MB12? Maybe I'm having side effects and not realizing it... Looks like HB12 has a much longer half life too, some adds claim it lasts 5 days, so it might actually be less expensive than the MB12. I'll give it a try, I'm running out of MB12 anyways... Will probably discontinue MSM now that I've lost a bunch of weight too. What does the SAMe inhibits part mean, it inhibits the SNP's activity? Best way to get SAMe if you need it is to preserve it by taking creatine.
Ordering some HB12 sublinguals and patches, will let you know how they compare. Apparently HB12 doesn't work if swallowed... but these two methods look promising and cost effective. Hydroxies are also found on alot of youth peptides and anti aging supplements. Perhaps this will lead to the production of more youth factors?
Posted 07 August 2015 - 11:18 AM
Posted 07 August 2015 - 11:42 AM
Posted 07 August 2015 - 12:29 PM
By the way according to liwello.com:
•COMT V158M - rs4680 HOMOZYGOUS AA
There is a significant association between schizophrenia and homozygous genotypes of this SNP. Patients with schizophrenia showed a higher severity of the psychotic symptoms and a worse response to the neuroleptic treatment. COMT genetic variation seems to be involved in the psychotic symptomatology of the schizophrenia-spectrum disorders and specifically in the narrow schizophrenia phenotype. This polymorphism also has some influence on the severity of psychotic symptoms and on the response to treatment.
Pubmed reference: 17363961
Thanks god I do not have schizophrenia ... :-)
Also avoid head injuries or any kind of brain damage... While this one gives you some fairly large benefits to memory, attention, etc. it also seems to be a greater liability in many instances of injury... So +25% can just as easily become and extra -25% after head injury. It's also the worrier gene and associates strongly with obsessive compulsive disorder/behavior... so you'll probably be worrying about whether or not to wear a helmet now and maybe which brand, model, and materials will will be best for the prevention of head injuries that you're most likely to be at risk for given your behavior and lifestyle 
Posted 07 August 2015 - 12:40 PM
I do HB12 injections in the arm when needed and they do have an immediate effect. I tried a HB12 spray called hydroxaden from Blue Rock Holistics. I do not feel it has the same effect as injections thought and i would not buy it anymore. I am not sure about patches, they are not available in Australia. Did you find any good brand of patches? Adenosylcobalamin has a lower effect than injections. I tried MB12 in an active B complex called B-right by Jarrow Formulas which has 100 mcg methylcobalamin. I did not have any side effects but I could not feel any benefit to be honest. HB12 injections have the best effect for me but of course I do not like the idea to do them on a regular basis.
Not sure about SAMe inhibits. I just know that when I tried Chelated Molybdenum I felt like a wave of relaxation. I tried creatine but it did not do much for me.
I saw benefits from 1mg of MB12 along with a bunch of other stuff in a multi... but 5mg is definitely better and gives me a great wake up boost. I can't say it stays with me through the day... it's apparently gone after ~5 hours. But MB12 definitely works at higher doses for a short period of time, especially when taken sublingually as a powder or as a quick dissolve lozenge. Having something more sustained like the HB12 sounds great to me, even if the doses are smaller. I'll have to look into the HB12 shots, I think the only shots most docs I've met admit to be in existence is cyanocobalamin... I'm not sure if IM HB12 exists in the US, but that should mean it's legal to order from overseas?
MB12 and CB12 are said to have very high bioavailability if taken sublingually, IIRC it approaches IM/IV injections, I'd expect HB12 to be similar?
Posted 07 August 2015 - 04:26 PM
. . .
Thanks for your response! I don't believe I have tried nutrahacker though I may upload my 23andme report and see what they have to say in their free report. I have used other websites like geneticgenie that also purport to identify significant SNP's.
The problem is that I think a lot of the claims made by these websites are borderline pseudo-science, and it's often almost impossible to find any type of study backing up their claims. For example, I am unable to find any study suggesting that the rs1801181 SNP that you reference (for which I'm also homozygous for the "risk" allele btw) has a significant biological effect. Are you aware of any such studies? I suspect that the claim originally came from Amy Yasko, who some say is notorious for misreading studies and overstating the significance of certain SNP's.
It seems that even the significance of SNP's that we know to have a pronounced effect on enzyme function, i.e. the C677T MTHFR mutation, are often overstated and can give rise to faulty information based on myth or at least exaggeration, which is then subject to the echo chamber of the methylation and health blogs and forums. For example, see earlier discussion in this thread with Darryl citing studies on the significance of the MTHFR C677T SNP.
The current scientific concensus regarding the genetic basis of complex health disorders appears to be that in most cases, individual SNP's do no more than create a small increment of risk, and that in fact it is the interaction of hundreds or even thousands of gene variations that gives rise to health problems. Even when studies successfully link individual SNP's to certain disorders, the significance of the association tends to be relatively weak and is often not reproduced in other studies. This appears to be especially true for neurological disorders.
In other words, I am becoming less and less convinced that one can point to a specific SNP in their genetic profile and meaningfully link it to their symptoms. I may eventually swing back in the other direction; who knows. That said, I am open to any all possibilities, and I do think that anecdotal evidence can have value when that's all we have to go on. The fact that you benefitted so much from molybdenum is very interesting. Were the effects consistent? Do you still benefit from it? I have tried it without noticeable effect.
As to the suggestion that those homozygous for the Met version of the COMT SNP you reference may experience bad effects from methyl donors, I have not found this to be the case for me. I'm Met/Met but do just fine with methyl donors (after I got my potassium up--see earlier posts). Most anecdotal accounts I have read seem to refute the association (it's another Yasko claim isn't it?). But hey, who knows?
I do take NAC and find it indispensable for boosting cognitive clarity. I find that I get a similar though perhaps less pronounced effect from other anti-inflammatory supplements like quercetin, grape seed extra, and curcumin. I am beginning to suspect that a lot of my issues, aside from some borderline vitamin deficiencies discussed earlier in this thread, relate to inflammation. I have a number of signs of inflammation (extensive allergies, digestive issues, etc.), and inflammation is increasingly being implicated in neurological disorders like ADHD (that'd be me), depression, schizophrenia, autism, etc. The effects of inflammation can't be underestimated, and can alter the function of many enzymes and processes throughout the body. If you benefit from NAC, you might try adding some other anti-inflammatory supplements and see if you get any added benefit.
I would like to try adenosylcobalamin. I wonder if I would benefit from it as I seem to benefit so markedly from both cyano and methylcobalamin.
Again, thanks for your response. I have found information exchanged on this and other forums to be indispensable.
Edited by Kingsley, 07 August 2015 - 04:43 PM.
Posted 08 August 2015 - 05:33 AM
I do HB12 injections in the arm when needed and they do have an immediate effect. I tried a HB12 spray called hydroxaden from Blue Rock Holistics. I do not feel it has the same effect as injections thought and i would not buy it anymore. I am not sure about patches, they are not available in Australia. Did you find any good brand of patches? Adenosylcobalamin has a lower effect than injections. I tried MB12 in an active B complex called B-right by Jarrow Formulas which has 100 mcg methylcobalamin. I did not have any side effects but I could not feel any benefit to be honest. HB12 injections have the best effect for me but of course I do not like the idea to do them on a regular basis.
Not sure about SAMe inhibits. I just know that when I tried Chelated Molybdenum I felt like a wave of relaxation. I tried creatine but it did not do much for me.
I saw benefits from 1mg of MB12 along with a bunch of other stuff in a multi... but 5mg is definitely better and gives me a great wake up boost. I can't say it stays with me through the day... it's apparently gone after ~5 hours. But MB12 definitely works at higher doses for a short period of time, especially when taken sublingually as a powder or as a quick dissolve lozenge. Having something more sustained like the HB12 sounds great to me, even if the doses are smaller. I'll have to look into the HB12 shots, I think the only shots most docs I've met admit to be in existence is cyanocobalamin... I'm not sure if IM HB12 exists in the US, but that should mean it's legal to order from overseas?
MB12 and CB12 are said to have very high bioavailability if taken sublingually, IIRC it approaches IM/IV injections, I'd expect HB12 to be similar?
Posted 08 August 2015 - 06:42 AM
. . .
Thanks for your response! I don't believe I have tried nutrahacker though I may upload my 23andme report and see what they have to say in their free report. I have used other websites like geneticgenie that also purport to identify significant SNP's.
The problem is that I think a lot of the claims made by these websites are borderline pseudo-science, and it's often almost impossible to find any type of study backing up their claims. For example, I am unable to find any study suggesting that the rs1801181 SNP that you reference (for which I'm also homozygous for the "risk" allele btw) has a significant biological effect. Are you aware of any such studies? I suspect that the claim originally came from Amy Yasko, who some say is notorious for misreading studies and overstating the significance of certain SNP's.
It seems that even the significance of SNP's that we know to have a pronounced effect on enzyme function, i.e. the C677T MTHFR mutation, are often overstated and can give rise to faulty information based on myth or at least exaggeration, which is then subject to the echo chamber of the methylation and health blogs and forums. For example, see earlier discussion in this thread with Darryl citing studies on the significance of the MTHFR C677T SNP.
The current scientific concensus regarding the genetic basis of complex health disorders appears to be that in most cases, individual SNP's do no more than create a small increment of risk, and that in fact it is the interaction of hundreds or even thousands of gene variations that gives rise to health problems. Even when studies successfully link individual SNP's to certain disorders, the significance of the association tends to be relatively weak and is often not reproduced in other studies. This appears to be especially true for neurological disorders.
In other words, I am becoming less and less convinced that one can point to a specific SNP in their genetic profile and meaningfully link it to their symptoms. I may eventually swing back in the other direction; who knows. That said, I am open to any all possibilities, and I do think that anecdotal evidence can have value when that's all we have to go on. The fact that you benefitted so much from molybdenum is very interesting. Were the effects consistent? Do you still benefit from it? I have tried it without noticeable effect.
As to the suggestion that those homozygous for the Met version of the COMT SNP you reference may experience bad effects from methyl donors, I have not found this to be the case for me. I'm Met/Met but do just fine with methyl donors (after I got my potassium up--see earlier posts). Most anecdotal accounts I have read seem to refute the association (it's another Yasko claim isn't it?). But hey, who knows?
I do take NAC and find it indispensable for boosting cognitive clarity. I find that I get a similar though perhaps less pronounced effect from other anti-inflammatory supplements like quercetin, grape seed extra, and curcumin. I am beginning to suspect that a lot of my issues, aside from some borderline vitamin deficiencies discussed earlier in this thread, relate to inflammation. I have a number of signs of inflammation (extensive allergies, digestive issues, etc.), and inflammation is increasingly being implicated in neurological disorders like ADHD (that'd be me), depression, schizophrenia, autism, etc. The effects of inflammation can't be underestimated, and can alter the function of many enzymes and processes throughout the body. If you benefit from NAC, you might try adding some other anti-inflammatory supplements and see if you get any added benefit.
I would like to try adenosylcobalamin. I wonder if I would benefit from it as I seem to benefit so markedly from both cyano and methylcobalamin.
Again, thanks for your response. I have found information exchanged on this and other forums to be indispensable.
Edited by world33, 08 August 2015 - 06:46 AM.
Posted 08 August 2015 - 06:03 PM
I do HB12 injections in the arm when needed and they do have an immediate effect. I tried a HB12 spray called hydroxaden from Blue Rock Holistics. I do not feel it has the same effect as injections thought and i would not buy it anymore. I am not sure about patches, they are not available in Australia. Did you find any good brand of patches? Adenosylcobalamin has a lower effect than injections. I tried MB12 in an active B complex called B-right by Jarrow Formulas which has 100 mcg methylcobalamin. I did not have any side effects but I could not feel any benefit to be honest. HB12 injections have the best effect for me but of course I do not like the idea to do them on a regular basis.
Not sure about SAMe inhibits. I just know that when I tried Chelated Molybdenum I felt like a wave of relaxation. I tried creatine but it did not do much for me.
I saw benefits from 1mg of MB12 along with a bunch of other stuff in a multi... but 5mg is definitely better and gives me a great wake up boost. I can't say it stays with me through the day... it's apparently gone after ~5 hours. But MB12 definitely works at higher doses for a short period of time, especially when taken sublingually as a powder or as a quick dissolve lozenge. Having something more sustained like the HB12 sounds great to me, even if the doses are smaller. I'll have to look into the HB12 shots, I think the only shots most docs I've met admit to be in existence is cyanocobalamin... I'm not sure if IM HB12 exists in the US, but that should mean it's legal to order from overseas?
MB12 and CB12 are said to have very high bioavailability if taken sublingually, IIRC it approaches IM/IV injections, I'd expect HB12 to be similar?
I would be surprised HB12 injections do not exist in the US. These are the ones I buy here in Australia and they cost 12 AUD for 3 (1000mcg/mL) Amps: http://www.chemistwa...ct.asp?id=51326
I guess when you try the HB12 injections you can compare the effectiveness of all other types of vitamin b12 forms and administrations.
I might try 5mg MB12 as you did and see if it is comparable.
What brand do you buy?
I've bought lozenges from everyone... vitacost, wonderlabs, others? My favorite is the kirkman powder though. It tastes great and is easily dissolved as well as being tested for 950 contaminants... MB12 was shown to increase proliferation of one form or another of neuro stem cell. I imagine HB12 would do better with less though.
Do you order the ampules yourself? If they are that easy to order, I might have to get some
Posted 09 August 2015 - 10:59 AM
Hmmm... looks like HB12 is available here... I can even order it online and a doc will write me a script for it... I like the giant bottles better though, much less expensive if they're available and it looks like it can be done IM, so it might even be more long lasting than 5 days. I'm seeing 3 month dosing schedules for it... Can it actually last that long?
Posted 10 August 2015 - 12:15 AM
Hmmm... looks like HB12 is available here... I can even order it online and a doc will write me a script for it... I like the giant bottles better though, much less expensive if they're available and it looks like it can be done IM, so it might even be more long lasting than 5 days. I'm seeing 3 month dosing schedules for it... Can it actually last that long?
Not really sure.
Posted 10 August 2015 - 10:12 AM
The HB12 sublinguals arrived Saturday night. I haven't noticed anything different yet... I took both the MB12, the HB12 and some other CB12 with other B Vits. I'll try just the HB12 tomorrow? Though I guess I wouldn't need to do anything but not take the other B12s as it'll last at least 5 days?
Posted 10 August 2015 - 01:40 PM
I agree 100% on what you say Kingsley. I am skeptical and rational by nature and my BS detection antennas start buzzing whenever I read Naturopathic Medicine, Holistic, Homeopathic and so on. Moreover both Yasko and Ben Lynch are selling lots of supplements to address mthfr and other genetic related conditions including autism. Yasko for example sells RNA supplements for 85$ for several conditions when according to several sources RNA is so unstable that selling it as a supplement it does not make sense at all (i.e. source:http://scienceblogs....1/autism-rna/).
On the other hand since I discovered I am C677T homozygous and I have started taking methylfolate I noticed a considerable improvement in my mental health which is not just placebo effect. I took so many supplements for my severe morning anxiety, brain fog, lack of memory and concentration and most of them did nothing for me. It is possible that for some people with the same MTHFR C677T mutation that does not cause any issue at all but for me it does indeed. In my case I do not think that the MTHFR C677T mutation is overstated or just a hype. My grandmother died at an early age (below 50) for a stroke; it could be just a coincidence but the C677T mutation is indeed related to higher risk of stroke and cardiovascular diseases. Indeed the concurrent effect of different genes, as you pointed out, may also have an impact on the severity of the symptoms.
What is the maximum daily dosage of methylfolate you have tried by the way?
To be honest with you I did not have much time to investigate on the rs1801181-related scientific literature but all I can say is that when I tried Molybdenum as suggested by nutrahacker I had an amazing feeling after only half an hour where Ornithine did not much for me. TMG also had a marginal benefit. I must have had a problem in converting sulfites into sulfates (sulphite oxidase process) and/or a Molybdenum deficiency. Have you tried Molybdenum or TMG? The Molybdenum effect are stronger at the beginning, then I think the brain goes back to "normal" and unless you stop for a week or more you do not experience the same initial effect. That was my case anyway. Similar effect with methylfolate. At the beginning when I took it the first time I realised how bad I was feeling before. Then when you are back to normal you do not feel the same effect unless you stop for a while taking it.
I also suspected inflammation for my severe morning anxiety and related mental issues (brain fog etc.). I noticed that I had episodes of morning anxiety the day after eating pizza, bread or pasta, all wheat products. I am still not sure whether I am sensitive to gluten or some wheat proteins. I am not celiac. Since I stopped eating wheat products I feel much better and I do not have morning anxiety anymore. If I do eat wheat products on an occasional basis I try to get some curcumin to prevent any inflammation. Methylfolate and Molybdenum, however, have taken me to another level as I used to feel in my 30s.
I actually didn't mean to imply that there are no SNP's that have a pronounced effect, only that many are overstated, especially by the methylation folks. I do believe that MTHFR C677T is the real deal; I just meant that myths seem to grow up around even the legitimately significant SNP's. I too am homozygous for C677T and methylfolate has been a game changer for me as well. And when I go without it, I feel it.
I haven't gone very high with my max daily dose with methylfolate. I don't seem to benefit beyond about 1600 mg per day. I understand that there are claims that mega-dosing methylfolate has some benefit beyond simply correcting deficiency and treating the MTHFR mutation. Supposedly, mega-doses of methylfolate are supposed to cause the MTHFR enzyme to work in reverse and produce more BH4, which is a co-factor in monoamine synthesis (or something like that--I am not completely clear on it). I understand that this is why deplin is such ridiculously high dose. Not sure if there's anything to this theory or not.
I have tried both molybdenum and TMG. I didn't notice an effect from molybdenum, though I do get an added boost from TMG. I take it occasionally. Very interesting how much you benefit from molybdenum. Maybe I will take it consistently for a while and see if I have any added benefit. I do seem to be prone to mineral deficiencies.
I do think inflammation is key, and I think that in time it will come to be known as one of the primary causes of brain fog, if it's not already. I am still experimenting with the right mix of anti-inflammatory supplements, but I am loving NAC, grape seed extract, and quercetin so far. I do need to work on getting my diet in order, though.
Posted 10 August 2015 - 11:41 PM
The HB12 sublinguals arrived Saturday night. I haven't noticed anything different yet... I took both the MB12, the HB12 and some other CB12 with other B Vits. I'll try just the HB12 tomorrow? Though I guess I wouldn't need to do anything but not take the other B12s as it'll last at least 5 days?
Sublinguals? HB12 is very unstable so I am not sure they work. I thought you bought injections.
Posted 10 August 2015 - 11:51 PM
I agree 100% on what you say Kingsley. I am skeptical and rational by nature and my BS detection antennas start buzzing whenever I read Naturopathic Medicine, Holistic, Homeopathic and so on. Moreover both Yasko and Ben Lynch are selling lots of supplements to address mthfr and other genetic related conditions including autism. Yasko for example sells RNA supplements for 85$ for several conditions when according to several sources RNA is so unstable that selling it as a supplement it does not make sense at all (i.e. source:http://scienceblogs....1/autism-rna/).
On the other hand since I discovered I am C677T homozygous and I have started taking methylfolate I noticed a considerable improvement in my mental health which is not just placebo effect. I took so many supplements for my severe morning anxiety, brain fog, lack of memory and concentration and most of them did nothing for me. It is possible that for some people with the same MTHFR C677T mutation that does not cause any issue at all but for me it does indeed. In my case I do not think that the MTHFR C677T mutation is overstated or just a hype. My grandmother died at an early age (below 50) for a stroke; it could be just a coincidence but the C677T mutation is indeed related to higher risk of stroke and cardiovascular diseases. Indeed the concurrent effect of different genes, as you pointed out, may also have an impact on the severity of the symptoms.
What is the maximum daily dosage of methylfolate you have tried by the way?
To be honest with you I did not have much time to investigate on the rs1801181-related scientific literature but all I can say is that when I tried Molybdenum as suggested by nutrahacker I had an amazing feeling after only half an hour where Ornithine did not much for me. TMG also had a marginal benefit. I must have had a problem in converting sulfites into sulfates (sulphite oxidase process) and/or a Molybdenum deficiency. Have you tried Molybdenum or TMG? The Molybdenum effect are stronger at the beginning, then I think the brain goes back to "normal" and unless you stop for a week or more you do not experience the same initial effect. That was my case anyway. Similar effect with methylfolate. At the beginning when I took it the first time I realised how bad I was feeling before. Then when you are back to normal you do not feel the same effect unless you stop for a while taking it.
I also suspected inflammation for my severe morning anxiety and related mental issues (brain fog etc.). I noticed that I had episodes of morning anxiety the day after eating pizza, bread or pasta, all wheat products. I am still not sure whether I am sensitive to gluten or some wheat proteins. I am not celiac. Since I stopped eating wheat products I feel much better and I do not have morning anxiety anymore. If I do eat wheat products on an occasional basis I try to get some curcumin to prevent any inflammation. Methylfolate and Molybdenum, however, have taken me to another level as I used to feel in my 30s.
I actually didn't mean to imply that there are no SNP's that have a pronounced effect, only that many are overstated, especially by the methylation folks. I do believe that MTHFR C677T is the real deal; I just meant that myths seem to grow up around even the legitimately significant SNP's. I too am homozygous for C677T and methylfolate has been a game changer for me as well. And when I go without it, I feel it.
I haven't gone very high with my max daily dose with methylfolate. I don't seem to benefit beyond about 1600 mg per day. I understand that there are claims that mega-dosing methylfolate has some benefit beyond simply correcting deficiency and treating the MTHFR mutation. Supposedly, mega-doses of methylfolate are supposed to cause the MTHFR enzyme to work in reverse and produce more BH4, which is a co-factor in monoamine synthesis (or something like that--I am not completely clear on it). I understand that this is why deplin is such ridiculously high dose. Not sure if there's anything to this theory or not.
I have tried both molybdenum and TMG. I didn't notice an effect from molybdenum, though I do get an added boost from TMG. I take it occasionally. Very interesting how much you benefit from molybdenum. Maybe I will take it consistently for a while and see if I have any added benefit. I do seem to be prone to mineral deficiencies.
I do think inflammation is key, and I think that in time it will come to be known as one of the primary causes of brain fog, if it's not already. I am still experimenting with the right mix of anti-inflammatory supplements, but I am loving NAC, grape seed extract, and quercetin so far. I do need to work on getting my diet in order, though.
Posted 11 August 2015 - 10:02 AM
Posted 11 August 2015 - 02:24 PM
BTW Kingsley if you want to have a look at the genes that, according to current genetic studies, have been associated to ADHD you can check this page:
http://www.malacards...r#related_genes
Thanks! I have previously reviewed a number of studies and meta-analyses and dug into my 23andme genetic profile concerning many of the genes that have been associated with ADHD, including some of the ones in the link you provided. I have a number of the risk SNP's, while others I do not have or are not tested by 23andme. I question how significant these SNP's truly are, as many studies fail to replicate the associations, and even when they do, the statistical significance is pretty weak. Recent meta-analyses verify this and show that even the biggies, like DRD4, only show a very modest association.
One author speculated that this could be due to the heterogeneous nature of ADHD: failing to adequately distinguish between sub-types in the test samples could cause dilution of the effects of particular SNP's. This makes a lot of sense to me, as there are many "ADHD" people whose symptoms I simply cannot relate to, i.e. hyperactivity, impulsivity, etc. (I'm primarily inattentive sub-type or "sluggish cognitive tempo"). Presumably we'd have different genetic risk factors and lumping us together could be counterproductive. It could be that we haven't discovered the major offending variations yet, or that the disorder simply can't be profitably analyzed on the basis of individual SNP's.
Notably, at least one study I read linked genes associated with inflammation to ADHD, and I suspect that this is an under-studied area. The recent trend in the literature characterizing neurological diseases as inflammatory in nature resonates deeply with me, as I have signs of inflammation and my cognition benefits dramatically from anti-inflammatory supplements. Interestingly, my only friend to carry an ADHD diagnosis, and legitimately so, also has IBS, an inflammatory condition.
Not only can inflammatory conditions lead to neuro-inflammation and less efficient cognition, but inflammation of the digestive tract can lead to poor absorption of nutrients and lead to borderline deficiencies, further compounding things. Then add the MTHFR mutation on top of this and boom, you've got a situation on your hands. The really wonderful thing is how easily and cheaply these issues can be treated once they reveal themselves. The challenge is that most doctors and psychiatrists are of almost no help, and so much depends on individual research and experimentation. Enter the internet, online medical databases, and forums like this one. Open information really is a powerful, and empowering, thing.
Posted 11 August 2015 - 02:46 PM
I am glad it works for you. 1600 mcg would not do much for me. Today I tried 30 mg and I feel so clear minded and concentrated. I hope it lasts and I do not get dry eyes.
This company sell mthfr supplements at better prices than prescription meds like Deplin if you are interested in trying high dosages. http://www.methylpro.com/
As I stated before I use an Alibaba supplier to cut costs and it works fine with me.
Did you try molybdenum after using TMG? I think, but it is just a guess, they might both help with suphites so if you try one first the other would have not a noticebale effect when you try it the first time.
By the way do you have any of the following:
- sensitivity to shampoos with SLS
- tonsil stones
- yellow stains in white clothes under the arms
I am wondering if they could be related to the high level of sulphites in my metabolism.
Wow, 30 mg! That is a mammoth dose. I actually find methylfolate a bit dulling at higher doses, though this is probably not the norm.
Not sure on the sulfite issue. I have never noticed any problem with sulfite-containing foods, or the issues you mention here. Does your sweat smell like ammonia or cat pee? I have read that this can be a sign of high ammonia and that it can cause brain fog, though I'm not sure of the validity of these claims, or how it ties into the sulfite issue, though I understand that ammonia and sulfites are both products of the transsulfuration pathway. Sorry I can't be more helpful.
Posted 12 August 2015 - 12:36 AM
Posted 12 August 2015 - 01:22 AM
No it does not smell like ammonia but I notice that when I eat meat or lots of protein it gets worse. So It may be related to ammonia. I have just received some Yucca root powder and it has similar effects as TMG. The problem is that to really appraise the benefit of a supplement I should stop all of them for a few days and take just that one. I tried to stop all my supplements to test my level of homoceysteine and I got back to square one with morning anxiety so I restarted them all. I do not want to risk it. I feel pretty clear minded these days. Methylfolate daily dosage can go up to 50mg in some cases of severe depression. I guess everyone has a different sweet point. I think I will try 15mg daily on the long run as the Deplin highest dosage. I might try grape seed extract and quercetin one day.
If depression is an issue, I have read a lot of anecdotal accounts, including on this forum, of people benefiting from anti-inflammatory supplements. You can't miss em if you search for em, and there is a lot of discussion of the merits of different supplements. Really couldn't hurt if you haven't tried already.
Posted 12 August 2015 - 10:52 AM
The HB12 sublinguals arrived Saturday night. I haven't noticed anything different yet... I took both the MB12, the HB12 and some other CB12 with other B Vits. I'll try just the HB12 tomorrow? Though I guess I wouldn't need to do anything but not take the other B12s as it'll last at least 5 days?
Sublinguals? HB12 is very unstable so I am not sure they work. I thought you bought injections.
Well if it stays in one piece until I put it under my tongue, their are some fairly large veins there with very thin skin that will suck it right up. MB12 works that way as do a bunch of other sublingual supps. Sublingual is a great way to bypass the GI tract without sticking yourself with a needle for many things. I will try to get injections from my doc next time I see her though and see if they are any better.
Posted 12 August 2015 - 11:47 AM
BTW Kingsley if you want to have a look at the genes that, according to current genetic studies, have been associated to ADHD you can check this page:
http://www.malacards...r#related_genes
Thanks! I have previously reviewed a number of studies and meta-analyses and dug into my 23andme genetic profile concerning many of the genes that have been associated with ADHD, including some of the ones in the link you provided. I have a number of the risk SNP's, while others I do not have or are not tested by 23andme. I question how significant these SNP's truly are, as many studies fail to replicate the associations, and even when they do, the statistical significance is pretty weak. Recent meta-analyses verify this and show that even the biggies, like DRD4, only show a very modest association.
One author speculated that this could be due to the heterogeneous nature of ADHD: failing to adequately distinguish between sub-types in the test samples could cause dilution of the effects of particular SNP's. This makes a lot of sense to me, as there are many "ADHD" people whose symptoms I simply cannot relate to, i.e. hyperactivity, impulsivity, etc. (I'm primarily inattentive sub-type or "sluggish cognitive tempo"). Presumably we'd have different genetic risk factors and lumping us together could be counterproductive. It could be that we haven't discovered the major offending variations yet, or that the disorder simply can't be profitably analyzed on the basis of individual SNP's.
Notably, at least one study I read linked genes associated with inflammation to ADHD, and I suspect that this is an under-studied area. The recent trend in the literature characterizing neurological diseases as inflammatory in nature resonates deeply with me, as I have signs of inflammation and my cognition benefits dramatically from anti-inflammatory supplements. Interestingly, my only friend to carry an ADHD diagnosis, and legitimately so, also has IBS, an inflammatory condition.
Not only can inflammatory conditions lead to neuro-inflammation and less efficient cognition, but inflammation of the digestive tract can lead to poor absorption of nutrients and lead to borderline deficiencies, further compounding things. Then add the MTHFR mutation on top of this and boom, you've got a situation on your hands. The really wonderful thing is how easily and cheaply these issues can be treated once they reveal themselves. The challenge is that most doctors and psychiatrists are of almost no help, and so much depends on individual research and experimentation. Enter the internet, online medical databases, and forums like this one. Open information really is a powerful, and empowering, thing.
DRD4 C allele is the novelty seeking SNP? I have that one, I loved novelty and I loved learning... some novelties I just never found and I abandoned novelty for a while, but I've come to realize life's better when you don't hold back from using it (in fact it's probably my best way of being personable and friendly with people) and you learn more, and stay more well adapted as long as your world is friendly and you're comfortable with people. I think it's all about how you feel about it and what you do with it. It's ADHD if you're materialistic and novelties are out of reach, but if you use it to find novelty in others and information, it becomes very rewarding. So it's all about learning to use it right and with the right perspective. If I find novelty, I'll pay attention and suck it up like sponge. But if there's no "novelty," usefulness, or some other interest, I'll have more fun being curious about something else. I'd be passing it on to my daughters, so if I imagined raising them, it would be about sharing in the novelty rather than sharing things otherwise things become novel and it makes one selfish and greedy. It's about keeping things interesting and useful in some way. I imagine that learning progressively more beneficial or useful information would keep me zoned in.
One thing I've realized combing through my genome is that everything is useful and has a purpose. In fact, that in itself makes me novel, and everyone else potentially novel In addition to that, it has a role in my social interactions and acquisition of experiences and thoughts that follow. I've on many occasions found myself learning things that have made me a better person. It's crucial that we use it. Esp. if you happen to carry the introvert variant of the OXTR SNP and the Worrier allele (another potential introvert SNP). If I keep myself from seeking novelty, I'm just not very social, if at all. DRD4 C allele is beneficial, contributes to the acquisition of knowledge and is an advantage in dealing with others. If something or someone catches your eye, tell them, start a conversation, give a compliment, find a friend and don't be shy. It may be how you evolved to be social and using right has notably increased my empathy/social intelligence and lead me understand the social conventions of those with the extrovert/high empathy OXTR allele, in fact, these are novel and useful things to me.
I think the real information that arises from the statistics of genetics is a question that reads something like "how aught I to live happily to best serve myself and humanity given my genetic predisposition and what role do my genetics play in having a fulfilling and productive life?" I'm not military, but studying genetics has made the US Army's "Be all you can be" slogan feel like genius in simplicity. Speaking of novelty, now that we know the Army has it right, they need a symbol that looks as cool and novel as the one the Air Force has (saying stuff like that or thinking down on something because it lacks apparent novelty) would be an example of improper or unproductive use of the novelty gene). Just live it right, it's how we've survived and prospered. Live it wrong and you're into an unknown.
Now on the topic of inflammation and diet, these are legitimate diseases and tie in heavily to aging, which is why I say we all need to be agelessly young and in a state of sustainable health to remain happy. There is simply no sustainable aging without pathology and disease.
Edited by YOLF, 12 August 2015 - 11:53 AM.
Posted 12 August 2015 - 11:57 AM
I am glad it works for you. 1600 mcg would not do much for me. Today I tried 30 mg and I feel so clear minded and concentrated. I hope it lasts and I do not get dry eyes.
This company sell mthfr supplements at better prices than prescription meds like Deplin if you are interested in trying high dosages. http://www.methylpro.com/
As I stated before I use an Alibaba supplier to cut costs and it works fine with me.
Did you try molybdenum after using TMG? I think, but it is just a guess, they might both help with suphites so if you try one first the other would have not a noticebale effect when you try it the first time.
By the way do you have any of the following:
- sensitivity to shampoos with SLS
- tonsil stones
- yellow stains in white clothes under the arms
I am wondering if they could be related to the high level of sulphites in my metabolism.
Wow, 30 mg! That is a mammoth dose. I actually find methylfolate a bit dulling at higher doses, though this is probably not the norm.
Not sure on the sulfite issue. I have never noticed any problem with sulfite-containing foods, or the issues you mention here. Does your sweat smell like ammonia or cat pee? I have read that this can be a sign of high ammonia and that it can cause brain fog, though I'm not sure of the validity of these claims, or how it ties into the sulfite issue, though I understand that ammonia and sulfites are both products of the transsulfuration pathway. Sorry I can't be more helpful.
Ammonia might point to a kidney problem. Perhaps that could be solved with some Klotho boosting supplements or curcumin? Maybe Ornithine? Agmatine? Maybe Hyaluronic Acid? I think more of that might be the end result of boosting klotho anyways.
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