161 replies to this topic

[eon]

I'm doing house cleaning. I bought several bulk powders thinking it would do me good. One example is Arginine. It's cheap though. I bought 1kg of it thinking I would use the whole thing but came to find out later that this can be problematic to people "predisposed" to schizophrenia, which I am not but the disorder has run in the family. I did feel unusual when on Arginine. So I dumped nearly 1kg of it. Another powder that I am trying out and find very effective is TMG (Trimethylglycine or Betaine Anhydrous). It's cheap and I like it so far. It gives me great workout in the gym. I bought less amount this time just to try it out first (100g). It's cheap and effective. It is said to fix certain amino acid abnormalities in the body. I hope it fixes the unusual-ness I felt when I was on Arginine.

 

Another supplement I am considering of dumping is creatine monohydrate. Not sure I'd even need creatine anymore. We shall see. I'm close to dumping half a kilogram of creatine if I fall in love with TMG. I'm not sure I should even mix any of these aminos at the same time. I'd like to have a go-to supplement which is why i bought several of these and see which ones work. Another workout supplement I liked was D-Ribose. It works well on pumps in the gym as well as lessening soreness after workouts even killing body aches. I dumped my D-Aspartic Acid powders as well. It was said to be neurotoxic. Oh well these are cheap powders anyway. 

 

Is TMG a good workout supplement as well as for general wellness? I don't want to be mixing several compounds anymore.

[nowayout]

Haha, the whole bottom shelf of my fridge is full of bottles that I stopped using either because of lack of effect or because of side effects:

 

Not counting a bunch of bottles that I threw out already, there is DHEA, nettle root, citicoline, choline, GPLC, magnesium, B6, rhodiola, ashwaghanda, ALCAR, taurine, DIM, 5-HTP, MK-7, low dose aspirin, LDN.  And that's not even counting the whole bag of probably about ten different useless antidepressants in my closet.   

 

 

Edited by nowayout, 09 May 2014 - 03:47 PM.

[Duchykins]

I just threw out some stuff yesterday and upon reading this thread I went to go my cabinet

Alright, so yesterday I threw out nearly full bottles of GABA Calm, primrose oil, krill oil. A while back I threw out pyridoxine (replaced it which P5P which was much better), folic acid, multivitamin with 2mg copper, biotin, DHEA, milk thistle complex (probably the licorice root is what bothered me), some calc/mag/zinc complex that contained zinc oxide (replaced it with gluconate) I gave my bottle of arginine (migraine) to a bodybuilder guy I know, lecithin capsules in favor of lecithin granules, threw out an ALCAR/ALA complex so I could take them separately

Hanging around in the cabinet are almost never used are nearly 100 grams of phenylethylamine and trimethylglycine each, a bunch of whey isolate, panax ginseng, green tea, rarely used NAC and nicotinic acid, 5-htp, glutathione reduced (glad I only got 10g of that to try), SAMe, rhiodola's been sitting there for a couple of weeks, d-phenylalanine.

Micronized creatine is definitely a keeper for me


Dude give me your citicoline, ashwagandha and taurine! lol


TMG is okay. I don't take it regularly because it sometimes messes with my bowels but that is because I have an unpredictable methylation issue, not because there is something wrong with TMG. I'm still working it out. There is nothing wrong with taking TMG and creatine at the same time as long as you are not taking those larger doses of each (for example 1g of creatine, 500mg TMG is just fine)

Edited by Duchykins, 09 May 2014 - 04:13 PM.

[thedarkbobo]

Hmm partially wasted, either no effect or can't feel effect or not what I needed: rhiodola, sunifiram(unifiram works better for me), probiotics, lecithin.

[zorba990]

Mercola liposomal vitamin C that turned out to be NOT liposomal.

http://www.vitamincf...malVitaminC.pdf

 

 

 

 

[Duchykins]

Mercola liposomal vitamin C that turned out to be NOT liposomal.
http://www.vitamincf...malVitaminC.pdf
 
 
 
 

I didn't know this before, but coming from Mercola, I'm not surprised. Spouting bad logic about scary soy is a universal red flag of quackery, irresponsible "research" and arguments reeking of confirmation bias. questionable agenda and taking advantage of and inflaming dietary fads. Also, some of his supplements for children are dangerous, I didn't learn this until I was on the verge of buying a Mercola muti for my daughter, then at the last minute double checked a few things on its copper content among other things, and breathed a sigh of relief at dodging a bullet.

[eon]

I think the problem here is we all bought too much of a lot of things thinking we could use all of it all at once. This was my case anyway. It turns out less is more. I think a lot of the stuff you guys had probably works but you didn't take it long enough or ended up wanting to try another compound so you forgot what you're really trying to achieve or gain out of all this. This was my case as well. There was a time when I was new I was only taking phosphatidylserine as my nootropic. I don't know how I ended up with a dozen nootropics that won't be effective or could be side effect heavy when stacked with other compounds all at the same time.

 

I'd like to get back to basics: aniracetam and alpha GPC for my nootropics. TMG for my workout supplement. 

 

By the way TMG's primary benefit is the reduction of homocysteine levels within the body. Curious how it ended up in the body? This is off topic but if someone could explain or send me a link about it that would be great.

[Duchykins]

I said nothing about any lack of effectiveness of any of the stuff I don't use anymore. I'll tell you why




GABA Calm: contains n-acetyl-tyrosine. Tyramine is made from tyrosine. Migraine trigger

Primrose oil: contains phenylalanine. Eventually increses tyramine. Migraine trigger. Also increased inflammation

Krill oil: contains astaxanthin. Alters hormones and lowers blood pressure, my average b/p is 90/50. Two migraine triggers.

Folic acid: not awesome for people undermethylating with high histamine. Exacerbates symptoms.

Biotin: simply unnescessary for me

DHEA: hormones, migraines

Arginine: major vasodilator. Migraine trigger.

ALCAR/ALA complex: poor way to take them, one should be on empty stomach, the other with food. Doses unacceptable anyway. I still take daily but separately so they work better for me without hurting my stomach

Phenylethylamine: migraine trigger if used regularly. Shouldn't be used regularly anyway due to addition/abuse potential and it being a stimulant. Rocking good time when used wisely

Trimethylglycine: good stuff when methylation is balanced

Whey isolate: beaucoup aspartic acid, some phenylalanine. Migraine triggers if used regularly.

Ginseng: contains tyramine. Migraine trigger.

Green Tea: unnecessary since I started using Emerald Balance

NAC: good stuff but if used regularly histamine goes through the roof (via glutathione). Otherwise I would go back to taking it daily

SAMe: same as TMG. Otherwise is okay so I hang onto it.

Rhodiola: mild SNRI. Inconsistent. One day anxiety, another day migraine, another day awesomeness. It turned out my problem is low dopamine and low GABA, with highish norepinephrine, maybe serotonin too. Serotogenics have a tendency to trigger migraines. I gave it a try anyway and now I keep it around because my husband likes it

D-phenylalanine: most recent failure to replace Wellbutrin with. Migraines, too much became tyramine. Other than that it was very effective at replacing Wellbutrin and is an alternative to anticholinergic DNRI

Edited by Duchykins, 10 May 2014 - 06:00 AM.

[eon]

does PEA really have addiction/abuse potential? I've never tried it yet although I have it. Isn't it a form of amphetamine?

[Duchykins]

does PEA really have addiction/abuse potential? I've never tried it yet although I have it. Isn't it a form of amphetamine?

It's very close to one, like phenibut almost being a benzo. I've used it with pure cacao a couple of times, at low doses, which was very nice for about an hour... took it with rhodiola once (never again lol). I personally have little use for stimulants, I was primarily interested in what it might do for my need for dopamine help.

You should do a bit more reading about people's stories falling in hard with PEA, just so that you can find your own way to use it without it using you.

[eon]

ok good advice. I thought phenibut was for relaxation and was told to take it before sleep. what happened with phenibut with rhodiola?

[fntms]

L-theanine, had just ordered a new bag of powder after finding out it makes me dumb after a few weeks of taking it... :-/
Good dopamine like effects though at first, excellent with coffee...

[normalizing]

keep in mind guys, it depends on extraction methods and the quality and reputation of various companies selling you the stuff. basically you might have to buy the same one single ingredient from at least 10 different companies to test it and confirm efficiancy. do you have money and time? may God help you!

[Duchykins]

ok good advice. I thought phenibut was for relaxation and was told to take it before sleep. what happened with phenibut with rhodiola?

I've never tried phenibut... too scared of it

[eon]

I have tried theanine. I liked it. It's meant to be taken with caffeine I think. I take it with teas.

 

 

L-theanine, had just ordered a new bag of powder after finding out it makes me dumb after a few weeks of taking it... :-/
Good dopamine like effects though at first, excellent with coffee...

 

why is that? Never heard anything negative about phenibut.

 

 

 

ok good advice. I thought phenibut was for relaxation and was told to take it before sleep. what happened with phenibut with rhodiola?

I've never tried phenibut... too scared of it

 

 

[TheFountain]

I am not sure if we can consider it a waste to go through a process of elimination for that which works for us vs what does not.

 

But off the top of my head I can think of DNA pills (lol?). 

 

Alpha Lipoic acid. I am sure this does someone some good but I don't necessarily think I needed it for anything.

 

Rhodiolia extract I guess. I don't even remember what this was suppose to be for. Anxiety I think?

 

L-Arginine? I can't say. Could be this one was meant to be taken in conjunction with something else.

 

Kelp too I suppose. But cannot say for certain. Other forms of iodine are better for sure.

 

GTF Chromium. Wtf was I taking this for again? *scratches head*

 

L-Ornithine. Who knows, I might return to this one some day as it's suppose to be a precursor to L-proline or something.

 

 Ex-Stress. Which is just a bunch of shit for stress supposedly. I guess it worked but i've found better things since then I think, like HOly Basil extract. 

 

Manganese-Is this necessary on a balanced diet???

 

Rosemary extract. WTF?

 

So, it's a process of elimination aye? 

 

[normalizing]

^ lol i find this funny so many people have such experiences going "wtf did i buy this stuff for..." its funny. its like some kind of a giant marketing machine that gets in our heads and we end up buying stuff later asking WHY!?

[pro-v]

Just about all of them. 

[TheFountain]

^ lol i find this funny so many people have such experiences going "wtf did i buy this stuff for..." its funny. its like some kind of a giant marketing machine that gets in our heads and we end up buying stuff later asking WHY!?

No, there are some that work.

 

I will remember them and get back to you on it later. 

[eon]

process of elimination of course!

 

had I not bought any of these products, I eventually would end up buying them in the future regardless, out of curiosity or boredom. 

 

I am not sure if we can consider it a waste to go through a process of elimination for that which works for us vs what does not.

 

But off the top of my head I can think of DNA pills (lol?). 

 

Alpha Lipoic acid. I am sure this does someone some good but I don't necessarily think I needed it for anything.

 

Rhodiolia extract I guess. I don't even remember what this was suppose to be for. Anxiety I think?

 

L-Arginine? I can't say. Could be this one was meant to be taken in conjunction with something else.

 

Kelp too I suppose. But cannot say for certain. Other forms of iodine are better for sure.

 

GTF Chromium. Wtf was I taking this for again? *scratches head*

 

L-Ornithine. Who knows, I might return to this one some day as it's suppose to be a precursor to L-proline or something.

 

 Ex-Stress. Which is just a bunch of shit for stress supposedly. I guess it worked but i've found better things since then I think, like HOly Basil extract. 

 

Manganese-Is this necessary on a balanced diet???

 

Rosemary extract. WTF?

 

So, it's a process of elimination aye? 

 

 

[Aka Poe]

I like this topic, have thought about it from time to time.  I have friends who have said I am nuts to have so many supplements and herbs in my house.  I guess I have to say I have indeed wasted a ton of money on supplements and herbs, I really fear to know the  amount! 

 

It is weird, my mind suggest to me over and over that the next best thing to cure my ills is just around the corner, and after reading some anecdotal reports here and there, I buy into the idea that such and such a supplement or herb is going to be "the one."  In the end most of these items fail miserably to do what I hope, and the nearly full bottles end up sitting on my shelf for years, after initial dismaying trials, so  I throw them out. Seems that if you read NCIB you can often find some journal article where some herb or supplement can absolutely cure cancer, induce neurogenesis in the brain etc., mitigate depression, cause hair growth, you name it, but like one other poster noted, you can to a large degree study long enough and find some purported study to fit your hope.

 

I liked the comment Saffron wrote in the thread:

Re: L-Threonate for neurogenesis, alzheimer's, hair loss, osteoarthritis

I might need to try this for hairloss

but i am skeptical of neural genesis in the hippocampus

that claim is made for like 100 different things, that they do neurogenesis in the hippocampus

Abstracts and studies are often incorrect and also they never tell you HOW MUCH something does something, unless you find like IC50 values

So for instance they might say 100 different things cause neurogenesis but nothing really doesnt it to any significant level except Stablon.

Doesnt anyone else feel a lack of confidence on how abstracts claim everything does everything?

Watch this, Im going think of a random herb and type neurogenesis with it to get abstracts. a totally random herb.

Im going to type ginseng neurogenesis and i bet ill get results -- i thought of ginseng at random

........

done, heres my results:

Ginseng total saponins enhance neurogenesis after focal cerebral ischemia.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/21073942

Ginseng enhances contextual fear conditioning and neurogenesis in rats.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15596238


see how you can just think of random things and type neurogenesis and then find abstracts on it?

and notice how abstracts always contradict each other? Ive seem ones that say DIM inhibits CYP1A2 next to ones that say DIM Induces CYP1A2 .. ive seen so many contradictions in abstracts. I dont trust them like people into supplements do, their so weak.

Check this out, ill do it again, ill think of a random herb and type neurogenesis with it and im sure theres abstracts on it.

Green Tea.

Here,

Green tea epigallocatechin-3-gallate (EGCG) promotes neural progenitor cell proliferation and sonic hedgehog pathway activation during adult hippocampal neurogenesis.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22692966


its so asinine how everything does everything and you can find an abstract for things you make up at random in your head.

 

One mycologist I know jokes that if you get deep into NCIB, you will eventually find "everything does everything!"

 

It is funny, the mistaken idea that the next thing that will make "everything alright" I often believe will come as something as simple and small as a pill. I guess it worked when I was a child and my mom gave me an aspirin for a headache and I haven't let go.

 

I also think taking the time to order something online, or hunting a medicinal plant or mushroom in the forest,  fulfills temporarily  the reward process in my brain, maybe a it's dopamine-reward thing, the seeking temporarily satisfies something, but rarely if ever are the benefits lasting or reproducable and so most often the early positive experience  may simply be just a placebo response. I feel this repetitive desire to buy supplements often without considering cost effectiveness and moreover seldom gaining significant  health benefits is part of my addictive nature.

 

I should add that there must be people who are making a lot of money off Longecity members by selling supplements and no doubt, as with anything profitable,  not all sellers are scrupulus, honest, and some of the posters on these and similar forums are likely straight out shills who submit fake posts to further sales of their products. At another forum, "herbs. mxf. yuku .com" for example, the person who created the website and forum has been suggested by several to be merely  posing as more than a few different posters at the forum, all of whom tend to be  the only members to  give positive experience reviews and product recommendations in discussions, and low and behold, that forum owner  also happens to sell those very  lackluster essential oils and other bunk items on his linked commercial website. So buyer beware!

 

I will add, like I have in a recent post, that EMDR and CBT with a skilled therapist, as well as meditation and yoga, daily exercise have probably done far more for me than most of these supplements and herbs.  Unfortunately meditation and yoga do not provide me with that same dopamine surge that I get from ordering the next pill, so I will continue reading!

[nowayout]

It is weird, my mind suggest to me over and over that the next best thing to cure my ills is just around the corner, and after reading some anecdotal reports here and there, I buy into the idea that such and such a supplement or herb is going to be "the one."  In the end most of these items fail miserably to do what I hope, and the nearly full bottles end up sitting on my shelf for years, after initial dismaying trials, so  I throw them out.

 

Exactly! 

 

Will we ever learn?

 

Maybe this thread should be a wake-up call. 

[normalizing]

Aka Poe, great post buddy. I agree with everything you said there and I am in the same boat as you, I get some rush to search NCBI and order the next thing! :D cmon now, NCBI is super addictive. I especially love the chinese articles, they always have the most promising, unbelievable in fact, results from their own chinese medicine stocks. It becomes like a game, chasing the next article there....

 

so yeah, wake up call to chill back a bit.

 

anyway, Aka Poe, whats the latest you are after, share so I chase too :P

Edited by normalizing, 13 May 2014 - 12:13 AM.

[Duchykins]

I am not sure if we can consider it a waste to go through a process of elimination for that which works for us vs what does not.
 
But off the top of my head I can think of DNA pills (lol?). 
 
Alpha Lipoic acid. I am sure this does someone some good but I don't necessarily think I needed it for anything.
 
Rhodiolia extract I guess. I don't even remember what this was suppose to be for. Anxiety I think? hi
 
L-Arginine? I can't say. Could be this one was meant to be taken in conjunction with something else.
 
Kelp too I suppose. But cannot say for certain. Other forms of iodine are better for sure.
 
GTF Chromium. Wtf was I taking this for again? *scratches head*
 
L-Ornithine. Who knows, I might return to this one some day as it's suppose to be a precursor to L-proline or something.
 
 Ex-Stress. Which is just a bunch of shit for stress supposedly. I guess it worked but i've found better things since then I think, like HOly Basil extract. 
 
Manganese-Is this necessary on a balanced diet???
 
Rosemary extract. WTF?
 
So, it's a process of elimination aye? 
 

I agree with you here, to me it's worth it, I have learned quite a bit about myself since beginning this mission to get well. First, it's still cheaper and less painful than going the prescription route, which I had done the previous decade. Secondly, when the internet is used wisely it can be more helpful than any doctor's visit. If I hadn't begun these supplements then my doctor would still think X is wrong with me when it's really Y or Z... and there are many more such stories out there. Some of us are just tired of basically living in an episode of Mystery Diagnosis.

[Gerrans]

In the end most of these items fail miserably to do what I hope, and the nearly full bottles end up sitting on my shelf for years, after initial dismaying trials, so  I throw them out.

Unless I had a bad reaction, I would not throw away a supplement I was trying out. Very few supplements have an immediate effect, and some never have perceptible effects anyway. If I had read some convincing research, I would keep going at least until the bottle ran out.

 

As far as expense goes, these days I experiment by trying cheaper versions of supplements. It is true these may be too weak, or may be badly prepared by some cost-cutting company, but my attitude is that if I can get somewhere with a cheap or weak version, then that is a sign the supplement might be worth experimenting with more carefully. I also like to try a non-concentrated version of a herb before shelling out on standardised extracts--on the grounds that the herbs are taken in a fairly whole form by the peoples who use them traditionally.

But I have certainly wasted a lot of money in my time. I bought some Vitamin K1 when I meant to buy K2, for example. I have also several times bought supplements suspended in sunflower oil--because I did not read the information closely enough. (I avoid sunflower oil, as a rule.)

Edited by Gerrans, 13 May 2014 - 06:11 PM.

[normalizing]

^ sunflower oil is much better than the generic vegetable oil, cannola oil, cottonseed oil and/or soybean oil so why avoid it?

[eon]

Now since I take single vitamins and minerals, the GTF Chromium on your list should be a good buy. I have it myself. I don't take multi vitamins, I take the single vitamins so I get to choose what dose and what version I'm taking. Anything that isn't considered a vitamin or mineral is something I may have wasted money on due to some hype about them.

 

Anyway, what's the deal with pycnogenol pine bark? I would want to try it out. Once my bottle of Taurine is done, I may just do that. I read Taurine is good for something but forgot what it was. LOL.

 

 

I am not sure if we can consider it a waste to go through a process of elimination for that which works for us vs what does not.

 

But off the top of my head I can think of DNA pills (lol?). 

 

Alpha Lipoic acid. I am sure this does someone some good but I don't necessarily think I needed it for anything.

 

Rhodiolia extract I guess. I don't even remember what this was suppose to be for. Anxiety I think?

 

L-Arginine? I can't say. Could be this one was meant to be taken in conjunction with something else.

 

Kelp too I suppose. But cannot say for certain. Other forms of iodine are better for sure.

 

GTF Chromium. Wtf was I taking this for again? *scratches head*

 

L-Ornithine. Who knows, I might return to this one some day as it's suppose to be a precursor to L-proline or something.

 

 Ex-Stress. Which is just a bunch of shit for stress supposedly. I guess it worked but i've found better things since then I think, like HOly Basil extract. 

 

Manganese-Is this necessary on a balanced diet???

 

Rosemary extract. WTF?

 

So, it's a process of elimination aye? 

 

 

[eon]

my cabinet with 3 shelves are filled with nothing but bottles and bags of supplements.

 

L-threonate I have tried (Magnesium Threonate) but since it is the threonate that is what's beneficial about it, why not just get some threonic acid supplement? I've seen it being sold and am planning on getting it actually. Just a small order of the bulk powder to see how it goes.

 

I'm not familiar with NCIB at all. I think research and or looking at the seller websites about what the specific supplement is for is what temps me to buy them. They usually back it up with legitimate sources too so it's not like snake oil is being sold here. Also, Life Extension magazine has influenced me to buy supplements I never heard of as well. Again with legitimate sources at the bottom of their research.

 

I like this topic, have thought about it from time to time.  I have friends who have said I am nuts to have so many supplements and herbs in my house.  I guess I have to say I have indeed wasted a ton of money on supplements and herbs, I really fear to know the  amount! 

 

It is weird, my mind suggest to me over and over that the next best thing to cure my ills is just around the corner, and after reading some anecdotal reports here and there, I buy into the idea that such and such a supplement or herb is going to be "the one."  In the end most of these items fail miserably to do what I hope, and the nearly full bottles end up sitting on my shelf for years, after initial dismaying trials, so  I throw them out. Seems that if you read NCIB you can often find some journal article where some herb or supplement can absolutely cure cancer, induce neurogenesis in the brain etc., mitigate depression, cause hair growth, you name it, but like one other poster noted, you can to a large degree study long enough and find some purported study to fit your hope.

 

I liked the comment Saffron wrote in the thread:

Re: L-Threonate for neurogenesis, alzheimer's, hair loss, osteoarthritis

 

I might need to try this for hairloss

but i am skeptical of neural genesis in the hippocampus

that claim is made for like 100 different things, that they do neurogenesis in the hippocampus

Abstracts and studies are often incorrect and also they never tell you HOW MUCH something does something, unless you find like IC50 values

So for instance they might say 100 different things cause neurogenesis but nothing really doesnt it to any significant level except Stablon.

Doesnt anyone else feel a lack of confidence on how abstracts claim everything does everything?

Watch this, Im going think of a random herb and type neurogenesis with it to get abstracts. a totally random herb.

Im going to type ginseng neurogenesis and i bet ill get results -- i thought of ginseng at random

........

done, heres my results:

Ginseng total saponins enhance neurogenesis after focal cerebral ischemia.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/21073942

Ginseng enhances contextual fear conditioning and neurogenesis in rats.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15596238


see how you can just think of random things and type neurogenesis and then find abstracts on it?

and notice how abstracts always contradict each other? Ive seem ones that say DIM inhibits CYP1A2 next to ones that say DIM Induces CYP1A2 .. ive seen so many contradictions in abstracts. I dont trust them like people into supplements do, their so weak.

Check this out, ill do it again, ill think of a random herb and type neurogenesis with it and im sure theres abstracts on it.

Green Tea.

Here,

Green tea epigallocatechin-3-gallate (EGCG) promotes neural progenitor cell proliferation and sonic hedgehog pathway activation during adult hippocampal neurogenesis.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22692966


its so asinine how everything does everything and you can find an abstract for things you make up at random in your head.

 

One mycologist I know jokes that if you get deep into NCIB, you will eventually find "everything does everything!"

 

It is funny, the mistaken idea that the next thing that will make "everything alright" I often believe will come as something as simple and small as a pill. I guess it worked when I was a child and my mom gave me an aspirin for a headache and I haven't let go.

 

I also think taking the time to order something online, or hunting a medicinal plant or mushroom in the forest,  fulfills temporarily  the reward process in my brain, maybe a it's dopamine-reward thing, the seeking temporarily satisfies something, but rarely if ever are the benefits lasting or reproducable and so most often the early positive experience  may simply be just a placebo response. I feel this repetitive desire to buy supplements often without considering cost effectiveness and moreover seldom gaining significant  health benefits is part of my addictive nature.

 

I should add that there must be people who are making a lot of money off Longecity members by selling supplements and no doubt, as with anything profitable,  not all sellers are scrupulus, honest, and some of the posters on these and similar forums are likely straight out shills who submit fake posts to further sales of their products. At another forum, "herbs. mxf. yuku .com" for example, the person who created the website and forum has been suggested by several to be merely  posing as more than a few different posters at the forum, all of whom tend to be  the only members to  give positive experience reviews and product recommendations in discussions, and low and behold, that forum owner  also happens to sell those very  lackluster essential oils and other bunk items on his linked commercial website. So buyer beware!

 

I will add, like I have in a recent post, that EMDR and CBT with a skilled therapist, as well as meditation and yoga, daily exercise have probably done far more for me than most of these supplements and herbs.  Unfortunately meditation and yoga do not provide me with that same dopamine surge that I get from ordering the next pill, so I will continue reading!

 

[normalizing]

^ *slaps forehead in disbelief*

 

for those people who spend so much money and time on supplements claiming that if they dont do anything great at least they wont harm them are wrong. 100% of all supplements have leftover byproducts of production, most are manufactured in china (king of polution) for cheap prices and there is not a single supplement now days without even minute quantities of metals in them which one might argue is too little to cause harm but considering you might be taking tons of supplements in contunues manner of years, shit builds up. anyway, do as you wish.

[eon]

I think half of my supplements are manufactured in the U.S. but any mullet head can put crap in it as well deliberately and not necessarily of Chinese pollution. But I think the bulk powders all come from China. The U.S. manufacturer who then capsulizes and packages the whole thing may test the powders or run it through their machine for purification process, whatever that is. Even if something is made in Disney World does not mean it is clean either. 

Edited by eon, 14 May 2014 - 09:08 AM.