161 replies to this topic

[123apk]

does PEA really have addiction/abuse potential? I've never tried it yet although I have it. Isn't it a form of amphetamine?

I used it a few times because I remembered reading something Russian about Phenibut doing something with it which is why Phenibut can be stimulating for some people maybe?

Anyway first time - holy sh*t was it strong! I only took less than 100mg to test the waters.
Lasted about an hour, suddenly my body felt real good, my muscles felt pumped and toned, I had an urge to work out and did so and felt awesome, my arms felt orgasmic. I just felt really nice, really motivated, like a rush of energy, I wanted to do stuff and did so really fast.
Wore off after an hour or so but it made my pupils massive, like those kids you see in horror movies with the eyes that are all black and creepy - like that big, and the massive pupils lasted for DAYS and people kept looking at more funny and suspecting I was high.
Also it tastes disgusting, how you'd imagine wet dog would taste like. And after it kicks in you smell it for ages. I have no idea if you smell your own breath, if it gets up into your sinuses or if it's in your sweatz but you smell the wet dog smell too. It does seem to make your senses stronger though, smells become stronger, with music you just feel like raving to it and playing it as loud as possible till your ear drums hurt.

2nd time (about a week or two latter) - slightly nice body feel, bit of stimulation but not much else. I dosed 400mg, was very disappointed.

So anyway, pretty sure I had a strong reaction the first time, not sure why. But very little the second time apart from massive pupils.
I daren't take it any more because of the pupils thing because I had people at work giving me funny looks and acting kind of weird and I'm sure I heard someone say to someone else did they reckon I am high as I walked away. It's a shame because I could do awesome workouts on it I reckon, I've never been that motivated to work out before usually I have to force myself.

[123apk]

I like this topic, have thought about it from time to time.  I have friends who have said I am nuts to have so many supplements and herbs in my house.  I guess I have to say I have indeed wasted a ton of money on supplements and herbs, I really fear to know the  amount! 
 
It is weird, my mind suggest to me over and over that the next best thing to cure my ills is just around the corner, and after reading some anecdotal reports here and there, I buy into the idea that such and such a supplement or herb is going to be "the one."  In the end most of these items fail miserably to do what I hope, and the nearly full bottles end up sitting on my shelf for years, after initial dismaying trials, so  I throw them out. Seems that if you read NCIB you can often find some journal article where some herb or supplement can absolutely cure cancer, induce neurogenesis in the brain etc., mitigate depression, cause hair growth, you name it, but like one other poster noted, you can to a large degree study long enough and find some purported study to fit your hope.
 
I liked the comment Saffron wrote in the thread: Re: L-Threonate for neurogenesis, alzheimer's, hair loss, osteoarthritis

I might need to try this for hairloss

but i am skeptical of neural genesis in the hippocampus

that claim is made for like 100 different things, that they do neurogenesis in the hippocampus

Abstracts and studies are often incorrect and also they never tell you HOW MUCH something does something, unless you find like IC50 values

So for instance they might say 100 different things cause neurogenesis but nothing really doesnt it to any significant level except Stablon.

Doesnt anyone else feel a lack of confidence on how abstracts claim everything does everything?

Watch this, Im going think of a random herb and type neurogenesis with it to get abstracts. a totally random herb.

Im going to type ginseng neurogenesis and i bet ill get results -- i thought of ginseng at random

........

done, heres my results:

Ginseng total saponins enhance neurogenesis after focal cerebral ischemia.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/21073942

Ginseng enhances contextual fear conditioning and neurogenesis in rats.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15596238


see how you can just think of random things and type neurogenesis and then find abstracts on it?

and notice how abstracts always contradict each other? Ive seem ones that say DIM inhibits CYP1A2 next to ones that say DIM Induces CYP1A2 .. ive seen so many contradictions in abstracts. I dont trust them like people into supplements do, their so weak.

Check this out, ill do it again, ill think of a random herb and type neurogenesis with it and im sure theres abstracts on it.

Green Tea.

Here,

Green tea epigallocatechin-3-gallate (EGCG) promotes neural progenitor cell proliferation and sonic hedgehog pathway activation during adult hippocampal neurogenesis.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22692966


its so asinine how everything does everything and you can find an abstract for things you make up at random in your head.
 

One mycologist I know jokes that if you get deep into NCIB, you will eventually find "everything does everything!"
 
It is funny, the mistaken idea that the next thing that will make "everything alright" I often believe will come as something as simple and small as a pill. I guess it worked when I was a child and my mom gave me an aspirin for a headache and I haven't let go.
 
I also think taking the time to order something online, or hunting a medicinal plant or mushroom in the forest,  fulfills temporarily  the reward process in my brain, maybe a it's dopamine-reward thing, the seeking temporarily satisfies something, but rarely if ever are the benefits lasting or reproducable and so most often the early positive experience  may simply be just a placebo response. I feel this repetitive desire to buy supplements often without considering cost effectiveness and moreover seldom gaining significant  health benefits is part of my addictive nature.
 
I should add that there must be people who are making a lot of money off Longecity members by selling supplements and no doubt, as with anything profitable,  not all sellers are scrupulus, honest, and some of the posters on these and similar forums are likely straight out shills who submit fake posts to further sales of their products. At another forum, "herbs. mxf. yuku .com" for example, the person who created the website and forum has been suggested by several to be merely  posing as more than a few different posters at the forum, all of whom tend to be  the only members to  give positive experience reviews and product recommendations in discussions, and low and behold, that forum owner  also happens to sell those very  lackluster essential oils and other bunk items on his linked commercial website. So buyer beware!
 
I will add, like I have in a recent post, that EMDR and CBT with a skilled therapist, as well as meditation and yoga, daily exercise have probably done far more for me than most of these supplements and herbs.  Unfortunately meditation and yoga do not provide me with that same dopamine surge that I get from ordering the next pill, so I will continue reading!

I've seen cbd (cannabidiol) sellers posing as members on here and giving good reviews to their own websites.

[eon]

Some CBD oils are legit, some may be snake oil.

 

 

I like this topic, have thought about it from time to time.  I have friends who have said I am nuts to have so many supplements and herbs in my house.  I guess I have to say I have indeed wasted a ton of money on supplements and herbs, I really fear to know the  amount! 
 
It is weird, my mind suggest to me over and over that the next best thing to cure my ills is just around the corner, and after reading some anecdotal reports here and there, I buy into the idea that such and such a supplement or herb is going to be "the one."  In the end most of these items fail miserably to do what I hope, and the nearly full bottles end up sitting on my shelf for years, after initial dismaying trials, so  I throw them out. Seems that if you read NCIB you can often find some journal article where some herb or supplement can absolutely cure cancer, induce neurogenesis in the brain etc., mitigate depression, cause hair growth, you name it, but like one other poster noted, you can to a large degree study long enough and find some purported study to fit your hope.
 
I liked the comment Saffron wrote in the thread: Re: L-Threonate for neurogenesis, alzheimer's, hair loss, osteoarthritis

I might need to try this for hairloss

but i am skeptical of neural genesis in the hippocampus

that claim is made for like 100 different things, that they do neurogenesis in the hippocampus

Abstracts and studies are often incorrect and also they never tell you HOW MUCH something does something, unless you find like IC50 values

So for instance they might say 100 different things cause neurogenesis but nothing really doesnt it to any significant level except Stablon.

Doesnt anyone else feel a lack of confidence on how abstracts claim everything does everything?

Watch this, Im going think of a random herb and type neurogenesis with it to get abstracts. a totally random herb.

Im going to type ginseng neurogenesis and i bet ill get results -- i thought of ginseng at random

........

done, heres my results:

Ginseng total saponins enhance neurogenesis after focal cerebral ischemia.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/21073942

Ginseng enhances contextual fear conditioning and neurogenesis in rats.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15596238


see how you can just think of random things and type neurogenesis and then find abstracts on it?

and notice how abstracts always contradict each other? Ive seem ones that say DIM inhibits CYP1A2 next to ones that say DIM Induces CYP1A2 .. ive seen so many contradictions in abstracts. I dont trust them like people into supplements do, their so weak.

Check this out, ill do it again, ill think of a random herb and type neurogenesis with it and im sure theres abstracts on it.

Green Tea.

Here,

Green tea epigallocatechin-3-gallate (EGCG) promotes neural progenitor cell proliferation and sonic hedgehog pathway activation during adult hippocampal neurogenesis.

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/22692966


its so asinine how everything does everything and you can find an abstract for things you make up at random in your head.
 

One mycologist I know jokes that if you get deep into NCIB, you will eventually find "everything does everything!"
 
It is funny, the mistaken idea that the next thing that will make "everything alright" I often believe will come as something as simple and small as a pill. I guess it worked when I was a child and my mom gave me an aspirin for a headache and I haven't let go.
 
I also think taking the time to order something online, or hunting a medicinal plant or mushroom in the forest,  fulfills temporarily  the reward process in my brain, maybe a it's dopamine-reward thing, the seeking temporarily satisfies something, but rarely if ever are the benefits lasting or reproducable and so most often the early positive experience  may simply be just a placebo response. I feel this repetitive desire to buy supplements often without considering cost effectiveness and moreover seldom gaining significant  health benefits is part of my addictive nature.
 
I should add that there must be people who are making a lot of money off Longecity members by selling supplements and no doubt, as with anything profitable,  not all sellers are scrupulus, honest, and some of the posters on these and similar forums are likely straight out shills who submit fake posts to further sales of their products. At another forum, "herbs. mxf. yuku .com" for example, the person who created the website and forum has been suggested by several to be merely  posing as more than a few different posters at the forum, all of whom tend to be  the only members to  give positive experience reviews and product recommendations in discussions, and low and behold, that forum owner  also happens to sell those very  lackluster essential oils and other bunk items on his linked commercial website. So buyer beware!
 
I will add, like I have in a recent post, that EMDR and CBT with a skilled therapist, as well as meditation and yoga, daily exercise have probably done far more for me than most of these supplements and herbs.  Unfortunately meditation and yoga do not provide me with that same dopamine surge that I get from ordering the next pill, so I will continue reading!

I've seen cbd (cannabidiol) sellers posing as members on here and giving good reviews to their own websites.

 

 

[eon]

I think Phenibut is belong in a similar class of drug as GHB belong in that's why the muscle pumped you mentioned was there because GHB is known to raise GH levels and was also used by bodybuilders for that reason. I wish I had real GHB though. LOL. 

 

My eyes are already dark, which people mistake for being dilated so I'm sure I can get away with looking "high" on Phenibut, something I have not tried yet but I do have the compound I bought from Powdercity. Is it good? I read about how it can be addicting...

 

 

does PEA really have addiction/abuse potential? I've never tried it yet although I have it. Isn't it a form of amphetamine?

I used it a few times because I remembered reading something Russian about Phenibut doing something with it which is why Phenibut can be stimulating for some people maybe?

Anyway first time - holy sh*t was it strong! I only took less than 100mg to test the waters.
Lasted about an hour, suddenly my body felt real good, my muscles felt pumped and toned, I had an urge to work out and did so and felt awesome, my arms felt orgasmic. I just felt really nice, really motivated, like a rush of energy, I wanted to do stuff and did so really fast.
Wore off after an hour or so but it made my pupils massive, like those kids you see in horror movies with the eyes that are all black and creepy - like that big, and the massive pupils lasted for DAYS and people kept looking at more funny and suspecting I was high.
Also it tastes disgusting, how you'd imagine wet dog would taste like. And after it kicks in you smell it for ages. I have no idea if you smell your own breath, if it gets up into your sinuses or if it's in your sweatz but you smell the wet dog smell too. It does seem to make your senses stronger though, smells become stronger, with music you just feel like raving to it and playing it as loud as possible till your ear drums hurt.

2nd time (about a week or two latter) - slightly nice body feel, bit of stimulation but not much else. I dosed 400mg, was very disappointed.

So anyway, pretty sure I had a strong reaction the first time, not sure why. But very little the second time apart from massive pupils.
I daren't take it any more because of the pupils thing because I had people at work giving me funny looks and acting kind of weird and I'm sure I heard someone say to someone else did they reckon I am high as I walked away. It's a shame because I could do awesome workouts on it I reckon, I've never been that motivated to work out before usually I have to force myself.

 

 

Edited by eon, 12 January 2016 - 12:33 PM.

[123apk]

I think Phenibut is belong in a similar class of drug as GHB belong in that's why the muscle pumped you mentioned was there because GHB is known to raise GH levels and was also used by bodybuilders for that reason. I wish I had real GHB though. LOL.

Yes, it hits Gaba b like GHB but is much weaker. Russian articles also say it touches upon Gaba A (like benzos), dopamine (which would explain the slight stimulation, increase in motivation and "can do attitude") and noradrenaline.
That goes in stages, eventually all you get is it taking the edge off anxiety a bit.
As for growth hormone, it's suspected but not certain. But my face has changed a bit in the last year and become more masculine I think. And a guy on YouTube calling himself " Phenibut God" seems to have changed since his earlier videos. But of course it could just be ageing, I'm in my mid 20s and he looks about the same.

When thing I did notice when it was working at full strength was I was much more confident and flirtatious. I noticed I seemed to be a lot more liked and noticed women looking at me in a good way. A part of that must be the influence on mood perhaps putting a certain expression on my face, perhaps giving me a more powerful stride and posture and overall air of confidence. That's gone too, now I just look at ease but laid back on it at best I think.

Besides all that, GABA (which Phenibut is in a way) has a positive effect on your skin and heart (unless you go mad with it) and many other things, pretty much everything in the body responds to GABA and thus Phenibut in some way.
I noticed it gave my skin a nice healthy glow, even through much of winter and seemed to make the tan I get a bit more even.

It also delays ejaculation when you're new to it and makes them feel a lot better, but doesn't make it impossible to cum like some things.

There's a load of effects I've had off it, most no longer apply because of overuse. I'll have to list them some time.

My eyes are already dark, which people mistake for being dilated so I'm sure I can get away with looking "high" on Phenibut, something I have not tried yet but I do have the compound I bought from Powdercity. Is it good? I read about how it can be addicting...

My eyes are brown and I think it helps because it's not as noticeable as it would be with light eyes. But I tend to make strong eye contact..

It is addictive. I don't feel a need to dose constantly, but if I miss a daily dose I'm analysing myself and how I'm doing without it and attributing anything negative to having missed it.

I read all the scare stories before starting it and did a month of research before starting it. I was going to be sensible with it and not become another victim of it. But obviously I couldn't stick to that, so bear that in mind.
I think I've avoided the worst of the bad stuff because I very rarely went above 2g in a day, mainly sticking to 1.5g.

If you try it, be careful. If you don't have anxiety or depression and have no real need for it then there's no real reason to use it more than once a week.

[123apk]

One more thing - when you're new to it and it wears off you'll feel mega tired and crash. I'm not sure if this is due to me a socially anxious guy getting tired from all the extra socialising and talking on it, or if it's Phenibut itself.
I'd go sleep for a couple of hours after work. Interestingly this is also said to be an effect of HGH, the desire to have a short sleep during the day.
Or it could be the stimulatory effect wearing off, leaving gaba to sedate you and make you tired.

[eon]

if you looked at my threads, I think I could use some phenibut. Anyway, when you say "it's gone too", does that mean you can't have what was "gone" back? Maybe it's because of tolerance that you don't think it's "there" anymore? This goes with any drug actually. I started off with a 10 mg Vyvanse (which is an amphetamine) and all the way to max dose of 70 mg, because with each dose it feels as if "it's gone" but I think it never left to begin with it's just my mind seem to be telling me, I need a higher dose (this is called addiction). Like when an alcoholic can't really get drunk with just 1 bottle...

 

 

I think Phenibut is belong in a similar class of drug as GHB belong in that's why the muscle pumped you mentioned was there because GHB is known to raise GH levels and was also used by bodybuilders for that reason. I wish I had real GHB though. LOL.

Yes, it hits Gaba b like GHB but is much weaker. Russian articles also say it touches upon Gaba A (like benzos), dopamine (which would explain the slight stimulation, increase in motivation and "can do attitude") and noradrenaline.
That goes in stages, eventually all you get is it taking the edge off anxiety a bit.
As for growth hormone, it's suspected but not certain. But my face has changed a bit in the last year and become more masculine I think. And a guy on YouTube calling himself " Phenibut God" seems to have changed since his earlier videos. But of course it could just be ageing, I'm in my mid 20s and he looks about the same.

When thing I did notice when it was working at full strength was I was much more confident and flirtatious. I noticed I seemed to be a lot more liked and noticed women looking at me in a good way. A part of that must be the influence on mood perhaps putting a certain expression on my face, perhaps giving me a more powerful stride and posture and overall air of confidence. That's gone too, now I just look at ease but laid back on it at best I think.

Besides all that, GABA (which Phenibut is in a way) has a positive effect on your skin and heart (unless you go mad with it) and many other things, pretty much everything in the body responds to GABA and thus Phenibut in some way.
I noticed it gave my skin a nice healthy glow, even through much of winter and seemed to make the tan I get a bit more even.

It also delays ejaculation when you're new to it and makes them feel a lot better, but doesn't make it impossible to cum like some things.

There's a load of effects I've had off it, most no longer apply because of overuse. I'll have to list them some time.

My eyes are already dark, which people mistake for being dilated so I'm sure I can get away with looking "high" on Phenibut, something I have not tried yet but I do have the compound I bought from Powdercity. Is it good? I read about how it can be addicting...

My eyes are brown and I think it helps because it's not as noticeable as it would be with light eyes. But I tend to make strong eye contact..

It is addictive. I don't feel a need to dose constantly, but if I miss a daily dose I'm analysing myself and how I'm doing without it and attributing anything negative to having missed it.

I read all the scare stories before starting it and did a month of research before starting it. I was going to be sensible with it and not become another victim of it. But obviously I couldn't stick to that, so bear that in mind.
I think I've avoided the worst of the bad stuff because I very rarely went above 2g in a day, mainly sticking to 1.5g.

If you try it, be careful. If you don't have anxiety or depression and have no real need for it then there's no real reason to use it more than once a week.

 

 

[eon]

gaba is supposedly sedating since it is also a combo with niacin in the drug called picamilon. Another anti anxiety drug. Also, GHB is derived from GABA and prescription GHB (called Xyrem) is prescribed for narcolepsy and cataplexy. From what I understand 2.5 g of it puts you to sleep within 5 minutes hence it's called the "date rape drug". Light dose GHB it becomes a stimulant. Try lowering your phenibut dose?

 

One more thing - when you're new to it and it wears off you'll feel mega tired and crash. I'm not sure if this is due to me a socially anxious guy getting tired from all the extra socialising and talking on it, or if it's Phenibut itself.
I'd go sleep for a couple of hours after work. Interestingly this is also said to be an effect of HGH, the desire to have a short sleep during the day.
Or it could be the stimulatory effect wearing off, leaving gaba to sedate you and make you tired.

 

[123apk]

if you looked at my threads, I think I could use some phenibut. Anyway, when you say "it's gone too", does that mean you can't have what was "gone" back? Maybe it's because of tolerance that you don't think it's "there" anymore?

Yes, what I mean is those aspects of it go in time. It could be a tolerance thing or getting used to it, but simply dosing more *doesn't result in getting those effects back* for *me* (it could vary by person).
When I've tried to increase dosage in the past those effects didn't come back and it came with negative effects. At higher dosage I felt a stronger, sedating GABA effect, it felt like diazepam or another benzo.
I may try a higher dosage again to be sure, but for me as time progresses I can handle less of it.

This goes with any drug actually. I started off with a 10 mg Vyvanse (which is an amphetamine) and all the way to max dose of 70 mg, because with each dose it feels as if "it's gone" but I think it never left to begin with it's just my mind seem to be telling me, I need a higher dose (this is called addiction). Like when an alcoholic can't really get drunk with just 1 bottle...

I can't handle higher doses though, even the doses I used to be on are decreasing due to negative effects (such as the "dumb" feeling, sedated benzo effect).
When tolerance builds I think it starts feeling like a typical benzo.
And one has to remember that it's slightly stimulating and motivating at first because it hits other brain receptors than just GABA. It's probably those effects that I've become tolerant to so don't feel, not so much the gaba, but gaba by itself is just sedating as calming.

gaba is supposedly sedating since it is also a combo with niacin in the drug called picamilon. Another anti anxiety drug. Also, GHB is derived from GABA and prescription GHB (called Xyrem) is prescribed for narcolepsy and cataplexy. From what I understand 2.5 g of it puts you to sleep within 5 minutes hence it's called the "date rape drug". Light dose GHB it becomes a stimulant. Try lowering your phenibut dose?

One more thing - when you're new to it and it wears off you'll feel mega tired and crash. I'm not sure if this is due to me a socially anxious guy getting tired from all the extra socialising and talking on it, or if it's Phenibut itself.
I'd go sleep for a couple of hours after work. Interestingly this is also said to be an effect of HGH, the desire to have a short sleep during the day.
Or it could be the stimulatory effect wearing off, leaving gaba to sedate you and make you tired.

I've been lowering my dose for months now. Phenibut isn't purely a gaba drug, that's the thing.
It was designed so soviet astronauts could take it to stay calm whilst still being functional, thus it's not designed to be sedating when it works.

[Sith]

I wasted money on multivitamin supplements, then realised the iron content is too high for my liking and supplementing on it is worthless since I get most of my vitamins and minerals from my diet. 

[123apk]

What I've tried -

 

What worked for me -

 

• Phenibut - boy does that stuff work. It's cheap and worth every penny so long as you can control your usage of it. But it can work so well in some people (such as me) that even if you think of yourself as a sensible, controlled person you can easily get carried away with it, especially if it helps alleviate a problem. 
• Tyrosine - it's subtle, but when you've got some sort of dopamine down regulation you can really notice it. I think if your dopamine is functioning normally you're less likely to notice it. I think it's possibly the safest thing that plays on dopamine as it's a precursor meaning your body presumably makes how much it's craving from it then dumps the rest. If it were some supplement acting on or mimicking dopamine then I think there'd be more potential for harm.

Tyrosine is very interesting because I used it when the slight stimulation and motivation aspects of Phenibut started to fade. I use 1.6g a day first thing in the morning and it usually gives me back some of the motivation, energy and confidence I lost when Phenibut began to fade out. Phenibut simply takes the edge of these days but whilst it used to make me incredibly sociable, energised and great at work, it just doesn't do that any more on its own - it must have some effect on dopamine.

I ran out of Tyrosine about two months ago and didn't buy and more and I just wasn't as motivated and energetic as I was when Phenibut was working nor when it stopped having these effects and I used it with Tyrosine. I felt Phenibuts effects I believe purely on a GABA level - sedating, taking the edge of. None of the other dopamine-related effects it has.

I got some Tyrosine again yesterday and boom, I was back. It's quite amazing really but that's what I've been missing. Since I ran out of Tyrosine my appetite increased - I believe I was seeking it out in foods, I got grumpy if I missed a meal - never had this happen before. So I believe Tyrosine has been filling thr gap from some of the Phenibut-induced damage to dopamine receptors and this is just one thing I don't intend to quit. When I wean off Phenibut I want to make it a part of a more nautral stack.

 

 

What sort of worked -

 

• Phenylalanine - It made me really stimulated one time I tried it on its own, then nothing. I tried it again last night with Hordenine, I got very little. This may be because I've never tried it yet when I haven't had any Phenibut in my system, I believe GABA could be blocking it.
• Hordenine - I tried this for the first time last night. I'm not able to measure if accurately as my scales only go down to 100mg but it was somewhere below 100mg. I felt a very brief body high from it before ingesting the phenylalanine. I didn't get any stimulatory effects from either though but it kind of put me at ease a bit. Again it might not have worked so well because I had Phenibut that day and couldn't measure it well. I went out on it and sensed it doing something. The bit of a body high had me walking with a good posture and I was kind of at ease. I did feel slightly nauseas but that might be because of what I've read before using it about it giving you nausea. But I had a lot to eat on it anyway and didn't puke. I will try these two again some time when I've had a few days off Phenibut. Overall though I didn't like these two so far. I didn't feel bad on them, but I felt a bit odd. I'm not sure how to describe it really.

 

As for phenylalanine, I came across a few threads on other forums where people are arguing whether it upregulates GABA B receptors or not. It seems it might do, so it would perhaps be useful to try using it occasionally once I'm weaned off Phenibut to repair the receptors and maybe get more than I had before if it's possible (which would presumably be good).

 

What hasn't worked -

 

I tried using more natural things. I'm hoping to still build a more subtle, natural stack over time.

 

• Taurine - it made me horny one day, little else. Felt more like I'd mega dosed zinc (because of its effects on libido) tbh.
• Theanine - Made me tired one time. Every other time nothing. Did 5g one time to try and feel something, it gave me really bad diarrhea for 3 days, some of the worst I've had in my life - I actually lost weight because I was losing so much water and couldn't keep food down.
• Gotu Kola - Gave me a nice body high one time, then nothing.
• Rhodiola - no anti-anxiety effects for me or anything increasing motivation and energy really. But I had it a few times when I was feeling under the weather and it made me feel much better, so it has some medicinal value there. Taking too much just makes me angry though.
• Ashwagandha - Just made me a groggy sort of tired. May try again in the future though because of what I read about it. 
• Aniracetam - doesn't have any positive effects. But for some reason it does have a few negative ones - it makes me slow witted and for some reason effects my speech in a bad way making me less intelligible and making it feel hard to pronounce words, especially if I try mega dosing it (which I have tried before just to try and get something from it). I've never used it with a choline source, maybe that's why. The speech effects might be something unique to me because I had a speech disorder as a kid. 

Edited by 123apk, 16 January 2016 - 11:32 AM.

[Ames]

The rite of passage for having issues that one attempts to self-treat with OTC chemicals is that you invariably have boxes full of supplements that you'll never take again just to find the one or two that you couldn't be without. Listing all of those that were a waste of money, so to speak, would be an exercise in redundancy. It would be much easier to state that most were a waste in the sense that I don' take them, though also that perhaps that they were a necessary journey.