821 replies to this topic

[Logic]

We are producing a new batch now and there is a 10% discount open to anyone by request for the pre-order at this time, which as I recall we did for the Group Buy discount dynamic.

Contact at tlr@teamtlr.com

We'll do 15% off for the first five who respond with "GHKMIX15" in the subject. ;-)

 

For more details:

https://teamtlr.com/...atio-blend.html

 

As well: 

Acetyl Epitalon 20mg vial pre-order we will afford $10 off per vial for those who note "ACEPI10" in the subject

Informal research has demonstrated a "pro-life bioregulating" synergy with concurrent use of the GHKmix and Acetyl Epitalon, which is more potent due to superior pharmacokinetics than the parent compound Epitalon itself, with the same profile of efficacy.

https://teamtlr.com/...-ac-epi-98.html

 

 

I assume the person who voted this post 'Dangerous and Irresponsible' did so because Acetyl Epitalon is a completely untested form of Epitalon?
Plz PM me as I am very interested in taking the combo due to great success with  Sciwalk's Epitalon and positive feedback from a person who has taken Acetyl Epitalon and would like better feedback.

 

http://www.longecity...s-thread/page-8

The price on;
https://teamtlr.com/...&submit_search=

is currently $99.80
The 15% discount brings it down to $84.83 which is pretty good, not so?

[mikey]

 

 

 

I would be interested in participating in a group buy of GHK and NR HCL

 

TLR, the origial group buy supplier of GHK/GHK-Cu says:

Limited Run - Due Late October

 

https://teamtlr.com/...&submit_search=

 

Is anyone interested in another group buy/order?

 

 

What's the price?

 

 

 

We are producing a new batch now and there is a 10% discount open to anyone by request for the pre-order at this time, which as I recall we did for the Group Buy discount dynamic.

 

Contact at tlr@teamtlr.com

We'll do 15% off for the first five who respond with "GHKMIX15" in the subject. ;-)

 

For more details:

https://teamtlr.com/...atio-blend.html

 

As well: 

Acetyl Epitalon 20mg vial pre-order we will afford $10 off per vial for those who note "ACEPI10" in the subject

Informal research has demonstrated a "pro-life bioregulating" synergy with concurrent use of the GHKmix and Acetyl Epitalon, which is more potent due to superior pharmacokinetics than the parent compound Epitalon itself, with the same profile of efficacy.

https://teamtlr.com/...-ac-epi-98.html

 

 

So we can pay $69.95 - 10% for 20 mg of acetyl epitalon with you or $129 for 100 mg from Ceretropic.

 

That means that Ceretropic charges $1.29 per mg, where you charge $3.14 per mg.

 

Guess I'll stick with Ceretropic.

 

Also, consider that epitalon was optimally used at 10 mg per day for 10 days every 6 months in Khavinson's research.

 

So 20 mg is two days for $62.96 from you?!?

 

Please consider making less profit and serving us better.

[niner]

So we can pay $69.95 - 10% for 20 mg of acetyl epitalon with you or $129 for 100 mg from Ceretropic.

 

They're two different compounds.  Ceretropic is selling regular epitalon while TLR is selling acetyl epitalon.   Edit:  dz93 pointed out my mistake below; Ceretropic also has acetyl epitalon.  Why the large difference in price?

 

Hypothetically, the acetylated version would be more bioavailable, so you shouldn't need as much, but I have no idea exactly what the equivalent amount would be.  Anyone know?  Acetyl-epitalon supposedly crosses the BBB, according to an article at the TLR site, which I presume implies that regular epitalon doesn't.  I don't know if this is actually the case or not, just reporting what they wrote.

Edited by niner, 16 October 2015 - 02:39 AM.

[dz93]

 

So we can pay $69.95 - 10% for 20 mg of acetyl epitalon with you or $129 for 100 mg from Ceretropic.

 

They're two different compounds.  Ceretropic is selling regular epitalon while TLR is selling acetyl epitalon.  Hypothetically, the acetylated version would be more bioavailable, so you shouldn't need as much, but I have no idea exactly what the equivalent amount would be.  Anyone know?  Acetyl-epitalon supposedly crosses the BBB, according to an article at the TLR site, which I presume implies that regular epitalon doesn't.  I don't know if this is actually the case or not, just reporting what they wrote.

 

 

Ceretropic has Epitalon, N-Acetyl Epitalon, and N-Acetyl Epitalon Amidate

[niner]

Ceretropic has Epitalon, N-Acetyl Epitalon, and N-Acetyl Epitalon Amidate

 

Oh dang, I didn't scroll down far enough to see those.  My mistake.   So why the difference in price?  And does anyone know how the acetyl version should be dosed?  Any chance it has improved oral or sublingual bioavailability?  I wouldn't expect an N-acetyl group to make it resistant to a protease, with the possible exception of an endopeptidase that was expecting a naked amino terminus.

[Rocket]

Where you people buying it that you're taking 50-100mg / day?  The cheapest I've seen is about $200 for 200mg.  Also are you injecting that much?  Placing under the tongue?  Or are you talking about some kind of skin lotion? 

 

 

[dz93]

Where you people buying it that you're taking 50-100mg / day? The cheapest I've seen is about $200 for 200mg. Also are you injecting that much? Placing under the tongue? Or are you talking about some kind of skin lotion?

All your questions were literally just answered in the last two pages of this thread. You can only inject GHK or apply topically. Its not recommended any other way due to bioavailability/stability issues. Injection causes systemic effects while topical typically only causes topical effects.

Also, teamTLR is selling GHK for ~$100/g. That's where I got mine from.

Edited by dz93, 19 October 2015 - 04:11 PM.

[Rocket]

 

Where you people buying it that you're taking 50-100mg / day? The cheapest I've seen is about $200 for 200mg. Also are you injecting that much? Placing under the tongue? Or are you talking about some kind of skin lotion?

All your questions were literally just answered in the last two pages of this thread. You can only inject GHK or apply topically. Its not recommended any other way due to bioavailability/stability issues. Injection causes systemic effects while topical typically only causes topical effects.

Also, teamTLR is selling GHK for ~$100/g. That's where I got mine from.

 

 

Great, I just pre-ordered with them for a late Oct batch.

 

Is there any over 40 year olds here with comments on their skin using these injections?  Sorry but this thread is way long to read everything.
 

[Rocket]

How do you reconcile the pro-health affects of Cu in this peptide with studies on Cu negatively affecting health?

 

http://www.sciencedi...095177913000300

 

"5. Conclusion

Our study showed that copper binds to bases of DNA in chromatin by changing the winding angle of the helix. This induces the DNA damage and alters the B-conformation. Altered B-DNA conformation will alter the integrity of DNA which may affect the normal process of DNA replication and transcription. Copper induced DNA damage in the brain may cause neurotoxicity and the neuronal cell death and is implicated in Alzheimer's disease and other neurological disorders. Hence copper is expected to become one of the key factors for causing neurodegeneration. It is also concluded that histone and nonhistone proteins present in chromatin protect DNA from oxidative DNA damage and slowdown the age related diseases"\

 

 

[dz93]

How do you reconcile the pro-health affects of Cu in this peptide with studies on Cu negatively affecting health?

http://www.sciencedi...095177913000300

"5. Conclusion
Our study showed that copper binds to bases of DNA in chromatin by changing the winding angle of the helix. This induces the DNA damage and alters the B-conformation. Altered B-DNA conformation will alter the integrity of DNA which may affect the normal process of DNA replication and transcription. Copper induced DNA damage in the brain may cause neurotoxicity and the neuronal cell death and is implicated in Alzheimer's disease and other neurological disorders. Hence copper is expected to become one of the key factors for causing neurodegeneration. It is also concluded that histone and nonhistone proteins present in chromatin protect DNA from oxidative DNA damage and slowdown the age related diseases"\

Copper has beneficial functions inside the body but it appears that copper bound to GHK does not have any toxic effect. It also appears that GHK will neutralize toxic copper in the blood. So dosing the 50/50 mix, as determined long ago, is probably the best way to go.

http://www.hindawi.c...ri/2015/648108/

10. Biochemistry of GHK-Cu

"Lau and Sarkar found that at the physiological pH, GHK-Cu complexes can form binary and ternary structures which may involve the amino acid histidine and/or the copper binding region of the albumin molecule. They also observed that GHK can easily obtain copper 2+ bound to the high affinity copper transport site on plasma albumin (albumin’s binding constant of log10 = 16.2 versus GHK’s binding constant of log10 = 16.44). It has been established that the copper (II) redox activity is silenced when copper ions that are bound to the GHK tripeptide, which allows the delivery of nontoxic copper into the cell [48–50].

The most distinctive feature of GHK is its ability to form complexes with copper (II) [51]. This is very important since copper is required for more than a dozen vital enzymes in the human body and skin including those that participate in connective tissue formation, antioxidant defense, and cellular respiration. Copper also exhibits signaling function and can influence cell behavior and metabolism. For example, sufficient copper is required for stem cells to start proliferating and repairing tissues. GHK also helps to reduce the level of free ionic copper thus preventing the possibility of oxidative damage."

Key part;

"It has been established that the copper (II) redox activity is silenced when copper ions that are bound to the GHK tripeptide, which allows the delivery of nontoxic copper into the cell [48–50]."

Edited by dz93, 20 October 2015 - 07:08 PM.

[Forty Six & 2]

Here's a link to a great article on the pro-health/pro-life benefits of GHK:  http://www.hindawi.c...ri/2014/151479/

 

We have fresh stock of our GHK/GHK-Cu Blend and Acetyl Epitalon.  By request to TLR@TeamTLR.com we will give 50% off Acetyl Epitalon with any order of the GHK Blend.

We are as well working on some other "Pro-Life" Bioregulators which seem to have the greatest overall promotion of enhancing lifespan/healthspan.  Hopefully soon for introduction. 

[Rocket]

Here's a link to a great article on the pro-health/pro-life benefits of GHK:  http://www.hindawi.c...ri/2014/151479/

 

We have fresh stock of our GHK/GHK-Cu Blend and Acetyl Epitalon.  By request to TLR@TeamTLR.com we will give 50% off Acetyl Epitalon with any order of the GHK Blend.

We are as well working on some other "Pro-Life" Bioregulators which seem to have the greatest overall promotion of enhancing lifespan/healthspan.  Hopefully soon for introduction. 

 

My order arrived today.  I will be experimenting with ~25mg/day subq.  I'm also concurrently experimenting with 4mg/week cjc1295/DAC, so I hope I can tell what has what effect. 

[Rocket]

 

Where you people buying it that you're taking 50-100mg / day? The cheapest I've seen is about $200 for 200mg. Also are you injecting that much? Placing under the tongue? Or are you talking about some kind of skin lotion?

All your questions were literally just answered in the last two pages of this thread. You can only inject GHK or apply topically. Its not recommended any other way due to bioavailability/stability issues. Injection causes systemic effects while topical typically only causes topical effects.

Also, teamTLR is selling GHK for ~$100/g. That's where I got mine from.

 

 

How long was it before you noticed any effects of this peptide?  My lab rat is on his 3rd 25mg subq injection and says he doesn't notice anything.  However, he was a little apprehensive about being injected with something that was bright blue.

[Rocket]

 

 

Where you people buying it that you're taking 50-100mg / day? The cheapest I've seen is about $200 for 200mg. Also are you injecting that much? Placing under the tongue? Or are you talking about some kind of skin lotion?

All your questions were literally just answered in the last two pages of this thread. You can only inject GHK or apply topically. Its not recommended any other way due to bioavailability/stability issues. Injection causes systemic effects while topical typically only causes topical effects.

Also, teamTLR is selling GHK for ~$100/g. That's where I got mine from.

 

 

How long was it before you noticed any effects of this peptide?  My lab rat is on his 3rd 25mg subq injection and says he doesn't notice anything.  However, he was a little apprehensive about being injected with something that was bright blue.

 

 

Day 5: Lab rat less apprehensive about being injected with what looks like blue toilet water.  No results or side effects.

[Logic]

 

 

 

Where you people buying it that you're taking 50-100mg / day? The cheapest I've seen is about $200 for 200mg. Also are you injecting that much? Placing under the tongue? Or are you talking about some kind of skin lotion?

All your questions were literally just answered in the last two pages of this thread. You can only inject GHK or apply topically. Its not recommended any other way due to bioavailability/stability issues. Injection causes systemic effects while topical typically only causes topical effects.

Also, teamTLR is selling GHK for ~$100/g. That's where I got mine from.

 

 

How long was it before you noticed any effects of this peptide?  My lab rat is on his 3rd 25mg subq injection and says he doesn't notice anything.  However, he was a little apprehensive about being injected with something that was bright blue.

 

 

Day 5: Lab rat less apprehensive about being injected with what looks like blue toilet water.  No results or side effects.

 

 

How often is he getting the injection?
You might consider discussing a higher dose with him?

 

dz93:

"From personal experience, I can say that you won't get much of an effect from GHK at that dose. I was dosing GHK at 1mg twice daily and did not notice any effects. I bumped up my dosage to 100mg and noticed many effects. I lowered my dose to 50mg twice daily and the potency of those effects had not changed. Based on other reported doses, I would say an effective dose would be around 20mg - 30mg. I'm 22 so of course I'll need a much higher dosage to get any effects but I've been in contact with others much older than me who also didn't notice many effects until they got above 20mg.

I would highly recommend GHK, though. My experience with it was fantastic. To me, it seemed to be more effective then Epitalon was. At least when it comes to noticeable effects. I'll be looking forward to reading your report on it once you've tried it."

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=743314

 

Thx for the feedback.

Edited by Logic, 10 November 2015 - 03:24 PM.

[Rocket]

 

 

 

 

Where you people buying it that you're taking 50-100mg / day? The cheapest I've seen is about $200 for 200mg. Also are you injecting that much? Placing under the tongue? Or are you talking about some kind of skin lotion?

All your questions were literally just answered in the last two pages of this thread. You can only inject GHK or apply topically. Its not recommended any other way due to bioavailability/stability issues. Injection causes systemic effects while topical typically only causes topical effects.

Also, teamTLR is selling GHK for ~$100/g. That's where I got mine from.

 

 

How long was it before you noticed any effects of this peptide?  My lab rat is on his 3rd 25mg subq injection and says he doesn't notice anything.  However, he was a little apprehensive about being injected with something that was bright blue.

 

 

Day 5: Lab rat less apprehensive about being injected with what looks like blue toilet water.  No results or side effects.

 

 

How often is he getting the injection?
You might consider discussing a higher dose with him?

 

dz93:

"From personal experience, I can say that you won't get much of an effect from GHK at that dose. I was dosing GHK at 1mg twice daily and did not notice any effects. I bumped up my dosage to 100mg and noticed many effects. I lowered my dose to 50mg twice daily and the potency of those effects had not changed. Based on other reported doses, I would say an effective dose would be around 20mg - 30mg. I'm 22 so of course I'll need a much higher dosage to get any effects but I've been in contact with others much older than me who also didn't notice many effects until they got above 20mg.

I would highly recommend GHK, though. My experience with it was fantastic. To me, it seemed to be more effective then Epitalon was. At least when it comes to noticeable effects. I'll be looking forward to reading your report on it once you've tried it."

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=743314

 

Thx for the feedback.

 

 

My 195lb rat has agreed to 25mg/day first thing every morning on an empty stomach.  I had planned for this to be a 40 day experiment. 

I suppose tomorrow I will inject ratty with 50mg and try and force a response of some kind.  Ratty is technically middle aged, so I was hoping 25mg would be a good dose to stretch out $100 worth of peptides over 40 days.

 

One thing that I have noticed is that... in the past, I did research into gravity & relativity.  The last couple of days I started working on equations again I haven't touched in many years and my interest in mathematics is kind of sparked.  This could be a transitory effect due to some other reason and I'm hesitant to even lump it in with the GHK.

Edited by Rocket, 10 November 2015 - 07:06 PM.

[dz93]

Where you people buying it that you're taking 50-100mg / day? The cheapest I've seen is about $200 for 200mg. Also are you injecting that much? Placing under the tongue? Or are you talking about some kind of skin lotion?

All your questions were literally just answered in the last two pages of this thread. You can only inject GHK or apply topically. Its not recommended any other way due to bioavailability/stability issues. Injection causes systemic effects while topical typically only causes topical effects.

Also, teamTLR is selling GHK for ~$100/g. That's where I got mine from.

How long was it before you noticed any effects of this peptide? My lab rat is on his 3rd 25mg subq injection and says he doesn't notice anything. However, he was a little apprehensive about being injected with something that was bright blue.

Day 5: Lab rat less apprehensive about being injected with what looks like blue toilet water. No results or side effects.

How often is he getting the injection?
You might consider discussing a higher dose with him?

dz93:
"From personal experience, I can say that you won't get much of an effect from GHK at that dose. I was dosing GHK at 1mg twice daily and did not notice any effects. I bumped up my dosage to 100mg and noticed many effects. I lowered my dose to 50mg twice daily and the potency of those effects had not changed. Based on other reported doses, I would say an effective dose would be around 20mg - 30mg. I'm 22 so of course I'll need a much higher dosage to get any effects but I've been in contact with others much older than me who also didn't notice many effects until they got above 20mg.
I would highly recommend GHK, though. My experience with it was fantastic. To me, it seemed to be more effective then Epitalon was. At least when it comes to noticeable effects. I'll be looking forward to reading your report on it once you've tried it."
http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=743314

Thx for the feedback.

My 195lb rat has agreed to 25mg/day first thing every morning on an empty stomach. I had planned for this to be a 40 day experiment.
I suppose tomorrow I will inject ratty with 50mg and try and force a response of some kind. Ratty is technically middle aged, so I was hoping 25mg would be a good dose to stretch out $100 worth of peptides over 40 days.

To make deciding on a dose easier:
I am 22 years old, 135lbs, 5'8" tall, ~5% body fat. For me, 25mg twice daily worked best. Once in the morning and once at night.

If you read some of my past posts, I may have not been entirely clear on my dosing regime since I was still trying to find the sweet spot for me. The above is what I have found to work best for my body type. Feel free to ask me any question you may have. I won't have all the answers but I'll do my best to help haha.

[Logic]

More anecdotal reports from the Epitalon thread:

Gramson:
...tremendous benefits with ghk cu.  I also think this helps increase T4 cells in exposure to HIV. My friend is sexullay active and had exposure to HIV, seen in low t4 count. I gave4 her ghk cu, and the count is up.  willl follow up...

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=748652

 

dz93:

...Also, about GHK-Cu. I've learned that the effects of GHK-Cu are potentiated by ascorbic acid. I've also learned that GHK-Cu + Thymogen + Dalargin enhanced bone healing. Based on this, I will dose ascorbic acid when I dose GHK. I will also be purchasing Thymogen/thymalin and epitalon Amidate. Since studies have shown that thymalin and epitalon go well, I'd imagine GHK-Cu + Thymalin/Thymogen + Epitalon would go great together. Once I get all those, I'll report on whatever effects I notice from taking them together. What are your thoughts on this?...

http://dx.doi.org/10.1155/2015/648108

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=748656

 

...Its not anecdotal. Its briefly mentioned in the source I posted. I'm unsure of how much Ascorbic Acid potentiates it and when I dosed the two together I did not notice an increase in effects but I only say that because anything I did notice wasn't significant enough for me to believe the ascorbic acid had any immediate effect. The only thing I can say about that is I tried it when I was intentionally using GHK to heal a bad wound and I did notice a slight increase in healing speed and it healed much better than it normally would have. I drank some orange juice (made from 8+ fresh oranges) and injected 25mg of GHK. I also used a concentrated (~50mg) amount applied directly on the wound itself.

So, I want to say that my experience with GHK and ascorbic acid is extremely anecdotal and I can't rule out the placebo effect yet. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to tell if direct application better helped with healing when compared to injection. Basically, I can't offer anything of use right now haha. All I can say is that, based on the few days I tried it, GHK seems to work slightly better when taken with ascorbic acid. I'd go for natural sources instead of supplementing...

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=750843

 

...I want to share as much of my experiences as possible so I can help draw attention to GHK but at the same time I really don't want to be too detailed due to confirmation bias. However, since GHK has such broad effects, I'd imagine the experiences will greatly differ. For example, I must have had poor gut health which is why I had experienced diarrhea initially. As I continued to take it, that side effect had greatly diminished and my guts felt much better than before. I have yet to hear of anyone else reporting diarrhea as a side effect. So it is my assumption that the effects will greatly vary among people...

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=750853

 

Rocket:

Here is my log of GHK:

Day 5 of 25mg/day every morning.  No results.

http://www.longecity...ndpost&p=750858
 

 

"The effects of GHK-Cu are potentiated by ascorbic acid" wrung a bell:

 

Me:

L-threonate represses the glycoprotein dickkopf-1 (Dkk-1) via alkaline phosphatase activity; releasing ascorbic acid into the cell.
This enhances neurogenesis in the hippocampus, and stops papilla cells from dying and the hair-producing outer root sheath cells from stopping to work.

So perhaps we get the same amount of Magnesium from the L-Threonate form as any other, but its the vitamin C inside the cell, causing neurogenisis, that adds the extra brainy effect.

 

Ukko:

1. Problem: Vitamin C in the ascorbic acid form does not cross the BBB to brain. Traditionally, it was thought that it was the dehydroascorbic acid form how vitamin C got to the brain. Using glucose transports given the similarity between glucose and Vit c chemically. http://www.ncbi.nlm....cles/PMC508490/

2. Vitamin C is hugely important for brain function. We should all know that low brain vitamin C leads to low dopamine. Uncool, don't want that. What is also known is that vitamin C is needed for healthy BDNF production. Lots of studies on that...start from here: http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/15627972

3. How does Mg threonate fit into the picture? Well, its other part is threonic acid a molecule closely related to ascorbic acid. In fact, its breakdown product. Put there is increasingly data on threonic acid being able to do whatever ascorbic acid does, even preventing scurvy the classic syptom of vitamin C deficieny. Irrelevant whether threonic acid can actually be converted back to ascorbic acid or whether when we speak of scurcy and vitamin C deficiency, we are actually talking about threonic acid deficiency. Guess what? Threonic acid is up to 4 times better as vitamin C than ascorbic acid itself in that it prevents scurvy four times better than ascorbic acid. Wow. http://www.immunesup...ws/94spr002.htm It also hugely boosts cell uptake of ascorbic acid, maybe this is the mechanism. But it does not matter. Threonic acid makes the vitamin C metabolism work vastly better and it crosses over to brain through the BBB, at least when bound to a mineral like magnesium.

 

http://www.longecity...osteoarthritis/

 

Edited by Logic, 11 November 2015 - 01:36 PM.

[dz93]

Thanks Logic! That last part about L-Threonate is actually very interesting because I've been considering getting some try out. Perhaps using that may give better results when combined with GHK compared to ascorbic acid. I only have four doses left of GHK so I may decide to wait until I get more GHK before trying that out.

[Logic]

Thanks Logic! That last part about L-Threonate is actually very interesting because I've been considering getting some try out. Perhaps using that may give better results when combined with GHK compared to ascorbic acid. I only have four doses left of GHK so I may decide to wait until I get more GHK before trying that out.

 

I thought you might think so dz93.  

Do let us know how it goes.

[tolerant]

I'd just like to inform everyone that for the past few weeks I have been in contact with Forty Six & Two. He had offered to pay for product testing in full. He gave me the information to one of his private labs, which he wishes to kept secret as "intellectual property" and I've agreed to that. I did check into the lab and everything was in check with them. I had sent in one of my samples of the GHK blend to the lab to be tested. After about a week they were able to give us the results. I have included the full report below. The information of the lab and lab assistant had been removed from the report as TLR had kindly requested. Niner was also in contact with Forty Six & Two and he also knows the full information of the lab and exactly what was going on with the product testing. After the first initial test, Niner had recommended a different testing procedure to try to prove beyond doubt that the sample is authentic. The lab was unable to seperate GHK from GHK-Cu but they were aboiut to tell that the sample does contain GHK >98% as well as having Cu present. I think it's safe to say now that we did get what we paid for.

 

Hi dz93 (Алексей?),

 

I am glad that the product turned out to be legitimate and I've followed your posts on the positive effects you've had from it. However, the analysis you described is in no way independent. To do a proper independent analysis you would have had to send your sample to a lab which is not aware who the vendor is. If the vendor is generous enough to pay for such analysis, you can then invoice them. Analysis at a lab nominated by the vendor, let alone one which the vendor does not wish to disclose publicly is bordering on ridiculous. Furthermore, even if the analysis is legit, there is no guarantee that the analysis was carried out on your sample.

 

On reading the attached report, I can see that you had some learned exchanges with the lab. So you must have knowledge of chemistry. If those exchanges revealed that the lab was knowing what it was doing (and it's something I can't tell), then that of course strengthens the value of the report. But in the future you really should send stuff to a lab which hasn't even heard of the vendor and which the vendor hasn't even heard of. Check my analysis of Wuhan HengHeDa's product done about a year ago in the NSI-189 thread.

 

Anyway, I'm glad you were able to confirm the legitimacy of the product and alleviate suspicion which seems to dominate this market. And I'm glad it's working so well for you.

 

Kind regards,

 

tolerant

Edited by tolerant, 13 November 2015 - 01:13 AM.

[Forty Six & 2]

Most labs charge exorbitant costs for such testing. We found a lab that was at least reasonable. We proactively did such to make feasible to coordinate third party independent testing. This was within after the efforts of several people who tried to coordinate the group buy community for third party testing came up empty.

Before we proceeded with the testing, we asked for dz to review the lab for his approval in confidence in their authenticity and qualifications, which he found more than satisfactory. Thus we proceeded in all good manner and faith within electing dz to submit the sample with true chain of custody. As noted prior, dz was chosen due to his sincere and genuine efforts to finds means to have the material tested, though he could not himself achieve any success within this and with members of the group buy. As well, we sensed dz was one of honor and integrity.

As such the lab is known by dz who we would think others would see as honorable, trustworthy, and unbiased. As well, niner, a head moderator of Longecity and a person with expert background in this area, was also made aware of the lab and found all to be credible and well conducted.

Within practical contexts I believe we did all we could and all is in more than good order to qualify as a head to toe well conducted third party assay with authentication of chain of custody.

Unless you wish to expressly imply we have a lab that we are in collusion with I do not see validity to your point.

I'd like to feel we went over and above the call of duty here and to imply such collusion seems in poor judgment and taste. Further, it insults dz and niner who were involved within independently assessing by their standards that all was being well conducted and with integrity, on the up and up shall we say.

Obviously as well, research conducted with the material has displayed positive efficacy without engendering any adverse effects, which demonstrates the worth of the material in a practical manner and results are authentic to published studies supporting what benefits are demonstrated by the material.

Again to reiterate, we elected to do this as best as we possibly had means via our own proactive stance which was not deemed our responsibility to do so, but was voluntary. We went about it in the most thorough manner to be on point with the integrity of the testing.

Certainly we were not able to accommodate some random elected lab by someone from the group and bear the expense of a nature that is exorbitant, as was being found.

I assume all this is clearly rational and within acceptable standards shows integrity and validity within the testing conducted.

Edited by Forty Six & 2, 13 November 2015 - 01:51 AM.

[Rocket]

Day 9 of 25mg administered via subq injection.  No noticeable effects. 

 

I wonder if the peptide is broken by the body too quickly?

[tolerant]

Forty Six & 2,

 

I am really sorry if you were offended by my post. When I was writing it, I wasn't thinking of your conduct at all, I was thinking about the analysis carried out by dz93 (together with niner as I have since become aware). I know only the briefest summary of the story from this post, which Logic kindly wrote in response to my question, and my advice to dz93 was based solely on this post, because I only read the few pages which Logic referred me to. If I understand the facts correctly, you are the party which has been wronged in this case and I am not not accusing, judging or implying anything directed against you. I don't really have any doubts about the legitimacy of your product, especially because of dz93's and niner's work, and will probably be ordering some myself! So I thank them and I am not ciritisising the for anything. I'm just suggesting of what I think is a better way of doing an independent analysis. As for exorbitant prices of doring such an analysis, when I did my NSI-189 analysis, I was quoted around $700 by a commercial lab, but did more searching and found a univesity lab which did it for $200. In the end the cost was shared amongst the forum membrs interested in this product. In your case, I believe it should have been the competitor who publicly wrongly acccused you of selling a fake product who should have paid for the analysis you carried out. 

 

And again, I'm sorry, When I was writing the original post, I should have given thought to the fact that it could unfairly make you look bad.

 

Kind regards,

 

tolerant

 

 

 

Edited by tolerant, 14 November 2015 - 02:14 AM.

[david ellis]

Day 9 of 25mg administered via subq injection.  No noticeable effects. 

 

I wonder if the peptide is broken by the body too quickly?

from Pickart's skinbiology website:

 

"From my previous studies, we know the amount of GHK-Copper needed to activate strong systemic healing of skin throughout the body in mice, rats, and pigs. This should be the same as that needed to increase P63 and activate epithelial stem cells since wound healing proceeds via stem cell actions. GHK-Copper must also activate other types of adult stem cells since it has strong healing actions on on the stomach, intestinal linings and bone tissue. Approximately, 75 milligrams of GHK-Copper injected three times a week should be sufficient to activate human stem cells and improve the function of organs in older individuals. It is possible that GHK-Copper might be effective as an oral supplement enclosed in special liposomes that are taken up by the lymphatic system to avoid possible breakdown by intestinal enzymes.

The 75 milligram level of GHK-Copper should be very safe and is 280-fold below expected negative actions of the molecule caused by its blood pressure lowering actions.

In cell culture studies, GHK-copper increases differentiation of embryonic stem cells. However, in an organ culture system, GHK-copper "activated" adult stem cells which then produced more keratinocytes."

 

 "In 1975, during attempts to isolate GHK from human blood, we found that the molecule was especially vulnerable to carboxypeptidases and was rapidly degraded by blood enzymes.  Intradermal injections of GHK are cleared from the skin in approximately 30 seconds. If added to blood, GHK is rapidly degraded into constituent amino acids by blood enzymes."

 

Because blood enzymes destroy GHK-cu, probably the three injections a week recommended are peritoneal.

Edited by david ellis, 14 November 2015 - 11:21 PM.

[niner]

"In 1975, during attempts to isolate GHK from human blood, we found that the molecule was especially vulnerable to carboxypeptidases and was rapidly degraded by blood enzymes.  Intradermal injections of GHK are cleared from the skin in approximately 30 seconds. If added to blood, GHK is rapidly degraded into constituent amino acids by blood enzymes."

Because blood enzymes destroy GHK-cu, probably the three injections a week recommended are peritoneal.

 

Boy, it would be nice to get this sorted out.  I don't get how intradermal injections of GHK can be cleared that fast.  How does this work at all if it's degraded in an instant?   The phrase "GHK is rapidly degraded" is a lot more vague.  Does that mean it's gone in even less than 30 seconds?  Or in 30 minutes?   Has no one ever done a pharmacokinetic analysis on this?  Anyone want to ask Pickart what kind of injections he means?  With an IP injection, it eventually gets into general circulation, so there's no keeping it away from blood.

[Ark]

"In 1975, during attempts to isolate GHK from human blood, we found that the molecule was especially vulnerable to carboxypeptidases and was rapidly degraded by blood enzymes. Intradermal injections of GHK are cleared from the skin in approximately 30 seconds. If added to blood, GHK is rapidly degraded into constituent amino acids by blood enzymes."

Because blood enzymes destroy GHK-cu, probably the three injections a week recommended are peritoneal.

Boy, it would be nice to get this sorted out. I don't get how intradermal injections of GHK can be cleared that fast. How does this work at all if it's degraded in an instant? The phrase "GHK is rapidly degraded" is a lot more vague. Does that mean it's gone in even less than 30 seconds? Or in 30 minutes? Has no one ever done a pharmacokinetic analysis on this? Anyone want to ask Pickart what kind of injections he means? With an IP injection, it eventually gets into general circulation, so there's no keeping it away from blood.

If that may be, why not do a IV bag of GHK aside from cost?

Edited by Ark, 15 November 2015 - 05:11 AM.

[dz93]

"In 1975, during attempts to isolate GHK from human blood, we found that the molecule was especially vulnerable to carboxypeptidases and was rapidly degraded by blood enzymes. Intradermal injections of GHK are cleared from the skin in approximately 30 seconds. If added to blood, GHK is rapidly degraded into constituent amino acids by blood enzymes."

Because blood enzymes destroy GHK-cu, probably the three injections a week recommended are peritoneal.

Boy, it would be nice to get this sorted out. I don't get how intradermal injections of GHK can be cleared that fast. How does this work at all if it's degraded in an instant? The phrase "GHK is rapidly degraded" is a lot more vague. Does that mean it's gone in even less than 30 seconds? Or in 30 minutes? Has no one ever done a pharmacokinetic analysis on this? Anyone want to ask Pickart what kind of injections he means? With an IP injection, it eventually gets into general circulation, so there's no keeping it away from blood.

If that may be, why not do a IV bag of GHK aside from cost?

Ideally, research could be conducted to figure out which enzyme breaks it down, then inhibit that enzyme. Unless inhibition of that enzyme would cause significant side effects. I wonder if there would be a way to modify GHK so it would retain its effects but wouldn't be degraded by the enzymes.

However, I think I've read on here that, even though GHK is broken down fast, it sets off a chain reaction of some sort. I'd try to find it again but its a pain navigating the forums on my phone.

[Ark]

"In 1975, during attempts to isolate GHK from human blood, we found that the molecule was especially vulnerable to carboxypeptidases and was rapidly degraded by blood enzymes. Intradermal injections of GHK are cleared from the skin in approximately 30 seconds. If added to blood, GHK is rapidly degraded into constituent amino acids by blood enzymes."

Because blood enzymes destroy GHK-cu, probably the three injections a week recommended are peritoneal.

Boy, it would be nice to get this sorted out. I don't get how intradermal injections of GHK can be cleared that fast. How does this work at all if it's degraded in an instant? The phrase "GHK is rapidly degraded" is a lot more vague. Does that mean it's gone in even less than 30 seconds? Or in 30 minutes? Has no one ever done a pharmacokinetic analysis on this? Anyone want to ask Pickart what kind of injections he means? With an IP injection, it eventually gets into general circulation, so there's no keeping it away from blood.

If that may be, why not do a IV bag of GHK aside from cost?

Ideally, research could be conducted to figure out which enzyme breaks it down, then inhibit that enzyme. Unless inhibition of that enzyme would cause significant side effects. I wonder if there would be a way to modify GHK so it would retain its effects but wouldn't be degraded by the enzymes.

However, I think I've read on here that, even though GHK is broken down fast, it sets off a chain reaction of some sort. I'd try to find it again but its a pain navigating the forums on my phone.

I'm not sure I subscribe to the chain reaction theory. It's like micro dowsing trans-res, in theory it works but reality the body has to many defenses to cause a systemic reaction without the appropriate dose/saturation.

[david ellis]

 

Day 9 of 25mg administered via subq injection.  No noticeable effects. 

 

I wonder if the peptide is broken by the body too quickly?

from Pickart's skinbiology website:

 

Approximately, 75 milligrams of GHK-Copper injected three times a week should be sufficient to activate human stem cells and improve the function of organs in older individuals. It is possible that GHK-Copper might be effective as an oral supplement enclosed in special liposomes that are taken up by the lymphatic system to avoid possible breakdown by intestinal enzymes.

 

 

 

75 mg three times a week is deemed sufficient by Dr Pickart.    It seems that Dr Pickart believes that intradermal and subdermal are not satisfactory.   What injection method is satisfactory?