22 replies to this topic

[Kalliste]

A friend of mine has gone nuts over colloidal silver. It's the cure for everything. Now he is feeding it to his kids, spraying their noses with it and dripping it in their eyes.

 

He says that it's impossible for them to develop argyria since he has a type of silver that is not a salt. (Or something like that).

Personally I don't think it's a bad idea to add a little bit as a supplement every now and then, but I don't buy into the megadosing theories that roll around the internet.

 

I wouldn't mind if he turned blue, but it seems a bit crazy to be experimenting with others. Any suggestions for how I might talk some sense with this individual?

 

Edited by Cosmicalstorm, 16 November 2014 - 09:27 AM.

[krillin]

Is this the kind of silver he's using?

 

Clin Exp Dermatol. 2003 May;28(3):254-6.

Severe generalized argyria secondary to ingestion of colloidal silver protein.

White JM, Powell AM, Brady K, Russell-Jones R. 

Abstract 

Argyria is a rare cause of cutaneous discolouration caused by silver deposition. We report a case of dramatic and diffuse argyria secondary to ingestion of colloidal silver protein over a 1-year period. Stained electron microscopy with spectral analysis was used to confirm the clinical diagnosis. Silver-protein complexes are deposited in the skin and reduced to inert silver salts by sunlight in a process similar to that harnessed in photography. Our patient had obtained the silver for consumption via mail order. It had been advertised as a cure for a variety of diseases. Colloidal silver protein is commercially available as a 'food supplement', hence circumventing the strict controls placed on medicines. 

PMID:     12780705

[Kalliste]

It's bought in the shape of water mixed with 10 ppm silver ions. The company selling it has a product page in Swedish but I guess the picture makes some sense even without translation.

http://ion-silver.com/silver.htm

 

I've asked about the possibility of argyria but it's being dismissed as "impossible" because of the form the silver is delivered in. Namely as an ion.

[niner]

It's bought in the shape of water mixed with 10 ppm silver ions. The company selling it has a product page in Swedish but I guess the picture makes some sense even without translation.

http://ion-silver.com/silver.htm

 

I've asked about the possibility of argyria but it's being dismissed as "impossible" because of the form the silver is delivered in. Namely as an ion.

 

That seems like exactly what would cause argyria.  If the guy wants to use it on himself, I don't see a problem, but if he cosmetically disfigures his kids, that would suck.  He might face legal action were that to occur, or at least a lifetime of regret that he turned his kids into freaks.  Why does he think the kids need silver in the first place?  Do they not have functioning immune systems?

[Kalliste]

No problems with them as far as I know. Just a case of believe too much in supplement x. The problem is that he is semi knowledgeable about silver because he spends time on a facebook board for other believers.

[niner]

Hmm.  Semi-knowledgeable about silver by dint of hanging out on a FB board, (schnorrk) but as my dad used to say, I'll bet he doesn't know shit from Shinola about the health sciences.

[Joe Monroe]

The cases of argyria are mostly false reports of people using other silver containing substances. The other cases of argyria are mostly from older reports of colloidal silver when they used actual silver and in large quantities. I don't see anything wrong with colloidal silver. I have a bottle of it, I don't really use it though, I prefer MMS. I dunno why I guess I just know more about it and know that how much I take and use is safe and effective... I've been using it for over 4 years now so I guess I'm just more familiar with it. 

[Dolph]

The cases of argyria are mostly false reports of people using other silver containing substances. The other cases of argyria are mostly from older reports of colloidal silver when they used actual silver and in large quantities. I don't see anything wrong with colloidal silver. I have a bottle of it, I don't really use it though, I prefer MMS. I dunno why I guess I just know more about it and know that how much I take and use is safe and effective... I've been using it for over 4 years now so I guess I'm just more familiar with it. 

 

Mmm... well... http://en.wikipedia....g–Kruger_effect

 

I think longecity should make some kind of intelligence test mandatory to register for the forum. Just to sort out people that spread bullshit like that. A very easy one would obviously do. 

[Joe Monroe]

 

The cases of argyria are mostly false reports of people using other silver containing substances. The other cases of argyria are mostly from older reports of colloidal silver when they used actual silver and in large quantities. I don't see anything wrong with colloidal silver. I have a bottle of it, I don't really use it though, I prefer MMS. I dunno why I guess I just know more about it and know that how much I take and use is safe and effective... I've been using it for over 4 years now so I guess I'm just more familiar with it. 

 

Mmm... well... http://en.wikipedia....g–Kruger_effect

 

I think longecity should make some kind of intelligence test mandatory to register for the forum. Just to sort out people that spread bullshit like that. A very easy one would obviously do. 

 

 I I have no idea why you linked that considering I was never declaring anything about being smarter than anyone. I simply was stating I know more about MMS than coloidal silver because I've done plenty of research on it versus little on colloidal silver. 

 

If you are referring to my decision to use MMS, than I'm sorry you feel that way and I'd encourage you to educate yourself more on the topic: http://mmswiki.is/in..._Science_of_MMS

[Kalliste]

The cases of argyria are mostly false reports of people using other silver containing substances. The other cases of argyria are mostly from older reports of colloidal silver when they used actual silver and in large quantities. I don't see anything wrong with colloidal silver. I have a bottle of it, I don't really use it though, I prefer MMS. I dunno why I guess I just know more about it and know that how much I take and use is safe and effective... I've been using it for over 4 years now so I guess I'm just more familiar with it. 

 

This is in essence what I have been told re my concern about Argyria "It's different silver, it's stupid researchers.. etc".

Personally I really don't mind a little bit of colloidal silver, but what evidence is there that the ion form does not bio-accumulate like other forms of silver. Has this been tested?

[Logic]

I looked into and used CS and Ionic silver way back.
There is just not enough research done on the stuff IMHO, but I can speak about effects as I have always thought it a good idea to personally test things that are available, rather than write them off due to some sensationalist blue people on Ophra etc.
It always seemed to me that there was enough bad press on CS to make me wonder if someone was trying to hide something...

CS does work very well for disinfecting wounds as it does not burn (kill healthy tissue?) and cuts and scrapes heal up fast.
This may have something to do with telomerase activation as there is a study saying that it does activate telomerase initially, then not, if I remember correctly.

Next I applied the stuff to my scalp/hair 3 to 4 times a day for about 3 days to see what it would do to dandruff. I no longer have dandruff.

After that I tested it on coughs, colds and flus in myself and others.
In many, but not all, cases it worked very well with coughs disappearing immediately and colds and flus following suite.

Next I can tell of an ear infection that was cured after 1 application and caused a doctor that was seen anyway (the person took of work) to become angry.

I noticed some weight loss during one bought of flu? and continued to take CS 2 to 3 times a day for about 3 months and lost about 30kg. I think this was due to CS killing off gut bacteria as my stools were very pale, almost white, and floaters.
I noticed a very slight change in complexion which I was watching for and stopped.

I feel that argeria may be from Silver reacting with chloride in stomach acid if swallowed and sweat if applied topically. (Silver chloride is bright blue)
This can be avoided by using it buccally (swishing for 5 minutes and spitting it out, or swallowing only small amounts for a sore throat.
I only apply it topically when I am not going to be sweating before my next bath and have been using it these ways when the need arises ever since as it saves a lot on doctors visits.

I did notice a negative effect on mood in one family member (depression)and have seen studies showing neurotoxicity.
This seems o have something to do with the size of the colloid with certain sizes not being good.
More research is required, but I wouldn't count on seeing any soon.
Perhaps the colloidal gold research applies?

This is why I now only use CS when the need arises and avoid swallowing much, although I am careful to keep dosing for a while after symptoms disappear and take/administer brain protectors like Curcumin and Lithium at the same time FWIW.

If you do a pubmed search for 'Colloidal' or 'ionic silver' you will not find much. Adding 'silver Nanoparticles' to the search yields way more results.

CS is really effective at killing off most infections and worthy of more research IMHO.
If I catch a nasty, deadly infection however; I can assure you that Id rather be a depro Papa Smurf than be fucking dead!

Edited by Logic, 18 November 2014 - 03:39 PM.

[ceridwen]

I always found it interesting that Indian Gods are blue like the aristocracy of ancient India took loads of the stuff. Turning themselves blue and setting themselves apart from the commoners in that way. Is that possible?

[Kalliste]

I don't write it off completely. I'm willing to try it, both as a small supplement every now and then in case this is something we miss out on thanks to industry-agriculture. I'm also willing to try it for a short time during a bad cold/flu. Dose makes poison etc. What worries me is constant mega-dosing and the idea that it might mutate into something different inside the GI tract. I did now know about the sweat aspect.

I always found it interesting that Indian Gods are blue like the aristocracy of ancient India took loads of the stuff. Turning themselves blue and setting themselves apart from the commoners in that way. Is that possible?

 

Sounds like the kind of trickery religious gurus would be good at. I wonder if it could happen from simply wearing tons of silver-chains in humid conditions.

[Logic]

Ye; your friend is overdoing it Cosmicalstorm.
If you do a google site search you will probably find the study on neurotoxicity here.

About sweat/AgCl: The above are just my thoughts/theory, not from any study I have read.
My complexion is back to normal btw.

There is some talk on the net about 'Blue Bloods' being called so due to all the silver from their cutlery and them surviving the plagues better for it. Difficult to prove without digging up an old king though.

[Dolph]

 

 

If you are referring to my decision to use MMS, than I'm sorry you feel that way and I'd encourage you to educate yourself more on the topic: http://mmswiki.is/in..._Science_of_MMS

 

 

This must easily qualify as the new absolute low of this forum. There are many retarded and some dangerous practices that get pushed on this forum, but MMS is so outright hilariously stupid and obviously bullshit AND dangerous that I have a hard time not to call you what you are. 

[chemicalambrosia]

From the Chlorine Dioxide wikipedia:

 

Chlorine dioxide is toxic, hence limits on exposure to it are needed to ensure its safe use. The United States Environmental Protection Agency has set a maximum level of 0.8 mg/L for chlorine dioxide in drinking water.^[27] The Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA), an agency of the United States Department of Labor, has set an 8 hour permissible exposure limit of 0.1 ppm in air (0.3 milligrams per cubic meter (mg/m³) for people working with chlorine dioxide.^[28]

On July 30, 2010 and again on October 1, 2010, the United States Food and Drug Administration (FDA), warned against the use of the product "Miracle Mineral Supplement" or "MMS", which when made up according to instructions produces chlorine dioxide. MMS has been marketed as a treatment for a variety of conditions, including HIV, cancer, autism, and acne. The FDA warnings informed consumers that MMS can cause serious harm to health, and stated that it has received numerous reports of nausea, severe vomiting, and life-threatening low blood pressure caused by dehydration,^[29][30] among other symptoms, such as diarrhea.

 

 

[niner]

This is in essence what I have been told re my concern about Argyria "It's different silver, it's stupid researchers.. etc".

Personally I really don't mind a little bit of colloidal silver, but what evidence is there that the ion form does not bio-accumulate like other forms of silver. Has this been tested?

 

I don't know of any evidence to that effect.  Argyria can be caused either by silver or silver compounds.  This includes ionic forms of silver.  I can see that you're up against a problem here, as anything that doesn't agree with this guy's preconceived notions appears to be dismissed.

[meth_use_lah]

CS seems interesting vs chronic treatment resistant infections, but I would definitely not advocate drinking it daily and using it for whatever and I would ABSOLUTELY NOT GIVE IT TO MY KIDS (If I had any).

 

Daily exposure to silver nanoparticles during prepubertal development decreases adult sperm and reproductive parameters.

 

 

Abstract

Abstract As silver nanoparticles (AgNPs) have antimicrobial properties and potentiate the activity of some antibiotics, they are broadly used in both medical and nonmedical applications. In this study, prepubertal male Wistar rats were orally treated with 15 or 30 µg/kg/day AgNPs from postnatal day 23 (PND23) to PND58 and sacrificed at PND102. The acrosome integrity, plasma membrane integrity, mitochondrial activity and morphological alterations of the sperm were analyzed. Sexual partner preference, sexual behavior and the serum concentrations of FSH, LH, testosterone and estradiol were also recorded. The results were evaluated following the appropriate statistical analyses, and differences among the groups were considered significant when p < 0.05. AgNPs reduced the acrosome and plasma membrane integrities, reduced the mitochondrial activity and increased the abnormalities of the sperm in both treatment groups. AgNP exposure also delayed the onset of puberty, although no changes in body growth were observed in either treatment group. The animals did not show changes in sexual behavior or serum hormone concentrations. This study shows for the first time that prepubertal exposure to AgNPs causes alterations in adult sperm parameters. Importantly, the sperm appeared to be more sensitive to the toxic effects of AgNPs and demonstrated adverse effects following exposure to lower doses. Consequently, the effects of AgNPs on sperm should be considered in order to establish safety limits for the use of these particles.

 

Silver nanoparticles (AgNPs) cause degeneration of cytoskeleton and disrupt synaptic machinery of cultured cortical neurons.

 

 

Abstract

BACKGROUND:

Silver nanoparticles (AgNPs), owing to their effective antimicrobial properties, are being widely used in a broad range of applications. These include, but are not limited to, antibacterial materials, the textile industry, cosmetics, coatings of various household appliances and medical devices. Despite their extensive use, little is known about AgNP safety and toxicity vis-à-vis human and animal health. Recent studies have drawn attention towards potential neurotoxic effects of AgNPs, however, the primary cellular and molecular targets of AgNP action/s remain to be defined.

RESULTS:

Here we examine the effects of ultra fine scales (20 nm) of AgNPs at various concentrations (1, 5, 10 and 50 μg/ml) on primary rat cortical cell cultures. We found that AgNPs (at 1-50 μg/ml) not only inhibited neurite outgrowth and reduced cell viability of premature neurons and glial cells, but also induced degeneration of neuronal processes of mature neurons. Our immunocytochemistry and confocal microscopy studies further demonstrated that AgNPs induced the loss of cytoskeleton components such as the β-tubulin and filamentous actin (F-actin). AgNPs also dramatically reduced the number of synaptic clusters of the presynaptic vesicle protein synaptophysin, and the postsynaptic receptor density protein PSD-95. Finally, AgNP exposure also resulted in mitochondria dysfunction in rat cortical cells.

CONCLUSIONS:

Taken together, our data show that AgNPs induce toxicity in neurons, which involves degradation of cytoskeleton components, perturbations of pre- and postsynaptic proteins, and mitochondrial dysfunction leading to cell death. Our study clearly demonstrates the potential detrimental effects of AgNPs on neuronal development and physiological functions and warns against its prolific usage.

 

There are also studies reporting kidney and liver damage although you seem to be able to attune that effect by combining administration of CS with some potent antioxidant.

 

There is also the speculative issue of bacteria developing resistance to silver particles (and antibiotics) by evolving a thicker protective shell vs silver nanoparticles.

 

Edited by meth_use_lah, 02 January 2015 - 11:07 AM.

[Kalliste]

Sadly the person in question refuses to believe any of this. The local salesman has advised silvernut that any science contradicting CS is fraudulent.
But thank for posting that!

Edited by Cosmicalstorm, 02 January 2015 - 12:18 PM.

[Kalliste]

The subject of Hormesis came up in another discussion,My friend brought that response in our silverdebate. "Maybe colloidal silver is a hormetic agent? Some poisoning, but not too much stimulates the cellular defensesystems, lysosomes etc to speed up." Im not qualified about the toxicology at all so I wonder what others make of that claim?

Edited by Cosmicalstorm, 06 January 2015 - 01:34 PM.

[niner]

The subject of Hormesis came up in another discussion,My friend brought that response in our silverdebate. "Maybe colloidal silver is a hormetic agent? Some poisoning, but not too much stimulates the cellular defensesystems, lysosomes etc to speed up." Im not qualified about the toxicology at all so I wonder what others make of that claim?

 

He's reaching for reasons to stick with this stuff that he has some sort of attachment to.  Most things that are poisonous are just poisonous period.  They can only be hormetic if there's an existing response mechanism that they might upregulate.   There are cases where you can develop a degree of resistance to some poisons by upregulating the enzymes that metabolize them, but that's not what I would call hormesis.

[AlexCanada]

Unusual side effect:  Stings for me at the tip of my pen-s.  This has happened before from Colloidal Silver. 

 

Why does this happen for me though?    I had 3 drops today. And 2 drops yesterday. Today it really started up. I have confirmed it happened before on Silver months ago. 

Edited by AlexCanada, 26 December 2017 - 06:07 AM.

[sensei]

 

 

 

If you are referring to my decision to use MMS, than I'm sorry you feel that way and I'd encourage you to educate yourself more on the topic: http://mmswiki.is/in..._Science_of_MMS

 

 

This must easily qualify as the new absolute low of this forum. There are many retarded and some dangerous practices that get pushed on this forum, but MMS is so outright hilariously stupid and obviously bullshit AND dangerous that I have a hard time not to call you what you are. 

 

This^^^ +++

 

MMS and MMS2 are snake oil bullshit.