21 replies to this topic

[Stanfoo]

what are the best substances that increases deep sleep

[Plasticperson]

growth hormone releasing peptide... you will wake up feeling numb 

[Strelok]

growth hormone releasing peptide... you will wake up feeling numb 

 

I would tend to agree, though I've only woke up feeling anything close to numb a couple of times.  Currently using Ipamorelin and MOD GRF 1-29.

 

I don't sleep great every night I use it, but I sleep much better with it than without. 

[3mp0w3r]

Doesn't waking up numb defeat the original reason for using it (ie. to wake up feeling well rested and energetic)?  

 

I might be assuming things here but my guess is that the original poster wanted deeper sleep but not longer sleep.  

 

That being said, I am curious about the GH releasing peptides.  Do they result in measurable increases in GH?  

[penisbreath]

growth hormone releasing peptide... you will wake up feeling numb 

 

Numb? Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

 

Glycine helps with deep sleep (though makes me depressed with continual use); cyproheptadine (via 5-ht2a antagonism) is good too ..

[Galaxyshock]

Reishi (long-term)

Cordyceps

Lavender

 

Gabapentin

GHB

[Plasticperson]

bacon makes me very tired and not a gaba out of it tired either

[Flex]

Kava Kava,  but the deeper the sleep the more its unlikely to wake up if e.g. Your breath stucks like by sleep apnea & etc. 

[12 String]

 

 In young subjects, high-dose MK-677 treatment resulted in an approximately 50% increase in the duration of stage IV and in a more than 20% increase in REM sleep as compared to placebo (p < 0.05). The frequency of deviations from normal sleep decreased from 42% under placebo to 8% under high-dose MK-677 (p < 0.03). In older adults, treatment with MK-677 was associated with a nearly 50% increase in REM sleep (p < 0.05) and a decrease in REM latency (p < 0.02). The frequency of deviations from normal sleep also decreased (p < 0.02). 

http://www.ncbi.nlm..../pubmed/9349662

 

N=1, I'd fall in the "older adults" section, and didn't notice any improvement. YMMV.

[crazepharmacist]

I've noticed sleeping deeper when dosing delta sleep inducing peptide before bed but experiences vary. 

[Plasticperson]

bacon makes me very tired and not a gaba out of it tired either

hahahahahaha

 

i didn't realize this till now but my phone autocorrect bacopa to bacon lol

[3mp0w3r]

 

bacon makes me very tired and not a gaba out of it tired either

hahahahahaha

 

i didn't realize this till now but my phone autocorrect bacopa to bacon lol

 

 

I thought it was an odd response.  I start my day with bacon  

[jonnyD]

 

bacon makes me very tired and not a gaba out of it tired either

hahahahahaha

 

i didn't realize this till now but my phone autocorrect bacopa to bacon lol

 

 

It is interesting that bacopa seems to act very different. I am more or less unable to sleep when i take bacopa (waking up ten times or more per night). 

[Logic]

If GH release results in better sleep,  gelatine may be worth looking at as it increases the natural HGH spike that happens around 2 hours into sleep by up to 6X:
http://www.ergo-log....gelatinegh.html

The repair of cartilage and improvements in skin would be a bonus.

[Adamzski]

I will try some gelatine.

What about things as simple as something that reduces the urge to go to the toilet. I find that these days and maybe its because im getting to some midle age, im woken up by the urge to urinate, i am at a stage now where i have a lot of work on my mind so as soon as im up im going again with little chance of going back to sleep.

I sleep 6-8hrs these days and my sleep tracking app says that i get on average double the amount of deep sleep as most people. Would be great to extend the deep cycles or get another one in.

[jonnyD]

I will try some gelatine.

What about things as simple as something that reduces the urge to go to the toilet. I find that these days and maybe its because im getting to some midle age, im woken up by the urge to urinate, i am at a stage now where i have a lot of work on my mind so as soon as im up im going again with little chance of going back to sleep.

I sleep 6-8hrs these days and my sleep tracking app says that i get on average double the amount of deep sleep as most people. Would be great to extend the deep cycles or get another one in.

 

What sleep app tells you about the "average of deep sleep" ?

[focus83]

Three powerful ones: Phenibut, Baclofen and Pregabalin (Lyrica). Any of these will likely give you deep, refreshing sleep.

[Galaxyshock]

Also, very low carbohydrate diet seems to increase slow wave sleep:

http://www.ncbi.nlm....pubmed/18681982

 

Perhaps coconut oil can mimic this by releasing ketones. I put a tablespoon of it in my night-time tea that usually contains at least Reishi and Lavender, often I also add things like Chamomile, Lemon Balm, Valerian, Theanine etc. Phenibut indeed gives very refreshing sleep and a nice afterglow but is quite troubling substance, I do take it in low-doses but try to cycle off.

Edited by Galaxyshock, 10 February 2015 - 07:33 PM.

[Gerrans]

I will try some gelatine.

What about things as simple as something that reduces the urge to go to the toilet. I find that these days and maybe its because im getting to some midle age, im woken up by the urge to urinate, i am at a stage now where i have a lot of work on my mind so as soon as im up im going again with little chance of going back to sleep.

I sleep 6-8hrs these days and my sleep tracking app says that i get on average double the amount of deep sleep as most people. Would be great to extend the deep cycles or get another one in.

 

For me the thing that stops the urge to get up for a pee is salt. I keep a salt/gelatine mix in the bathroom. Salt has the opposite effect to a diuretic because it retains fluid. It also helps with sleep, I find--maybe by the same mechanism, reducing the urge to pee (or perhaps something more complicated). Three scoops of salty gelatine always get me to sleep--not straight away, but reliably.

[Adamzski]

 

I will try some gelatine.

What about things as simple as something that reduces the urge to go to the toilet. I find that these days and maybe its because im getting to some midle age, im woken up by the urge to urinate, i am at a stage now where i have a lot of work on my mind so as soon as im up im going again with little chance of going back to sleep.

I sleep 6-8hrs these days and my sleep tracking app says that i get on average double the amount of deep sleep as most people. Would be great to extend the deep cycles or get another one in.

 

What sleep app tells you about the "average of deep sleep" ?

 

 

Sorry I was getting mixed up, the app I use is "Sleep as Android" it shows me that I average 50%+ of deep sleep every night with the time and a for example last night a 6x next to it that I have no idea what means. Im not sure of the average of people but through a brief look online it seems that 50% is pretty good.  It seems fairly accurate or accurate enough as my cycles of sleep to light sleep are pretty consistent. Next step is something like a jawbone bracelet to get a bit more accurate.

 

I never use an alarm clock as I never have to wake up at any particular time. Maybe the easiest way for the OP to extend their time in deep sleep if they are using an alarm clock is to get an app that wakes them up within a 20min time window trying to not hit a deep sleep period.

 

Thanks Gerrans that is something to try. I do get cramps in my feet at times when I take in too much salt from junk food but that could be from lack of hydration + salt. I will try this.

 

On bodybuilding forums I have seen in the past people debating sleeping hydrated vs going to pee through the night.

[Logic]

I will try some gelatine.

What about things as simple as something that reduces the urge to go to the toilet. I find that these days and maybe its because im getting to some midle age, im woken up by the urge to urinate, i am at a stage now where i have a lot of work on my mind so as soon as im up im going again with little chance of going back to sleep.

I sleep 6-8hrs these days and my sleep tracking app says that i get on average double the amount of deep sleep as most people. Would be great to extend the deep cycles or get another one in.

Do let me know how it goes Adamski.
I sleep like a rock. I think I could do so standing up in the sun so cannot tell you if it improves sleep.

(Vit C is required if you want the collagen/joint repairing effects too)

[StevesPetRat]

On the subject of nocturesis:
Raising the head of the bed increases aldosterone and has an anti-diuretic effect. The original citation for this is a 1940 JAMA paper by MacLean and Allen which doesn't seem to be available online. Nevertheless, it's a well-known treatment to increase blood volume for those with autonomic nervous system dysregulation (POTS and / or orthostatic hypotension).