2255 replies to this topic

[Journey2016]

I had great results taking 500mg in the morning and 250mg at night, along with making an effort with diet and exersice its all came togeather so well..

Why is no one talking about RG3? NR in nasal spray? Much better way to get into the system ?

Rg3, a ginsenoside compound found in Panax ginseng, is able to decrease excitotoxic and oxidative stress in the brain while also promoting neurogenesis. The effects are improved memory and lessened brain fog caused from autoimmune conditions.

Dr. Andrew Heyman compounds nicatinomide riboside and Rg3 in one solution for his lyme and brain disorder patients to start the process of repairing the central nervous system.

He’s also been using an Rg3 nose spray on the Corvette race car drivers of Le Mans (an American version of 24 Hours of Le Mans) to help them maintain focus during races.

The Corvette drivers were taking Rg3 nose sprays when they won the Le Mans in 2011 ®.

It can be found in supplement form, or made as a compounded nasal spray.

16.Nicotinamide Riboside (NR)

[Bryan_S]

I had great results taking 500mg in the morning and 250mg at night, along with making an effort with diet and exersice its all came togeather so well..

Why is no one talking about RG3? NR in nasal spray? Much better way to get into the system ?

Rg3, a ginsenoside compound found in Panax ginseng, is able to decrease excitotoxic and oxidative stress in the brain while also promoting neurogenesis. The effects are improved memory and lessened brain fog caused from autoimmune conditions.

Dr. Andrew Heyman compounds nicatinomide riboside and Rg3 in one solution for his lyme and brain disorder patients to start the process of repairing the central nervous system.

He’s also been using an Rg3 nose spray on the Corvette race car drivers of Le Mans (an American version of 24 Hours of Le Mans) to help them maintain focus during races.

The Corvette drivers were taking Rg3 nose sprays when they won the Le Mans in 2011 ®.

It can be found in supplement form, or made as a compounded nasal spray.

16.Nicotinamide Riboside (NR)

 

 

 

Also why is no one here mire interested in looking into the nad+ nasal products? Im told that when using it as a nasal its far more effective than NR tabs, and this was from a US lab that make both.

 

NR is stabilized as a salt. When hydrated in an H2o solution it begins to break down after about 6 hours. "Stability analyses showed that when Niagen was dissolved in water, NR was stable up to 6 h at room temperature and 7 days at 2–8 C. " So from an IV or nasal spray perspective you have limited shelf life unless used right away. This was and still is the whole idea behind the Procter and Gamble Chromadex agreement they are partnering on a liquid version for food, beverage, skin care, sports nutrition, and pharmaceutical products. Also keep in mind the products we buy in capsule form often contains Silica Powder. So making aqueous preparations from this as your base wouldn't be recommended as a nasal spray but could be added to drinks and food eaten shortly after preparation.

 

As always JMHO  

 

 

 

"NR in nasal spray? Much better way to get into the system ?" I told you why. There is not a nasal version and for good reason.

[Journey2016]

Then what is Rg3 with added NR.:::

[Bryan_S]

Then what is Rg3 with added NR.:::

 

You say they are delivering a nasal spray? Here it is "Rg3 / Nicotinamide Riboside/ Methylcobalamin Compounded Intranasal Spray."

 

I've put your question to Frank Jaksch at Chromadex. I'll post his answer shortly.

 

It's doubtful Specialty Compounding, LLC which makes RG3 has found a way to stabilize NR in water without securing a massive research grant to ensure a stable aqueous solution. That's not to say NR can't be added to water but it would have a very limited shelf life without the IP Chromadex, and Procter and Gamble are working on as we speak.

 

Specialty Compounding, LLC  would have to have a license agreement with Chromadex to represent Nicotinamide Riboside and have access to pure, untainted NR. Otherwise, the only source would be a tainted encapsulated product from a licensed vendor, with unwanted excipients already added. Or they could source a Chinese vendor of questionable purity. No Chinese vendor has ever delivered Nicotinamide Riboside to my knowledge. 

 

Chromadex and Procter and Gamble have an exclusive agreement to develop a version of NR for aqueous solutions, and if this Rg3 product is real, it has just opened up a can of worms. 

 

 

We will see what answer we get from Chromadex, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

As always JMHO

[Journey2016]

Ive spoken to a fee wellness centres that offer NAD+ IV since and what im told is the Nasal sprays they supply are not NR but actual NAD

[Bryan_S]

Ive spoken to a fee wellness centres that offer NAD+ IV since and what im told is the Nasal sprays they supply are not NR but actual NAD

 

Journey2016,

 

Specialty Compounding, LLC is offering a nasal spray, I've found it and read their product brief, so you were correct. I however still question their product and its legitimacy.

 

Keep in mind NAD is a rather big molecule and absorption thru the mucus membrane might be a challenge. Many questioned NR under the tongue as a sublingual as well, so this approach with a larger molecule raises further questions. IV NAD is available and some drug rehab clinics have been offering this as a treatment.

 

We'll see what answer we get from Chromadex about Rg3.

 

As always JMHO

[Journey2016]

Someones on the ball! Good to see.

Ive been told that people who have used the NAD spray have had similar postive effects as people who have used NAD iv, i will be using this product from the end of the week and will update people on my experience

[ceridwen]

Could you give us a link as to where we could get this please

[Journey2016]

Once ive started ill give a review and happily share all the information i have once talking to the company supplying.

[bluemoon]

 

 

 

Chromadex and Procter and Gamble have an exclusive agreement to develop a version of NR for aqueous solutions, and if this Rg3 product is real, it has just opened up a can of worms.  

 

A couple of questions. First, what would P&G sell that is a liquid? Or does shampoo and skin cream fall under the category of aqueous solution.  

 

Second, a friend has started to take 250 mg of a chewable NR tablet. He had been taking NAD sublingually until I convinced him to switch to NR. Is there evidence that chewable tablets of 250 mg of NR raises NAD more than capsules?   

[Michael]

Once ive started ill give a review and happily share all the information i have once talking to the company supplying.

 

To be clear, though: you're not aware of any actual science supporting that nasal or i.v. NAD+ works at all, let alone better than oral NR, yes? This is all the claims of the producer and some largely anonymous testimonials — right? As has already been pointed out, most studies indicate that NAD+ is degraded into NMN and thence NR before it is taken up by cells.

[Bryan_S]

To be clear, though: you're not aware of any actual science supporting that nasal or i.v. NAD+ works at all, let alone better than oral NR, yes? This is all the claims of the producer and some largely anonymous testimonials — right? As has already been pointed out, most studies indicate that NAD+ is degraded into NMN and thence NR before it is taken up by cells.

 

 

Yes NAD+ is degraded into NR and NR is taken in and converted to NMN and then to NAD+. Yes there is a NAD IV however it isn't cheap. It will be converted to NR at the cell membrane. To me what's the point of using a more expensive alternative, right? The biggest NAD precursor molecule to get thru the cell membrane is NR, anything bigger gets reduced. No studies have show any advantage for nasal spray or chewable.

 

 

A couple of questions. First, what would P&G sell that is a liquid? Or does shampoo and skin cream fall under the category of aqueous solution.  

 

Second, a friend has started to take 250 mg of a chewable NR tablet. He had been taking NAD sublingually until I convinced him to switch to NR. Is there evidence that chewable tablets of 250 mg of NR raises NAD more than capsules?   

 

 

Procter and Gamble Chromadex agreement they are partnering on a liquid version for food, beverage, skin care, sports nutrition, and pharmaceutical products. Who knows what they want to sell but I expect they will be protective about it.

 

Could you give us a link as to where we could get this please

 

Let's see what Frank says when he gets back into the office. I expect I'll hear back from him soon. The first question is are they a partner? If not, this won't fly for long. 2nd NR does not have a long shelf life once hydrated.  "Stability analyses showed that when Niagen was dissolved in water, NR was stable up to 6 h at room temperature and 7 days at 2–8 C. "  If you mix NR with water it isn't going to last very long, you can read the link. Most of us need something that remains potent in the medicine cabinet. Niagen™ (Nicotinamide Riboside Chloride)" is a dry salt and it is stable in this form until taken. So let's see what we get from Frank, and if they pass the ChromaDex test we'll post the Vendors contact info. I have a sneaky suspicion they've flown under the radar. They also don't mention ChromaDex in the spec sheet. So I'm leery about this at first glance.

 

As always JMHO

Edited by Bryan_S, 21 February 2017 - 02:08 AM.
spelling

[normalizing]

sign me up for the nasal spray products, either NR or straight NAD, keep updates and share sources

[Nate-2004]

Because of its lack of stability I've been using the NR we buy from HPN topically for about 6 months now on my face and belly. I mix each application of Ceravé hyaluronic acid/ceramide lotion (four pumps) with half a capsule of NR and apply to face, belly and what's left I run through my hair. Sometimes the Ceravé is pre-mixed with a topical form of vitamin C I have. 

 

I suppose if you wanted to squirt it up your nose you could just mix it per dose each time you do it, but honestly I don't see the point of that since studies are showing good oral bioavailability and absorption via the gut, not to mention the 50%+ boosts in NAD.

 

I'm doing a lot for my skin, red light in the 600 - 900nm range (head, face, belly and lower back). Hydrolyzed collagen. The above NR application as well as a mix of Argan oil with honokiol, pterostilbene and a 30% extract of rosmarinic acid. Red light can increase ROS hence the vitamin C, also the argan oil has E.

 

The results I'm getting after the past couple weeks of adding in both the red light and collagen prior to applying the vitamin C/NR infused Ceravé and argan oil are far better than the lotion and oil alone. It will be hard to say without another month of trying this.

 

It's a shotgun approach to rejuvenating skin but it might just do the trick. I'm literally throwing almost every known rejuvenation trick in the book at it, except derma rolling. I'll let you know if my scruff starts changing from salt and pepper back into the dark reddish brown it used to be and people start confusing me for being 29.

Edited by Nate-2004, 21 February 2017 - 02:20 AM.

[midas]

Effects of a wide range of dietary nicotinamide riboside (NR) concentrations on metabolic flexibility and white adipose tissue (WAT) of mice fed a mildly obesogenic diet

 

http://onlinelibrary....201600878/full

[DareDevil]

Hi Guys & Gals,

 

I don't want to rain on the party, but I thought my experience may help others taking multiple supplements narrow down a particular side effect of NR. I was taking 250mg/day of NR and noticed in two different stacks that I was having digestive troubles, namely one I'd rather not mention more specifically as it is an embarrassing one. I was also taking MitoQ simultaneously and didn't know which might be causing this until I came across this source:

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC3193667/

 

"Nicotinamide reduces intestinal phosphate absorption by inhibiting the gastrointestinal sodium/phosphate 2b transporter (Na/Pi 2b).[17–22] Unlike niacin, it does not activate G-protein receptors specific for niacin and does not cause flushing.[23–26] However, it has dose-related gastrointestinal side effects, including diarrhea and cramping."

 

I have since discontinued taking NR until I can make sure it won't have this troublesome side. Fortunately I think that this is an uncommon side-effect which most folks won't experience. But if you do you can temporarily discontinue NR to find out if it might be the cause.

 

FWIW

 

DareDevil

[APBT]

Effects of a wide range of dietary nicotinamide riboside (NR) concentrations on metabolic flexibility and white adipose tissue (WAT) of mice fed a mildly obesogenic diet

 

http://onlinelibrary....201600878/full

 

 

FULL TEXT:

Attached Files

•  Effects of a wide range of dietary nicotinamide riboside (NR) concentrations on metabolic flexibility and white adipose tissue (WAT) of mice fed a mildly obesogenic diet.pdf   1.58MB   5 downloads

[bluemoon]

 

 

Procter and Gamble Chromadex agreement they are partnering on a liquid version for food, beverage, skin care, sports nutrition, and pharmaceutical products. Who knows what they want to sell but I expect they will be protective about it.

 

I'm curious where you found out about the above since the link doesn't mention any products. The above is what Chromadex makes. I did find this patent though and not surprised it is for skin care:

 

Title: ENCAPSULATED SKIN CARE AGENT

 

United States Patent Application 20160374918 

 

Abstract:

 

A stable cosmetic agent that includes an encapsulated particle in a core-shell configuration. The encapsulated particle is formed by coating nicotinamide riboside powder or a nicotinamide riboside containing material with one or more encapsulating agents. The stable encapsulated nicotinamide riboside particles exhibit less than 20% hydrolysis when incorporated into an aqueous skin care composition.

[Michael]

 

Procter and Gamble Chromadex agreement  they are partnering on a liquid version for food, beverage, skin care, sports nutrition, and pharmaceutical products. Who knows what they want to sell but I expect they will be protective about it.

I'm curious where you found out about the above since the link doesn't mention any products. The above is what Chromadex makes. I did find this patent though and not surprised it is for skin care:

Title: ENCAPSULATED SKIN CARE AGENT

 

Yeah ... note that the P&G press release doesn't say that the partnership is to develop "a liquid version for food, beverage, skin care, sports nutrition, and pharmaceutical products", or a liquid version at all — just that Chromadex itself broadly "creates science-based solutions for dietary supplement, food and beverage, skin care, sports nutrition, and pharmaceutical products." However, in addition to the ENCAPSULATED SKIN CARE AGENT patent cited by Bluemoon (and key underlying P&G patents for  Encapsulated particles comprising nicotinamide riboside and Multi-component skin care product comprising nicoinamide riboside in a multi-chambered container), the NR GRAS notice says that "ChromaDex, Inc. proposes to add Niagen to selected foods and beverages" and that "ChromaDex intends to add Niagen (nicotinamide riboside) to ... vitamin waters, protein shakes, nutrition bars and gums or chews." It adds at that point that  it "will be in powdered beverages designed to be reconstituted with water or milk," so that may not necessarily mean they expect to be able to put it into a liquid per se.

[Michael]

 

Effects of a wide range of dietary nicotinamide riboside (NR) concentrations on metabolic flexibility and white adipose tissue (WAT) of mice fed a mildly obesogenic diet
 
http://onlinelibrary....201600878/full

 
FULL TEXT:

 
I'll be damned ...
 

In this study we used a semi-synthetic obesogenic diet with moderate levels of fat (40 en%) resembling the average fat intake in the Netherlands and identified 30NR as the most optimal dose of NR in terms of metabolic health. Metabolic flexibility was not improved at 900NR (equivalent to 102 mg NR/kg BW/day at the start of the experiment to 65 mg NR/kg BW/day in the end); if anything it was decreased. This contrasts with Canto et al. who found that metabolic flexibility, assessed by the difference of RER between dark phase and light phase, was increased by supplementation with 400 mg NR/kg BW/day of a high fat diet that already contained 30 mg/kg diet of vitamin B3 (Nam) %5B8%5D. This improvement in metabolic flexibility, on the other hand, was not observed in mice fed a high-fat-high-sucrose (HFHS) diet %5B22%5D, nor in mice fed a chow diet [24], even though the same high dose of NR was used. This suggests a modifying effect of the diet on improvement of metabolic flexibility at high NR concentrations.
 
Alternatively, differences may be due to the absence and presence of the nicotinamide nucleotide transhydrogenase (Nnt) gene. The C57BL/6JRcc mice used in our study have, similar to humans, an intact Nnt gene, which is absent in the strain used by Canto et al. [8]. NNT has a key role in redox and peroxide metabolism [52, 53] and is responsible for maintenance of mitochondrial NAD+ levels [54]. Its absence impairs regulation of insulin secretion and thus affects glucose homeostasis [55]. Absence or presence of Nnt thus affects disease development as well as NAD+ levels which may explain the observed differences in protective effects of high dose NR supplementation, which needs to be tested experimentally.

Depending on how many studies relied on a substrain of C57BL/6 with the same defective Nnt gene as in Canto et al, that may mean that an awful lot of the NR literature is corrupted by an experimental artifact ... for instance, in the muscle stem cell and lifespan study in Science, the initial muscle stem cell study used the C57BL/10SnJ substrain, which does not appear to carry the mutation — but they also used the Nnt-mutant C57BL/6JRj substrain both for the followup study on mitochondrial function and stem cell aging, and also for the lifespan study, and possibly for other parts that are not explicitly spelled out ...

 

EDIT: Yup: the original Sinclair study on NMN restoring more youthful muscle bioenergetics in aging mice also used C57Bl/6J ...

Edited by Michael, 21 February 2017 - 11:44 PM.

[Bryan_S]

 

Then what is Rg3 with added NR.:::

 

You say they are delivering a nasal spray? Here it is "Rg3 / Nicotinamide Riboside/ Methylcobalamin Compounded Intranasal Spray."

 

I've put your question to Frank Jaksch at Chromadex. I'll post his answer shortly.

 

It's doubtful Specialty Compounding, LLC which makes RG3 has found a way to stabilize NR in water without securing a massive research grant to ensure a stable aqueous solution. That's not to say NR can't be added to water but it would have a very limited shelf life without the IP Chromadex, and Procter and Gamble are working on as we speak.

 

Specialty Compounding, LLC  would have to have a license agreement with Chromadex to represent Nicotinamide Riboside and have access to pure, untainted NR. Otherwise, the only source would be a tainted encapsulated product from a licensed vendor, with unwanted excipients already added. Or they could source a Chinese vendor of questionable purity. No Chinese vendor has ever delivered Nicotinamide Riboside to my knowledge. 

 

Chromadex and Procter and Gamble have an exclusive agreement to develop a version of NR for aqueous solutions, and if this Rg3 product is real, it has just opened up a can of worms. 

 

 

We will see what answer we get from Chromadex, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

As always JMHO

 

 

 

Checked it out http://www.austincompounding.com/rg3 they are legit. They're a ChromaDex customer and they are buying Nicotinamide Riboside for compounding products.

 

I still question the shelf-life of such a product but it's your choice if you want this delivery method. I've found 3 products. As a compounder they may make others upon request.

 

Methylcobalamin Rg3 NR 

 

Rg3 NR monograph

 

Purenergy NR monograph

 

Contact Us

211 S Bell Blvd

Tel: 512-219-0724

​Fax: 512-219-0943

Email: info@austincompounding.com

 

As always JMHO

[Journey2016]

As i say ive been told from clinics that offer iv nad treatments that the nasal version is new and is giving much better results than oral NR, i will update you when ive tested it out this week.

[Bryan_S]

GRAS Notices 02/17/2017
https://www.accessda...SNotices&id=635
GRN No. 635 
Substance:

Nicotinamide riboside chloride
Intended Use:

Intended for use as a source of vitamin B3 in vitamin waters, protein shakes, nutrition bars, gum and chews at a maximum use level is 0.027% by weight.

Basis:

Scientific procedures

 

Notifier:

ChromaDex, Inc.
10005 Muirlands Boulevard, Suite G, Irvine, CA 92618

 

Date of filing:

Mar 29, 2016

GRAS Notice (releasable information):

635 (in PDF) (15.5 MB)

Date of closure / FDA's Letter:

Aug 3, 2016
FDA has no questions

Page Last Updated: 02/17/2017

Edited by Bryan_S, 21 February 2017 - 10:50 PM.

[Nate-2004]

 

 

Effects of a wide range of dietary nicotinamide riboside (NR) concentrations on metabolic flexibility and white adipose tissue (WAT) of mice fed a mildly obesogenic diet
 
http://onlinelibrary....201600878/full

 
FULL TEXT:

 
I'll be damned ...
 

In this study we used a semi-synthetic obesogenic diet with moderate levels of fat (40 en%) resembling the average fat intake in the Netherlands and identified 30NR as the most optimal dose of NR in terms of metabolic health. Metabolic flexibility was not improved at 900NR (equivalent to 102 mg NR/kg BW/day at the start of the experiment to 65 mg NR/kg BW/day in the end); if anything it was decreased. This contrasts with Canto et al. who found that metabolic flexibility, assessed by the difference of RER between dark phase and light phase, was increased by supplementation with 400 mg NR/kg BW/day of a high fat diet that already contained 30 mg/kg diet of vitamin B3 (Nam)  [SNIP]

Depending on how many studies relied on a substrain of C57BL/6 with the same defective Nnt gene as in Canto et al, that may mean that an awful lot of the NR literature is corrupted by an experimental artifact ... [SNIP]

 

 

I don't quite understand this conclusion. In fact there's a lot of things I don't quite understand in this study. The title, "30NR", "900NR", dietary NR (I thought it was only in milk in tiny amounts), etc.

 

Can someone explain this?

Edited by Michael, 21 February 2017 - 11:03 PM.

[Michael]

 

 

Effects of a wide range of dietary nicotinamide riboside (NR) concentrations on metabolic flexibility and white adipose tissue (WAT) of mice fed a mildly obesogenic diet
 
http://onlinelibrary....201600878/full

I'll be damned ...
 

In this study we ... identified 30NR as the most optimal dose of NR in terms of metabolic health. Metabolic flexibility was not improved at 900NR (equivalent to 102 mg NR/kg BW/day at the start of the experiment to 65 mg NR/kg BW/day in the end); if anything it was decreased. This contrasts with Canto et al. who found that metabolic flexibility, assessed by the difference of RER between dark phase and light phase, was increased by supplementation with 400 mg NR/kg BW/day of a high fat diet that already contained 30 mg/kg diet of vitamin B3 (Nam)  [SNIP]

Depending on how many studies relied on a substrain of C57BL/6 with the same defective Nnt gene as in Canto et al, that may mean that an awful lot of the NR literature is corrupted by an experimental artifact ... [SNIP]

 

 
I don't quite understand this conclusion. In fact there's a lot of things I don't quite understand in this study. The title, "30NR", "900NR", dietary NR (I thought it was only in milk in tiny amounts), etc.
 
Can someone explain this?

 
That depends on what you need explained . The "dietary NR" bit just means that it was NR in the mouse chow, as opposed to in drinking water or by injection as in some studies.  Basically, they provided NR as the sole source of vitamin B3 (along with the mouse "RDA" of tryptophan, because mammals can synthesize B3 from Trp) for to see which dose would give the animals the best metabolic flexibility. The dosage groups are explained in the abstract, linked by Midas, in terms of mg/kg chow: "diet containing 0.14% L-tryptophan and either 5, 15, 30, 180 or 900 mg NR per kg diet for 15 weeks."
 
The mouse "RDA" is 15 mg/kg chow, so these guys found that metabolic flexibility is maxed out at 2 x the mouse "RDA" of B3 as NR, and may even get worse when NR is administered at the megadose levels used in previous studies. They suggest that the results seen in a key similar study by Canto and Auwerx (which seemed to show that megadose NR powerfully revs up bioenergetics and improves metabolic flexibility) might only have happened because the mouse strain used has a mutation in a gene for a protein used to transfer reducing equivalents from NADH to NADP+ in the mitochondria, whereas in their own study, they used mice that (like humans) don't have that mutation and thus don't benefit from a huge increase in NAD+.
 
I in turn put out the hypothesis that if the Canto and Auwerx mitochondrial and metabolic effects are only seen because of the Nnt mutation, then the results of other studies using mice with the same mutation might be equally irrelevant to human metabolism. The Dietary Reference Intake for B3 in humans is 16 mg/day, so that would suggest 32 mg daily, and a more dubious advantage for NR over other forms of the vitamin.

Edited by Michael, 19 April 2017 - 03:47 PM.

[Tom Andre F. (ex shinobi)]

And a few more quotes if not interested in registering with Seeking Alpha:
 
Brenner:  Nicotinamide and niacin can't substitute for NR because they aren't used in all of the same cells and they don't produce the same results. The best example of these compounds not being equivalent is with respect to glycemic control. Nicotinamide and niacin promote insulin insensitivity (which is bad), while NR promotes insulin sensitivity (which staves off type 2 diabetes). So you should not believe anyone who says that the three compounds are equivalent. ...
 
Brenner:  When we discovered NR as a vitamin, we discovered the NR pathway to NAD.   The value proposition of NR depends on the unique ability of NR to maintain and boost NAD in every cell and tissue and, in particular, in tissues undergoing damage and stress.
 
There are only two steps in the NR pathway to NAD but there are two genes that can do the first step and three genes that can do the second step. The NR pathway never gets turned off. NRK1 is expressed in every cell and tissue, while NRK2 is turned on by cellular damage, particularly in skeletal and cardiac muscle. This means that people supplementing with NR are able to keep NAD levels high in stressed cells that specifically have the NR pathway turned on to deal with cellular stress. Supplementing with niacin and nicotinamide doesn't help because they don't feed into the NR pathway, which is turned on by stresses.

 
This is totally wrong. Where are the data for Niacin and NA increasing insulin insensitivy ? wich dosage ? And in the other hand that NR does not ? Because we also proven earlier in this thread that NR increase NAD+ mostly by becoming niacinamide !...
 
The "unique ability" blabla is also wrong and only marketing as human cells makes ribose pools to make both niacin and nam use the NRK1,2 pathway also.
 
Clearly NR is an expensive Niacin. I really dont understand the hype around it ? I mean is there data about it increasing NAD+ long term as we speculate not now years back ? do we have more control versus niacin where it finally show a difference ?
 
Also, do we have more idea now about the crash many people get using Niagen ? Especially since normally it should be the total opposite that should occur

Edited by Michael, 23 February 2017 - 08:17 PM.

[bluemoon]

 

Clearly NR is an expensive Niacin. I really dont understand the hype around it ? I mean is there data about it increasing NAD+ long term as we speculate not now years back ? do we have more control versus niacin where it finally show a difference ? 

 

 

 

The longest term data that I know of is the study Elysium conducted last summer that showed 250mg of NR with 50 mg of pterostilbine maintained a 40% increase in NAD+ among healthy 60 to 80 year olds for 8 weeks and that double that increased NAD+ levels 90% for 8 weeks. I think that suggests a long term increase and obviously longer than Chromadex's one day study.

 

I agree that we need a niacin control group but Chromadex and Elysium are vendors with no incentive to run that study. My guess is that if we see such a study, it will be a small one of ten people run by a curious doctor or two in 2019 or so.   

[Bryan_S]

As i say ive been told from clinics that offer iv nad treatments that the nasal version is new and is giving much better results than oral NR, i will update you when ive tested it out this week.

 

I would keep it refrigerated once received because temperature can help stabilize NR in a H2O solution.  "Stability analyses showed that when Niagen was dissolved in water, NR was stable up to 6 h at room temperature and 7 days at 2–8 C. " 

[Journey2016]

Ive been told to put it in a fridge, but it is a 3month supply , 3 sprays at £100 a bottle

[bluemoon]

Time magazine has a feature on anti-aging in the recent edition and NR and Elysium get a small section.

 

THE HYPE: Many companies sell supplements with suspected longevity benefits, but one of the more talked-about new businesses is Elysium Health, co-founded by entrepreneurs and an MIT antiaging researcher named Leonard Guarente. Elysium has created a daily supplement, called Basis, that is "designed to support long-term well-being at the cellular level." The pill isn't marketed as a cure for aging, but Elysium Health cites evidence that the ingredients in the pill increase a compound called NAD+ that the company says is "essential to hundreds of biological processes that sustain human life." Basis costs $50 for a monthly supply, and the company, which doesn't release official sales numbers, says it has tens of thousands of customers so far.

 

THE DEBATE: Basis contains two main ingredients: nicotinamide riboside (NR) and pterostilbene, both of which have been shown in animal studies to fight aging at the cellular level. NR creates NAD+, which is believed to spur cell rejuvenation but which declines naturally in animals as they age. In a trial of 120 healthy people from ages 60 to 80, Guarente found that people taking Basis increased their NAD+ levels by 40%. "We are trying to be rigorously based on science," he says.

 

[Interesting that the 90% increase in NAD+ with a double dose isn't mentioned.]

 

Studies have shown that supplementing with the compound extends life in mice, but whether it increases human longevity is unknown. To find out if it does--and to request FDA approval for the pill's clearance as a drug--long, rigorous clinical trials would need to be done. Instead, Elysium Health has released Basis as a supplement. That prevents the company from making specific medical claims about the pills--something that's prohibited by law in the marketing of supplements.

 

"I think the pathway Guarente is targeting is interesting"--meaning the idea that increasing NAD+ may also slow aging--"but clinical evidence is crucial," says Dr. Nir Barzilai, a researcher at Albert Einstein College of Medicine, who also studies drugs for aging.

Other scientists question the supplement approach altogether. "There is no evidence whatsoever that [Basis] produces health benefits in humans," says Dr. Jeffrey Flier, former dean of Harvard Medical School. "Many molecules that have some apparent benefits in mice or other organisms have no benefit when studied in humans."

.

The company has seven Nobel Prize--winning scientists on its advisory board, a fact that has also raised some eyebrows. Flier cautions that the company's association with lauded researchers cannot replace the science required to prove that the supplements combat aging and are safe to use.

 

THE BOTTOM LINE: It's too early to tell whether supplements can have any life-extending effects in humans.

 

-------------------------

 

Same guys, same basic quotes as in previous articles. Time failed to mention that Elysium has sent the results for publication.