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Nicotinamide Riboside [Curated]

nicotinamide riboside nicotinamide nad boosting charles brenner david sinclair leonard guarente niagen niacinamide nicotinamide mononucleotide

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#1351 trakker

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Posted 18 October 2016 - 03:47 PM

 

Regarding dosage, this article on alivebynature  shows the   chart below to  imply that 300mg is  closer to the ideal dose than 1000mg.

 

300mg is slower than 1000mg to reach max NAD+ increase Brenner refers to at 8 hours,

 

but by 24 hours both are still elevated and by similar amounts.

 

 

NR_NAD_chart-800x607.png

 

First, a question, what is the difference between Mean and SEM?

 

Second, it looks like the rise in NAD+ stays persistent and even peaks at 24 hrs, which is interesting. That means taking it at spaced times throughout the day may not be all that useful.

 

SEM is related to SD - Standard Deviation.   https://www.graphpad.com/guides/prism/6/statistics/index.htm?stat_semandsdnotsame.htm

 

 Looks like there is more scatter in the NAD+ numbers than in some of the other metabolites?

 

According to this chart, the NAD+ is higher at 24 than at 8 hours, but we don't know if it peaked sometime between those 2 data points.  

 

Certainly is curious to me how slowly it converts.  

 

NAAD is much higher at 8 hours.  Is that indicative of it being some sort of overflow pool that gets converted to NAD+ later, as someone mentioned here earlier?



#1352 Aronte

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Posted 18 October 2016 - 08:18 PM

NAD+ in the news

 

http://www.dailymail...pone-aging.html



#1353 mrkosh1

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Posted 19 October 2016 - 02:51 AM

I think that I may be able to afford to try out NR in the near future. If I could get a consensus about the following questions, I'd appreciate it.

 

1) What is the purest, highest quality brand of NR on the market today?

 

2) What is the consensus on the best time of the day to take NR? (For the record, I'm much more of a night owl than a morning person.)

 

3) What methods optimize absorption? (Taking with food, taking without food, taking with another substance, grinding up the pills into powder, etc.)

 

4) I drink Atkin shakes quite often for breakfast. Would it help or hinder absorption to grind up a tablet and mix it with my shake? (They are high fat, high protein, and very low carb.)


Edited by mrkosh1, 19 October 2016 - 02:53 AM.


#1354 mrkosh1

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Posted 19 October 2016 - 03:07 AM

Bryan,

 

Please ask Dr. Brenner what he thinks about the possible synergy between NR and R-ALA which has also proven to boost the levels of NAD+, the SIRT genes, and telomerase. In particular, there is a paper I've linked to on here before that describes how R-ALA actually increases the quantity of SIRT and not just the activity. Basically, by using them both you might have more SIRT to use more NAD+ to have stronger anti-aging benefits.

 

Since R-ALA is non-toxic and safe, I think it would be an obvious choice to test alongside R-ALA.



#1355 Oakman

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Posted 19 October 2016 - 03:13 AM

I think that I may be able to afford to try out NR in the near future. If I could get a consensus about the following questions, I'd appreciate it.

 

1) What is the purest, highest quality brand of NR on the market today?

 

2) What is the consensus on the best time of the day to take NR? (For the record, I'm much more of a night owl than a morning person.)

 

3) What methods optimize absorption? (Taking with food, taking without food, taking with another substance, grinding up the pills into powder, etc.)

 

4) I drink Atkin shakes quite often for breakfast. Would it help or hinder absorption to grind up a tablet and mix it with my shake? (They are high fat, high protein, and very low carb.)

 

1. All vendors use Chromadex's base NR > https://chromadex.co...ent-brands.html

 

Then they add whatever as fillers, etc. Or they add another compound that might have a synergistic effect. As an example, I have LiveCellResearch 250mg caps. Each cap weighs 550mg, the cap itself is 100mg. So there's 250mg of NR, 200mg of rice bran in each capsule. I'm not concerned about rice bran, so that's a pure capsule IMO.

 

2. Again, LCR bottle says take before breakfast on an empty stomach. However, according to the latest published research the blood level is highest after 8 hrs, and remains high for 24hr. So really it would seem that taking on an empty stomach is the key, and repeating whatever time that is each day, and I don't see why morning is special if the levels stay high more or less as long as you're taking it.

 

3. (see 2.) I haven't seen anything saying something else helps with absorption, but there may be something to taking it with Bioperine, not really sure. Some take it sublingually, that sounds like it would be quick acting, but I haven't tried that.

 

4. (see 2 & 3) No, as best I've read. Think alone (wo/food) in your gut so it gets all your guts attention. That being said, I take it (with other 'alone in you gut' supps) early morning (5/6ish) with a couple spoons of applesauce, then water, just because it make it easier to get them down. Breakfast comes 7ish.


Edited by Oakman, 19 October 2016 - 03:15 AM.


#1356 mrkosh1

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Posted 19 October 2016 - 05:03 AM

Here is the paper that mentions the effect ALA can have on the level of SIRT.

 

http://onlinelibrary...by.2012.32/full

 

Effects of LA on SIRTs

To determine the role of SIRTs in LA actions on hepatic mitochondrial oxidative status, we analyzed the mRNA and protein levels of SIRT1 and SIRT3 in our experimental groups. Regarding to SIRT1, HFD downregulated the mRNA levels of this gene (P < 0.01) whereas LA was able to up regulate the mRNA levels up to control values (Figure 5a). However, this effect may be due to calorie restriction as deduced from the same values observed in the PFO group. By contrast, LA induced a strong stimulatory effect on protein level of SIRT1 (6.5 fold; P < 0.001 vs. C and OB group) whereas dietary patterns (obesity and calorie restriction) had no effect (Figure 5b and c). In addition, a highly significant correlation between protein levels of SIRT1 and mitochondrial copy number was found (r = 0.7800; P < 0.001). On the other hand, and similarly to what was observed with SIRT1, HFD induced a reduction in SIRT3 gene expression and this effect was completely reversed by LA treatment (P < 0.001). This upregulation was not secondary to calorie restriction as inferred from differences with PFO group (P < 0.05) (Figure 5d). Furthermore, LA also increases SIRT3 protein levels (P < 0.001) and independently of reduction in food intake (Figure 5e and 5f). Additionally, the protein levels of SIRT3 were negatively associated with acetylation of Foxo3a (r = −0.6108; P = 0.002) suggesting that SIRT3 could stimulate the activity of Foxo3a by deacetylation and, therefore, could mediate the effects of LA.

 

 

I don't know for sure, but it sounds like to me LA can increase the amount of SIRT 1 in a way NR cannot.

 

Is it possible that ALA could increase the quantity of the SIRTS (6.5 fold for SIRT1) and then NR could provide the NAD needed by the SIRT?



#1357 mrkosh1

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Posted 19 October 2016 - 06:16 AM

In the paper titled, "The NAD+ Precursor Nicotinamide Riboside Enhances Oxidative Metabolish and Protects against High-Fat Diet Induced Obesity" it claims that NR increases SIRT1 activity but not protein level.

 

So it seems we have a situation in which ALA increases the quantity of SIRT proteins and NR increases the activity. My hypothesis is that a combination of ALA and NR would create a powerful synergy.

 

Would you please ask Dr. Brenner about this?

 

 


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#1358 Bryan_S

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Posted 19 October 2016 - 11:16 PM

1) What is the purest, highest quality brand of NR on the market today?

ChromaDex is the manufacture of nicotinamide riboside and the originator of the only trusted source worldwide. They distribute to licensed venders who in turn take the nicotinamide riboside from a solid form and powder and encapsulate it, this is where the differences in the end product begins. To reach this end various excipients are used. These are often called binders, fillers, lubricants, & flow agents. These help the powdered (NR) to be handled. As is the case with many compounds in the raw state, they seldom behave and flow properly in the encapsulation process. One of the venders as listed in the previous response marketed their product as using no fillers . . .  when in fact they did. When discovered they were asked to confirm their other Customer Assurance claims as to third party testing and purity and to date have refused to corroborate those claims. So simply put I can not endorse that vender or attest to their product purity until they back up their claims.

 

Back to the root of the question. As of today 2 venders are using vegetable cellulose as the only excipient in the encapsulation process. So from a purity standpoint, while staying 100% vegetarian I would mention High Performance Nutrition Niagen (currently discounted to our members) and TRU NIAGEN @ Pro Healthspan.

 

2) What is the consensus on the best time of the day to take NR? (For the record, I'm much more of a night owl than a morning person.)

I'll soon be posting an interview with Dr. Brenner discussing dose. Dr. Brenner is the leading researcher on NR. From his standpoint if you are taking a single dose . . . when you awake. If you are taking a larger dose like a few of us here he said twice a day, so when you awake and around dinner time. This was to enhance the circadian rhythm which peaks twice per day. He said he couldn't see taking it more often than twice per day.

 

3) What methods optimize absorption? (Taking with food, taking without food, taking with another substance, grinding up the pills into powder, etc.)

I asked this question of Dr. Brenner and he said NR is water soluble. He reviewed how they gave the compound to mice and the human subjects. No enhancement methods were discussed.

 

4) I drink Atkin shakes quite often for breakfast. Would it help or hinder absorption to grind up a tablet and mix it with my shake? (They are high fat, high protein, and very low carb.)

I'd say no, its not necessary to grind it up. You could just simply open up a capsule and add it to your shake. They come apart easily  Keep in mind HPN sells a powder for shakes.

 

 

Bryan,

 

Please ask Dr. Brenner what he thinks about the possible synergy between NR and R-ALA which has also proven to boost the levels of NAD+, the SIRT genes, and telomerase. In particular, there is a paper I've linked to on here before that describes how R-ALA actually increases the quantity of SIRT and not just the activity. Basically, by using them both you might have more SIRT to use more NAD+ to have stronger anti-aging benefits.

 

Since R-ALA is non-toxic and safe, I think it would be an obvious choice to test alongside R-ALA.

 

When I interviewed him last Saturday he told me NR is already the best Sirtuin-activating compound (STAC). The mammalian sirtuins (SIRT1–7) are NAD+-dependent lysine deacylases. Giving them the NAD they need also stimulates their production. So as a user of pterostilbene which is also a (STAC) I'm beginning to question the necessity of its expense.


Edited by Bryan_S, 19 October 2016 - 11:43 PM.

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#1359 midas

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Posted 20 October 2016 - 12:53 AM

A vitamin (NR) could help treat Duchenne muscular dystrophy

 

Reversing course with a vitamin: nicotinamide riboside successfully tested on animals

 

http://medicalxpress...=daily-nwletter

 

 


Edited by midas, 20 October 2016 - 12:53 AM.

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#1360 mrkosh1

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Posted 20 October 2016 - 04:54 AM

Thank you Bryan and Oakman for all the information.

 

I really appreciate the responses.

 

I still hope that substances such as R-ALA and others can boost the SIRTs and other genes to levels higher levels than can be obtained by only utilizing NR. Of all the anti-aging substances and drugs I've read about, NR seems to be the most promising to its broad range of positive effects; however, in and of itself I doubt it will induce a major reversal of the aging process in people who are not experiencing disease conditions. I think it probably will have a much greater impact on healthspan and slowing aging than outright reversal -- at least in humans.So my thinking is that we need to figure out some way of using NR combined with other compounds (hopefully those that are already available) to maximize any possible synergies. For example, there are a few papers out there that show high levels of synergy between R-ALA and acetyl-l-carnitine. I'm hoping that there is something similar to maximize NR.

 

For example, I hope the ceiling isn't low with NR dosing when it comes to hitting the dosage level where the safety risk becomes too high and the potential benefit becomes too little. If there is such a low ceiling (lets say 1000mg a day possibly) then I hope we can find a way around it. I've been following anti-aging drugs and supplements since I was a teenager and I'm very pleased to know there is one substance that induces telomerase, increases DNA repair, increases levels of anti-oxidants, increases the number of mitochondria, reduces levels of amyloid beta, and a half a dozen other things at the same time. Literally, NR seems to be in a league of its own! Now we just need to figure out how to boost those effects the MAXIMUM SAFE LEVEL POSSIBLE.

 

The one aspect of aging I wish NR would have an effect on is the elimination of glucosepane!

 

If someone shows me a study where it helps boost a cellular process that can do that I'll be extremely happy.



#1361 Steve H

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Posted 20 October 2016 - 08:23 AM

The one aspect of aging I wish NR would have an effect on is the elimination of glucosepane!

 

If someone shows me a study where it helps boost a cellular process that can do that I'll be extremely happy.

 

Nope not a chance. So far the only thing I have heard of that has promise are some of the enzymes in the Spigel Lab at Yale. David mentioned that they are making progress when I spoke to him last. The good news is that Yale is getting an injection of funds from SENS as the 5 million dollars from Michael Greve are being used for Glucosepane and MitoSENS projects.

There are plenty of things that will slow down rate of glycation but nothing known to cleave the crosslinks once formed.



#1362 Nate-2004

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Posted 20 October 2016 - 02:01 PM

 

The one aspect of aging I wish NR would have an effect on is the elimination of glucosepane!

 

If someone shows me a study where it helps boost a cellular process that can do that I'll be extremely happy.

 

Nope not a chance. So far the only thing I have heard of that has promise are some of the enzymes in the Spigel Lab at Yale. David mentioned that they are making progress when I spoke to him last. The good news is that Yale is getting an injection of funds from SENS as the 5 million dollars from Michael Greve are being used for Glucosepane and MitoSENS projects.

There are plenty of things that will slow down rate of glycation but nothing known to cleave the crosslinks once formed.

 

 

Great news. Hopefully if successful we see a quick and easy means of access to these enzymes.



#1363 albedo

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Posted 20 October 2016 - 04:38 PM

A vitamin could help treat Duchenne muscular dystrophy

http://actu.epfl.ch/...muscular-dystr/



#1364 stefan_001

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Posted 20 October 2016 - 05:02 PM

 

 

When I interviewed him last Saturday he told me NR is already the best Sirtuin-activating compound (STAC). The mammalian sirtuins (SIRT1–7) are NAD+-dependent lysine deacylases. Giving them the NAD they need also stimulates their production. So as a user of pterostilbene which is also a (STAC) I'm beginning to question the necessity of its expense.

 

Well pterstilbene also impacts various cancer pathways, notably prostate.......

http://journals.plos...al.pone.0057542



#1365 Nate-2004

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Posted 20 October 2016 - 10:46 PM

 

The one aspect of aging I wish NR would have an effect on is the elimination of glucosepane!

 

If someone shows me a study where it helps boost a cellular process that can do that I'll be extremely happy.

 

Nope not a chance. So far the only thing I have heard of that has promise are some of the enzymes in the Spigel Lab at Yale. David mentioned that they are making progress when I spoke to him last. The good news is that Yale is getting an injection of funds from SENS as the 5 million dollars from Michael Greve are being used for Glucosepane and MitoSENS projects.

There are plenty of things that will slow down rate of glycation but nothing known to cleave the crosslinks once formed.

 

 

There's also rosmarinic acid which is shown to break down some AGE's in vitro. It may break down other types of AGEs like pentosidine, hard to say without more study though. I take L-carnosine which has shown good evidence for blocking crosslinks, not sure how it fairs against AGEs in cooked meat though.

 

I wish NR did a lot of things but I am confident that it's benefiting me greatly. I've never felt younger in the past 5 years than I do now.



#1366 Nate-2004

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Posted 20 October 2016 - 10:49 PM

 

 

 

When I interviewed him last Saturday he told me NR is already the best Sirtuin-activating compound (STAC). The mammalian sirtuins (SIRT1–7) are NAD+-dependent lysine deacylases. Giving them the NAD they need also stimulates their production. So as a user of pterostilbene which is also a (STAC) I'm beginning to question the necessity of its expense.

 

Well pterstilbene also impacts various cancer pathways, notably prostate.......

http://journals.plos...al.pone.0057542

 

 

I don't think it hurts to take, it's not that expensive but it could be a waste. Anything that activates sirtuins, if indeed it does (nobody knows for sure), should be a good thing. Especially if I happen to be taking in anything in my diet that might inhibit them, meaning coffee, if it does.


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#1367 Thell

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Posted 20 October 2016 - 11:15 PM

Each (resveratrol, pterostilbene and NR) has its own biochemical pathway idiosyncrasies that neither of the other two can (that we know of) replicate. Guarente, and people much more in the know us, say ptero and NR are synergistic and Brenner hasn't directly answered the question so I will reserve judgement. Resveratrol and pterostilbene will remain in the equation for my interests; the question is at what ratios.


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#1368 Supierce

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Posted 21 October 2016 - 12:25 AM

Each (resveratrol, pterostilbene and NR) has its own biochemical pathway idiosyncrasies that neither of the other two can (that we know of) replicate. Guarente, and people much more in the know us, say ptero and NR are synergistic and Brenner hasn't directly answered the question so I will reserve judgement. Resveratrol and pterostilbene will remain in the equation for my interests; the question is at what ratios.


I agree. There is much more to these compounds than just SIRT activation. Resveratrol, for example is a powerful AMPK activator, which I haven't yet seen claimed for NR.

#1369 Bryan_S

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Posted 21 October 2016 - 01:20 AM

 

 

 

When I interviewed him last Saturday he told me NR is already the best Sirtuin-activating compound (STAC). The mammalian sirtuins (SIRT1–7) are NAD+-dependent lysine deacylases. Giving them the NAD they need also stimulates their production. So as a user of pterostilbene which is also a (STAC) I'm beginning to question the necessity of its expense.

 

Well pterstilbene also impacts various cancer pathways, notably prostate.......

http://journals.plos...al.pone.0057542

 

 

Well as you know one of my favorites is honokiol which is regarded as the immune system's Swiss army knife. I started if for it SIRT3 propertiesHonokiol blocks and reverses cardiac hypertrophy in mice by activating mitochondrial Sirt3 Little did I know if helps with BPH



#1370 Heisok

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Posted 21 October 2016 - 06:43 PM

Thanks Bryan, if I recall correctly you were taking honokiol multiple times a day. Would you share your current dosing?

 

I have a feeling that it might even contribute to shrinking. I am reluctant to mention it, but anecdotally. I only take 1 of the 200 mg, 90 % Honokiol extract at bedtime. Have done this for about 4 months. I started it for Honokiol other effects.  I have cut my Natural Prostate dosage in half. The Natural Prostate formula helped with voiding issues for at least the last 14 years or so, but no noticeable shrinking of Prostate size.

 

"Application of honokiol (100μM) for 24 hours induced death of cultured WPMY-1 cells (Fig. 3). Microscopic examination revealed that cells were completely destroyed by treatment with honokiol."


Edited by Heisok, 21 October 2016 - 06:45 PM.


#1371 Bryan_S

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 09:23 AM

A vitamin could help treat Duchenne muscular dystrophy

http://actu.epfl.ch/...muscular-dystr/

 

NAD+ repletion improves muscle function in muscular dystrophy and counters global PARylation

http://stm.sciencema.../8/361/361ra139

 

Dongryeol Ryu1,*, Hongbo Zhang1,*, Eduardo R. Ropelle1,2,*, Vincenzo Sorrentino1, Davi A. G. Mázala3, Laurent Mouchiroud1, Philip L. Marshall4, Matthew D. Campbell5, Amir Safi Ali5, Gary M. Knowels5, Stéphanie Bellemin6, Shama R. Iyer7, Xu Wang1, Karim Gariani1, Anthony A. Sauve8, Carles Cantó9, Kevin E. Conley5, Ludivine Walter6, Richard M. Lovering7, Eva R. Chin3,†, Bernard J. Jasmin10, David J. Marcinek5, Keir J. Menzies1,4,‡ and Johan Auwerx1,‡
+ Author Affiliations
↵‡Corresponding author. Email: admin.auwerx@epfl.ch (J.A.); kmenzies@uottawa.ca (K.J.M.)
↵* These authors contributed equally to this work.
↵† Present address: Cytokinetics Inc., South San Francisco, CA 94080, USA.
Science Translational Medicine  19 Oct 2016:
Vol. 8, Issue 361, pp. 361ra139
DOI: 10.1126/scitranslmed.aaf5504
 
Article
Figures & Data
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You are currently viewing the abstract.
 
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Making muscle work better
 
Degenerating muscle—whether from muscular dystrophies, myopathies, or other diseases—loses its mitochondria (the energy supply) and an essential cofactor nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide (NAD+), while gaining an extra load of enzymes that use up NAD+, as reported by Ryu and colleagues. The resulting loss of NAD+ is exacerbated by a drop in NAD+ biosynthetic enzymes, such as NAMPT. Restoration of NAD+ levels in either mice or worms with disease-like degenerating muscles improved muscle function, a consequence of more mitochondria, more muscle structural proteins, and a decrease in inflammation. The authors suggest that NAD+ repletion may be a successful therapeutic approach for a number of muscle-wasting diseases.
Abstract
 
Neuromuscular diseases are often caused by inherited mutations that lead to progressive skeletal muscle weakness and degeneration. In diverse populations of normal healthy mice, we observed correlations between the abundance of mRNA transcripts related to mitochondrial biogenesis, the dystrophin-sarcoglycan complex, and nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide (NAD+) synthesis, consistent with a potential role for the essential cofactor NAD+ in protecting muscle from metabolic and structural degeneration. Furthermore, the skeletal muscle transcriptomes of patients with Duchene’s muscular dystrophy (DMD) and other muscle diseases were enriched for various poly[adenosine 5′-diphosphate (ADP)–ribose] polymerases (PARPs) and for nicotinamide N-methyltransferase (NNMT), enzymes that are major consumers of NAD+ and are involved in pleiotropic events, including inflammation. In the mdx mouse model of DMD, we observed significant reductions in muscle NAD+ levels, concurrent increases in PARP activity, and reduced expression of nicotinamide phosphoribosyltransferase (NAMPT), the rate-limiting enzyme for NAD+ biosynthesis. Replenishing NAD+ stores with dietary nicotinamide riboside supplementation improved muscle function and heart pathology in mdx and mdx/Utr−/− mice and reversed pathology in Caenorhabditis elegans models of DMD. The effects of NAD+ repletion in mdx mice relied on the improvement in mitochondrial function and structural protein expression (α-dystrobrevin and δ-sarcoglycan) and on the reductions in general poly(ADP)-ribosylation, inflammation, and fibrosis. In combination, these studies suggest that the replenishment of NAD+ may benefit patients with muscular dystrophies or other neuromuscular degenerative conditions characterized by the PARP/NNMT gene expression signatures.

Edited by Bryan_S, 22 October 2016 - 09:52 AM.


#1372 Bryan_S

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 09:49 AM

Thanks Bryan, if I recall correctly you were taking honokiol multiple times a day. Would you share your current dosing?

 

I have a feeling that it might even contribute to shrinking. I am reluctant to mention it, but anecdotally. I only take 1 of the 200 mg, 90 % Honokiol extract at bedtime. Have done this for about 4 months. I started it for Honokiol other effects.  I have cut my Natural Prostate dosage in half. The Natural Prostate formula helped with voiding issues for at least the last 14 years or so, but no noticeable shrinking of Prostate size.

 

"Application of honokiol (100μM) for 24 hours induced death of cultured WPMY-1 cells (Fig. 3). Microscopic examination revealed that cells were completely destroyed by treatment with honokiol."

 

I take 2 200 mg capsules in the morning and 2 at bed. I've tried 2 prescription medications for BPH, finding this was accidental. I don't know if it works for everyone?

 

I started the honokiol for inflammatory relief and its SIRT3 properties. Then while I was taking it I ran out of my prescription BPH medication. Guess I'd been taking honokiol for 6-months or so when this happened. I did eventually refill my medication but later changed insurance providers and couldn't get it filled for awhile again. So after going without twice and still being able to void I just stopped filling the script. It was strange being able to void without the other pills and previous lapses in my medication caused significant discomfort. Hey it works for now and I live day to day. This is not the proper thread for BPH but you can find some conversations here and here.



#1373 Heisok

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 12:58 PM

Thanks Bryan.



#1374 mrkosh1

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Posted 22 October 2016 - 11:16 PM

I was reading a thesis paper on NR and it seems to indicate that after NAD+ levels rise to a certain level, the excess NAD+ is converted to NAAD.

 

This is concerning to me, because it could limit the maximum NAD+ levels we can achieve. Even if we use multiple inducers of NAD+, if it is converted to NAAD then there could be a hard limit on the beneficial effects of NR.

 

Or, perhaps, maybe with LOTS of NR plus other supplements like R-ALA that also boost NAD, we could overwhelm whatever process converts NAD+ into NAAD.

 

Anyone have any thoughts?



#1375 Bryan_S

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Posted 23 October 2016 - 03:01 AM

I was reading a thesis paper on NR and it seems to indicate that after NAD+ levels rise to a certain level, the excess NAD+ is converted to NAAD.

 

This is concerning to me, because it could limit the maximum NAD+ levels we can achieve. Even if we use multiple inducers of NAD+, if it is converted to NAAD then there could be a hard limit on the beneficial effects of NR.

 

Or, perhaps, maybe with LOTS of NR plus other supplements like R-ALA that also boost NAD, we could overwhelm whatever process converts NAD+ into NAAD.

 

Anyone have any thoughts?

 

This is a good question but we know the cell won't waste resources so an upper limit is likely the case. I sent Dr. Brenner this very NAAD question you proposed and this kicked off an interview. Honestly we never got back to this exact point because there were so many things of interest to review and limited time. He did talk about NAAD and how it was so important as a NAD marker because it went from almost undetectable amounts to like 45 times that amount. I still feel its like a buffer but Dr' Brenner didn't describe it that way. He's indicated NAD is being converted to NAAD and back again so its acting like a buffer. I admit I could be totally wrong on that point. What he did is talk about is first pass NAD levels from NR and the secondary ones after the other NAD metabolites like NAM and Na were released. So the idea of several converging paths was discussed producing the one big NAD spike.

 

I did the interview as a Video Podcast for LongeCity so its in the approval phase.


Edited by Bryan_S, 23 October 2016 - 03:06 AM.


#1376 albedo

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Posted 23 October 2016 - 10:08 AM

 

A vitamin could help treat Duchenne muscular dystrophy

http://actu.epfl.ch/...muscular-dystr/

 

NAD+ repletion improves muscle function in muscular dystrophy and counters global PARylation

http://stm.sciencema.../8/361/361ra139

 

Dongryeol Ryu1,*, Hongbo Zhang1,*, Eduardo R. Ropelle1,2,*, Vincenzo Sorrentino1, Davi A. G. Mázala3, Laurent Mouchiroud1, Philip L. Marshall4, Matthew D. Campbell5, Amir Safi Ali5, Gary M. Knowels5, Stéphanie Bellemin6, Shama R. Iyer7, Xu Wang1, Karim Gariani1, Anthony A. Sauve8, Carles Cantó9, Kevin E. Conley5, Ludivine Walter6, Richard M. Lovering7, Eva R. Chin3,†, Bernard J. Jasmin10, David J. Marcinek5, Keir J. Menzies1,4,‡ and Johan Auwerx1,‡
+ Author Affiliations
↵‡Corresponding author. Email: admin.auwerx@epfl.ch (J.A.); kmenzies@uottawa.ca (K.J.M.)
↵* These authors contributed equally to this work.
↵† Present address: Cytokinetics Inc., South San Francisco, CA 94080, USA.
Science Translational Medicine  19 Oct 2016:
Vol. 8, Issue 361, pp. 361ra139
DOI: 10.1126/scitranslmed.aaf5504
 
...

 

Tks Bryan. I am following Auwerx's lab and his work since sometime. Recently he was awarded a very prestigious Swiss prize (the Marcel Benoist prize, http://marcel-benois...en/the-prize/).These folks look really on something, in particular on mitophagy and muscular disease, when you also add the recent results on pomegranate --> microbiome --> urolithin A --> mitophagy I also mentioned elsewhere and which is going clinical. Hongbo Zhang was also presenting the NR results at the last Keystone Symposium.



#1377 Synaptik

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Posted 23 October 2016 - 03:27 PM

Does anyone have any information on how much Nicotinamide Riboside is more effective in increasing NAD+ over plain old niacin? I have yet to read concrete numbers other than it's more "efficient". Wondering if it's worth the added expense.



#1378 Bryan_S

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Posted 23 October 2016 - 06:01 PM

 

 

A vitamin could help treat Duchenne muscular dystrophy

http://actu.epfl.ch/...muscular-dystr/

 

NAD+ repletion improves muscle function in muscular dystrophy and counters global PARylation

http://stm.sciencema.../8/361/361ra139

 

Dongryeol Ryu1,*, Hongbo Zhang1,*, Eduardo R. Ropelle1,2,*, Vincenzo Sorrentino1, Davi A. G. Mázala3, Laurent Mouchiroud1, Philip L. Marshall4, Matthew D. Campbell5, Amir Safi Ali5, Gary M. Knowels5, Stéphanie Bellemin6, Shama R. Iyer7, Xu Wang1, Karim Gariani1, Anthony A. Sauve8, Carles Cantó9, Kevin E. Conley5, Ludivine Walter6, Richard M. Lovering7, Eva R. Chin3,†, Bernard J. Jasmin10, David J. Marcinek5, Keir J. Menzies1,4,‡ and Johan Auwerx1,‡
+ Author Affiliations
↵‡Corresponding author. Email: admin.auwerx@epfl.ch (J.A.); kmenzies@uottawa.ca (K.J.M.)
↵* These authors contributed equally to this work.
↵† Present address: Cytokinetics Inc., South San Francisco, CA 94080, USA.
Science Translational Medicine  19 Oct 2016:
Vol. 8, Issue 361, pp. 361ra139
DOI: 10.1126/scitranslmed.aaf5504
 
...

 

Tks Bryan. I am following Auwerx's lab and his work since sometime. Recently he was awarded a very prestigious Swiss prize (the Marcel Benoist prize, http://marcel-benois...en/the-prize/).These folks look really on something, in particular on mitophagy and muscular disease, when you also add the recent results on pomegranate --> microbiome --> urolithin A --> mitophagy I also mentioned elsewhere and which is going clinical. Hongbo Zhang was also presenting the NR results at the last Keystone Symposium.

 

 

NAD repletion seems to help ameliorate so many maladies I'm really not surprised anymore when I see a new ailment listed for study. However the Stem cell rejuvenation experiments were a surprise at least to me.

 

One of the things Brenner spoke about off camera was his wish to retell the NAD story. In addition to his research he's embarked on publishing the corrected NAD story through a researchers eyes. So while we grapple with the papers he's going to boil down what each part of the research is telling us. Here is some of the first paragraphs. So from what I can make out this story and the opinions it contains will change as the research points one way or the other.

 

Does anyone have any information on how much Nicotinamide Riboside is more effective in increasing NAD+ over plain old niacin? I have yet to read concrete numbers other than it's more "efficient". Wondering if it's worth the added expense.

 

 

The data in the last NR study didn't quantify the human equivalent. Remember the comparisons were done in mice. I dual supplemented with NR and NAM some time back. It was the sirtuin inhibition data that changed my mind on that approach. There is plenty of pharmacokinetic data on NAM. As a general rule I would limit the daily dose at around 2 grams if sirtuin inhibition isn't your concern.


Edited by Bryan_S, 23 October 2016 - 10:34 PM.
Finish typing

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#1379 Bryan_S

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Posted 24 October 2016 - 04:16 AM

Charles Brenner, PhD discusses Nicotinamide Riboside  

 

Charles Brenner, PhD - University of Iowa Carver College of Medicine speaks with the Nicotinamide Riboside [Curated] user group at LongeCity.org October 15th, 2016 following his Nature Communications article, "Nicotinamide riboside is uniquely and orally bioavailable in mice and humans." Dr. Brenner answers questions about NAD supplementation and the history of the B3 discoveries and metabolism. He speaks off the cuff to a somewhat advanced audience level.
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#1380 Harkijn

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Posted 24 October 2016 - 01:09 PM

Charles Brenner, PhD discusses Nicotinamide Riboside

 

Charles Brenner, PhD - University of Iowa Carver College of Medicine speaks with the Nicotinamide Riboside [Curated] user group at LongeCity.org October 15th, 2016 following his Nature Communications article, "Nicotinamide riboside is uniquely and orally bioavailable in mice and humans." Dr. Brenner answers questions about NAD supplementation and the history of the B3 discoveries and metabolism. He speaks off the cuff to a somewhat advanced audience level.

 

For those of us who did not watch the video as a whole: in a short aside Dr. Brenner stresses the importance of  eating whole foods in order to keep NR  body levels up. Pretty obvious perhaps but important info for the many people who seem to be averse to eating vegetables :-)







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: nicotinamide riboside, nicotinamide, nad boosting, charles brenner, david sinclair, leonard guarente, niagen, niacinamide, nicotinamide mononucleotide

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