41 replies to this topic

[normalizing]

ratherbeunknown if you are still around and want something with similar mode of action as gingko you should switch to patented version of buterbur extract which purifies and removes pyrrolizidine alkaloids (just like gingko's toxic alkaloids are removed in patented versions) but unlike ginkgo it works much better for me by boosting blood flow to the brain and it has several studies proving it helps with migraines and cluster headaches, unlike gingko. now, taking something in similarity to gingko for the same purpose as gingko but  actually preventing the side effects gingko causes, is a win! 

[gamesguru]

back to topic, ginkgo causes headaches and various problems, and bacopa is useless with nasty side effect

 

ginkgo only causes problems if you have certain migraine traits, e.g. vasoconstriction, which is what the OP has.  even then he could still perhaps get away with a sprinkling of ginkgo; side effects could be dealt with using ginger^[1] (a vasodilator and antiserotonergic), magnesium (a muscle relaxant), or perhaps when it is bad even salicylic acid (a painkiller and anti-inflammatory).  in the case of cognitive retardation, ginkgo is wonderful.. did i mention you should start taking it, norm?

 

thanks for noticing that bacopa causes nut pain, thanks for bringing this to my attention, norm.  play3r play was too busy getting his sacked on to notice the pain.  besides, he's a quadrapelegic so he could soldier thru the pain even if it were unbearable. and one day his nutsack'll drop off like a raisin.. at least bacopa will have saved him a trip to the urologist for the vasectomy.  it also causes cancer and spontaneous explosions.  in all seriousness, this would be a huge concern, except it's not, aha:

Effect of standardized extract of Bacopa monnieri (CDRI-08) on testicular functions in adult male mice.
Patel SK1, Singh S1, Singh HK2, Singh SK3. (2016)

ETHNOPHARMACOLOGICAL RELEVANCE:
Bacopa monnieri (BM) has been used in India since the time of Rig-Veda for augmentation of learning, memory, brain health etc.

 

AIM OF THE STUDY:
The memory augmenting effect of BM is well documented. CDRI-08 is a standardized extract of Bacopa monnieri, but its effect on the male reproductive health has not been investigated. Therefore, the aim of the present study was to examine the effect of CDRI-08 administration on the male reproductive organs with special emphasis on testis in adult mice.

 

MATERIALS AND METHODS:
CDRI-08, containing at least 55% bacosides (the major constituent of BM), was investigated for its effect on testicular functions in adult Parkes (P) mice. A suspension of CDRI-08 was orally administered in doses of 40 and 80mgkg-1 body weight day-1 for 28 days and various male reproductive end points were evaluated.

 

RESULTS:
Compared to control, CDRI-08 treatment caused a significant increase (p<0.05) in spermatogenic cell density (germinal epithelial height: control, 55.03±4.22 vs 40mg, 67.15±2.65 and 80mg, 69.93±3.76; and tubular diameter: control, 206.55±2.62 vs 80mg, 253.23±12.19), PCNA index (control, 59.85±2.09 vs 40mg, 82.17±1.56 and 80mg, 84.05±3.51) and in steroidogenic indices in the testis, and in sperm viability (control, 0.67±0.010 vs 80mg, 0.80±0.04) in cauda epididymidis of the treated mice. On the other hand, however, the same treatment caused a significant decrease (p<0.05) in abnormal sperm morphology (control, 21.72±1.06 vs 40mg, 10.63±1.50 and 80mg, 15.86±0.87) in cauda epididymidis, and in lipid peroxidation level in testis of the treated mice compared to controls.

 

CONCLUSION:
The results suggest that treatment with CDRI-08 extract improves sperm quality, and spermatogenic cell density and steroidogenic indices in the testis of P mice. ["growing pains" anyone?]

 

Endocrine effects of marijuana in the male: preclinical studies.
Harclerode J. (1984)

Marijuana affects a variety of hormones that are regulated by hypothalamic function and it appears that the psychoactive ingredient, THC, is the major compound responsible for this action. It is probable that THC affects these hormones through its ability to alter various neural transmitters in the hypothalamus or neural transmitters in the CNS which impinge on the hypothalamus. The dopaminergic and serotonergic fibers seem to be particularly important. The two gonadotropins, LH and FSH, secreted by the pituitary gland are of major importance to reproduction in the male. Both gonadotropins appear to respond to a single releasing factor from the hypothalamus, GnRH, which is sensitive to catecholamine neurotransmitters. The THC-induced block of GnRH release results in lowered LH and FSH which is responsible for reduced testosterone production by the Leydig cells of the testis. Other hormones that might have a synergistic or antagonistic effect upon reproduction in the male are the adrenal cortical hormones, prolactin, thyroid hormones, and growth hormones. THC appears to depress prolactin, thyroid gland function, and growth hormone while elevating adrenal cortical steroids. Chronic exposure of laboratory animals, such as rats, mice, and monkeys to marijuana and to the various cannabinoids in marijuana has altered the function of several of the accessory reproductive organs. Reports of reduced prostate and seminal vesicle weights, as well as altered testicular function, have been partially explained by the effect of marijuana in lowering serum testosterone needed for proper function and support. Although some of the change in organ weight may be due to lowered testosterone production by the Leydig cells of the testis, some of the weight changes may be due to a direct action of THC, and perhaps some of the other nonpsychoactive cannabinoids in marijuana, on the tissue themselves. Also, of concern are the reports that acute cannabinoid treatments affects the quality and quantity of spermatozoa produced by the testis. The question is still unanswered as to whether or not the effects observed on spermatozoa are due to a direct action of the cannabinoids on spermatogenesis, or whether some of the observed effects may be due to altered hormone levels which are necessary for the support of spermatogenesis. Reduced testosterone and FSH may be important in producing the observed changes in sperm production by the seminiferous tubules. Many of the effects on the endocrine system caused by chronic treatment of animals with THC are completely reversible with time and there is reason to believe that tolerance develops to these effects with acute exposure to THC.

Edited by gamesguru, 31 August 2016 - 07:20 PM.

[normalizing]

gamesguru i dont like stimulants. gingko also caused me headaches, irritability etc. i think your problem is, in point to fact, you take way too many stimulants. my suggestion to YOU is, take downers a bit and RELAX! the marijuana study you posted should be a reminder for you to smoke some and chill and stop being on the offensive ktnx

Edited by normalizing, 01 September 2016 - 03:28 AM.

[psychejunkie]

Ginkgo extracts cause headaches only in those with already thin blood or high CBF (Cerebral Blood Flow), but even those who dont have thin blood, too much doses will cause headaches.

 

few years back I had thin blood, frequent nose bleeds, etc and even a single dose of Ginkgo would result bad headaches that didnt go away!

but now since 3 years ago, after a year-period of smoking marijuana for 24/7, my blood is as thick as 50-year old (according to the doctor who was trying to be threatening me against smoking tobacco), so by taking Ginkgo now my blood thins to normal levels, my headaches, insomnia and working-memory weakness goes away and even my acne are gone!

 

you cant just label a herb "bad" or "good", every medicinal herb, supplement or drug have its own purpose.

The problem in nootropic communities is mostly "Drug Seeking Disorder", people often read some statements about an herb/supp/drug on internet and start to get excited about taking them! and expecting NZT-48 like effects... but all they get are more hunger for substances and taking larger dose without fear!!!

 

Why don't you guys accept the fact that even herbs have both evil and angel sides like us? they don't have to be all "angel" in every aspects. frankly, most herbs are dangerous and poisonous but even those poisonous mushrooms might someday prove to be having strong anti-cancer benefits or even cure! they've had promising results and lot of hopes already. although, in same time they still can kill you instantly.

 

This is all paradoxical effects which we all experience in this cosmos all the time, but some people fail to perceive these universal rules.

 

peace out

Edited by psychejunkie, 01 September 2016 - 06:13 AM.

[pamojja]

Ginkgo extracts cause headaches only in those with already thin blood or high CBF (Cerebral Blood Flow), but even those who dont have thin blood, too much doses will cause headaches.

 

Though don't took more than 180 mg Ginkgo extract per day long term, used it consistently for years. Never had any negative effect with otherwise very thin blood. For example, can't even take a baby aspirin without resulting in blood in stool.
 

[gamesguru]

gamesguru i dont like stimulants. gingko also caused me headaches, irritability etc. i think your problem is, in point to fact, you take way too many stimulants. my suggestion to YOU is, take downers a bit and RELAX! the marijuana study you posted should be a reminder for you to smoke some and chill and stop being on the offensive ktnx

 

You don't like stimulants, and you said in a PM you do research on bullying?  Also, piss off norm.  You're a load of crap who's propped his fat gut up on a splintering desk.  If anything, marijuana is what precipitates my outbursts and aggression most of all!  Ginkgo is 2nd, tea is 3rd.  So why don't you drop the marijuana, norm, for some lithium and bacopa and get back with me in a few months?

[normalizing]

oh wow you are a strange fellow didnt know marijuana does this to you. but tell you what, cbd oil, the medicinal constituents of marijuana without the THC will benefit you then. does all the good without the bad.try it

[gamesguru]

tried it, didn't get you high or make music better. it's more so when I'm off that I get irritible, but still, it messes with mood

Edited by gamesguru, 01 September 2016 - 08:33 PM.

[bugsbunny]

 Never overdose gingko! Nasty stuff. I consumed 1g extract for about 1 week and had very strong headache, together with strange vision problems that made me think ill turn blind. I couldnt see anything i focused. It faded away after one day but the experience wasnt nice.

[Skyguy2005]

 Never overdose gingko! Nasty stuff. I consumed 1g extract for about 1 week and had very strong headache, together with strange vision problems that made me think ill turn blind. I couldnt see anything i focused. It faded away after one day but the experience wasnt nice.

 

Coming back to this thread, I've consumed 1-1.5g Ginkgo Biloba extract daily and sometimes more (but not much more) for three years, and I never get headaches (except from hangovers haha). I also drink Ginkgo Biloba tea.

 

Everyone is different, we should always remember that. Perhaps this is just an example of that.

 

I'd also add the fact that I don't take many different things. Ginkgo, Red Reishi, Resveratrol, Glucosamine is pretty much my "stack". Sometimes Valerian. I'm also quite young (28).
 

[bugsbunny]

 

 Never overdose gingko! Nasty stuff. I consumed 1g extract for about 1 week and had very strong headache, together with strange vision problems that made me think ill turn blind. I couldnt see anything i focused. It faded away after one day but the experience wasnt nice.

 

Coming back to this thread, I've consumed 1-1.5g Ginkgo Biloba extract daily and sometimes more (but not much more) for three years, and I never get headaches (except from hangovers haha). I also drink Ginkgo Biloba tea.

 

Everyone is different, we should always remember that. Perhaps this is just an example of that.

 

I'd also add the fact that I don't take many different things. Ginkgo, Red Reishi, Resveratrol, Glucosamine is pretty much my "stack". Sometimes Valerian. I'm also quite young (28).
 

 

I had the strong pharmaceutical extract version of ginkgo for 50e per package and it said only one pill per day. I took 10 :D It might be because of a difference in potency. I think it caused brain bleeding but im not sure about that.

Edited by bugsbunny, 07 January 2017 - 06:16 PM.

[gamesguru]

doubtful of the brain bleeding. i too used to take retarded amounts of ginkgo 5-7 caps, usually as a pre-workout or adderall alterative.

 

ginkgo is actually poorly distributed in the brain.  and accordingly, i only ever noticed bleeding in the extremities (due to eczema) or my face (picking acne).  but you could have an issue with brain bleeding if you had an AVM, aneursym or whatnot.  it's just highly unlikely. and hey! if it did happen, at least it wasn't serious enough to wind you up in the hospital