I've been doing 1mg QOD for something like 3 months, & haven't had any increase in negative effects. When I first started, it induced water retention (could have been caused by a move to a keto diet, though), and restless legs (which I got rid of by taking tyrosine).
FYI: The study mTOR inhibition improves immune function in the elderly used three groups. 0.5mg per day, 5mg per week, and 20mg per week. The 0.5mg & 5mg groups tolerated the rapa well. Even the 20mg wasn't too far off the placebo, in terms adverse effects!
New Rapamycin Study- up to 60% increase in mouse lifespan- Anyone Experimenting With This?
#181
Posted 13 February 2017 - 03:36 PM
#182
Posted 13 February 2017 - 04:12 PM
Just keep in mind that the trial on immune function in elderly used a rapalog, Everolimus. Everolimus was created to have less of an impact on mTorc2. It's half life is 36 hours vs 72 for rapamycin. One can take a larger dose of everolimus vs rapamycin with fewer side effects. This was a very good study because it was over 200 people. Now the University of Texas dosing will be 1 mg daily x 8 weeks of rapamycin not everolimus. It will be interesting to see the difference if there is any because this will not be intermediate dosing, but very low dosing. The Texas trial will also be the first to check ageing parameters such as grip strength, and walking time.
Here is a new study https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC5270685/ dealing with pan-mTOR inhibitors. This could be the next drug to block mTorc1 without side effects.
Study is by Mikhail Blagosklonny the number one advocate of ageing research and rapamycin.
#183
Posted 12 March 2017 - 02:12 AM
#184
Posted 12 March 2017 - 06:51 AM
]Here is a new study https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC5270685/ dealing with pan-mTOR inhibitors. This could be the next drug to block mTorc1 without side effects.
Study is by Mikhail Blagosklonny the number one advocate of ageing research and rapamycin.
Hi PAMPAGUY,
That is indeed an interesting study. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Are they suggesting substances other than Rapamycin, such as Torin 1 and PP242, might better yet prevent cellular aging at low doses without any unwanted side-effects?
"Gerosuppressive effect of pan-mTOR inhibitors (as measured by RPP) was equal to that of rapamycin because it is mostly associated with inhibition of the S6K/S6 axis. Yet anti-hypertrophic effect as well as prevention of SA-beta-Gal staining and large cell morphology was more pronounced with pan-mTOR inhibitors than with rapamycin. Also, at optimal concentrations, all pan-mTOR inhibitors extended loss of re-proliferative potential in stationary cell culture more potently than rapamycin. This test determines hyper-metabolism and lactic acid production and is an equivalent of “yeast CLS”. One conclusion is that pan-mTOR inhibitors may be superior to rapamycin."
If this is true maybe frontrunner experimenters may derive more significant anti-aging benefits at higher dosage than can be safely done today with Rapamycin or even Everolimus, which could warrant research into the availability and pricing of pan m-TOR inhibitors. Reason posted about pan mTOR inhibitors in Longecity's Biosciences News section a few weeks ago.
http://www.longecity...s-to-rapamycin/
Is it possibly mature enough a perspective to start discussing Torin 1 in the Supplement section of the forum? An issue is going to be cost-effective dosage pricing. It is commercially available from $105 / 5mg to $650 / 50mg. Making it necessary to explore Group Buy price conditions for custom fabrication and testing. As many here have explored micro-dosage administration of Rapamycin with mixed results, it becomes plausible to not delay testing of a plausibly safer and potentially more effective candidate allowing the use of higher doses.
DareDevil
Edited by DareDevil, 12 March 2017 - 07:26 AM.
#185
Posted 12 March 2017 - 02:45 PM
Yes, these Pan-mTOR inhibitors could be the next big thing in aging and all the diseases that come with that. The main thing about these mTor inhibitors is that they inhibit other signal pathways that Rapamycin does not. But with so little clinical research, how does one decide about dosing and dosing schedules. I'm inclined to wait and this is why.
Rapamycin is very safe. It has been taken daily for many years by transplant patients. No doubt dosing and dosing schedules are very important. But looking at the elderly immunology trial back in 2014, they took up to 20 mg weekly with very few side effects and these were very elderly volunteers. They went onthat the 20 mg dose almost completely blocked the mTor signal and that the 5 mg weekly dose blocked over 50% of the signal. Other mice trials have confirmed that the higher the dose, the better the aging benefits. While the immunology trial used a rapalog Everolimus which has a shorter half life and less effect on mTor2 we know that we probably do not have to block the signal completely in order to be effective. Any dose from 10-15 mg should be very effective at blocking from 80-90% of the mTor1 signal without causing major side effects. If one does experience side effects you can always back off and they disappear. If one wanted to experiment with yourself you could slowly up your weekly dosage until you experience an unwanted side effect and then back off safely.
Another big factor is cost. Everolimus is very expensive somewhere around $5 mg or much more. I purchase Sirolimus for $1.50 mg all in. I should mention that I also take Metformin, low dose aspirin, and a statin. Metformin and aspirin works in synergy with Rapamycin to delay aging.
My goal is to feel as happy as the dog smiling in this caption. He is 13 years old( the equivalent of 80 years old), but has the energy of a much younger dog. His image was taken from the DogProject at Washington State University trial. The dog has also showed up on numerous UTube videos. Just google Dogproject/Rapamycin dogs. You cannot imagine at a younger age how you will feel once aging really kicks in. At 50 yo, I was running 1/2 marathons and felt great. I slowed down in my later 50's, but it really hit me after age 60. So no matter how good a shape your in it it's going to hit you eventually.
Of course, my goals at 70 yo are different than someone who is younger than me. As mentioned before I would not recommend Rapamycin for a young person below the age of 60 unless they are taking it for another medical reason.
Mikhail Blagosklonny, Phd has also stated that this sort of intervention could save Medicare. Much less trips to the Doctor and hospital. In mouse studies, when it came time to die, they died quickly without dragging on for a long time.
#186
Posted 12 March 2017 - 07:03 PM
Sirt1 activation and mTor1 suppression. In most cases, this yields the same
Result. But in gut cells mTor1 supression is actually bad. In addition
Rapamycin has serious side effects. So Rapamycin is not a perfect candidate for longevity.
NAD+ precursor Nicotinamide riboside can duplicate all the good effects of
Rapamycin without any of the side effects.
#187
Posted 12 March 2017 - 07:43 PM
Thank you for your writing. Often one problem on this site is older people come onto the scene announcing their bold experimental plans, they report a few times, and usually too soon, too generally, without sustained commitment, or objective blood work or measurements, and then they disappear....You cannot imagine at a younger age how you will feel once aging really kicks in. At 50 yo, I was running 1/2 marathons and felt great. I slowed down in my later 50's, but it really hit me after age 60. So no matter how good a shape your in it it's going to hit you eventually.[/background][/size]
Of course, my goals at 70 yo are different than someone who is younger than me. As mentioned before I would not recommend Rapamycin for a young person below the age of 60 unless they are taking it for another medical reason.
Mikhail Blagosklonny, Phd has also stated that this sort of intervention could save Medicare. Much less trips to the Doctor and hospital. In mouse studies, when it came time to die, they died quickly without dragging on for a long time.
Poof. Gone. What did the rest of us learn? Little. And so we're left kinda hanging.
So if you do choose a Blagosklonny-like self trial with 7mg per week of rapamycin (or whatever you decide) you could help the tiny community of seekers here by consistently posting your anecdotal N1 over time, with specificity. We'd be grateful, curious, and supportive.
Edited by sthira, 12 March 2017 - 07:44 PM.
#188
Posted 12 March 2017 - 07:46 PM
Any interest in a metformin, rapamycin group buy?
#189
Posted 12 March 2017 - 08:03 PM
Charles Brenner had a presentation where he compared the effects of
Sirt1 activation and mTor1 suppression. In most cases, this yields the same
Result. But in gut cells mTor1 supression is actually bad. In addition
Rapamycin has serious side effects. So Rapamycin is not a perfect candidate for longevity.
NAD+ precursor Nicotinamide riboside can duplicate all the good effects of
Rapamycin without any of the side effects.
Mike: we understand your enthusiasm about NR. But Dr. Brenner's discoveries in providing preliminary evidence for the unique properties of NR in genetically-modified rodents (neuroprotection, sirtuin activation, protection against weight gain on a high fat diet, improvement of blood glucose and insulin sensitivity) these potentially beneficial-for-modified-rodent attributes are not "a perfect candidate for longevity," either.
Now exists no perfect candidate pills for longevity, and no metabolic tinkering to stop intrinsic and extrinsic human aging will be found anytime soon. Meanwhile, friendly advice: learn to curb your enthusiasm about NR so it doesn't bubble over into every thread to which you contribute.
And peace, brother.
#190
Posted 12 March 2017 - 08:14 PM
I asked TLR and they said they may be able to get it.
#191
Posted 12 March 2017 - 08:32 PM
Any interest in a metformin, rapamycin group buy?
Sure! Might not be so easy, though.
Edited by tintinet, 12 March 2017 - 08:33 PM.
#192
Posted 12 March 2017 - 08:35 PM
I'm interested. Definitely! Longecity member Logic seems solid at group buys.Sure! Might not be so easy, though.Any interest in a metformin, rapamycin group buy?
#193
Posted 12 March 2017 - 09:49 PM
I'm interested. Definitely! Longecity member Logic seems solid at group buys.Sure! Might not be so easy, though.Any interest in a metformin, rapamycin group buy?
Generic Metformin is pretty cheap already, but rapamycin is certainly of interest for a group buy for me.
#194
Posted 12 March 2017 - 10:55 PM
There are 300,000 people taking it now and increasing quickly.
Most people feel an immediate boost in energy. Some get younger skins, some even turned their grey hair to black. But the most important thing is it prevents age related diseases such as cancer, Alzheimer's, Parkinson, and many many more.
#195
Posted 12 March 2017 - 11:34 PM
Sthira: there are lots of evidence that Niagen works in humans.
There are 300,000 people taking it now and increasing quickly.
Most people feel an immediate boost in energy. Some get younger skins, some even turned their grey hair to black. But the most important thing is it prevents age related diseases such as cancer, Alzheimer's, Parkinson, and many many more.
Even if all of that is true, which maybe it is or maybe it isn't, this is a thread about rapamycin.
#196
Posted 13 March 2017 - 12:59 AM
Sthira: there are lots of evidence that Niagen works in humans.
There are 300,000 people taking it now and increasing quickly.
Most people feel an immediate boost in energy. Some get younger skins, some even turned their grey hair to black. But the most important thing is it prevents age related diseases such as cancer, Alzheimer's, Parkinson, and many many more.
Even if all of that is true, which maybe it is or maybe it isn't, this is a thread about rapamycin.
Would that it were true, but I've been taking Niagen for years and I've not noticed any increase in energy, improvement in skin, or reversal of hair graying.
#197
Posted 13 March 2017 - 01:47 AM
#198
Posted 13 March 2017 - 02:13 AM
Maybe you don't have NRK1 genes. Or you are too young. Only recommend people over 40 to take it
Does NR interfere with abilities to post about anything other than NR in threads unrelated? Or is that an NRK1 gene or over 40 conundrum, too?
Please mark me Unfriendly: I'm a terrible person, I'm a shitty, obscure comic on a cold stage, and as we say please leave comedy to the professionals, and fuck if I can make dollar up here.
Meanwhile, how about that 60% increase in gen-modified mouse LS for rapamycin, ain't that some shit.
#199
Posted 13 March 2017 - 02:20 AM
Does NR interfere with abilities to post about anything other than NR in threads unrelated? Or is that an NRK1 gene or over 40 conundrum, too?Maybe you don't have NRK1 genes. Or you are too young. Only recommend people over 40 to take it
Please mark me Unfriendly: I'm a terrible person, I'm a shitty, obscure comic on a cold stage, and as we say please leave comedy to the professionals, and fuck if I can make dollar up here.
Meanwhile, how about that 60% increase in gen-modified mouse LS for rapamycin, ain't that some shit.
+1 spicy
#200
Posted 13 March 2017 - 02:25 AM
#201
Posted 13 March 2017 - 04:42 AM
Any interest in a metformin, rapamycin group buy?
I asked TLR and they said they may be able to get it.
Hi LOOKINGFORTIME,
Yes I'm on board. The only reason I haven't tried Rapamycin is due to not being able to source it without a prescription. However, I had positive experience with TLR's Dasatinib and Quercetin. So if they offer them for purchase this it might make it easier/quicker to get through them? In any case I'll defintely participate in a Group Buy of Rapamycin or Everolimus and Metformin. Even if the latter is widely available, it is easier to buy them as a package. That is how TLR sold the D+Q as the cheaper ingredient was computed at its considerably lower price when calculated into the combined purchase. Keep us posted if you make progress on this with them. TIA
DareDevil
#202
Posted 13 March 2017 - 07:11 AM
Any interest in a metformin, rapamycin group buy?
Yes, definitely.
#203
Posted 13 March 2017 - 12:13 PM
I was quoted $1.45 mg, 300 Biocon, blister pack of 10, for Sirolimus by the following India Pharma Co. without Rx. This price includes shipping. http://somipharma.com/
Wire money, no Pay Pal or Credit Cards. They also have Metformin, regular and SR. for those without Rx.
Also, dropshipmd.com. $1.75 mg, shipping included, but same terms as Somi. Will send Invoice. This is company I have already used and was very satisfied.
Cheapest I have found. If you can get a Rx for Metformin from your doctor that is the best way. Metformin SR 1000 mg sells for about 7 cents a tablet here, but about 23 cents from India without Rx.
#204
Posted 13 March 2017 - 01:14 PM
Thanks Pampaguy,
I was unable to get a reply without a prescription and have contacted the source your already purchased from, dropship.md, asking their pricing on 50mg of Rapamycin (5 boxes of 10 x 1mg Rapacan-1) and on 100mg of Everolimus (1 box of 10 x 10mg Evertor). As I had no prescription to upload, I'll get back to you with my reply and won't get excited quite yet until I receive a positive sales offer upon which I will make an advance MoneyGram payment.
DareDevil
#205
Posted 13 March 2017 - 01:25 PM
That is considered a very small order. There minimum order is $100. Remember it cost me $25 for a bank wire which really adds to the cost of a small order. My first order was for 200 mg. The small order will probably get a much higher price. They pay $25 for shipping to US, for air with tracking number. They can ship 300 mg with one $25 shipping package. The Evertor will be very expensive because it is sold in India and the rest of the world for a Cancer treatment and as such is very expensive per mg.
Just some things to remember. Good Luck
#206
Posted 13 March 2017 - 08:37 PM
Notice that Rapamycin causes aging in intestinal stem cells.
Niagen can rejuvenate old intestinal stem cells (ISC).
#207
Posted 13 March 2017 - 08:43 PM
TLR sent this email to me, about rapamycin
If a 5g or more group buy total can be arranged we will take orders
individually and give $30 off the 500mg/1g price or someone in your
group can buy 5g as priced and divide it up themselves and ship it. If
we ship it will be obviously price + shipping, whatever mode is desired
by each person - thx
#208
Posted 14 March 2017 - 07:18 PM
TLR sent this email to me, about rapamycin
If a 5g or more group buy total can be arranged we will take orders
individually and give $30 off the 500mg/1g price or someone in your
group can buy 5g as priced and divide it up themselves and ship it. If
we ship it will be obviously price + shipping, whatever mode is desired
by each person - thx
$30 off what price?
We understand that the min order should be 5g but 5g/1g pricing needs to be included as well before making any decision.
#209
Posted 14 March 2017 - 08:45 PM
Their Everolimus (fewer side effects) is better priced than their Rapamycin.
FYI they won't ship to Canada or to Western European countries.
Here is the reply I received from Med Impex:
400$ for 10 tabs Evertor, and 50 tabs Rapacan x 3.5$ per pill.
Registered airmail shipping takes 15 days approx upto post office in usa and it is 10$ extra.
Ems express shipping takes approximately 7-10 days upto your hands (in usa) and it is 25$ extra.
= Everolimus at $4/mg and Rapamycin at $3.50/mg
+ shipping costs
If TLR's special Longecity pricing is good I'd be ready to purchase immediately. Please give us details on their conditions. An advantage for those who are overseas, TLR will ship outside the USA. I had a positive experience buying their Dasatinib with Quercetin so I would be inclined to trust them. Others are free to do likewise or otherwise.
DareDevil
Edited by DareDevil, 14 March 2017 - 08:56 PM.
#210
Posted 14 March 2017 - 09:16 PM
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