18 replies to this topic

[MattMcFly1986]

A week ago I started taking 150 mg Aurorix (Moclobemide), a reversible MAOI (RIMA), which affects Serotonin, Norepinephrine and Dopamine, without the extreme diet restrictions of irreversible MAOIs. It sounds pretty good on paper, but there isn't a whole lot of information available about it, even though it has been on the marked since the 70's.

My Neurologist didn't know what else to try on me since I can't take SSRIs (emotional flattening and libido problems). So I suggested Moclobemide (which I read about online). She confided that she knows little about it since it hardly gets prescribed over here. She told me to start with 150 mg once a day for 30 days.
 

So far I am feeling extremely lethargic and tired. When I get up too quickly I'm getting these weird body impulses (usually just 1 or 2)- they're hard to describe, though. I'm going to increase the dosage to 300 mg and hope it will then start to affect dopamine and norepinephrine and give me the boost I need.
 

I had been on Wellbutrin XR 150 mg for the past two months because of what seems to be a lack of dopamine. For the past couple of years I have been unmotivated, have brain fog and shot vocabulary, negative mental talkback, a libido that goes in and out, lethargy and easily enraged.

The Wellbutrin XR 150 mg took 4 weeks of side effects before it started working. Turned me into a super productive robot- for exactly one week. Then I felt as lethargic as before. Wellbutrin Rage (and maybe a slight increase in hair loss - not sure if that has anything to do with this med) were the only things I really noticed. Between quitting Wellbutrin and starting Moclobemide I waited 7-9 days. It was impossible to get any official information switching from an atypical anti-depressant to a reversible MAOI. One company said wait 24 hours, the other said 7 days. Maybe the side effects I am currently experiencing are because of my discontinuation and not the Aurorix building up?

 

Now what neither my doctor, nor the pharmacist could answer me:

 

• Can Moclobemide "cure" you? I read it loses its effectiveness after 2 years. I want to stay on an AD for as short as possible (6 months max.), but what happens then? Being a stimulant that increases Dopamine artificially, will it put me in a worse depression without taking it?
• Did it increase anger / irritability in you?
• Did you notice an increase in hair loss?
• Did you experience a decrease in libido?

Any experiences and suggestions are greatly appreciated.

 

[MattMcFly1986]

I'm going from 150 mg to 300 mg today, but I'm a bit skeptical. So far it is only making me really tired and lethargic (again, that may be Wellbutrin leaving my system, or Moclobemide doing initial restructuring).
Also, I'm freezing no matter how many layers I wear. I had the same experience on Wellbutrin. I tend to feel the cold around my torso, in the back, where the kidneys are. That I felt for the whole year, way before going on ADs, but it seems to have increased from sometimes to constantly.

[sant2060]

Moclo is supposed to work best for atypical depression. And if it works, it starts usually working relatively fast, 2-3 Weeks. I had actually a good results on it, for first time in years had glimpse of joy, from simple things like enjoying a sunny day, or listening to music. Unfortunatelly, it didnt last, after three months honeymoon was over, and I was back to my usuall depressive level.

Your dosages are still very low, I could go up to 900 per day without any side effects.

[MattMcFly1986]

I've been 300 mg/d for a few days now, it is still making me feel more tired after I take it. So far it hasn't shown any effects whatsoever (nearly 2 weeks). Your post gives me a bit of hope, though.

 

 

''Moclobemide is relatively well-tolerated. Severe side effects are infrequent. The side effect profile is as follows:
Breast: Rarely secretion of milk in both sexes (due to elevated prolactin levels) and breast enlargement.''

This was posted in an old Moclobemide thread. Doesn't raised Prolactin cause hair loss in men?

[magniloquentc0unt]

ive had great success with aurorix, made me active again. i used to take different dosages, up to 600mg a day for relatively regular periods. sometime 900 a day. What i am doing nowadays as a maintenance dose on need is 150 or 300mg with 10mg ritalin. The ritalin helps in my opinion. I found aurorix to make me a bit agitated and chatty and combining it with ritalin throws in a bit of "edginess" which basically balances me back to 0 on that aspect. I am mainly concerned about looking hyper. The ritalin i am prescribed for ADD.

 

my suggestion is to experiment with dosages and times of days

Edited by magniloquentc0unt, 29 November 2016 - 07:47 PM.

[magniloquentc0unt]

• Can Moclobemide "cure" you? I read it loses its effectiveness after 2 years. I want to stay on an AD for as short as possible (6 months max.), but what happens then? Being a stimulant that increases Dopamine artificially, will it put me in a worse depression without taking it?

"it loses effectiveness" is some anectodal bullshit. what that supposed to mean? of course homeostasis does its course. take a break and give it another go after a while.

• Did it increase anger / irritability in you

not really, made me more talkative

•  
• Did you notice an increase in hair loss?
• not at all
• Did you experience a decrease in libido?
• nope, the opposite, slightly

[MattMcFly1986]

Interesting, well that gives me a bit of hope. I have a doctor's appointment in two days where I will up my dose to 375 mg. So far I only feel zoned out, slow and tired shortly after taking it and then again about 4 hours after that. Maybe that's the Serotonin, which I don't think is my problem to begin with, rather the Dopamine.

[MattMcFly1986]

After one month the 150 mg still made me increasingly tired / zoned out and feel chills (anybody know why these things happen? Is it the Serotonin?)
I switched from 150 mg two times a day (morning and early afternoon) to one 300 mg pill. As suggested by my doctor, I took it right before going to sleep. Interestingly, the 300 mg felt like a barrage of brain "zaps" / impulse waves, followed by sleep paralysis (haven't had one in a long while), during which I had one of those imagined audio sensations that can happen during one. This time though it wasn't a natural sound (bee, TV, phone ringing, distant voices), it was that 50s/ 60s Flying Saucer interior ambience wave sound, cranked up all the way, almost gave me a migrane.

Anyway, if I can I will try the 300 mg for another week or two, but I am getting the feeling ADs were never the right tools for my case. SSRIs, Wellbutrin and now this reversible MAOI have done nothing more than give me side effects.

[MaybeYouShouldDrive]

Hi MattMcF, I hope your month with moclobemide has been to some help for you.

There is a thread no 215143 about moclobemide somewhere else on the net that might be of interest. A familiar user name over in that thread too. It's also possibly an opportunity to play "spot the (hypo)manic user", not unlike that "spanked-up caller"
from gta3/chatterbox.

I have one year of experience with moclobemide / manerix / aurorix, started at 2x150mg and after a couple of weeks or a month doubling that. The doctor involved was hesitant to let me up the dose above 600mg due to the guidelines not mentioning anything above it. Said doctor also made sweeping references to unspecified studies and results showing good enough occupancy of maoi-a at 600mg.

One such study can be found in pubmed, but I don't remember if it actually said anything about 600mg being in any way optimal or preferable to a somewhat higher dose. There are other studies on tranylcypramine (Parnate, non-selective for A/B, non-reversible) that discuss hoe many percent of maoi they believe can still be free while still providing the antidepressant effects. If anyone remembers the specifics feel free to correct me and or fill out the blanks.

Anyway some time later another doctor thought 900mg would not be such a bad idea, so I briefly tried that dose, still split in two equal doses per day. Together with the lisdexamfetamine that I had been on since before the Moc that 900mg dose felt like a bit much. Possibly some serotonin syndrome stuff there, a bad headache and worrying about if this is what intercranial bleeding feels like.

So did it work? Well - No. Gained some weight of the uncool kind. Body perspiration like if had been wearing a down jacket while doing heavy manual labour in the tropical rainforest with suffering from a bad case of malaria.
Emotional blunting? No, quite the opposite, but I only got back the feelings I was not looking for. I blame the serotonin.

Does it increase the strength of your amps 10x - as is claimed in that other thread? - No. (+ROFL) If you look around the net some [who? I dunno] claim moclobemide even lowers dopamine. If taken with mph, amps or similar any such effect should be neglible.

Did it affect my hair? - No.


Anything else? - You might not want to combine stimulants, bupropion and moclobemide at the same time. Seizures.

[MattMcFly1986]

Interesting on the perspiration aspect- I had that on Wellbutrin, but mostly because it gave some anxiety, thus resulting in sweating.

 

I've been on 300 mg before bedtime for 10 days now. Forgot to take a pill yesterday (was away from home, so I took it this morning) which I fear will make me tired again. I will try 450 mg a day next week.

[MaybeYouShouldDrive]

Matt, since you mentioned being prescribed moclobemide by a neurologist there might be issues - factors we are unaware of so as usual it is best to stick to the doctor's orders as long as possible and it still seems meaningful to do so.

Anxiety, yes in the mornings, so maybe a bad synergy there with the stimulant, since I suppose the maoi-a level should ideally remain stable during treatment with a RIMA and not vary with the time of day and with time since the last dose. Maybe dividing the daily dose into three could be better or different, but not so according to the info I got from the doctor so I did not try that.

Also there was the issue of worsened insomnia. Once again, possibly due to the combination with vyvanse. Maybe the evening half of the Maoi dose could be blamed here?

Aurorix seems to me like it could be well worth a try for depression together with that feeling of having no energy in you when it is supposedly time to rise and shine in the morning. Cheaper than Bupropion (possibly) , no warnings about seizures - unlike B, and hey it is a safe Maoi that doctors can let you have without fears of interactions or diet restrictions, and then you either get your undepressed self back or you start asking for Marplan, nardil, parade, or begin petitioning "your" politicians so we can have our Survector / Amineptine back.


Edited autouncorrect

Edited by MaybeYouShouldDrive, 17 December 2016 - 11:38 AM.

[magniloquentc0unt]

perspiration and insomnia are both caused by noradrenaline/norepinephrine ... on reboxetine (pure NRI, strong) ive had the weirdest cold sweats and impossibility to fall asleep tough exausted

[MattMcFly1986]

I did experience insomnia every night for the first three to four weeks on Wellbutrin. Nothing on Moclobemide, though. Maybe that's because I now take it right before I go to sleep. This does make me wonder if I experience any benefits from it during the day at all, since its halflife is very short, depending who you want to believe. Some say two hours, others six, etc.

However, both ADs share one thing in common, after taking them I get the chills, especially around my lower back where my kidneys are. My hands, which aren't the warmest to begin with are freezing. Not sure what causes this exactly, but it's annoying. I have a constant room temperature and know I shouldn't feel cold, yet I do. I have to wear body heat protecting sports wear under my regular clothes to keep me warm at the moment. Sucks, since I am not into layers.

Edited by MattMcFly1986, 17 December 2016 - 03:22 PM.

[magniloquentc0unt]

actually, as someone on these forums explained me in another post, the half life of the drug does not equal to how long the medication affects you. apparently the enzymes are disabled for longer than the half life. it is not clear how much though

[Junipersun]

actually, as someone on these forums explained me in another post, the half life of the drug does not equal to how long the medication affects you. apparently the enzymes are disabled for longer than the half life. it is not clear how much though

 

The guidelines to changing to a ssri from moclobemid say that it is possible after 24 hours, as MAO inhibition returns completely back to normal after that time frame.

[pecanpie]

IME you aren't taking enough. My pdoc went up to 900 mg per day with me. 150 mg is silly, sounds like your doctor doesn't know how to pose this medication. It is a reversible MAOI do the dietary restrictions and drug interactions are waaaaay less of a big deal then the old school irreversible MAOIs. Also low dose Lithium , 300-600 mg will turn up the volume in a big way on this medication. And for energy 200-600 modafanil daily. It was prescribed top me that way and 600 mg should nail your eyelids open like you just have given the Starbucks mermaid a rimjob while smoking crack.

Edited by pecanpie, 23 January 2017 - 11:06 PM.

[magniloquentc0unt]

I like that analogy, sounds accurate

[treeinme]

In the end, even if you take more than 600mg/day, moclobemid falls short in nearly every aspect compared to parnate (a "real", non-reversible, non-selective maoi) if you want to treat depression and especially anxiety. I'd go moclobemid first and if you don't find relief, move on to parnate. It does way more than just mao inhibition (upregulation of gaba-b for example), which results in better reduction of symptoms for most people.

[rewired]

300mg / day helped with depressive symptoms and made me quite energetic. On the other hand, anxiety transformed into feeling of being stressed out with qualities like irritability and aggressivity. This eventually outweighed pros and I discontinued it after two months. I din't notice any hair loss or changes to libido. Overall, i think moclobemide is worth trying.