537 replies to this topic

[Nate-2004]

https://www.google.c...followup_to_my/

Another interview with jw fahey
Some interesting points most of you have probably seen it. The miracle tree is easy to grow I'd be interested in myrosinase content.

 

As far as I know this is her only interview with Fahey. This was posted earlier in the thread.

[jjnz]

Really? Would love to know why. I also happen to know that she doesn't grind the seeds either, just eats the sprouts apparently.

https://twitter.com/...399516311556096

Follow the above, apparently a new video coming out on it.
I'm just about to start sprouting, will mix with me and see what happens

[Harkijn]

Perhaps you all, like me, were not aware that maca is a crucifer, too, and contains SFN. If you can find quality maca you'll find it energizing which is caused by many powerful ingredients but also by SFN.

This website provides a good start for reading up about it:

https://thesunlighte...iment.com/maca/

 

It briefly mentions raising SFN by heating the maca. It would be interesting to find out how much SFN Macapowder contains per gram.

[scooterboy]

I discovered that it's really upsetting to the stomach if I eat too many broccoli sprouts. I have been warming them up to 69°C with water and blending them. I'm not sure exactly how much I should be eating her day but a little over a cup of this will really upset my stomach.

 

I no what you mean . I drank my first sprout smoothy today an it made me sick to my stomach for a while . How are you eating them ? After you freeze the sprouts do you thug them before eating  or making a smoothy  ? Do you then refreeze them ?

Edited by scooterboy, 17 March 2017 - 03:10 PM.

[Nate-2004]

 

I discovered that it's really upsetting to the stomach if I eat too many broccoli sprouts. I have been warming them up to 69°C with water and blending them. I'm not sure exactly how much I should be eating her day but a little over a cup of this will really upset my stomach.

 

I no what you mean . I drank my first sprout smoothy today an it made me sick to my stomach for a while . How are you eating them ? After you freeze the sprouts do you thug them before eating  or making a smoothy  ? Do you then refreeze them ?

 

 

I haven't tried freezing them, maybe I should grow a bunch more and do that. Not sure what the technique is if any, I heard it increases SFN content though. I could just grow a ton and store it in the freezer. I seem to end up with more than I can eat in a timely manner.... or rather mix into the smoothies.

[mikela]

 

I discovered that it's really upsetting to the stomach if I eat too many broccoli sprouts. I have been warming them up to 69°C with water and blending them. I'm not sure exactly how much I should be eating her day but a little over a cup of this will really upset my stomach.

 

I no what you mean . I drank my first sprout smoothy today an it made me sick to my stomach for a while . How are you eating them ? After you freeze the sprouts do you thug them before eating  or making a smoothy  ? Do you then refreeze them ?

 

 

I have mine right after a meal without any problems.  However, when I tried it on an empty stomach I also felt sick.

[bosharpe]

 

 

Would rinsing the final sprouts in a weak solution of bleach kill any harmful bacteria without effecting the sprout quality, taste, or nutritional content?

Yikes bleach!

 

There is precedence for using bleach, if done properly, as per one of the Fahey papers, in how they made their Broccoli seed powder: https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC4629881/
 

Broccoli seed powder (BSdP) was made by surface disinfesting seeds of broccoli (Brassica oleracea var. italica) with 25% Clorox bleach, followed by extensive rinsing with distilled water and drying.

 

 

Some informational articles about preparing sprouts: https://beprepared.c...s-for-sprouting

 

http://www.sproutnet...ith-the-Consum 

 

" Even if only a few organisms survive a seed treatment, they can grow to high levels during sprouting and contaminate the entire batch (25). Therefore, disinfection alone can not be relied upon to ensure the safety of sprouts. The best results were obtained with the use of calcium hypochlorite; thus approval was granted for its use at 20, 000 ppm (25).

It has been suggested that the barrier to disinfecting seeds is not in the lethality of the treatment solutions but, the inability of treatments to reach pathogens in the seeds

(5, 27). Microbial cells in seed crevices and between the cotyledons and testa may be protected from exposure to lethal concentrations of sanitizers.

 

Heat Treatment

Application of heat to kill pathogens on alfalfa seeds has been investigated (26) in a study that found treatment at 57 or 60 degrees C for 5 minutes appeared to be effective in killing S stanley without substantially decreasing germinability of seeds. However, heat treatment has limited appeal because there is such a fine threshold at which bacteria can be killed and germination not destroyed (4).

 

Use of Gamma Radiation

Research carried out by the U. S. Department of Agriculture concluded that treating alfalfa seeds and sprouts with a combination of chlorine and irradiation effectively safeguards them against contamination byE coli O157: H7 and Salmonella (29). The report further stated that the doses used to eliminate those organisms did not affect germination of seeds. However, the required irradiation dose is higher than the 1.0 kiloGray dose allowed for fruits and vegetables. Further studies are required to confirm these preliminary reports"

[Harkijn]

This  study does not add anything of practical value to us but it is very motivating:

http://www.medicalne...cles/316448.php

[SearchHorizon]

Bump. Any more feedback on sulforaphane use? 

 

I'd be curious to know whether one has to be in caloric surplus for sulforaphane to be active in one's body (e.g., epicatechin, appears to require the presence of either IGF-1 or insulin for it to be effective with respect to myostatin inhibition).

 

 

[MikeDC]

Bump. Any more feedback on sulforaphane use?

I'd be curious to know whether one has to be in caloric surplus for sulforaphane to be active in one's body (e.g., epicatechin, appears to require the presence of either IGF-1 or insulin for it to be effective with respect to myostatin inhibition).

sulforaphane is a NRF2 inhibitor

[Nate-2004]

 

Bump. Any more feedback on sulforaphane use?

I'd be curious to know whether one has to be in caloric surplus for sulforaphane to be active in one's body (e.g., epicatechin, appears to require the presence of either IGF-1 or insulin for it to be effective with respect to myostatin inhibition).

sulforaphane is a NRF2 inhibitor

 

 

NRF2 activator you mean.

 

I don't know anything about it inhibiting myostatin.

[able]

Just noticed this on the  anti-agingfirewalls  site:

 

 

 

"The Asian vegetable, “pak choi,” reduces colon inflammation and colon cancer even better than broccoli sulforaphanes"

 

 

[Iporuru]

Sulforaphane in prostate cancer prevention

http://www.lifeexten...ampaign=EZXX00E

[jeffrg]

I was looking at Avmacol as mentioned in this thread and see they also have a product Avmacol Immune, which they state "works in combination with Maitake mushroom extract to support your body's natural detoxification process better than sulforaphane alone." "Maitake mushroom extract have been found to provide immune support by promoting neutrophil function and natural killer cell activity."

 

Any thoughts on the addition of Maitake mushroom extract to the Sulforaphane supplement?

 

I take the suggested daily dose of Elysium Basis (NR & Pterostilbene) and have been doing so for over a year now.  I'm concerned of nullifying the effect though based on Turnbuckle's #273 post.

 

 

Edited by jeffrg, 06 April 2017 - 03:20 AM.

[Oakman]

Interesting read on sulforaphane, good summary. Things that caught my eye:

 

1) Brussels sprouts contain X4 the Glucosinolate of Broccoli (not Broccoli Sprouts) per 100 grams i.e., 104 mg vs. 27mg. Because Broccoli sprouts aren't so easy or convenient to come by, Brussels Sprouts may be a better choice than Broccoli.

 

2) Some Sulforaphane dosage recommendations: 

• 7-43mg for 150lb person
• 9-45mg for 200lb person
• 11-57 mg for 250lb person

3) Synergistic effects are observed when sulforaphane is co-administered with curcumin in regard to its anti-inflammatory action.

 

4) When directly consuming cruciferous vegetables, mustard increases the amount of sulforaphane entering the bloodstream by stabilizing the enzyme Myrosinase leading the production of more sulforaphane.

 

(references for the above in the link)

 

 

 

 

[Harkijn]

In the past the bitter taste of Brussels sprouts presented a commercial problem. This has made growers produce less bitter strains , which I think means lower in SFN. So many of the BP commercially available now may be relatively low in SFN.

[Harkijn]

Nothing really new in this video but still good for motivation:

https://nutritionfac..._eid=0e00c8120b

[ambivalent]

Digging around to see if sulforaphane would help with reducing histamine and I stumbled across this recent paper (apologies if posted):

 

Mechanisms for inhibition of colon cancer cells by sulforaphane through epigenetic modulation of microRNA-21 and human telomerase reverse transcriptase (hTERT) down-regulation.

 

(where it quoted sulforaphane to be a powerful HDAC inhibitor, which should inhibit mast-cell release of histamine)

[ambivalent]

Interesting read on sulforaphane, good summary. Things that caught my eye:

 

1) Brussels sprouts contain X4 the Glucosinolate of Broccoli (not Broccoli Sprouts) per 100 grams i.e., 104 mg vs. 27mg. Because Broccoli sprouts aren't so easy or convenient to come by, Brussels Sprouts may be a better choice than Broccoli.

 

2) Some Sulforaphane dosage recommendations: 

• 7-43mg for 150lb person
• 9-45mg for 200lb person
• 11-57 mg for 250lb person

3) Synergistic effects are observed when sulforaphane is co-administered with curcumin in regard to its anti-inflammatory action.

 

4) When directly consuming cruciferous vegetables, mustard increases the amount of sulforaphane entering the bloodstream by stabilizing the enzyme Myrosinase leading the production of more sulforaphane.

 

(references for the above in the link)

 

Incidentally, I take Swanson Sulforaphane 400mcg capsule. Am I making a schoolboy error believing I should be taking at least 20 of these a day to stay within the dosing recommendations above? Also, I'd be interested to know of recommendations of how much complementary iodine supplementation to take for the SFN and when to take it - different times of the day or separate cycling? Thanks in advance.  

Edited by ambivalent, 28 April 2017 - 10:31 PM.

[ambivalent]

I mentioned in the NR personal experience thread that I strongly believe my experience of taking high doses of NR induced raised levels of histamine. As I've linked elsewhere there is some evidence to suggest this could be the case. I'm wondering whether histamine accounts for the alertness and clarity some folks have experienced while taking NR. Have people noticed a reduction in the 'brain gains' while taking NR with SFN?. As a rather loose anecdote, it took a few days for the high doses I was taking of NR to kick in mentally, but I was interestingly, taking high doses of Turmeric and Sulforaphane in the beginning. I dropped those right down after a few days - I can't remember exactly when - but it was early: so I can't marry the sulforaphane doses to the change in clarity and alertness. Unfortunately I can't try this myself just yet, but will do when histamine levels are down and there is no bad reaction to NR, but that may be a while.

Edited by ambivalent, 28 April 2017 - 11:29 PM.

[Oakman]

 

Interesting read on sulforaphane, good summary. Things that caught my eye:

 

1) Brussels sprouts contain X4 the Glucosinolate of Broccoli (not Broccoli Sprouts) per 100 grams i.e., 104 mg vs. 27mg. Because Broccoli sprouts aren't so easy or convenient to come by, Brussels Sprouts may be a better choice than Broccoli.

 

2) Some Sulforaphane dosage recommendations: 

• 7-43mg for 150lb person
• 9-45mg for 200lb person
• 11-57 mg for 250lb person

3) Synergistic effects are observed when sulforaphane is co-administered with curcumin in regard to its anti-inflammatory action.

 

4) When directly consuming cruciferous vegetables, mustard increases the amount of sulforaphane entering the bloodstream by stabilizing the enzyme Myrosinase leading the production of more sulforaphane.

 

(references for the above in the link)

 

Incidentally, I take Swanson Sulforaphane 400mcg capsule. Am I making a schoolboy error believing I should be taking at least 20 of these a day to stay within the dosing recommendations above? Also, I'd be interested to know of recommendations of how much complementary iodine supplementation to take for the SFN and when to take it - different times of the day or separate cycling? Thanks in advance.  

 

 

I would venture that's an open question as to the 'optimal' Sulforaphane dose. The reason I mentioned seeing those dosages was that it was rare to find any recommendation at all. Supplement doses vary widely. There's 400mcg Sulforaphane (Swanson), and 3mg Sulforaphane here for example. Then add whatever % amount of the precursor, Glucosinolate, gets converted to Sulforaphane in the gut. It's pretty fuzzy what is actually produced in total.

 

So to make things simple, I take 2-4 capsules Swansons (.8-1.2mcg) daily, and often Bulk Supplements Broccoli extract powder and Sprout Living "FD Sprout Mix, Broccoli & Kale" (for some myrosinase) on salads or in foods. I eat salads most days. I've also grown to like brussel sprouts too. How much is this all adding up to daily... no idea really. Going forward, as I run out of Swansons, I just got the 3mg Nova Nutrition product and will try some higher dosing with that (of known sulforaphane).

 

As to your point, 20x Swanson's capsule of 400mcg, sure why not... we're all into N=1 experimenting. Let us know what you feel. I let my judgment tempered with what my body feels, be my guide in cases like this, until I know more. Getting to 43-57mgs seems like a whole lot, but maybe not.

 

Can you explain the iodine reference reasoning, not familar with that. However I take 2 drops, twice a week, of J.CROW'S Lugol's Solution 2% Iodine. I typically take everything at lunch away from my 500mg NR taken at 6:30am.

[Nate-2004]

My best guess, since we have no real research indicating a proper dosage, is that less is better than more. It's a plant hormetic compound, too much is definitely a bad thing. 30mg sulforaphane is probably the best max dosage. Not sure how much glucoraphanin is needed to make that, but the BroccoMax supps, if you take 3, you probably get the optimal.

[ambivalent]

I remember reading how cruciferous vegetables can block the uptake of iodine, although this is at extreme levels. But it appears to be other compounds in broccoli which are doing the inhibition.

 

I'm happy to stick with Swanson for a while, but I'd like to know, if its been researched here, the most $ efficient supplement: how does Broccoli max's  30 mg Sulforaphane Glucosinolate stack up once converted against Swanson's 400mcg of sulforaphane.

 

I will ramp up intake over the next few days to see the effect on histamine.

 

Thanks.  

 

 

[Nate-2004]

BroccoMax has myrosinase in it, they claim it converts to ~8mg per capsule.  Also Swanson has a really bad reputation on Labdoor.

[Oakman]

Based on the conversion rate 8mg/30mg, then BroccoMax produces 27% Sulforaphane (although I would think this varies depending on the human gut) ...

 

So Sulforaphane by brand:

 

~$33  BroccoMax gives ~8mg /capsule (gut production from myrosinase) 

~$4.50  Swanson gives ~0.4mg /capsule (standardized) 

~$13  Nova Nutritions gives ~ 3mg + 16mg = 19mg /x2 capsules  (standardized + possible gut production)  

 

So the best combo (and deal) might be 2 caps Nova Nutritions + 1 cap BroccoMax (providing Myrosinase) for a total ~ 19mgs+8mgs = 27mgs sulforaphane  (standardized + possible gut production)  

Edited by Oakman, 29 April 2017 - 02:46 PM.

[beefnewton]

I've had recent trouble getting BroccoMax so just started sprouting my own.  Not sure how much I'm going to have to eat, but it's better than zero.  I also used to take EnduraCell's product, but it's really just too cost prohibitive for me.

[Oakman]

<stub>

Edited by Oakman, 29 April 2017 - 02:47 PM.

[Nate-2004]

BroccoMax has been out of stock for a while but it tends to be the cheapest of the most convenient as I  can just add it to my Amazon Fresh order for groceries occasionally. Also, I don't think the more is better rule works with Sulforaphane or anything hormetic where the benefits come from stress response activated pathways and enzymes. 

 

I plan to just wait till it's back in stock which should be any day now.  I'm in the U.S. and it appears you're in Colorado, but I'm an inner city Philly guy, everything comes by delivery to me. I recommend Amazon Fresh if it's available where you are.

[Nate-2004]

I've had recent trouble getting BroccoMax so just started sprouting my own.  Not sure how much I'm going to have to eat, but it's better than zero.  I also used to take EnduraCell's product, but it's really just too cost prohibitive for me.

 

Should be back in stock soon they say, beginning in May. I tried sprouting my own but I kept failing, it tasted so awful and I wasn't sure if it was just because I hate broccoli to begin with or because it got moldy somehow. I could never keep the environment right with all my attempts. I followed all the videos and instructions I could find on the internet to no avail. I live in the city and I have no sunlit window sil. Maybe if I upgrade my apartment to one with a balcony soon I'll try again. They're supposed to be in the dark for the first couple of days but after that you're supposed to put them in the light. I also think I need a better drainage system.

[tintinet]

http://tim.blog

Dr. Rhonda Patrick rantathon.