848 replies to this topic

[katrina]

Katrina, yes, it has been advised to stop several supplements with anti-inflammatory properties for a few weeks prior to taking FOXO4-dri, but a course of FOXO4-dri can be completed in a matter of days/a week and as far as I understood you can resume taking your supplements thereafter.
It would be great if you'd want to partake in the group buy - and potentially organize it?

Well, I am a bit scared... Afraid to try it tho wanting to. And afraid to organize the group buy. I never participated in a group buy let alone organized one. But 20% difference in cost is huge.

[Moondancer]

Well, I am a bit scared... Afraid to try it tho wanting to. And afraid to organize the group buy. I never participated in a group buy let alone organized one. But 20% difference in cost is huge.

 

 

21% of VAT makes a huge difference indeed, and a group buy in addition will certainly make the FOXO4-dri more affordable compared to buying it individually. 

But of course it is most important to read up and consider potential risks associated with administering a peptide that has not been tested on humans, and decide yourself if this is something you'd want to try.

 

If you do decide you want to partake in the group buy: I for one would be very grateful if you would perhaps be willing to organize the group buy. And if I can somehow be of help per email if you do decide to organize the group buy, I would be happy to do so (if others allow me to). But I can imagine if you would prefer not to organize it.

[katrina]

Moondancer, what are we looking at for 100 mg minus the VAT cost wise? From that good company that the study was from?

[Moondancer]

Moondancer, what are we looking at for 100 mg minus the VAT cost wise? From that good company that the study was from?

 

 

Well Smithx mentioned a price of 11000 euro's (VAT excluded) if we were to order 1 gram of FOXO4-dri (or: 1100 euro's for 100mg). But I believe he received this price quote 1-1,5 years back, so I'm not sure about the current price. And as far as I understood this was for a purity level of >90% - and I'm still not sure if others would find that sufficient, or if everyone would prefer a purity level of >98% which would certainly raise the price.

 

For a comparison: if you were to buy 100mg individually, the price quote without VAT comes down to 3900 euro's (>90% purity level). 

 

Edit: these are all prices from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study.

 

 

Concerning a potential group buy, currently we have:

1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)

2) Beetlejuice 100mg

4) Longevitarian 200mg

5) Smithx (unsure, possibly 100mg)

 

Anyone else interested in participating?

Edited by Moondancer, 17 August 2018 - 11:05 PM.

[Moondancer]

Not sure what's there to "disagree" with, but if the prices I remembered are incorrect, please do correct me. As I would like to know too. 

The quote of 3900 euro for 100mg (VAT excluded), is actually the price quote I received very recently when I contacted the company myself. 

[smithx]

It was 11K euros for 1gm, 18K euros for 2 gm.

 

The purity was specified as "90% to 99%", so no guarantee of greater than 90% but a possibility.

 

 

[Hrub]

Hello all of this blog.

I follow this blog already a long time.

I happened to live 3 miles from the company Pepscan b.v. , here in Lelystad, Netherlands.

Also I am interested to join the group buy.

This problem with 21% VAT: there are several possibilies/difficulties to get that back.

One way would be if the buyer can show a VAT number from another company outside of the Netherlands.

Then Pepscan can skip the VAT on it's invoice.

But then that company might be subject of VAT in it's country.

 

Another way is at the customs if you as private person leave the Netherlands and you show the invoice of Pepscan on your name.

But for other reasons that might be not possible legally for Pepscan.

 

Another way is at the customs and you leave the Netherlands as a person representing a foreign company.

I have no experience, it might not work.

 

 

A complete other problem is , what I understood, that only lab's can order this.

That I do not know how to solve that.

 

Anyhow, If i can be of any help in this, I am available.

 

Herbrand Hofker

 

 

Edited by Hrub, 18 August 2018 - 08:25 AM.

[Moondancer]

For how many mg would you want to participate in the group buy, Hrub?

 

Concerning a potential group buy, currently we have:

1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)

2) Beetlejuice 100mg

4) Longevitarian 200mg

5) Smithx (unsure, possibly 100mg)

6) Hrub

[meatsauce]

Hey everyone I have the Order in finally!

 

I'm sorry this took so damn long I know people were worried.

Edited by meatsauce, 21 August 2018 - 06:45 AM.

[Moondancer]

Hey everyone I have the Order in finally!

 

I'm sorry this took so damn long I know people were worried.

 

 

It's not just that it took long, Ryan. It is that you: refused to tell anyone where you got the "stuff" from.

It is that you on your own decided to buy it from another (whatever) company.

It is that you refused to answer to anyone for months. 

 

So where does "the stuff" come from, and can you perhaps finally send all of us involved in the group buy the quote and bill from the company that you spent our money on?

[OP2040]

Hey everyone I have the Order in finally!

 

I'm sorry this took so damn long I know people were worried.

 

When will you be sending it out?  And as moondancer mentioned, is there any accompanying paperwork that can set our minds at ease?

 

I assume by "have the order in" you mean that it has arrived at your place.

[meatsauce]

Order will be going out tomorrow or Monday. I need to get the shipping cost from most of the people from Australia. I really recommend we do it express which is like 160 I think. I want to make sure everyone is home to receive it and not on vacation.

 

Also there is 200mg available to purchase right now.

[Beetlejuice]

Hi Meatsauce,
I’m in that group buy and have emailed you so we can sort out shipping. Will await your reply
Cheers
Beetlejuice (Australia)

[OP2040]

Briefly because it is off topic:

2. Yes, 100% measurable in pre and post blood tests; EGFR went up and has stayed up; have self ordered blood tests going back years; took D+Q and EGFR went up; it had been trending downwards a little as I am not 19 years old anymore.

 

This is what worries me the most about D+Q or Fox04-dri.  Kidneys are one thing I want to avoid damaging at all costs.  I know there was also some discussion of the idea that there could be a similar effect to tumor lysis  syndrome.  It all makes logical sense because you are flushing out tons of dead cells all at once, and presumably the end products must pass through the kidneys.

 

I'm pretty sure that the mouse studies for either substance(s) either didn't measure kidney function, or kidney function was greatly improved.  However, even if greatly improved, we know how little correlation there is between mouse studies and humans.

 

Does anyone taking FOX04-dri have anything to report with egfr?  Are there any protective measures that can be taken?

[Rocket]

This is what worries me the most about D+Q or Fox04-dri.  Kidneys are one thing I want to avoid damaging at all costs.  I know there was also some discussion of the idea that there could be a similar effect to tumor lysis  syndrome.  It all makes logical sense because you are flushing out tons of dead cells all at once, and presumably the end products must pass through the kidneys.

 

I'm pretty sure that the mouse studies for either substance(s) either didn't measure kidney function, or kidney function was greatly improved.  However, even if greatly improved, we know how little correlation there is between mouse studies and humans.

 

Does anyone taking FOX04-dri have anything to report with egfr?  Are there any protective measures that can be taken?

 

EGFR going up is a VERY good thing! With advancing age, EGFR goes down... Kidney function drops with age which causes EGFR to drop. EGFR going up means the kidney's are rejuvenating. I think you misunderstand the importance of EGFR going up.

Edited by Rocket, 23 August 2018 - 01:38 PM.

[OP2040]

EGFR going up is a VERY good thing! With advancing age, EGFR goes down... Kidney function drops with age which causes EGFR to drop. EGFR going up means the kidney's are rejuvenating. I think you misunderstand the importance of EGFR going up.

 

Ahh yes, thanks!  What an elementary mistake.  I was confusing it with the other tests for BUN, for example.  So in this particular case all good.  It is still a concern for me just based on the logic of a lot of waste material all at once.  But this clarification allays my fears somewhat.

[poonja]

Meatsauce owes me both foxo one other product (forget right no).  I have written off the money sadly as he has not responded to my latest inquiry.  Sad.

[Moondancer]

Order will be going out tomorrow or Monday. I need to get the shipping cost from most of the people from Australia. I really recommend we do it express which is like 160 I think. I want to make sure everyone is home to receive it and not on vacation.

 

Also there is 200mg available to purchase right now.

 

 

You want people to send you MORE money after what happened? I would suggest you carry the shipping costs for now until the Australian members receive their product, and that you present all of us with the bill you received of the company you spent our money on.

Somehow I have the idea that it may be less problematic for you to get back the shipping costs in hindsight from those Australian members after they received their product, than for them to try to get a hold on you and get back their money the moment you disappear again with now another $160 in your pocket.

[TaiChiKid]

I would agree with Moondancer.  Although I received my first order of FOXO4.DR1, I have not received any of the Epitalon group buy, nor does meatsuace (Ryan) respond to any emails from me.

[Advocatus Diaboli]

TaiChiKid, are you saying that your order was confirmed to be FOXO4 DRI as determined from lab analysis of a sample from your personal shipment? Or is it the case that you received "something" which was characterized by meatsauce as being FOXO4 DRI?

[TaiChiKid]

I received glass 10mg bottles with the Genscript logo silkscreened on, and metal clamp down lids.  The Genscript lot number was silkscreened on the bottle, along with the starting peptide sequence and the mW.  Both DD and I reported our results:  DD reported rather subjective results, I showed a great and apparently persistent drop in both systolic and diastolic pressure of 15mmHg each, as well as my TSH reverting to what it was two decades ago.  If you want to test, I still have 0.05mL? mixed in PBS...

Edited by TaiChiKid, 24 August 2018 - 11:39 PM.

[katrina]

Is it too late? Seems like it... Oh well... Guess I can do my own group buy without the vat from that good company. No hurry.... If interested folks guide me, I will get the US price... How do I assure I don't get ripped off? Shipping from US to UK seems like it would be a real hasstle.

Edited by katrina, 25 August 2018 - 12:08 AM.

[Moondancer]

Is it too late? Seems like it... Oh well... Guess I can do my own group buy without the vat from that good company. No hurry.... If interested folks guide me, I will get the US price... How do I assure I don't get ripped off? Shipping from US to UK seems like it would be a real hasstle.

 

 

Katrina, as I wrote in my anwer to your message: the group buy of those members that want to buy FOXO4-dri from the company that produced it for De Keizer's study has not yet taken place.

In the two group buys MeatSauce arranged, he placed an order with two different companies. Personally I'd prefer if we could move forward with the group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study too - I'd certainly want to participate in it, as frankly I am unsure at this point what MeatSauce bought, from what company etc. 

 

That was why I asked you if you would want to partake in this third group buy from the company that made the peptide for De Keizer et al., and how many mg you'd want to order.

I'd prefer not to wait too long anymore before we'd place an order - not sure what the opinion is of the other members. So I hope we will have enough members willing to participate so that we can place an order for 1 gram of FOXO4-dri soon (in order to get a 'decent' price).

[Longevitarian]

Katrina, mondacer and others thinking about group buy from the

De Keiser FOXO4-DRI supply company:

 

I am in for 200mg ....So count me in for participation in the group

buy....

[OP2040]

I'm sure there will be another group buy once the storm has settled on previous transactions. 

 

However, this one we should probably take our time and do everything exactly right.  As I stated before, I don't think meatsauce necessarily had any bad intent here.  In fact, it makes sense that the first person to jump in and go on something like this would be a risk-taker type.  Great for getting things moving, maybe not so great for reliability.

 

For the next buy, we should establish some ground rules, starting with:

1.  We want to know exactly where product is being purchased, and if at all possible pay for it directly to the company itself, or in a way there is no risk of losing money.

2.  Certs, docs, pics, whatever trust building needs to be done to ensure we are getting a quality product that is what it is supposed to be.

 

Sounds simple, but not so simple when you are dealing with a bunch of strangers on the internet.  And also, not simple because whoever does organize these things takes on a lot of extra work and risk themselves.

[TaiChiKid]

I recall someone mentioning PPal, but I believe they frown on people using their service for certain types of transactions such as this likely due to liability issues.  Ohe of the previous organizers mentioned that he got banned for just that reason.  Bank transfers are an alternative if there are only a few participants. 

[mikey]

Katrina, as I wrote in my anwer to your message: the group buy of those members that want to buy FOXO4-dri from the company that produced it for De Keizer's study has not yet taken place.

In the two group buys MeatSauce arranged, he placed an order with two different companies. Personally I'd prefer if we could move forward with the group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study too - I'd certainly want to participate in it, as frankly I am unsure at this point what MeatSauce bought, from what company etc. 

 

That was why I asked you if you would want to partake in this third group buy from the company that made the peptide for De Keizer et al., and how many mg you'd want to order.

I'd prefer not to wait too long anymore before we'd place an order - not sure what the opinion is of the other members. So I hope we will have enough members willing to participate so that we can place an order for 1 gram of FOXO4-dri soon (in order to get a 'decent' price).

I would buy whatever dose will reduce hypertension.

 

Count me in to buy from the company that manufactured for De Keizer's study.

[Moondancer]

I would buy whatever dose will reduce hypertension.

 

Count me in to buy from the company that manufactured for De Keizer's study.

 

Great! No guarantee concerning the hypertension of course ;-). However, most members seem to be using 3x 30mg, and order 100mg. This based on the amounts used in the mice in the following study, as far as I'm aware: "Targeted Apoptosis of Senescent Cells Restores Tissue Homeostasis in Response to Chemotoxicity and Aging" (The mice received IV-injections every other day on day 1,3 and 5 of 5mg/kg).

 

I'm suprised too not more persons are interested in this group buy. Imho it is one of the more fascinating/promosing compounds out there. 

 

So concerning a potential group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, currently we have:

1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)

2) Beetlejuice 100mg

4) Longevitarian 200mg

5) Smithx (unsure, possibly 100mg)

6) Hrub

7) Mikey (100mg?)

 

So potentially in total we would want to order around 800mg now it seems. I assume we would need at least 1gram to get a 'decent' price. Any other members interested in joining this group buy? 

Mikey, would you potentially be interested in organising the group buy? (You have a longer trackrecord - I don't. Plus I'm located in Europe and would have to pay an extra 21% VAT for the FOXO4-dri).

 

Hrub, I sent you a message too: how many mg would you want to order?

Beetlejuice, you mentioned partaking in MeatSauce's second group buy. If MeatSauce will after all ensure you will get the compound he ordered for the second group buy, do you still want to join our group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, or not? Please let us know

Edited by Moondancer, 26 August 2018 - 05:04 AM.

[Moondancer]

I recall someone mentioning PPal, but I believe they frown on people using their service for certain types of transactions such as this likely due to liability issues.  Ohe of the previous organizers mentioned that he got banned for just that reason.  Bank transfers are an alternative if there are only a few participants. 

 

 

Good advice, thanks TCK. I suggested Paypal since I thought that way perhaps we would have some kind of 'buyer's protection' for two months after making the payment. (I suggested that because of the mess that MeatSauce's group buy became). However I did not realize this, thanks: this could be an issue indeed. I thought that if you would not state anything in the payment details, it was not likely to cause any problems - but perhaps I'm wrong.

 

I guess the issue with bank transfers may be again, that in case someone runs off with your payment, there in't that much you can do - besides starting a lawsuit, which is an option, but also a hassle.

[Beetlejuice]

Great! No guarantee concerning the hypertension of course ;-). However, most members seem to be using 3x 30mg, and order 100mg. This based on the amounts used in the mice in the following study, as far as I'm aware: "Targeted Apoptosis of Senescent Cells Restores Tissue Homeostasis in Response to Chemotoxicity and Aging" (The mice received IV-injections every other day on day 1,3 and 5 of 5mg/kg).

I'm suprised too not more persons are interested in this group buy. Imho it is one of the more fascinating/promosing compounds out there.

So concerning a potential group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, currently we have:
1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)
2) Beetlejuice 100mg
4) Longevitarian 200mg
5) Smithx (unsure, possibly 100mg)
6) Hrub
7) Mikey (100mg?)

So potentially in total we would want to order around 800mg now it seems. I assume we would need at least 1gram to get a 'decent' price. Any other members interested in joining this group buy?
Mikey, would you potentially be interested in organising the group buy? (You have a longer trackrecord - I don't. Plus I'm located in Europe and would have to pay an extra 21% VAT for the FOXO4-dri).

Hrub, I sent you a message too: how many mg would you want to order?
Beetlejuice, you mentioned partaking in MeatSauce's second group buy. If MeatSauce will after all ensure you will get the compound he ordered for the second group buy, do you still want to join our group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, or not? Please let us know

Great! No guarantee concerning the hypertension of course ;-). However, most members seem to be using 3x 30mg, and order 100mg. This based on the amounts used in the mice in the following study, as far as I'm aware: "Targeted Apoptosis of Senescent Cells Restores Tissue Homeostasis in Response to Chemotoxicity and Aging" (The mice received IV-injections every other day on day 1,3 and 5 of 5mg/kg).

I'm suprised too not more persons are interested in this group buy. Imho it is one of the more fascinating/promosing compounds out there.

So concerning a potential group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, currently we have:
1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)
2) Beetlejuice 100mg
4) Longevitarian 200mg
5) Smithx (unsure, possibly 100mg)
6) Hrub
7) Mikey (100mg?)

So potentially in total we would want to order around 800mg now it seems. I assume we would need at least 1gram to get a 'decent' price. Any other members interested in joining this group buy?
Mikey, would you potentially be interested in organising the group buy? (You have a longer trackrecord - I don't. Plus I'm located in Europe and would have to pay an extra 21% VAT for the FOXO4-dri).

Hrub, I sent you a message too: how many mg would you want to order?
Beetlejuice, you mentioned partaking in MeatSauce's second group buy. If MeatSauce will after all ensure you will get the compound he ordered for the second group buy, do you still want to join our group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, or not? Please let us know

Great! No guarantee concerning the hypertension of course ;-). However, most members seem to be using 3x 30mg, and order 100mg. This based on the amounts used in the mice in the following study, as far as I'm aware: "Targeted Apoptosis of Senescent Cells Restores Tissue Homeostasis in Response to Chemotoxicity and Aging" (The mice received IV-injections every other day on day 1,3 and 5 of 5mg/kg).

I'm suprised too not more persons are interested in this group buy. Imho it is one of the more fascinating/promosing compounds out there.

So concerning a potential group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, currently we have:
1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)
2) Beetlejuice 100mg
4) Longevitarian 200mg
5) Smithx (unsure, possibly 100mg)
6) Hrub
7) Mikey (100mg?)

So potentially in total we would want to order around 800mg now it seems. I assume we would need at least 1gram to get a 'decent' price. Any other members interested in joining this group buy?
Mikey, would you potentially be interested in organising the group buy? (You have a longer trackrecord - I don't. Plus I'm located in Europe and would have to pay an extra 21% VAT for the FOXO4-dri).

Hrub, I sent you a message too: how many mg would you want to order?
Beetlejuice, you mentioned partaking in MeatSauce's second group buy. If MeatSauce will after all ensure you will get the compound he ordered for the second group buy, do you still want to join our group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, or not? Please let us know

Great! No guarantee concerning the hypertension of course ;-). However, most members seem to be using 3x 30mg, and order 100mg. This based on the amounts used in the mice in the following study, as far as I'm aware: "Targeted Apoptosis of Senescent Cells Restores Tissue Homeostasis in Response to Chemotoxicity and Aging" (The mice received IV-injections every other day on day 1,3 and 5 of 5mg/kg).

I'm suprised too not more persons are interested in this group buy. Imho it is one of the more fascinating/promosing compounds out there.

So concerning a potential group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, currently we have:
1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)
2) Beetlejuice 100mg
4) Longevitarian 200mg
5) Smithx (unsure, possibly 100mg)
6) Hrub
7) Mikey (100mg?)

So potentially in total we would want to order around 800mg now it seems. I assume we would need at least 1gram to get a 'decent' price. Any other members interested in joining this group buy?
Mikey, would you potentially be interested in organising the group buy? (You have a longer trackrecord - I don't. Plus I'm located in Europe and would have to pay an extra 21% VAT for the FOXO4-dri).

Hrub, I sent you a message too: how many mg would you want to order?
Beetlejuice, you mentioned partaking in MeatSauce's second group buy. If MeatSauce will after all ensure you will get the compound he ordered for the second group buy, do you still want to join our group buy from the company that manufactured FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study, or not? Please let us know