848 replies to this topic

[mikey]

 

Guys we have reached 800-900mg for this group buy currently from the manufacturer for De Keizer's study.

 

Currently the members partaking in it are:

1) BeetleJuice 100mg

2) GregV - 100mg

3) Mikey - 100mg

4) Moondancer - 100 or 200mg, depending on price

5) anonymous member - 300mg  

6) Hrub - 100mg

 

• Longevitarian, you mentioned you wanted to order 200mg a week back or so, but have not responded anymore thereafter. I have sent you a PM, could you please let me know if you'd still want to partake. If I don't get a response in a few days I will assume you don't want to partake and remove you from the list.
• Benko, please send me a response to the PM I sent you if you still want to partake.
• Smithx would you still want to partake?

If I have forgotten about anyone, please let me know. 

 

BeetleJuice, Gregv, I know you sent me a PM already. However, I'm sorry to ask, but could you plesae send me an additional PM with the format of the 7 questions I used (as posted in this thread at this page). That would make it a bit easier for me to process all information. Thanks!

 

Concerning the group buy coordinator: do all members agree letting Mikey coordinate the group buy? If so, please all confirm. Because I want the group buy coordinator to be chosen with unanimity. To avoid that if something goes wrong I can be blamed since members will say they have never been able to choose who would coordinate the group buy.

My personal preference is letting Mikey arrange the group buy. But I'd want all members participating to state who they want to coordinate the group buy too. You can post that here or send me a PM. 

 

Anyone else interested in getting this senolytic agent FOXO4-dri from the company that manufactured it for De Keizer's study? (To be administered at your own risk).

Please let me know, and if so, send me a PM. Thanks!

 

 

While I will require (0.5%) as a handling and ordering fee, I going to have a legal liability waiver drawn up that protects the main buyer and the buyers, which will also require the buyer to perform transparently. I will share the legal waiver free for anyone doing a Group Buy and use it as a template where blanks for the material and the person buying and the end buyer can be plugged in.  This will be a contribution that I will donate for the common good. Group buys should have a template for a legal waiver. I intend to have one written up, for all of our protections. So, the commission that I receive for the group buy will help to pay my an attorney to write it up correctly. 

[Moondancer]

While I will require (0.5%) as a handling and ordering fee, I going to have a legal liability waiver drawn up that protects the main buyer and the buyers, which will also require the buyer to perform transparently. I will share the legal waiver free for anyone doing a Group Buy and use it as a template where blanks for the material and the person buying and the end buyer can be plugged in.  This will be a contribution that I will donate for the common good. Group buys should have a template for a legal waiver. I intend to have one written up, for all of our protections. So, the commission that I receive for the group buy will help to pay my an attorney to write it up correctly. 

 

I expressed per PM, but I have my doubts about spending thousands of dollars on a legal liability waiver - or rather: attorney fees. I understand the issue of liability, but: there have been hundreds of group buys over the years, have there ever been liability issues for the group coordinator in the existence of Longecity with these group buys? I'd gladly sign some kind of draft to waive anyone from any responsibility about the use of this the peptide, but can we not come up with some kind of draft ourselves? 

This to me seems over the top when I suggested to arrange for a group buy from the manufacturer that produced the peptide for De Keizer's study. But I hope others chime in too. 

On another note: the peptide will be shipped worlwide, will this "waiver" that you intent to have your attorney draw, be drawn in accordance with US regulations? 

 

With regard to the handling and ordering fee: 0,5% = 0,005 x the total price of the order. Is that what you meant to state, or did you in fact mean 5%? I'm confused. 

[meatsauce]

I can ask the company I already have a relationship for a quote in the US. They are a top notch company.

[mikey]

Since Group Buys are a tradition here at LongeCity, it would make sense for a general waiver to be drafted which would cover them, if it's possible to do so.

 

Such a waiver would contain very detailed disclosures of risks and state that each participant is assuming the risk with knowledge that using any such substances could be harmful or fatal, etc.

 

Any mods here? It would be a good thing to consider getting on the agenda.
 

LongeCity (Imminst) has a policy of not being involved in group buys.

I am going to have an attorney draft a waiver with fill-in-the-blanks for the material sourced and the persons (buyer and recipient) involved and donate it for common use. This is best for me legally and something that will provide ongoing value for others for group buys, in general. 

[Moondancer]

Evening,

 

A few of the members that want to participate in this group buy of FOXO4-dri from the manufacturer for De Keizer's study, prefer to get it moving as fast as possible. I definitely agree with that. But as I said in PM too: it is difficult to get a hold on some members that expressed interest. I hope we can all quickly respond, make our payment to Mikey, so that we can place an order soon and get things rolling fast - but not before we all agree on all aspects of this group buy of course. 

 

Longevitarian, you mentioned you wanted to order 200mg a week ago. Do you still want to join the group buy? I sent you a PM a few days back too. If I dont hear from you within a few days, I will assume you don't want to join the group buy and remove you from the list for now.

Benko, you showed interest. Do you still want to join? Without response to my PM I will assume you don't want to join.

Smithx, do you still want to participate?

 

Gregv, BeetleJuice,  Hrub, can you please still let me know which member you would prefer coordinates the group buy, and if you agree with letting Mikey coordinate the group buy? As said, I'd want to explicitly know, so that everyone agrees who will run the group buy. To avoid any potential issues in the future. Thanks!

[mikey]

I expressed per PM, but I have my doubts about spending thousands of dollars on a legal liability waiver - or rather: attorney fees. I understand the issue of liability, but: there have been hundreds of group buys over the years, have there ever been liability issues for the group coordinator in the existence of Longecity with these group buys? I'd gladly sign some kind of draft to waive anyone from any responsibility about the use of this the peptide, but can we not come up with some kind of draft ourselves? 

This to me seems over the top when I suggested to arrange for a group buy from the manufacturer that produced the peptide for De Keizer's study. But I hope others chime in too. 

On another note: the peptide will be shipped worlwide, will this "waiver" that you intent to have your attorney draw, be drawn in accordance with US regulations? 

 

With regard to the handling and ordering fee: 0,5% = 0,005 x the total price of the order. Is that what you meant to state, or did you in fact mean 5%? I'm confused. 

I already have the basics of a waiver started. I will bear the cost of it. No one else needs to. It will be universally acceptable world-wide or it has no value.

 

As to percent, to be clear I will pay anyone 5% if they do a group buy and I benefit.

If 100 mg costs $1500, then 10 people generate $15,000. 5% is $750 or $75 per order. In any order, even for a low-cost item, I would give whoever ran the group buy at least $40 for their trouble. I think that 5%, or a $40 minimum for lower costing buys, provides an incentive for a person to do the work involved AND for us to expect that they will be diligent and transparent. My opinion. I welcome others to express their opinion.
 

[Moondancer]

Ah okay, you said 0.5% in your post, which I assumed would be incorrect.

 

Albeit I certainly feel a compensation is fair: I saw that compensation also a bit as a courtesy of the members participating in the group buy frankly, and did not realize it would become such a main topic in this group buy.

I would gladly run this group buy for free - as I've done the past weeks investing quite a bit of my time in it too and gathering members to participate. But unfortunately if I were to buy the peptide for the group buy the price would increase with 21% VAT since I live in Europe, so someone living overseas has to pay the peptide. I would have gladly run it for free, since I realize I too benefit from such a group buy - after all we can all get the product with a roughly 200% discount. And I saw this forum a bit as a bunch of people sharing enthusiasm about the same topic and interested in potentially improving their health enabled by the information shared here by different members. Let us be fair: most of us would not even have bought this peptide if we wouldn't have read the information others posted here too.

 

Either way, there are more important hurdles to overcome and discussions to sort out, that several members have expressed concern about over here and in PM, and as I tried to bring up the past week. Perhaps you'd want to start thinking those hurdles over too Mikey: 

1) The Australian members are concerned about shipping (temperatures), and how it will influence the quality of the peptide. The peptide after all will be flying from The Netherlands to The US and from the US to Australia. Some members are concerned up to the extent that they are unsure if they want to partake in the group buy if there is not more clarity about this.

2) The Dutch members don't want the peptide to be flown from The Netherlands to the US and back to The Netherlands again - it seems absurd, and unnecessary. Some members may also not want to partake if this hurdle is not overcome.

 

 

 

Edited by Moondancer, 02 September 2018 - 08:00 AM.

[mikey]

Ah okay, you said 0.5% in your post, which I assumed would be incorrect.

 

Albeit I certainly feel a compensation is fair: I saw that compensation also a bit as a courtesy of the members participating in the group buy frankly, and did not realize it would become such a main topic in this group buy.

I would gladly run this group buy for free - as I've done the past weeks investing quite a bit of my time in it too and gathering members to participate. But unfortunately if I were to buy the peptide for the group buy the price would increase with 21% VAT since I live in Europe, so someone living overseas has to pay the peptide. I would have gladly run it for free, since I realize I too benefit from such a group buy - after all we can all get the product with a roughly 200% discount. And I saw this forum a bit as a bunch of people sharing enthusiasm about the same topic and interested in potentially improving their health enabled by the information shared here by different members. Let us be fair: most of us would not even have bought this peptide if we wouldn't have read the information others posted here too.

 

Either way, there are more important hurdles to overcome and discussions to sort out, that several members have expressed concern about over here and in PM, and as I tried to bring up the past week. Perhaps you'd want to start thinking those hurdles over too Mikey: 

1) The Australian members are concerned about shipping (temperatures), and how it will influence the quality of the peptide. The peptide after all will be flying from The Netherlands to The US and from the US to Australia. Some members are concerned up to the extent that they are unsure if they want to partake in the group buy if there is not more clarity about this.

2) The Dutch members don't want the peptide to be flown from The Netherlands to the US and back to The Netherlands again - it seems absurd, and unnecessary. Some members may also not want to partake if this hurdle is not overcome.

 

Perhaps a chemist can answer the question of transport during hot weather. How heat-stable is FOXO4-DRI?

I, too, am concerned about transport, such as buying the material from the Netherlands and shipping it here without refrigeration or some appropriate way to keep it cool.

This, much less being responsible for shipping it out to a number of people, especially if it means buying cold packs and then shipping packages overnight, even within the US. Anyone that is handling this should be quite clear about what is ideal. Shipping overnight to other countries is likely not possible, because of potential delays with customs. (Perhaps DHL ships overnight internationally.)

Nutricology will only ship their heat sensitive ingredients overnight with a cold pack. They told me that this is true for their Micro-Liposomal Vitamin C.

They further answered my question about buying it on Amazon, as something that they would not do during hot weather. It will likely be exposed to extreme heat between them shipping it to Amazon and it being stored at Amazon and then shipped via UPS or via a commercial delivery service. 

This is an important consideration for an expensive material such as FOXO4-DRI.

A UPS driver confirmed for a friend that his truck could register as high as 160% F in the back during this hot weather.

 

Remembering that FOXO costed something like $10,000 a day a year or so ago, I decided to wait until the price came down and it was more accessible.

Trodusquemine apparently is less expensive and has human safety data, as it is being used in a human breast cancer study. So, I am looking at Trodusquemine also as I want to improve various health conditions ASAP. Whichever material is more accessible most quickly is what I seek.

Have you looked at Trodusquemine, Moondancer?


 

[katrina]

Please cite statutes that invalidate correctly written legal waivers.

One state down... You can do the rest if you like. But in general, illegal acts can't have liabilities signed away. This is pretty much common sense, and you shouldn't need a reference.

Example, it is illegal to shoot a person. So, you wanna do a jackass video and have someone shoot you in the foot for fun. A liability waiver is signed... Whoops bullet lands in the chest, is the shooter libel? Yes. Why? Because they shouldn't have been shooting you in the first place.

“The general rule in Washington is that a liability waiver is enforceable unless: 1) it violates public policy; 2) the negligent act falls greatly below the standard for protection of others; or 3) the waiver is inconspicuous. Johnson vs. Ubar LLC., 150 Wn. App. 533, 537-538 (2009). Of course, these exceptions must be viewed through the individual facts of each case. There is extensive, well-developed case law which sets forth factors to be considered when making arguments to exclude a liability waiver.”

https://www.avvo.com...ashington-state

[meatsauce]

To Whom It May Concern, 

 

This is a friend of 'MeatSauce'. I am reaching out on his behalf as an emergency has happened. He will be back in a couple of weeks. 

 

Thank you. 

[Moondancer]

Thanks Mikey, Trodusquemine looks interesting, but I haven't read up on it sufficiently. Given my health concerns I really wanted to order FOXO4-dri for a start.

 

We have reached 900mg with this FOXO4-dri group buy. However: one Australian group member that also partakes in the group buy MeatSauce arranged has some hesitations - she would like to know if the FOXO4-dri can be stored.

• Can the unreconstituted peptide be frozen at -20C without affecting the quality of the peptide, and for how long? Does anyone know?
•  I'd love to see more input from persons with more insight in this than I have how shipping temperatures may influence the quality of the peptide.

I have not received any PM back from Longevitarian and Smith after they showed interest in the group buy, so I assume they are not interested after all, and I have removed them from the group buy list.

 

If the total price is reasonable I'm willing to order 200mg so that we reach the 1 gram mark and can place our order. 

However since one Australian member still has some hesitations and is not sure whether she wants to partake, we may be better off waiting until we have an additional member for this group buy.

 

Anyone else still interested in joining this group buy of FOXO4-dri from the manufacturer for De Keizer's study?

 

[Moondancer]

Currently we have:

1. BeetleJuice - 100mg UNSURE
2. Gregv - 100mg
3. Mikey - 100mg
4. Moondancer - 100mg (potentially 200mg if price is reasonable, and if we can't reach 1gr)
5. Anonymous member - 300mg
6. Hrub - 100mg
7. Benko - 100mg

 

[Beetlejuice]

To Whom It May Concern,

This is a friend of 'MeatSauce'. I am reaching out on his behalf as an emergency has happened. He will be back in a couple of weeks.

Thank you.

Hi. I am arranging transport of an order with Meatsauce and have just replied to an email from him regarding this. Hoping my peptide order is ok to wait a few weeks. Crossing fingers. Hope he is ok

[Beetlejuice]

Thanks Mikey, Trodusquemine looks interesting, but I haven't read up on it sufficiently. Given my health concerns I really wanted to order FOXO4-dri for a start.

We have reached 900mg with this FOXO4-dri group buy. However: one Australian group member that also partakes in the group buy MeatSauce arranged has some hesitations - she would like to know if the FOXO4-dri can be stored.

• Can the unreconstituted peptide be frozen at -20C without affecting the quality of the peptide, and for how long? Does anyone know?
• I'd love to see more input from persons with more insight in this than I have how shipping temperatures may influence the quality of the peptide.

I have not received any PM back from Longevitarian and Smith after they showed interest in the group buy, so I assume they are not interested after all, and I have removed them from the group buy list.

If the total price is reasonable I'm willing to order 200mg so that we reach the 1 gram mark and can place our order.
However since one Australian member still has some hesitations and is not sure whether she wants to partake, we may be better off waiting until we have an additional member for this group buy.

Anyone else still interested in joining this group buy of FOXO4-dri from the manufacturer for De Keizer's study?

Thanks Moondancer,
Yes I am hesitant because I am in process of hopefully getting my order from Meatsauce. I am of the mind to take baby steps with this stuff - Eg small doses as I have this vision of seeing myself disintegrate before my eyes, lol, like the melting man (woman). Clearly fearful I will find I am 100% senescent cells! So I am thinking I am likely to want to store this 2nd lot for quite a while so as to spread out batches. I am interested in having more on hand though, and also this supplier. Anyone who can shed some light on whether this can be stored in, for example, a freezer? And for how long? Would be much appreciated.
Thanks

Edited by Beetlejuice, 03 September 2018 - 03:41 PM.

[mikey]

One state down... You can do the rest if you like. But in general, illegal acts can't have liabilities signed away. This is pretty much common sense, and you shouldn't need a reference.

Example, it is illegal to shoot a person. So, you wanna do a jackass video and have someone shoot you in the foot for fun. A liability waiver is signed... Whoops bullet lands in the chest, is the shooter libel? Yes. Why? Because they shouldn't have been shooting you in the first place.

“The general rule in Washington is that a liability waiver is enforceable unless: 1) it violates public policy; 2) the negligent act falls greatly below the standard for protection of others; or 3) the waiver is inconspicuous. Johnson vs. Ubar LLC., 150 Wn. App. 533, 537-538 (2009). Of course, these exceptions must be viewed through the individual facts of each case. There is extensive, well-developed case law which sets forth factors to be considered when making arguments to exclude a liability waiver.”

https://www.avvo.com...ashington-state

This is an interesting job of citing a statute, Katrina. However, a question is how much does it apply to this situation?

 

We are not dealing in dangerous items - or bullets and guns - that fall "below the standard of protection for others" or I (and hopefully all of us) would not do the group buy or participate in it.

 

It would be contrary to my historically fundamental well-documented long-term ethics.

A consideration voiced to me by an FDA official some years back. "FDA doesn't enforce against anything "unless there are bodies in the street."

If a substance appears to have a potential to cause harm, any of us should be avoiding it if we want to extend lifespan.

 

A comprehensive contractual liability waiver and description of the responsibilities of a buyer of a substance that appears to be benign is one layer of protection against obvious malicious intent from a recipient or a buyer or the non-performance of a trusted buyer.

 

Certainly, if the substance has obvious potential to cause harm, a liability waiver would carry no weight. But we are not talking about buying cocaine or strychnine.

 

Again, you seem to just like being busy rather than contributing worthwhile content. I quit viewing your forum because it was lots of busy work on superficial aspects of facial aging, in the extreme, rather than addressing the cause(s) of skin wrinkling.

 

Other less busy options, such as long-term use of C60oo, have almost entirely erased my age-related wrinkles.

With luck, FOXO4-DRI and perhaps Trodusquemine have age-reversal properties that are global and age-related issues, such as facial wrinkling, are reversed, as well as the reversal of cardiovascular damage and others.

A recent study associated facial forehead wrinkles with cardiovascular disease. 

Just think, a broad age-reversal brush with the right molecule(s) and multiple aspects of aging are reversed without a lot of busy work, especially superficial work that does not address the internal metabolic causes of aging, as you do in your forum.

THAT is the goal.
 

[Moondancer]

Actually Katrina may have a valid point that may hold up in the court of law. 

 

So what about if all of the group members were to sign a waiver that we buy this peptide for RESEARCH PURPOSES only, and we hand over this waiver to the group coordinator (aka Mikey). He can't help what we personally decide to do with the peptide if we agree to buy it from him for research purposes only. Just like the manufacturer sells the peptide only for research purposes, in fact, and is not liable the moment anyone decides to use it with a different purpose.

[Moondancer]

I hope MeatSauce is okay too, and I wish him the best, on another note.

I can't help though that after 8 months since I made my payment and a lot of silence, logically I'm more concerned than I would like to be.

[mikey]

Actually Katrina may have a valid point that may hold up in the court of law. 

 

So what about if all of the group members were to sign a waiver that we buy this peptide for RESEARCH PURPOSES only, and we hand over this waiver to the group coordinator (aka Mikey). He can't help what we personally decide to do with the peptide if we agree to buy it from him for research purposes only. Just like the manufacturer sells the peptide only for research purposes, in fact, and is not liable the moment anyone decides to use it with a different purpose.

 

As I indicated what Katria brought up has little to do with a benign or beneficial molecule.

 

As you said, a contract/waiver should be "FOR RESEARCH PURPOSES ONLY," while I say that it should also hold the buyer to being transparent, accountable and certain to deliver.

 

I note that C60oo, which is not FDA approved or on the GRAS (generally recognized as safe) list, was previously sold with strict statements about it being for "RESEARCH PURPOSES ONLY" and "NOT FOR HUMAN OR ANIMAL CONSUMPTION."

 

https://carbon60oliveoil.com/shop/, probably the most successful, grounded, tested vendor of C60oo, is now providing dosing details for humans. This is quite a jump from their previously protective stance of not acknowledging even knowing that humans were consuming this product. Quite a surprise for me to see this recently.

 

It seems that since no one has suffered significant ill consequences from using C60oo and numerous other vendors are providing details about human use for their products that FDA is not paying attention to C60oo or its vendors.

 

It seems that our group buy of what appears to be an innocuous beneficial molecule might also not receive legal scrutiny.

 

A contract/waiver is just a prudent consideration.

 

I am sure that my attorney, who is THE authority on FDA and dietary supplements, would tell me that this is not prudent. I listen to him and take what he says into consideration, but realize that his perspective is EXTREMELY conservative and protective and must be for him to practice law.

 

He will not draw up a contract/waiver for me on this issue. I will use other counsel.

 

As I said, FDA told me some years ago that they did not enforce unless there are "bodies in the street."

 

Edited by mikey, 03 September 2018 - 06:23 PM.

[katrina]

Do as you wish folks, I ain't trying to sidetrack anything here. But I just had a cautionary thought pop into my head and shared it for your benefit. If you wish to learn more about legaities you may do so yourself. But I caution you, the more you know, the scarier things get. Maybe just throw a blindfold on and jump feet first like the original plan. LOL... And I aint being sarcastic, life is about taking chances.

You all take care and I will sit back and watch in excitment!

[Michael]

I humbly suggest that all of you shroud take a step back and ask yourselves whether this agent is really the best candidate for self-experimentation (putting aside the question of whether to self-experiment at all at this time). To date, we have exactly one scientific report on the effects of FOXO4-DRI in vivo, vs. dozens on D+Q, Navitoclax, et al; that paper contains only a very limited amount of information on short-term outcomes in otherwise-healthy aging mice, with most of the data being instead on a severely genetically damaged putatively "progeric" animal model — whereas for D+Q, Navitoclax, et al, we have multiple reports from many different labs of actual health and functional improvements in long-term studies in both otherwise-healthy, normal aging mice, and also in well-established mouse models of age-related disease. We also have zero human data on FOXO4-DRI, vs. a number of clinical trials on the small-molecule senolytics from their original indications — and there is the residual uncertainty of what one is actually getting when one orders the peptide.

[mikey]

Good point, Michael. This is part of why I prefer a group buy for Trodusquemine. It has passed safety tests and is being used in a human breast cancer study. It shows promise for regeneration of cardiovascular tissues. It is key to regeneration of limbs for salamanders, and other such animals. Trodusquemine seems like a “best” candidate for systemic regeneration. Please chime in, people.

Edited by mikey, 04 September 2018 - 01:12 AM.

[Beetlejuice]

Good point, Michael. This is part of why I prefer a group buy for Trodusquemine. It has passed safety tests and is being used in a human breast cancer study. It shows promise for regeneration of cardiovascular tissues. It is key to regeneration of limbs for salamanders, and other such animals. Trodusquemine seems like a “best” candidate for systemic regeneration. Please chime in, people.

I personally am still interested in the FOX04 peptide, however am very interested in Trodusquemine group buy too, so if anyone goes that way do contact me.
However it does seem to me that these both do 2 separate thing, hence continued interest in the other. Also whilst human ‘clinical trials’ are limited in the Fox peptide it seems to me it certainly has been trialed by many people - even via this site- reporting some notable positive results. Risk we take I guess, and some have more reason to take it than others.
Group buy for Trodusquemine? Rekon I’de Be in that

[meatsauce]

To Whom It May Concern, 

 

This is a friend of 'MeatSauce'. I am reaching out on his behalf as an emergency has happened. He will be back in a couple of weeks. 

 

Thank you. 

 

Hey I'm back everything's cool

[Moondancer]

I personally am still interested in the FOX04 peptide, however am very interested in Trodusquemine group buy too, so if anyone goes that way do contact me.
However it does seem to me that these both do 2 separate thing, hence continued interest in the other. Also whilst human ‘clinical trials’ are limited in the Fox peptide it seems to me it certainly has been trialed by many people - even via this site- reporting some notable positive results. Risk we take I guess, and some have more reason to take it than others.
Group buy for Trodusquemine? Rekon I’de Be in that 

 

 

I would like to move forward with the FOXO4-dri group buy too, and may be interested in a Trodusquemine group buy in addition.  So please contact me too if anyone decides to set up a Trodusquemine group buy. 

 

If anyone that has agreed to participate in the FOXO4-dri group buy from the manufacturer for De Keizer's study changed their mind and does not want to participate after all, please let me know.

• Mikey, does this mean you'd prefer to not partake (and coordinate) the FOXO4-dri group buy after all? Please let us know, since if it is up to me (and some other members) we would want to get this group buy rolling sooner rather than later.

 

For this FOXO4-dri group buy from the manufacturer for De Keizer's study, currently we have: 

1) BeetleJuice 100mg (unsure)

2) Gregv 100mg

3) Hrub 100mg

4) Benko 100mg

5) anonymous member 300mg

6) Smithx 100mg

7) Moondancer 100mg or 200mg (depending on price)

8) Mikey 100mg

 

If everyone still wants to move forward (including Mikey): does everyone agree that we place our order now, and get this moving? Plus that Mikey arranges for this group buy? Thanks.

Edited by Moondancer, 05 September 2018 - 09:28 AM.

[smithx]

Hey I'm back everything's cool

 

Meatsauce, if you want people to feel better about you and your group buy, here's my advice:

1. Disclose what supplier you used.
2. Send all participants a copy of the order confirmation from the supplier, including the price, purity, etc.
3. Also send them a copy; of the payment confirmation, showing what you actually paid.
4. Send all participants any and all test results you got from the supplier showing the purity and composition of the compound

The impression that you're giving is that you're hiding this information because of one or more of:

 

a) you used a cheap supplier and want to keep as much money as possible, and therefore don't want to disclose who they are or what you paid

b) you didn't actually get the correct compound are are sending people something else

 

If a) is true, just admit it: you are profiting from this and maybe that's ok with people. If it's not true, the order confirmation and payment confirmation will prove it.

 

if b) is true, no one will be ok with it, it's fraud and you've committed a crime. The only way to prove that it's not true is to fully disclose the documents mentioned above.

 

I am not accusing you of anything, just pointing out that you're giving the appearance of dealing in bad faith, and there are easy ways to prove that it isn't true, if it isn't, by becoming transparent and disclosing the information that will prove it.

 

 

 

 

Edited by smithx, 05 September 2018 - 05:32 PM.

[mikey]

I would like to move forward with the FOXO4-dri group buy too, and may be interested in a Trodusquemine group buy in addition.  So please contact me too if anyone decides to set up a Trodusquemine group buy. 

 

If anyone that has agreed to participate in the FOXO4-dri group buy from the manufacturer for De Keizer's study changed their mind and does not want to participate after all, please let me know.

• Mikey, does this mean you'd prefer to not partake (and coordinate) the FOXO4-dri group buy after all? Please let us know, since if it is up to me (and some other members) we would want to get this group buy rolling sooner rather than later.

 

For this FOXO4-dri group buy from the manufacturer for De Keizer's study, currently we have: 

1) BeetleJuice 100mg (unsure)

2) Gregv 100mg

3) Hrub 100mg

4) Benko 100mg

5) anonymous member 300mg

6) Smithx 100mg

7) Moondancer 100mg or 200mg (depending on price)

8) Mikey 100mg

 

If everyone still wants to move forward (including Mikey): does everyone agree that we place our order now, and get this moving? Plus that Mikey arranges for this group buy? Thanks.

Reading Darren's story on his use of FOXO4-DRI since May 2017 I am not excited any longer about FOXO, so I am out.

 

I am interested in a Trodusquemine group buy, but I found that the forum about it has died down. This is confusing. 

I personally am still interested in the FOX04 peptide, however am very interested in Trodusquemine group buy too, so if anyone goes that way do contact me.
However it does seem to me that these both do 2 separate thing, hence continued interest in the other. Also whilst human ‘clinical trials’ are limited in the Fox peptide it seems to me it certainly has been trialed by many people - even via this site- reporting some notable positive results. Risk we take I guess, and some have more reason to take it than others.
Group buy for Trodusquemine? Rekon I’de Be in that

 

I am in for this Beetlejuice. COUNT ME IN. Perhaps we need to start up a new forum for it.

???

[mikey]

Here you go, folks, a Trodusquemine group guy and data gathering.

 

https://www.longecit...buy-share-data/

[Moondancer]

Here you go, folks, a Trodusquemine group guy and data gathering.

 

https://www.longecit...buy-share-data/

 

I guess now it is only waiting for the right person to arrive to coordinate the Trodusquemine group buy, since somehow you have not come across as the most reliable group buy coordinator either. 

[Benko]

I've rethought things and I'll pass on Fox04 for now.

[mikey]

I guess now it is only waiting for the right person to arrive to coordinate the Trodusquemine group buy, since somehow you have not come across as the most reliable group buy coordinator either. 

 

Now hold on a minute, Moondancer.

That statement is much harsher than I deserve and I feel like it is incorrect criticism 

 

It is one thing to have a molecule that causes a feeling of "caution" and lack of complete inspiration, which has been born out as "shaky" in reading Darren's tale of his long use of FOXO. He just doesn't tell a story that sounds like FOXO is doing anything profound. Effects are erratic.

His before and after photos of his hair do not speak of "regeneration" the way that has been seen with such things as Turnbuckle's reported re-growth of hair on the crown of his hair, my own experience with numerous friends saying that my hair looked thicker and darker about five months after I began to use Carotec tocotrienols and then C60oo apparently adding to it.

All we have for FOXO are Darren's uninspiring rendition of his experience and a lab animal study that investigated FOXO.

We/I need more solid data to inspire ANYONE/me that confirms merit to want to do a group buy.

 

The FOXO group buy left a bad taste in the mouth of everyone that read about it, as well as presenting a feeling of "I don't know that this will do what I need it to do."

 

Trodusquemine (MSI-1436) DOES present some solid good data, enough safety data to generate a human breast cancer study, and other inspirational notes to magnetize the attraction of anyone that has plaque/CVD. And then cancer, diabetes, and obesity. 

It reversed CVD in mice with just one exposure.

 

A prudent look at sourcing, dosing and administration are required first. So far Trodusquemine DOES provide the kind of inspiration that causes me to want to move on it and yes, with a little more data and a group of intelligent people determining exactly how to dose it, administer it and where to buy it I am interested enough in using it that I would consider running a group buy.
 

Folks, please chime in on the new Trodusquemine group buy forum and let's get a clear understanding on the basics so that we are all on the same page and then DO IT!

Edited by mikey, 07 September 2018 - 06:02 PM.