848 replies to this topic

[aribadabar]

 I'm not sure if VAT would be charged on orders shipped to the USA or not.

 

VAT is not (supposed to be) applicable to non-EU orders.

[TaiChiKid]

Had my annual checkup two months before and TSH was 8.4 with normal range expected 0.32 - 5.04 mU/L.  Tried FOXO-4.DR1 from the original group buy, and as I mentioned the BP went down about 15 mm/Hg in systolic and diastolic.  TSH went down to what it was twenty years ago:  about 3.5!  The effect of both BPs seems permanent for over a month now.  The immune system, in particular thymus generated T-cells are again available to the immune system.

 

I took a smaller dose that everybody was recommending.and it is encouraging that you only need this every few decades.  I have a few years on DD who reported his subjective results a while back in this thread.

[Moondancer]

That's great news TaiChiKid. 

 

If that doesn't make one enthusiastic to try FOXO4-dri  . 

So what about a new attempt, and this time with the manufacturer of the peptide for De Keizer's study?

 

I'd really like to participate in such a group buy. I'd want to buy 100mg (aliquoted), and if needed to ensure we can get a group buy of 1gr, I'd be willing to buy max. 200mg (also depending on the price).

 

If we can get a price of $1200-$1500 for 100mg that would be a reasonable price in my opinion.

There must be more members interested in such a group buy?

[Valijon]

I would if it wasn't cost prohibitive. I've been away for a while. I take it most results were positive from this? I'm. Too busy to go back and read through pages and pages of information on every substance lately but, this one had been showing real potential.

[Moondancer]

I would if it wasn't cost prohibitive. I've been away for a while. I take it most results were positive from this? I'm. Too busy to go back and read through pages and pages of information on every substance lately but, this one had been showing real potential.

 

It seems to be one of the most promising senolytic agents we currently have. 

Would you be willing to join in a group buy if the price for 100mg would be around $1200-$1500 (ordering from the manufacturer that produced FOXO4-dri for De Keizer's study)? 

[OP2040]

Bucky labs was mentioned and quickly dismissed.  I can see why, as it doesn't seem as reputable as a standard chemical company.  I don't think that is for any nefarious reason, rather it's a young startup type company.  Can anyone lay out in practical terms the risk of using such a company?  We kinda know who the guy is, and I think he takes his own products, so that helps.  In particular, the FOX04-dri listed there shows "98% purity" on the bottle.  Usually it's more than that isn't it?  Maybe we can get that guy on  this thread to answer some questions.  If he is willing to work with us, then it's a lot more business for him, and he has posted here before, even in this thread.

[smithx]

Bucky labs was mentioned and quickly dismissed.  I can see why, as it doesn't seem as reputable as a standard chemical company.  I don't think that is for any nefarious reason, rather it's a young startup type company.  Can anyone lay out in practical terms the risk of using such a company?  We kinda know who the guy is, and I think he takes his own products, so that helps.  In particular, the FOX04-dri listed there shows "98% purity" on the bottle.  Usually it's more than that isn't it?  Maybe we can get that guy on  this thread to answer some questions.  If he is willing to work with us, then it's a lot more business for him, and he has posted here before, even in this thread.

For something this expensive and potentially dangerous, it would seem foolish to rely on anyone's say-so that they are producing the actual compound. The only way to easily test it is to have a known-good sample and compare that to what you are testing. In the absence of that, it would seem most reasonable to go with the company that produced the compound that was used in the study.

BTW, 98% is actually a reasonable purity for a peptide although maybe not as pure as one would prefer. Pepscan, as I noted earlier, quoted 90-99% purity.

[Longevitarian]

In case the new FOXO-DRI buy group will form count me in for at

least 200 mg.

 

Hopefully it will be as successful as the Dasatinib purchase I

participated last year, thanks to Logic. Since then I tested it (D)

thoroughly. Since I had opportunity to try on myself Sprycel

year earlier, by comparison of the medical events after dosing

of both : the (purchased from China by Logic) Dasatinib powder

and the medical grade Sprycel I have no doubt we got real , high

quality product working exactly the same way as the Phrma

grade medication (Sprycel) works.

 

Hopefully we will be able to say the same about FOXO4-DRI

purchase in the future. So maybe we should give a try with the

Chinese supplier followed by the thorough chemical testing?

[Moondancer]

In case the new FOXO-DRI buy group will form count me in for at

least 200 mg.

 

Hopefully it will be as successful as the Dasatinib purchase I

participated last year, thanks to Logic. Since then I tested it (D)

thoroughly. Since I had opportunity to try on myself Sprycel

year earlier, by comparison of the medical events after dosing

of both : the (purchased from China by Logic) Dasatinib powder

and the medical grade Sprycel I have no doubt we got real , high

quality product working exactly the same way as the Phrma

grade medication (Sprycel) works.

 

Hopefully we will be able to say the same about FOXO4-DRI

purchase in the future. So maybe we should give a try with the

Chinese supplier followed by the thorough chemical testing?

 

Really? Did anyone actually read what Smith just wrote and remember whatever happened to this prior FOXO4-dri and Epitalon group buy - up to 'the stuff'' being delivered in plastic vials and nobody seems to know from what company it is coming? Good luck injecting that.

 

If anyone still wants to do a group buy from the company that actually manufactured the peptide for De Keizer's study I'm in (for 100mg, and 200mg the most if the price is "okay" and if we can't get to 1gram otherwise), but if it's going to be a Chinese-we-have-no-clue-where-it's-coming-from-and-what-it-is group buy again, I'll definitely won't throw my money at that once again.

Edited by Moondancer, 14 August 2018 - 08:25 PM.

[OP2040]

I'm starting to wonder if I should just go the D+Q route.  Another mouse study just came out today showing this combination eliminating senescent cells in young and old mice and human cells.  The very old mice had lifespan increases without increased morbidity.  The Quercetin is very easy to get, but the Dasatinib is probably not.

 

Does anyone have any experience procuring Dasatinib?  Also, I've heard that it can be very harsh, but the harshness must be temporary if it causes so many benefits.  Just a thought since it seems like D+Q has a long track record now of actually being used.

[Rocket]

I'm starting to wonder if I should just go the D+Q route. Another mouse study just came out today showing this combination eliminating senescent cells in young and old mice and human cells. The very old mice had lifespan increases without increased morbidity. The Quercetin is very easy to get, but the Dasatinib is probably not.

Does anyone have any experience procuring Dasatinib? Also, I've heard that it can be very harsh, but the harshness must be temporary if it causes so many benefits. Just a thought since it seems like D+Q has a long track record now of actually being used.

Its readily available online. Google is your friend. Harsh? Very! When taken at doses I take. Plan on a day home on the couch 24 to 48 hours after starting a 2 day cycle.

I don't know why people are throwing thousands away on foxo4 and no one is getting results with their dubious Chinese stuff.

[Beetlejuice]

I wasnt part of it but believe meatsauce (Ryan) May have done a group buy with Quercetin & Dasatinib.

To all in this thread I am also interested in any group buys being arranged here

[Moondancer]

I wasnt part of it but believe meatsauce (Ryan) May have done a group buy with Quercetin & Dasatinib.

To all in this thread I am also interested in any group buys being arranged here

 

Beetlejuice, would you be interested in participating in a FOXO4-dri group buy from the supplier that produced the peptide for the De Keizer study? (Which would mean we would be paying a bit more, but can be sure we are really getting FOXO4-dri).

If so, how much mg would you want to buy? 

[Moondancer]

Its readily available online. Google is your friend. Harsh? Very! When taken at doses I take. Plan on a day home on the couch 24 to 48 hours after starting a 2 day cycle.

I don't know why people are throwing thousands away on foxo4 and no one is getting results with their dubious Chinese stuff.

 

Off topic, but what kind of physical ailments do you experience the days after taking Q+D? And you feel that is 'inherent' to using a potent senolytic agent? Do you have any measurable results from using Q+D (bloodwork)?

 

From what age onwards do most here recommend using a senolytic drugs in the first place? And what about if you suffer from a chronic inflammatory disease at a younger age?

[Beetlejuice]

Hi Moondancer. Yes I would be interested in the FOXO4-dri group buy for likely 100mg but if you were organising it I would discuss this with you first to see if it’s feasible, due to my location. Will msg you

[Beetlejuice]

Beetlejuice, would you be interested in participating in a FOXO4-dri group buy from the supplier that produced the peptide for the De Keizer study? (Which would mean we would be paying a bit more, but can be sure we are really getting FOXO4-dri).
If so, how much mg would you want to buy?

[Beetlejuice]

Hi Moondancer ... Just worked out how to ‘quote’ on this but you’ll see my reply in the thread. Yes interested in the FOXO4-dri group buy & have msged you some questions

[Moondancer]

Hi Moondancer. Yes I would be interested in the FOXO4-dri group buy for likely 100mg but if you were organising it I would discuss this with you first to see if it’s feasible, due to my location. Will msg you

 

Admittedly I was not planning to arrange the FOXO4-dri group buy from the company that manufactured the peptide for De Keizer's study. Reason being, that I don't have a long track record/I haven't been posting on Longecity for years. And I can imagine that members would prefer to have a group organizer that has posted on Longecity for years - certainly after what happened with MeatSauce. In addition: I would have to pay 21% VAT if I order the peptide from PepScan. Whereas a member that orders from abroad should not have to pay 21% VAT. So the price would be lower if another member orders the peptide.

 

 

That being said, I'm very driven to gather enough members interested in taking part in a new group buy, as I would really like to try FOXO4-dri (as I have a chronic disease). And indeed I strongly prefer to use PepScan to be sure that we truly get the correct peptide.

This is why I try to find members that are interested in a group buy from PepScan too. So I can note the names and see if we can come up with enough members that want to join the group buy, and we can ask someone else to organize the group buy. 

 

You wanted to order 100mg right? I'd prefer to order 100mg too (in the worst case scenario, if we can't at least come up with a group buy of 1gram, I'm willing to order 200mg if affordable, to ensure at least we can get up to 1 gram).

 

So that makes:

1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)

2) Beetlejuice 100mg

 

Longevitarian, did you still want to join this group buy, or did you prefer the Chinese supplier as you mentioned, and thus you wouldn't want to join?

[smithx]

Can we get anyone not in the EU to do this, and save the 21%? If it's someone who has a track record so people will be more comfortable, so much the better.

[Moondancer]

Can we get anyone not in the EU to do this, and save the 21%? If it's someone who has a track record so people will be more comfortable, so much the better.

 

Definitely agree. It would be a pity/waste to spend so much on 21% VAT. One of the reasons i would not want to arrange the group buy (in addition to my short posting history).

But with BeetleJuice in Australia, and I'm in Europe, we'd still have to find a group buy organizer.

[katrina]

May possibly be interested in a group buy. And I am from the states and been a member since 2009. But I need to read more on this before I decide.

Would I need to go off any supplements while using this?

Edited by katrina, 16 August 2018 - 10:27 AM.

[Longevitarian]

 

You wanted to order 100mg right? I'd prefer to order 100mg too (in the worst case scenario, if we can't at least come up with a group buy of 1gram, I'm willing to order 200mg if affordable, to ensure at least we can get up to 1 gram).

 

So that makes:

1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)

2) Beetlejuice 100mg

 

Longevitarian, did you still want to join this group buy, or did you prefer the Chinese supplier as you mentioned, and thus you wouldn't want to join?

 

 

Yes' I am interested ...200 mg for me
 

[Moondancer]

Yes' I am interested ...200 mg for me
 

 

Great!

 

So that makes:

1) Moondancer 100mg (potentially 200mg)

2) Beetlejuice 100mg

4) Longevitarian 200mg

5) Smithx (unsure, possibly 90mg)

 

Smithx I put you on the list, is that okay? I understood you were still contemplating if you want to participate.

Smithx: from what amount do you think we could expect to get a 'reasonable price' for the peptide: 1 gram?

I think your comment with regard to purity is important discussing with everyone that wants to take part in the group buy too: are we satisfied with the >90% purity level, or do we prefer a purity level of >98% (the latter could be quite a bit more expensive).

 

Katrina, yes, it has been advised to stop several supplements with anti-inflammatory properties for a few weeks prior to taking FOXO4-dri, but a course of FOXO4-dri can be completed in a matter of days/a week and as far as I understood you can resume taking your supplements thereafter.

It would be great if you'd want to partake in the group buy - and potentially organize it?

Edited by Moondancer, 16 August 2018 - 04:08 PM.

[Rocket]

Off topic, but what kind of physical ailments do you experience the days after taking Q+D? And you feel that is 'inherent' to using a potent senolytic agent? Do you have any measurable results from using Q+D (bloodwork)?

 

From what age onwards do most here recommend using a senolytic drugs in the first place? And what about if you suffer from a chronic inflammatory disease at a younger age?

 

Briefly because it is off topic:

 

1. Yes, inherent to the senolytic effect; you're killing  a lot of cells and your body needs to clear out a lot of bad "junk" so you will feel ill if it is working; basically small amounts of poison is being released from all these cells all at the time. If anyone injects themselves with this junk being peddled in this group buy and says "Wow, I feel great the next day" then that is placebo.

2. Yes, 100% measurable in pre and post blood tests; EGFR went up and has stayed up; have self ordered blood tests going back years; took D+Q and EGFR went up; it had been trending downwards a little as I am not 19 years old anymore.

3. For something SAFE and PROVEN SAFE like Dasatanib, mid 30s is sufficient; every 6 months. this Chinese make junk people are using here (even if real) has not even been trialed on primates and yet people are lining up to fork out thousands of dollars.

4. For chronic inflammation I have found liposomal resveratrol with turmeric in large doses to be great; it rid myself of carpal tunnel syndrome that was starting to develop

 

Edited by Rocket, 16 August 2018 - 05:24 PM.

[smithx]

I would consider doing 100mg under the following conditions, that whomever does the group buy shares each set of documents along the way:

1. The quote request
2. The quote
3. The payment
4. The payment confirmation
5. All correspondence
6. Analysis reports
7. Shipping information, including tracking numbers
8. Photographs of the vials.

With regard to pricing, my quote of last year for 1gm was just over 11K euros and for 2gm was just under 18K euros.

 

 

Edited by smithx, 16 August 2018 - 08:50 PM.

[Daniel Cooper]

So what happened to meatsauce?  Did he abscond?   

 

 

 

[Moondancer]

I would consider doing 100mg under the following conditions, that whomever does the group buy shares each set of documents along the way:

1. The quote request
2. The quote
3. The payment
4. The payment confirmation
5. All correspondence
6. Analysis reports
7. Shipping information, including tracking numbers
8. Photographs of the vials.

With regard to pricing, my quote of last year for 1gm was just over 11K euros and for 2gm was just under 18K euros.

 

 

I can only completely agree with that, after the debacle that the last group buy turned out to be. The problem is mostly if the group buy organizer would want to take the effort to share all documents - as it takes some time/effort of the group buy organizer too.

 

The 11K price for 1 gm is for >90% purity levels: is this good enough for everyone, or do we prefer >98% purity levels?

Edited by Moondancer, 16 August 2018 - 09:54 PM.

[mikey]

Hi all, I'm Darren Moore from www.foxo4dri.com. As many know, I've been experimenting with FOX04-DRI. I started my second month-long cycle, but have stopped because I seem to be getting an immunogenic response now (the injection site is itchy and red like a bad mosquito bite)… I had a small reaction at first (a small histamine reaction like this seems to happen with anything I've ever injected by-the-way) but it appears to be getting stronger. Anyway--- just an FYI.

 

I will retry again shortly, the plan is take 35mg 2/wk – perhaps while trying an antihistamine.

 

Vitamin C is a natural antihistamine.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.../pubmed/1578094

 

My biochemist father pointed this out to me over 30 years ago, while adding that he didn't experience a significant antihistamine effect if he was taking less than 6,000 mg a day.

 

I found the same effect and have continued to supplement with 6,000 to 12,000 mg a day and do not experience my confirmed allergy to ragweed, pollen, etc... anymore unless I quit taking it.

 

Pharmaceutical grade extended release vitamin C is available as Endur-C, and from Bronson. 
Endure products have been used in clinical trials, so I believe that their sustained-release mechanism works. Bronson has been a quality company for a long time, but Endure has been vetted for clinical study use.

[VP.]

Slightly off topic but here is a gentleman commenting on Josh Mittledorf's most recent posting. He give his full regimen and results. D & Q and rapamycin are in there. He thinks the are the most efficacious. 

 

Robert H Olander on August 2, 2018 at 12:01 am said:

Hi Josh, I wonder if I may be an outlier – at least my test results and lsit of supplements may be of interest.

May 2018 Zymo tested my urine sample as (70yrs) minus 13 years & retested w/blood in June 2018 as (74 yrs) minus 9 years. June 2018 Teloyears tested average telomere length as (66) minus 18 years.

I am 83, excellent health, married, exercise daily, tennis three times weekly, and have consumed supplements since the Durk and Sandy days – precursor to LEF. In addition to the drug listing below, I take a number of LEF’s supplement combinations.

Prescriptions, Vitamins, Herbals
(Robert H. Olander Apr. 2018)
(Note: Started and continued usage for ten or more years unless otherwise noted)

Prescription Medicine:

Nexium – – 40mg 2x daily (GERD)
Celebrex – – 100 mg 2x daily (Arthritis pain)
Lipitor – – 10mg each evening (Maintain low cholesterol)
Jalyn 0.5 – 0.4 each evening (Control BPH, relax sphincter) Started 2017
Carafate – – 1gm 4x each night (Protect from GERD)
Cytotec – – 100mcg 2x each night (Protect from GERD)
Retin A, 1% – – Apply every other evening (Clear skin)
Aspirin – – 162 mg once daily (Thin blood)
Metformin – – 2 gm daily (Control slightly high A1c)
Synthroid – – 75 mcg daily (Boost sluggish thyroid)
Toprol 12.5 mg daily (Maintain low blood pressure)
Vitamins, Herbals, Supplements:

Life Extension Foundation (LEF) mix (see separate sheet) at least 30 years
LEF Booster (see separate sheet)
LEF Cognitive mix
D3 – 10,000 IU daily (plus in LEF mix)
DHEA – 75mg daily
Curcumin – 400mg daily
A.L-Carnitine – 1,200mg daily
Melatonin – 12mg nightly
B12, sublingual – 5mg daily
COQ10 – 200mg daily
Omega 3 – EPA: 700mg; DHA: 500mg
Magnesium – 144mg daily (plus in LEF Mix)
Carnosine – 1gm daily
Resveratrol – 250mg daily
Extracts: Blueberry, Grape, Pomegranate, Cruciferous Veg, Provinal, ++
Creatine – 3gm daily
Fiber supplement– 6gm daily
NAD+ booster (Niagen) 250mg daily (Nicotinamide Riboside) Started 2015
Acidophilus every morning
Desatinib (100mg, once monthly) w/grapefruit juice – – Started 2016
Rapamycin 2mg once weekly w/grapefruit juice – – Started 2015
ALT711 – 100 mg daily (anti-fibrotic)
Green tea extract 725mg daily
J147 – 10mg buccally. Started 2014 intermittently
Reishi mushroom 980mg daily
GHK applied topically

More conversation from him here: https://joshmitteldo...ogram/#comments

 

[VP.]

More detail: 

Good morning Paul, I bought the Desatanib at a pharmacy in Guadalajara three years ago during our winter vacation in Mexico. Sorry, my supplement list is incomplete – I do take Quercetin (about 10-1) with the Desatanib and I’ve taken LEF’s tocotrienols for many years.

The winter of 2015 when I started Desatanib at 100mg two consecutive days each month, I developed a rash on my back and chest for each of the first few months – I cut back to 100mg once monthly and have had no sides since.