118 replies to this topic

[Daniel Cooper]

Able, I wonder if Marshmallow has a C.O.A. ? Is it Fractal Health brand? Their 125 mg capsule contained 5 mg of NMN.

 

Anthony sells supplements, but the C.O.A. they paid for does not lie.

 

The Alive NMN combination lists it as >95 % purity NMN, but I would like to see the C.O.A. It could be far more economical.

 

I have emailed them with a request to see a C.O.A.

 

http://www.longecity...evgenetics-nmn/

 

 

You might also ask them the country of origin, though I'd just about bet my house it's China.

 

 

 

[Heisok]

Daniel, I did not get that country of source information. The batch submitted on 08/16/2017 tested at a little over 98% NMN. I do not forward Emails or attachments like the C.O.A. which come via email, unless I ask permission ahead of time. They plan to put manufacturer, and independent lab C.O.A.'s on their site. I will periodically check back, and will forward links once they are up.

 

They test every batch and can not accept anything less than the 95%. The samples they tested, and the first batch, were all 98%, but they have to put 95% on the label since they can not be sure all batches will be the same 98. They also plan to apply for NSF certification once the product is in distribution. They will then add that designation to their label.

 

http://www.nsf.org/c...f-certification

 

"Most importantly, NSF certification is not a one-time event, but involves regular on-site inspections of manufacturing facilities and regular re-testing of products to ensure that they continue to meet the same high standards required to maintain certification over time. If for any reason a product fails to meet one or more certification criteria, NSF will take enforcement actions to protect you, including product recall, public notification or de-certification.

Products that earn NSF certification are said to be “NSF certified” or “NSF listed” and display the applicable NSF certification mark to show that they have been tested by one of today’s most respected independent product testing organizations.

 

Edited by Heisok, 30 September 2017 - 12:33 AM.

[able]

 

Daniel, I did not get that country of source information. The batch submitted on 08/16/2017 tested at a little over 98% NMN. I do not forward Emails or attachments like the C.O.A. which come via email, unless I ask permission ahead of time. They plan to put manufacturer, and independent lab C.O.A.'s on their site. I will periodically check back, and will forward links once they are up.

 

They test every batch and can not accept anything less than the 95%. The samples they tested, and the first batch, were all 98%, but they have to put 95% on the label since they can not be sure all batches will be the same 98. They also plan to apply for NSF certification once the product is in distribution. They will then add that designation to their label.

 

http://www.nsf.org/c...f-certification

 

"Most importantly, NSF certification is not a one-time event, but involves regular on-site inspections of manufacturing facilities and regular re-testing of products to ensure that they continue to meet the same high standards required to maintain certification over time. If for any reason a product fails to meet one or more certification criteria, NSF will take enforcement actions to protect you, including product recall, public notification or de-certification.

Products that earn NSF certification are said to be “NSF certified” or “NSF listed” and display the applicable NSF certification mark to show that they have been tested by one of today’s most respected independent product testing organizations.

 

 

Ah,nice.  AFAIK, HPN is the only NR vendor to bother with NSF, which is why I trust them the most.

 

[MikeDC]

I opens Niagen pill from HPN before and you can clearly see brown particles. I just opened a new pill from HPN can it is all white. Probably similar to Basis. I will no longer buy Niagen from them. It doesn't matter what certification they have, it is no longer the same Niagen inside.

[Daniel Cooper]

Is the color difference simply different fillers?

 

 

 

Edited by Daniel Cooper, 30 September 2017 - 01:09 AM.

[MikeDC]

No. The brown particles are the real Niagen. The white powder are fillers.

[Advocatus Diaboli]

My bottle of HPN Niagen has, in light blue printing on the bottom of bottle: lot #36919,  MFG DATE:06/2017, and EXP: 06/2019

 

The color of the capsule contents (125mg) is a uniform light tan.

Edited by Advocatus Diaboli, 30 September 2017 - 01:25 AM.

[MikeDC]

You can see the brown particles clearly in old HPN pills. It is definitely different. Can Tru Niagen users check their pills?

[Valijon]

Everyones pain is different. I shouldn't have allowed myself a loss of control. Im at the end of my rope with you and your cheerleading of this one substance by a potentially corrupt corporation.

I would think it best to liquidate all shares of Chromadex quickly. Login to Etrade, Ameritrade, or whoever you trade with and put in a sell order at market price.

[MikeDC]

Why don't you short the stock?

[Daniel Cooper]

Everyones pain is different. I shouldn't have allowed myself a loss of control. Im at the end of my rope with you and your cheerleading of this one substance by a potentially corrupt corporation.

I would think it best to liquidate all shares of Chromadex quickly. Login to Etrade, Ameritrade, or whoever you trade with and put in a sell order at market price.

 

 

Why do you think Chromadex is corrupt?

[Valijon]

I believe a short sale may be a capital idea.

I cant say with certainty if they are corrupt. Yet there isnt definitive proof that they are not. I wouldn't trust their reports on NR because they have an obvious financial interest and bias.

[Daniel Cooper]

If you're going throw the accusation out there, it is incumbent on you to provide the proof, not them to prove they are innocent.

 

And they certainly do have a financial interest in the outcome of these trials, but so does every drug company that sponsors a trial.

 

Show me someone anywhere in the supplement or pharmaceutical business that doesn't have a financial interest.

 

 

 

[MikeDC]

Actually Most clinical trial using Niagen are independent university researchers. The first drug trial will be done by NIH.

[stefan_001]

Stefan, as a publically traded corporation, those sitting on the board, and usually directors of the corporation have a fiduciary responsibility to protect the owners. You, and all stockholders.

 

I hope you reported HPN, and that Chromadex followed up. They have the ability to test for their product. 

 

I do not doubt about your integrity in how you post on Longecity owner or not. You add good information to the issues. Thanks!

 

Just wrote to Chromadex and thanks for the other comments.
 

[stefan_001]

 

 

 

 

 

I see that Marshmellow, from the yahoo message boards, posted the same email as you.

 

Also, that they are selling their nmn now, for $46 a bottle.

 

If I'm reading it right, it's 125 mg nmn, 60 capsules.  A little more than Tru Niagen, I think?

 

Plus they include some niacin, nam, and tryptophan, which I'd prefer NOT to have myself.

 

http://alivebynature...st-nad-booster/

 

Hmnn, some interesting charts on that page....

 

 

They are probably not adding anything but those are left overs from the manufacturing process. They either cannot remove them or its too expensive. Essentially they cook up a mix of products and measured in there 125mg NMN and 350mg other items which are not split out in individual components. Could as well be 300mg of Nicotinamide and fractions of the rest.

 

It reminds me of this rejected bottling filing for NAD

https://www.fda.gov/.../UCM565933.pdf:

[MikeDC]

Previous HPN pills have brown particles that are real Niagen.
HPN might be using the same Chinese provider as Elysium.

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[able]

You really shouldn't be accusing them of fraud like this.  

 

HPN clearly has "Niagen" on their labels, same as always.

 

Besides the fact that Chromadex is THE supplier, HPN also spends the extra money for NSF testing.

 

I've read somewhere the spec Chromadex uses and it lists yellow to light brown as the color.  

 

Constantly bashing anything that threatens the price of your stock should be against the forum rules.

 

 

 

 

[able]

 

 

 

 

 

 

I see that Marshmellow, from the yahoo message boards, posted the same email as you.

 

Also, that they are selling their nmn now, for $46 a bottle.

 

If I'm reading it right, it's 125 mg nmn, 60 capsules.  A little more than Tru Niagen, I think?

 

Plus they include some niacin, nam, and tryptophan, which I'd prefer NOT to have myself.

 

http://alivebynature...st-nad-booster/

 

Hmnn, some interesting charts on that page....

 

 

They are probably not adding anything but those are left overs from the manufacturing process. They either cannot remove them or its too expensive. Essentially they cook up a mix of products and measured in there 125mg NMN and 350mg other items which are not split out in individual components. Could as well be 300mg of Nicotinamide and fractions of the rest.

 

It reminds me of this rejected bottling filing for NAD

https://www.fda.gov/.../UCM565933.pdf:

 

 

Right...  I have no chemistry background, but I'd bet that  Tryptophan is not a byproduct of manufacturing nmn.

 

I REALLY like Chromadex and Niagen myself, but you and your brother Mikedc really turn people against them with your blather.

Edited by able, 30 September 2017 - 03:00 PM.

[stefan_001]

Right... I have no chemistry background, but I'd bet that Tryptophan is not a byproduct of manufacturing nmn.

I REALLY like Chromadex and Niagen myself, but you and your brother Mikedc really turn people against them with your blather.

Well reasoned message. Ah well time for me to take a break from the forum. Not interested in discussions that include personal adjectives. Ciao.

Edited by stefan_001, 30 September 2017 - 03:55 PM.

[Heisok]

Deleted, this portion sorry.

 

. The NMN that Alivebynature uses is >95% NMN. The current batch is around 98%. There is not any Nicotinamide, Nicotinic Acid or Tryptophan in their NMN.

 

Alivebynature will be selling a product called NMN+. Using the 98% batch it has 122.5 mg of NMN. It has what they call a NAD+ Precurser Complex which is a combination Nicotinamide, Nicotinic Acid and Tryptophan. 350 mg. Total per capsule is 475 mg. Those ingredients are very inexpensive, and readily available at little cost. No nutrient retailer would have them specifically manufactured or place them with inconsistent mg ratios.

 

I agree, I prefer not having the extra complex, but it might be useful for some.

 

 

Edited by Heisok, 30 September 2017 - 04:43 PM.

[MikeDC]

You really shouldn't be accusing them of fraud like this.

HPN clearly has "Niagen" on their labels, same as always.

Besides the fact that Chromadex is THE supplier, HPN also spends the extra money for NSF testing.

I've read somewhere the spec Chromadex uses and it lists yellow to light brown as the color.

Constantly bashing anything that threatens the price of your stock should be against the forum rules.

We will find out soon enough. If you can't tell the difference between previous and current version you are fooling yourself. From now on only Tru Niagen. I don't trust other supplements sellers.

[sthira]

I don't trust other supplements sellers.

Why trust any of them?

Stepping back, ask yourself: even if these pills are pristine, every single blessed batch is what it says it is, every pill in every bottle is forever perfect, amen.

Given this perfection, why would you even want to have to take ANY vitamin pill for the rest of your life? Regardless of trustworthiness of the benevolent human rejuvenation aims of the publicly traded company, who wants to be tethered to some lifelong pill? We don't.

We don't want to have to rely on consuming unregulated commodity vitamin pills to reverse aging precisely because of what this thread is represents: what's in the pill capsule? Who says? Do they even "work"?

Rather, we want proper bodily rejuvenation. We want the body to "relearn" how best to repair its own damned ability to produce NMN. So one better method forward is perhaps through gene editing -- CRISPR. George Church's lab, for example, has been exploring this through cellular editing by activating the TFAM (Transcription Factor A, Mitochondrial).

Let's go there instead! Writing about vitamins is going nowhere, just like it has always gone nowhere to reverse aging.

Edited by sthira, 30 September 2017 - 06:48 PM.

[MikeDC]

I am in contact with HPN. They said nothing has changed. They got the powders from ChromaDex with no fillers. They will ask a person in ChromaDex to explain to me why the color has changed. I will keep you informed.

[Hebbeh]

I am in contact with HPN. They said nothing has changed. They got the powders from ChromaDex with no fillers. They will ask a person in ChromaDex to explain to me why the color has changed. I will keep you informed.

Are you going to delete all the posts in multiple threads where you trashed HPN accusing them of using contaminated counterfeit Niagen? Not to mention apologizing to HPN for slandering them. You should be sued for more reasons than one. For pumping Chromodex stock for starters.

[Heisok]

sthira, you make an excellent point as far as reversing aging, or human regeneration. I think that should be a goal. Achieved, as soon as possible.

 

At this stage for many of us, look at the demographics of an aging population, we will settle for anything that helps our health span now, and perhaps even halting the progression of some conditions such as Insulin resistance, high blood pressure, liver issues on and on. We might not have the time to wait for the huge leaps.

 

Some of the ways we might try, you already practice if I remember correctly; A very healthy way of eating, fasting, exercise and yoga...........

 

If there are net benefits to be achieved from pharmaceuticals, nutrients, vitamins, herbs and anything else, some of us will make the decision to try them. I find that most discussions add information which have great educational value when many participate. I do not buy most of these NR claims. It is sad how some promote it. I believe I get a benefit from it, but given the behavior of the companies involved, I will look to other ways.

Edited by Heisok, 30 September 2017 - 08:09 PM.

[MikeDC]

I am in contact with HPN. They said nothing has changed. They got the powders from ChromaDex with no fillers. They will ask a person in ChromaDex to explain to me why the color has changed. I will keep you informed.

Are you going to delete all the posts in multiple threads where you trashed HPN accusing them of using contaminated counterfeit Niagen? Not to mention apologizing to HPN for slandering them. You should be sued for more reasons than one. For pumping Chromodex stock for starters.

Communicating the concerns with other users benefits everyone.

Why so many jerks in this forum? Ungrateful jerks?

[MikeDC]

I don't trust other supplements sellers.

Why trust any of them?

Stepping back, ask yourself: even if these pills are pristine, every single blessed batch is what it says it is, every pill in every bottle is forever perfect, amen.

Given this perfection, why would you even want to have to take ANY vitamin pill for the rest of your life? Regardless of trustworthiness of the benevolent human rejuvenation aims of the publicly traded company, who wants to be tethered to some lifelong pill? We don't.

We don't want to have to rely on consuming unregulated commodity vitamin pills to reverse aging precisely because of what this thread is represents: what's in the pill capsule? Who says? Do they even "work"?

Rather, we want proper bodily rejuvenation. We want the body to "relearn" how best to repair its own damned ability to produce NMN. So one better method forward is perhaps through gene editing -- CRISPR. George Church's lab, for example, has been exploring this through cellular editing by activating the TFAM (Transcription Factor A, Mitochondrial).

Let's go there instead! Writing about vitamins is going nowhere, just like it has always gone nowhere to reverse aging.

You obviously have no idea what you are talking about. The aging from Lower NAD+ has nothing to do with genetic changes. The genes are still the same when you are young. We are dealing with epigenetic changes that NR can reverse.

Gene editing is far from practical for any purpose. It is not specific enough. It causes mutations that can be very harmful.

[ironfistx]

 

 

 

I haven't heard anyone say where they are sourcing it from.  Maybe someone here can ask him.  I'd frankly be a little surprised if it isn't coming out of China.

 

That's not the end of the world, provided that you're doing regular and extensive testing on every batch to verify what they're selling you.  The problem with Chinese sources is that many vendors test the first couple of batches and they just turn them on an assume that they are continuing to ship the same stuff.  That is a really bad assumption wrt to China.  They tend to cheapen the product as time goes on until the customer notices and calls them on it.  And if you aren't testing, you aren't going to notice until something bad happens.

 

 

All the things you said are correct.  It's referred to as quality fade.

 

 

[Heisok]

Great information. Quality Fade. Thanks. Hopefully Elysium does with their NR, like what AliveByNature commits to for their NMN

 

"We test every batch and can not accept anything less than the 95%."