8 replies to this topic

[Mr Serendipity]

Hi all.

 

So I got in a bad habit over the last couple of months on and off smoking weed with my cousin in the evening. Big mistake, I overate so much crap every time (even if only slightly high), and put on a lot of weight (biggest I've ever been). I do believe a lot of this is to do with mindset, being someone who struggles with weight, I overate every time I was high, even when only slightly high. While my cousin, being naturally skinny all his life, can control his eating when high, and he literally smokes 10 times more weed than me (smokes throughout the day). 

 

Anyway I decided to quit weed and lose some weight. I've always struggled to stick to a diet every time I tried to diet, but I may have found my solution.

 

I knew a friend who told me years ago he lost weight by smoking every time he was hungry. I also found this well collaborated research paper of smoking/nicotines effect on appetite suppression and increasing metabolism (up to 10% due to increased heart rate): https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC3195407/

 

I'm a casual smoker, around 4 a day. 1 in the morning before work, then another 3 spread out after 6.30pm. I smoke the additive free pouch tobacco American Spirit blue (roll it yourself). With this tobacco I rarely get much throat trouble, and don't get a horrible taste in my mouth the next morning, really makes a difference compared to smoking other tobacco/cigarettes, including American Spirits normal cigarettes (which tickle my throat). 

 

The last point I want to make before we delve in, is I'm very sensitive to supplements/chemicals in general now, which is most likely to do with my obsessive taking of supplements since I was 16 (29 now), where I've tried and experimented with everything from A-Z, including mega dosing a few of them. But now my body has a low barrier to  most of them, even low doses effect me bigly. 

 

So my goal was to test how well the appetite suppressing effects of nicotine from smoking are. 

 

Results so far:

 

Wednesday 24th/Jan/18 - Drank 1 can of coke in the morning (originally for the caffeine to help the appetite suppression), and ate 1 porridge pot before bed with some added golden syrup. (total calories around 500)

 

Thursday 25th/Jan/18 - Just ate 1 porridge pot before bed and took my nightly supplements. (270 calories total).

 

Friday 26th/Jan/18 - Didn't eat anything all day.

 

 

Good effects I experienced:

 

1. Amazing appetite suppression, lack of 95% of hunger pangs. Was easy to restrict calories.

 

2. It obliterated my procrastination. On Friday I spent all day on adding content to my website, something I've been putting off for weeks. Even creating and writing this new long thread isn't burdensome or stressful. 

 

3. Little to no crash. I don't seem to be crashing hard or at all it feels like, when compared to a caffeine or sugar high, which is interesting.

 

Good/Bad effects I experienced:

 

4. I would get a boost of mental clarity, most likely a combination of ketones + nicotine. However it would decline somewhat later on the day the more I smoked. However this could also be due to a lack of sleep (read bad effects).

 

5. I experience more hyperactivity/positivity/confidence/excitability, and a reduction of shame/fear of what other people might think. This is sort of good, but you might tell people things you usually wouldn't. For example I wouldn't really want to tell most people my extreme diet experiment, but the fear of them judging me is much lower than usual, and I've told a couple of people I usually wouldn't have. It's not like it's 100% uncontrollable, it's just a noticeable confidence boost which you may regret if you ever come down.

 

Bad effects I experienced:

 

6. Major insomnia! I knew nicotine gives me insomnia in general, because even before this experiment, if I smoked too close to bed, I would have trouble sleeping. On Wednesday I couldn't fall asleep until 4:30am! But it should be noted that low calorie diets/fasting also gives me insomnia, even when there are no hunger pangs. Last night (Friday) I experienced major insomnia also, couldn't fall asleep until 3-4am.

 

7. Cigarettes slightly stimulate my bowel movements; combine this with not eating anything, and you have a recipe for needing to go when there's not much to go.

 

8. Nausea. Only experienced it once, which was last night, but went after 15 minutes, and wasn't as bad as the nausea I get from a cup of coffee.

 

 

Conclusion

 

Luckily compared to caffeine, nicotine is a God send. Caffeine gives me major nausea, makes me much more stressed out, not all with it, and I just don't feel right; while nicotine seems to be a much more positive experience overall. 

 

I want to use my experiences with this experiment to maximize the potential health benefits it could provide.

 

New Plan:

 

1. I will be adding a porridge pot every night. That way I won't get as much toilet trouble the next day, and I can take my supplements with it too. This will make it 270 calories instead of 0.

 

2. Find the right balance between smoking and appetite suppression. If I really want this to work in my favour, I need to find a cut off time which will maximize the appetite suppression effects of smoking (allowing me to stick to my low calorie diet), while avoiding the major insomnia effects I usually get from it. For example no more smoking/nicotine after 2pm.

 

3. Experiment with cigarette/tabacco alternatives to see which will give the same positive effects. For example nicotine gum, patches, lozenges, maybe vaping.

 

4. Lose all excess body fat (may take a couple of months), then go onto an intermittent fasting regime, and only using nicotine as a way of controlling my fast days.

 

 

 

Anyway that's it really; if you read all this, congratulations.

Edited by manny, 27 January 2018 - 12:24 PM.

[Mr Serendipity]

So I wasn't totally honest. When I wrote this thread on Saturday 27th, I did take some nicotine gum 2mg in the morning before I wrote it, so it was nicotine gum that caused this motivation/nootropic effect then.

 

However Saturday night I ended up eating a proper small meal at night (500-700 cals), and then crashing due to a lack of sleep/too much nicotine. I became very emotional as the lack of sleep was really kicking my ass. I took 2 night nurse liquid caps that night, along with my supplements, and I woke up around 12pm really refereshed and awake.

 

Sunday was a day where I took no nicotine gum but smoked normally during the day. I also ate normally from morning until night, and took more vitamin c during the day. Even though I woke up feeling refreshed and awake, later on throughout the day I felt anhedonic, and had a little bit of trouble sleeping due to smoking so late. I didn't take any night nurse though, I fell asleep after sex around 1:30am, and woke up today around 12pm again.

 

Anyway I woke up this morning at 12pm feeling much better, happier, and motivated. I weighed myself this morning and I must have lost weight, because before I went through my weed phase I weighed 108kg, this morning I weighed 107.7kg. I didn't record my weight before this experiment, but I put on a lot more weight than 108kg. The last recorded weight I have is 21st November 2017, where I weighed 112.2kg, and I think I was heavier then that before I started this experiment; but if we take this weight from November, I've lost 4.2kg. How much of that was muscle mass along with fat loss, I have no idea, but my face looks a little slimmer, but my belly is still pretty big.

 

It should also be noted I've developed dark circles under my eyes. I put this more to a lack of sleep than increased nicotine consumption, because I was smoking before this experiment and didn't have these circles. Then again I wasn't smoking as much as when I did this experiment.

 

Anyway I now know the importance of getting back into a regular supplement regime, in a way to counter the negative effects of too much nicotine stimulation/problems falling asleep. This is why I'm adapting my regime in various ways to try and maximize nicotine stimulation, while buffering its negative effects.

 

Supplements in the morning:

 

Gingko Biloba

Zinc (15mg)

Vitamin E (500mg)

Vitamin C (2-3g, half a teaspoon)

Blackthorn Oil (500mg, Omega 3,6,7,9)

 

Supplements before bed:

 

Same as the morning, except the Zinc (supplementing too much increases my appetite), and Gingko (has a dopamine increasing effect which causes a bit of insomnia for me).

 

Diet Regime:

 

To avoid toilet troubles (not having enough food to go), and help stick to a more long term slower weight loss while taking my supplements every day. I've decided to move on to intermittent fasting sooner than planned. One day with a low day (500-700 calories), and the next day eating normally.

 

Nicotine regime:

 

Now this is the hard one (because it's addicting), but one of the most important. If I am going to get this to work, I need to have a cut off period of where I can't take anymore nicotine gum or smoke, to avoid insomnia at night and get a good nights sleep. 4pm should be the max, 2pm would be ideal.

 

 

Last point I will make is my stomach has shrunk, as eating normally yesterday, I struggled to overeat as I felt full quicker.

 

 

So anyway starting today, I'm on my low cal day. Lets see if I can stick to it, and stick to no more nicotine after 2 or 4pm.

 

 

Also look here: http://www.longecity...otropic-effect/

 

I need to remember how important it is to regularly take my supplements, especially vitamin c because my brain & energy levels love the stuff, and I shouldn't go months without my supplement regime like I have done before this experiment (by getting lazy/forgetting about it).

 

Wish me luck!

Edited by manny, 29 January 2018 - 01:55 PM.

[Mr Serendipity]

Ok so an update on this.

 

Motivation/Procrastination

 

Monday 29th Jan - I ended up clearing and organising my desk and a very big messy cupboard, which took 3 hours of continuous work. I also rolled every cigarette from my tobacco pouch in one go (took 30 minutes). I even exercised for 10 minutes on the treadmill. Also emptied the bins rather then leaving it last minute.

 

Another point I should make, is it's put me back into my supplement regime since Saturday (which I got lazy on before this experiment).

 

These are some example of how nicotine intake has affected my procrastination/motivation on things I wouldn't haven't done normally. Can't remember much of what I did yesterday (Tuesday).

 

Appetite Suppressant/Diet

 

It still seems to be working, not to the same extreme degree as when I was smoking throughout the day, but more like it's helping me cut calories in general. Originally the new plan was to go low cal Monday (700 calories), which I did. Then eat normally the next day, and keep alternating with this intermittent fasting pattern. However yesterday (Tuesday) my appetite wasn't significantly increased, and I ended up eating around 1000 calories rather than eating normally. So it seems like my diet has now shifted to general calorie restriction, where the aim is to get 1000 calories a day.

 

I have woken up today though a bit more hungry than the last 2 days. 

 

Sleep

 

AAAAAGGGHHHHH! What a pain in the ass getting to sleep is! OK, it is my fault because I'm not adhering to a nicotine cut off period, but I also think I found another culprit, which I actually think I identified before I started this experiment but forgot about. Taurine! I have 1g taurine capsules, originally bought to help sleep and generally be good for my health. But I'm pretty sure this stopped me from going to sleep when I originally tried it, so I stopped taking them. Forgetting this lesson I took one last night, along with my new arrival of liquid magnesium (something with a track record of helping me fall asleep quicker), and I just couldn't fall asleep, so I chucked that taurine straight in the bin.

 

Conclusions/Thoughts/New Plan/& GOOD NEWS!

 

Appetite/Diet - As long as nicotine is helping me with general calorie restriction to around 1000 calories a day, I don't mind. All that matters is cutting my calories and losing excessive body fat, whether IF or not. I would like to do a form of IF in the future though for its general health benefits.

 

Sleep - I'm trying to force myself to wake up earlier so it's easier to fall asleep earlier. I feel very tired today as I woke up early today (and fell asleep around 2am last night), so hopefully it will work. I also chucked the nicotine away.

 

Motivation/Procrastination - I know I've been doing more things thanks to the stimulation of nicotine. But lets be honest, so far these are things which are easy/require less brain power. Writing my thoughts & experiences on this forum isn't mentally tasking, neither is tidying up or exercise. And the thing with the exercise, is I still had to motivate myself to get myself started on it, and I only did 10 minutes on Monday, while I didn't end up doing any yesterday (Tuesday). So my observation on nicotine stimulation is it generally makes easy tasks such as tidying, really easy. While slightly motivating you & giving you positive outlook on everything else, making everything else seem a little bit more easier to do.

 

GOOD NEWS! - This morning (Wednesday), I ran my prerolled cigarettes under the tap and chucked them away. I wouldn't say I was addicted addicted anyway, for example earlier this month we went on a 4 day holiday, and I didn't bother taking them with me. So I went 4 days not smoking or buying smokes, and it wasn't a problem. But the trouble falling alseep at night is what really motivated me to get rid of them and stick with the gum. Now lets see if I don't get addicted chewing this all day, and enforce a cut off period to help avoid sleeping problems.

 

Final Conclusion - So far I would say this nicotine experiment has put more zest into my life and is an overall positive experience, the future is currently bright. I'm doing far more than usual, and seem to be sticking to my diet/cutting calories (something which I've failed countless times). However I also started taking all my supplements again, so there is a combination here than just nicotine alone. Nicotine alone, and way too much of it throughout the day (like when I started) was a killer on my sleep and emotional health. But I am confident I may have found my stimulant of choice, and with enough tweaking over the coming weeks/months, I will hopefully be able to find the right balance between it, sleep, & a more motivated life; but it's still to early to tell. Whatever the case, my main priority in this experiment currently, is to establish a healthy sleeping pattern, because in my opinion this will be required for it to work in long run.

[Mr Serendipity]

Quick update.

 

I just realised I experienced one of the previously noted effects of nicotine in another thread on this forum.

 

Here's the effect I wrote about in the first post:

 

 

5. I experience more hyperactivity/positivity/confidence/excitability, and a reduction of shame/fear of what other people might think. This is sort of good, but you might tell people things you usually wouldn't. For example I wouldn't really want to tell most people my extreme diet experiment, but the fear of them judging me is much lower than usual, and I've told a couple of people I usually wouldn't have. It's not like it's 100% uncontrollable, it's just a noticeable confidence boost which you may regret if you ever come down.

 

Now this morning I posted in my Vitamin C for the Brain & Nootropic thread. And in my post, I wrote about my experience with Gingko Biloba, peyronies disease, and using my dick as an indicator to what supplements are best for me. The paragraph is 8 lines long, so it wasn't a simple mention either. 

 

Post #25 of this thread: http://www.longecity...ct/#entry839872

 

Now I've come down a bit from the nicotine, I'm feeling a bit embarrassed & regretful for sharing such information, because I wouldn't have usually shared such information, but I did. It doesn't matter now, but it made me realise I just experienced one of my previously observed effects of nicotine (read quote above).

 

So that's one of the benefits of nicotine compared to caffeine. While caffeine may increase anxiety in general, nicotine seems to decrease it significantly, even to a point where you might share something you regret because you feel so confident and don't fear shame.

 

I will also note that I'm getting little to no social anxiety on nicotine. Talking and interacting with everyday people is easy and fluid, and I've only had nicotine gum today (no cigarettes). In fact I can't remember getting such a profound effect on cigarettes alone, but then again I'm consuming more nicotine in a shorter period of time, so all of nicotine's effects are stronger.

 

So watch out, nicotine in my experience might be too good for anxiety. 

 

And please don't forget I've restarted supplementing myself with Ginkgo, Vitamin C, Vitamin E, Magnesium, & Zinc also, to help counter some of the negative effects of too much nicotine (which I experienced at the beginning of this experiment). So don't go chewing a load of nicotine gum for your social anxiety, unless you're taking something to balance it out (especially high doses of Vitamin C).

Edited by manny, 31 January 2018 - 04:54 PM.

[Mr Serendipity]

Morning update! - Thursday 1st Feb

 

So last night I tried to go to bed early (8pm), only to wake up 2 hours later (10pm); so I watched a few things and ended up falling asleep around 2am.

 

I woke up earlier then my usual time (7:30am instead of 8:30-9am), and the sleep was adequate, not exceptional, but adequate. I went to the toilet, chewed some 2mg nicotine gum, went on the cross trainer for 10 minutes, then took my supplements, and I'm now eating a pot of porridge!

 

So I feel pretty good atm. Sure it wasn't perfect, but very good start to where I eventually want to be (fall alseep quicker, wake up at 7am, do 30m-1h on crosstrainer). But atm I'm trying to set the routine up, then slowly increase to my goals.

 

So I'm pretty happy atm. It's a start into the right direction, and I thank nicotine for playing it's part.

 

New Adjustments in Plan:

 

1. Only have 1 nicotine gum a day, early in the morning. I know I'm sensitive to supplements in general, so I really shouldn't be chewing 3 pieces throughout the day. No more cut off period, just 1 in the morning along with all my other supplements.

 

2. Only take my supplements in the morning. I want to create a good healthy sleeping pattern and don't want anything to possibly disturb it. The only supplement I will take at night is liquid magnesium from now on. 

 

3. With the reduced nicotine consumption, I'm going to have to carefully watch my calorie intake as I won't experience a strong appetite suppressing. Also I'm taking zinc in the morning and this can increase my appetite, so might have to adjust zinc intake to twice a week or something, we'll see.

 

KFC Yesterday

 

It should be noted my one meal I ate yesterday was KFC. I was attracted to the idea that I could eat one of their buckets, and still be within my 1000 calorie range (according to their nutrition PDF). However that wasn't the best idea, the food didn't taste great, and the greasiness stayed in my stomach many hours after eating (ate at 3pm, felt it up until 11pm), which was one of the reason I woke up when trying to go to bed early.

 

Anyway it was a food fantasy, I honestly prefer the proper food ready meals I get from Asda. I trust their calories on their packaging more, they're tasty (with lots of hot sauce), and I feel better on them. It should be noted I'm not usually a KFC or ready meal guy, my wife cooks healthy meals most of the time; however for easy calorie restriction and counting, it's just easier to use them for now, and I'll go back to a more fresh diet once I've shed my excess body fat.

[Mr Serendipity]

Possibly my last post:

 

I think it's time to drop nicotine. The appetite suppressing effects have worn off (or my tolerance has grown), and one nicotine gum in the morning isn't going to cut it. In fact I feel I might now be experiencing a rebound effect i.e. since I've lowered my nicotine intake, I need something else (such as food) to give me that dopamine release, hence why my hunger has actually started to increase.

 

However as long as I'm careful with my caloric intake, and this isn't just the nicotine gum talking, I feel confident I can carry on in the positive routine nicotine has set out for me.

 

Thanks to this experiment I've lost around 4kg and experienced the powerful appetite suppressing effects of nicotine, as well as the nootropic/motivational effects of it. I also feel it put me on my current path to a better sleeping pattern, exercise regime, regular supplement regime; oh and let's not forget of course, I've stopped smoking too.

 

Nicotine may have a place in my life as an occasional consumption. But I now want to experience a completely healthy life from now on. A steady/high energy only from good sleep, good supplements, good exercise, and plenty of vitamin c; no nicotine/drugs/stimulants required.

 

I may laugh & cry at myself later though. Things truly seem easier and more possible when on nicotine, so who knows if my mindset will change back to old ways when I try and do all this without it. Time will tell...

[fiftyyy]

If you attribute appetite suppression in cigarettes to nicotine, i believe you wrong. The effects might have been placebo. There are reversible MAO-i in cigs, which cause the hunger suppression. 

[Mr Serendipity]

If you attribute appetite suppression in cigarettes to nicotine, i believe you wrong. The effects might have been placebo. There are reversible MAO-i in cigs, which cause the hunger suppression. 

 

You may be right, but I can't be 100% sure. I did start my journey on cigarettes (not nicotine gum). And it was at the beginning of the journey my appetite suppression was the strongest, but I was also smoking a lot more than usual to achieve this, and was experiencing horrible side effects of too much nicotine stimulation also. So the question is, was the appetite suppression due to the increased nicotine or other chemicals in the cigarette?

 

I would still lean towards the nicotine. You have to remember I allowed myself to smoke unrestricted when this experiment first started, not only did I experience appetite suppression, but also major insomnia, emotional stress, and terrible nausea at one point (only for 20 minutes). So I was giving myself a lot more nicotine than my body was use to, before any down-regulation in the brain would have occurred (and while experiencing horrible side effects too).

 

I honestly hated those side effects, the lack of sleep, the stimulation in the brain, it was driving me to breaking point, I wouldn't have been able to go on with my experiment. The first thing that helped counter this was starting my supplement regime again (something I should have been doing anyway), these supplements definitely helped me handle the side effects better. The next goal was getting a healthy sleep pattern back. So I tried cutting my nicotine consumption to do this, first by stopping smoking, then second by chewing less gum until I was down to only one 2mg gum in the morning. By then you have to think my brain has down-regulated certain chemical processes in relation to nicotine consumption, combined that with me consuming much less nitcotine then I even did before this experiment (when I would smoke), and you can see why it's appetite suppressing effects is bound to be less effective then when I first started. I'm pretty sure I could experience the appetite suppression effects again with just nicotine gum, but that would require me to dose the gum regularly throughout the day, and I just don't want to do experience those side effects again; I'd prefer a healthy sleeping pattern.

 

Last point. One of the biggest reasons I started this experiment, was because of this study of nicotine done on mice and weight loss: https://www.nih.gov/...ine-weight-loss

 

 

The investigators were studying how different compounds interact with specific receptors — known as nicotinic acetylcholine receptors — found on the surfaces of neurons throughout the body. These receptors come in different configurations, or subtypes, and perform a variety of functions. In the brain, they’re the main docking site for nicotine.

 

The researchers observed that mice given a nicotine-like drug called cytisine tended to eat less than mice not receiving the medication. More careful analysis — reported in the June 10, 2011, issue of Science — showed that both nicotine and the drug could reduce weight gain and body fat over time and cut food consumption by up to half. When the mice were given a drug that prevented nicotine or cytisine from activating the receptors, food intake rose back to normal levels.

[Mr Serendipity]

Quick update, post nicotine consumption:

 

So last night I went to bed at a decent time (only taking liquid magnesium before bed), and I woke up at 7am today. I still felt like I needed more sleep, and still have circles under my eyes (damn you sleep debt!). I'm not experiencing any of the positive effects of nicotine this morning, my zest for life, my confidence, my positivity that I can do anything are all now gone. I now just feel balanced and back to normal. I didn't even do any exercise this morning either. Damn. Sure I shouldn't rely on nicotine for exercise, but it sure does help when it makes you feel like you can do anything.

 

Now I should clarify on one of my previous posts. I didn't just decide to drop nicotine because the appetite suppressing effects wore off. But because even with one 2mg of gum in the morning, I could feel the vasoconstriction effects (on my dick & toes), and there wasn't a steady brain energy throughout the day (my concentration/nootropic effect would drop off). But the main reason is I just didn't feel right, there was a slight stimulation in the background of my brain I just didn't like. The only benefit I really felt I was getting in the end with low nicotine consumption was the inner zest/confidence/positivity, but that wasn't enough to carry on in lieu of the aforementioned negative effects.

 

But this morning, I come to a stroke of genius. There is 1 other stimulant out there where I experienced this zest for life, and I can't remember experiencing those aforementioned negative side effects like I did with nicotine. Theobromine! (in the form of cocoa/hot chocolate). The only thing I remember experiencing negatively was insomnia and tolerance when messing with it before; but I  was drinking the hot chocolate multiple times a day. Now it's time to experiment whether drinking it only once in the morning, while keeping a good sleeping pattern, will allow me to experience the benefits of nicotine, with the reduction of the negative effects. I'll have to start this next Monday, and look over my old notes on this in the meantime.

 

Here's one of my previous experiences posted on the forum: http://www.longecity...n-memory-focus/

 

 

Cocoa is extremely good for motivation. Try drinking a cocoa drink in the morning with 2-3 teaspoons of cocoa in it. You'll soon believe in yourself and be motivated. Warning do not do it before bed, it will cause insomnia.

 

Also note, it doesn't have to be raw cocoa. Infact raw cocoa might be dangerous in the long run (I've read a few things, though I can't remember what specific ingredients in raw cocoa may make you worse off). Use the cocoa powder you can buy in the everyday supermarket.

 

Edited by manny, 02 February 2018 - 09:05 AM.